It seems like incels were effectively silenced, under the guise of ‘policies against hate’ …Even though incels are literally a bunch of men with an absence of a crucial human need, and, surprise surprise, they're in pain and use these communities to cope....Wow. Shocker. Such hate. Such threat.
All they were doing was coping with their ailments and commiserating together….
A single Incel was responsible for a shooting and that was all they needed to paint the entire group as dangerous men who are a threat to society. I think this is not only stupid but very wrong to do, especially when done by Western Society who is supposedy so tolerant and virtuous and accepting of disenfranchised communities. These supposedly liberal tolerant people saw a group of men suffering, couldn't immediately relate to their pain, and instead of trying to see where they were coming from, deemed them monsters.
Deemed them monsters for being different. And then subsequently used arbitrarily enforced standards to erase them from society, and take away the one coping mechanism they had. That right there is what makes mainstream Western Liberals so disgustingly hypocritical, and the fact that no one sees it, less a select few, is enraging.
To claim that these men were a danger to anyone but themselves is pathetic, and so obviously untrue. They had to take the actions of one guy and use that to fear-monger, and paint incels as some violent gang that is an immediate danger to society. I wonder why boogiemen like Proud Boys and Incels are so concerning to Western Society, but actual criminal gangs that commit violence in impoverished communities on a daily basis are ignored. It's more of that good 'ol Liberal Hypocrisy.
The notion that a bunch of sad, depressed, and resentful men are a bunch of violent gun-weilding thugs is so far a reach, that it's almost sci-fi level far fetched. But then when you take into account the fact that the majority of American people will listen to anything the media tells them, no matter how illogical it is--then it goes from being laughable to being enraging.
But I really do want to know. Where do the incels go now that the Virtuous liberals have silenced them into extinction? I’m a writer and a podcaster and although I am not a bona fide Incel, I commiserate with the movement and I understand the pain. I just can’t technically call myself one because I'm married to someone that I love which is exactly contrary to being an incel. But I recall almost a decade of pain and rejection brought on by women and their treatment of men like me. One thing I do have in common with incels is that I lost the genetic lottery. I’m short, fat, and ugly. No level of confidence will ever fix my level of hideousness. I know this because I’ve developed a noticeable level of confidence over the years, so much so that it’s often the first thing others mention to describe me.
I still have a lot of anger towards society for how they treat men like us—men who have physical attributes out of their control. Society will feel bad for a woman who struggles with her weight and calling her fat or being harsh is socially unacceptable. But when a man is short and ugly, two things he had no control over, girls
will be disgusted by him, creeped out, and won't feel bad to act this way to his face. This starts in grade school and carries on into adulthood. When a man is short and he's in any type of confrontation, he's not taken seriously, treated like a child, oftentimes taken advantage of. The fact that "virtuous" peopel will help a wounded puppy or a lost little child, but will scoff at a short man who is in pain, and even actively partipate in causing him pain, shows me that the world is very ugly, and that people only feel sympathy for things with exterior beauty. People try to deny this all the time. They try to hide from it. They try to overcompensate with stories and anecdotes. But it's true. It's absolutely true.
HeatedBeans 3y ago
Seriously? How on earth are you that delusional to blame all women just because you’re insecure about your “physical attributes that are out of your control”. Men are not oppressed and if you’d actually pay attention to the feminism movement, then you’d realise that feminism is trying to eradicate stereotypes such as men not being allowed to cry. We’re on your side. I have no idea where this height strawman is coming from, I hear more men complaining about it than it actually happening. And may I remind you that you incels, or as you put it “men going their own way”, are the ones that call fat women “land whales”. Please get some help. It’s not healthy to hate and to discriminate against half of the population.
[deleted] 3y ago
Incels do not blame their attributes on women, but how those attributes are being percieved, while nowadays looks are number one factor. What incels are annoyed with is the lie, that "improving personality" helps.
Funny joke
Maybe first and second wave were like that, nowadays most of feminists are 3rd wave and above midandrists. I can just point out that 100% of r/FemaleDatingStrategy members are feminists. And they are men haters. Also I could point out with multiple points (but later, I am heading to a lecture now how entire feminist movement is making men life suffering.
And where do stats about it 'actually happening' come from? Right from 'believe me dude' insutitute of statistics?
As women used to say "eww" or act gag reflex when they saw them, I heard multiple stories too. Women are less vocal about men looks, but they take them in count more by far.
As well as it isn't go hate entire population of ugly men. But noone cares about them - hate towards them just "doesn't exist" and it's all fine. Convinient.
HeatedBeans 3y ago
Alrighty then, please tell me how men are oppressed in this day and age? Let me guess, you’re oppressed because “society doesn’t like how muh jawline looks and no women want to fuck meeh!!” Or let me guess, you’ll make an “argument” about how women falsely report men for sexual assault/rape despite the prevalence of false accusations is indicated to be between 2% and 10%. fucking lol.
And do you seriously believe that improving your own personality doesn’t help? Like for fuck sake, how do you expect women to like you if you actively despise them and blame all of them for the actions of a minority of women? I know it’s a lot to ask from you, but try to have a little empathy. Imagine you are a woman looking for a potential soulmate, and you see a guy who actively hates society, feminism, and is stuck in an echo chamber that dislikes women. Surely then you can see why women would steer clear of incels and would go for “chad” instead. Lmfao
The feminist movement is not making “men life suffering”. How on earth is wanting women to be equal to men making men’s life suffering? Again, you are listening to the loud minority in subreddits such as the one you mentioned which make you foolishly believe that “the feminist movement is making men’s life suffering”. I have extreme envy on men such as yourself, who are able to walk out at night without immense fear of being raped or sexually abused. (not saying that men do not get raped or sexually abused, however the chances of that happening are very slim compared to a woman)
And I love how you complained about me using anecdotal evidence, or as you called it, “believe me dude statistics” while you did the exact same thing by saying “women are less vocal about men’s looks, but take them in count way more by far”. Fucking lol.
In response to the height thing, It is impossible for me to get statistics about how many women care about height in a relationship. If I do get statistics from a questionnaire then you’ll discredit it due to many reasons, such as the fact that people may lie on it, due to things such as social desirability bias or due to random people trolling. There is no way to convince you.
And I don’t know how many times you people need to hear this, but it’s not a huge deal if you are ugly or if you are under 6 feet. If you truly do want a relationship then you will find a partner that loves you for your personality, but again, I have no idea how you expect that to happen with such a bigoted mindset.
Also, how do you think that many ugly men or short men manage to find partners? because according to you, if you are correct, then surely they shouldn’t be able to?
You’re clearly stuck in a very toxic echo-chamber which does not allow for your views to change. I really hope that you’ll listen to me when I say that you really should get help and that you’ll feel genuinely happier if you do.
amongthemaniacs 3y ago
Incels aren't a dangerous threat to society for the most part but they're pretty fucked up people. Have you seen their message boards? They talk about wanting to rape women, saying rape should be legal, they say women should have all their rights taken away and be treated like property, they say women are in their prime when they're 14 years old or even younger which is just disgusting and gross, they laugh whenever a woman is killed or commits suicide, they celebrate mass shooters like Elliot Rodger, etc. They're fucked up. They don't just commiserate about not being able to find a date, they say and think some really depraved shit and a lot of them are in need of mental therapy.
https://incels.is/threads/women-gain-sexual-pleasure-from-the-pain-that-is-inflicted-upon-them.254271/
There you go. They think Joan of Arc enjoyed and was turned on by being burned alive. Does that sound like they're just commiserating over not being able to find a date to you?
Thot_Slayer069 3y ago
Incels have the right to do their own stuff and try to better themselves,live their own lives. just dont bother other people and spread toxicity
[deleted] 3y ago
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[deleted] 3y ago
Because PUA concentrate on the "improve game" bullshit and uses lonely men for money - to buy those completely fake guides. You can't build up confidence without external validation.
Guide by PUAs should be: 1.Don't be ugly. 2.Be good looking.
tricerisnake 3y ago
Yea might as well call those who are ugly and below 5’3 incels.
[deleted] 3y ago
5'3 is a hard border, it's way above it nowadays.
Ubi_societas_ibi_ius 3y ago
One of the main issues is that the biggest incel communities (/incel, /braincels) didn't condemned those violent acts, even leaving alone incesto.co (wich always was one of the biggest communities), the general tone of inceñ spaces was a total disregard for women, open hate for them, and making those killers an object of worshipping.
It's natural that society hates them, if their public image is like that.
Scourmont 3y ago
I was an Incel from HS to 32. Basically took my mom's life insurance money and went to the Philippines to JBW. This is how I ended up with my ex wife. I used to talk to those guys alot on braincels and incelswithouthate. It's an impossible situation for them unless they can find balance like I did after my divorce.
[deleted] 3y ago
I was a short kid throughout my school life. I compensated for it by sharpening my intelligence on the whetstone of knowledge. I also never got involved with fights, and was mostly a teacher's pet (for protection). But I can safely say that I don't miss my childhood. I had lost my father young, and was from a less financially affluent background than my peers, hence I was never able to befriend anyone as there was nothing common.
Then I got into engineering, and finally found some peers with similar background, ambitions, etc. I have considerably developed my personality over the last 2 years, by working in technical clubs and student startups. And it is by no help of the society. Rather I'd say in spite of them pushing me back at every step of my life.
Things get better, and remember that you owe nothing to anyone in this world. I'd say that even Bill Gates does not owe anything, yet people are always demanding freebies from his foundation shamelessly from the thought that he owes something to them. Society will always tell you that you are in essence their slave, but you are not. Because responsibility without authority is slavery and that is all that Society deems men to be capable of.
mistralol 3y ago
| . I just can’t technically call myself one because I'm married to someone that I love which is exactly contrary to being an incel
Actually you could be. Since the actual defintion seems to be somebody who has not had sex in 6 months. There are many men trapped in marriage but also fall under the catagory of what is technically an incel. Estimates actually show about 25% of marriages don't involve sex in the western world. So about a quarter of married men are incels or commiting adultry.
The incels as a whole havn't actually gone anywhere. In variours area on the internet you come across them all the time. Try looking for things like the black pill communities. Most of the main stream platforms on the internet don't permit them an existance there now. so they have gone elsewhere.
One of the things that the liberals are doing in constantly changing language. They do this by creating a label to call a group of people a specific label. Then they find a way eg find evidence to tarnish that entire group and hold it responsible for the actions of one.
Once that happens the group either "scatters" or in the case of incels it just kinda rebranded and renamed its self into other language terms which most people in the world has not up to speed in the terminology and language of the new group identitfy they collect under.
As the saying goes of course.... "How very tolerents are these liberals"
They often stand on their ivory tower shouting morals arguments and injustice that must be resolve but actually have no idea or any regard for the long term consequances of their "solutions"
The_Meep_Lord 3y ago
They also are as hateful and vile as the bigots they moan about, they just want to look better Iva virtue signaling.
polishknightusa 3y ago
I'll tell you a story about how liberals, or rebranded as "progressives" after they trashed the "liberal" label, project their intolerance and hypocrisy.
When I was about 10, I went to school and while I was out, my little sister who was about 4 decided to feed the cat so she dumped food all over the floor. My mother asked who did it and she said, without skipping a beat, me. I then just walked in home from school.
Imagine you're doing something naughty, whatever it is, and someone sees you. What do you do? Bribe them? Threaten them? Or better yet, say you'll turn yourself in and then go to the authorities and report that person did the crime. That way, you eliminate them as a witness. You are privileged and attack someone whose weak? Call them privileged and complain that they need to shut up.
As horrid as that is, the traditional-conservative-limited-government types have totally ignored all this happening while fretting about tax cuts and abortion as the culture has gone to pot.
Speaking of that, my sister wasn't punished for making a false accusation on top of doing something she knew was wrong and later turned out to have severe behavioral disorders.
mistralol 3y ago
| As horrid as that is, the traditional-conservative-limited-government types have totally ignored all this happening while fretting about tax cuts and abortion as the culture has gone to pot.
The problem here is that well they are conservatives their approach is a stand off one to begin with. The action is actually "do nothing" and let the problems resolve themselves. Quite often because if you don't have an acceptable solution to the problem which doesn't have massive negative outcomes which can be predicted and have happens in history many times over. The correct action is actually to do nothing.
Its increibly easy to make lots of sweeping changes to a very complex system with the best of intent to make things better. But in fact it can result in making things much worse and at best typically sending them in the opposite direction that what was originally intended.
polishknightusa 3y ago
That's a neat outline of how I think the trad-conservative/limited government mindset works. I chuckle at how when I point out that the left is going to dominate, they say "Well, we'll revolt and use those 2nd amendment rights!" Yeah, the same ones who are afraid to get government involved in anything because it's "so complex" and they might "mess something up" are going to dodge bullets in the hopes that an unlikely revolution will work out.
Instead, it sounds to me like they're clever teenagers who are great at finding excuses for their parents, as Jordan Peterson would put it, to avoid cleaning up their room. "You wouldn't want me to contribute to global warming by using an electric vacuum, would you?"
Do nothing libertarians and conservatives have shown they are as relevant to the modern world as a houseplant except the houseplant generates oxygen.
mistralol 3y ago
Revolts don't always happen the way people think they do. Theres a time for "guns" and theres also a time thats "do nothing" and do nothnig like quite literally "nothing" would collapse things way faster than anything else.
To put it in perspective the cities are almost all liberal. The farmers are all conservatives. Whos going to feed the cities if the farmers mosty down tools and just feed only themselves and their direct neighbours.
It did happen in my country like that in the 70's. Where large groups of people refused to work and blocked all the roads off to prevent others going to work. Took about 2 weeks for the goverment to collapse.
polishknightusa 3y ago
I will agree to disagree with you on that and provide this other observation that just allowing things to go to pot so bad that when a revolution happens, it has to be bloody, is amazingly as harmful thinking as the commies with "breaking a few eggs to make omelettes" except this thinking washes their hands of it by acting like the deaths are natural causes or a revolution they LET happen.
So much could easily have been done to avoid getting to this point and note that I'm not going to be one of those dodging bullets for more tax cuts for the corporations and protecting the flag from being burned. What would such a revolution try to achieve when the majority of citizens live in the cities, suburbs and towns and effectively would try to force a "small government elite" upon a majority leftist nation?
All this assumes that the "USA" is the same USA as, say, back in the 1940's when the electorate of it now is as alien and changed as North America was different between 1500 to 1700.
mistralol 3y ago
I am not sure what exactly. The money tends to move to one end of the spectrum for a lot of reasons and its very hard to stop this from occuring its also not the first time in history its happened.
It actually doesn't matter if its a socalist or democractic system people adapt
and learn to play the game and succeed in making all the money go to one end of the system. Its just what happens.
| What would such a revolution try to achieve when the majority of citizens live in the cities
I am not really suggesting it will happen. Its just one possability. There are many different scenarios which are possible. It just probably won't look like people things its looks like.
ronoda12 3y ago
The thing is no man is entitled to sex. And I agree. But by the same logic no woman is entitled to commitment or relationship.
The_Meep_Lord 3y ago
Entitlement is not a justification though.
Technically speaking, it can be used in every single argument that has and ever will exist.
Are blacks entitled to begin free? Nope. Are we entitled to life? Nope?
Etc, etc.
But does it matter if the person isn’t entitled to x? Nope, the focus is on if it is the “right” thing to do or not.
Entitlement is a method of silencing someone and is a manipulation tactic.
Although you can usually shut it down by pointing out the obvious. Nobody is entitled to anything, but we are responsible for how are actions impact the lives of another.
Survivoria 3y ago
See but here’s another thing, that whole “you are not entitled to sex” bullshit is an overplayed Strawman”
No one is entitled to anything. If he applied that logic to everything in life, we’d be totally okay with naked homeless people and when the question came up about helping the homeless, someone with a rude, shrill tone would say “woah. They are NOT entitled to help!”
No one is entitled to sex just as no one is entitled to shelter or food.
But just as everyone DESERVES shelter, food, and happiness, everyone deserves a loving relationship with sex.
And that’s why I find the whole “you are NOT entitled” argument to be stupid
[deleted] 3y ago
Every single man knows that he is not entitled to sex. The issue comes when the women say that even after he does everything as he had been told, ie. be romantic, be respectful, provide for her, give her gifts, cherish her, blah blah, he is STILL not entitled to sex. Then okay, there is no incentive for him to even acknowledge the existence of women, let alone court them. So eventually men will take the hint and not engage with common women, instead paying for escorts, that interestingly does make them entitled to sex from her. Personally, that's how I go by. I rarely talk with any girl, while my friends and classmates actively behave like emotional tampons in hopes of getting a crumb. I love my work, and even in that I rarely involve female classmates in group projects (not because of sexism, but because very few students show the enthusiasm to perform their tasks in a group project, and fewer girls at that), because when I am the project manager, I can yell at my friends to get off their asses and do their jobs, but I can't speak the same way to a female member, and they actively misuse this hesitation to wriggle their way out of any responsibility and into all of the credit.
ronoda12 3y ago
I have argued this with multiple people and they usually say food shelter is a necessity while sex is not. Now I can show medical journals which say certain neurons in men fire when they are horny overriding their sense of hunger but no one will buy that argument.
The_Meep_Lord 3y ago
Food and shelter is not necessary as those people are replaceable and insignificant. Which is why we have left so many to starve and such throughout history.
And just use slavery and such as counter arguments instead. Are slaves entitled to freedom? No and that was the justification used.
Great_husky_63 3y ago
It became a useful topic for political arguments. The same happened with the Red Pill, it was satanized in spite of its excellent contributions to the inter-gender dynamics.
The_Meep_Lord 3y ago
Red pill and mgtow are still growing and probably more rapidly now.
They just spread out and just drop red pills everywhere instead of one place where it is much easier to control.
yellomachine 3y ago
Satanizing it didn't make it go away. It grew. Eat balls, Leftists
[deleted] 3y ago
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The_Meep_Lord 3y ago
It is a psychological need that is right with food and water on maslows pyramid. Sex is as important as food and water for one’s development and growth. Let that sink in.
While it will not kill you, it will be all you care about until you get it. It is like starving but being unable to die from lack of food.
Your mind and body will suffer until you become a shell of your former self, but it will not directly kill you.
warlocc_ 3y ago
Right? Rich, famous, never worked a day in their lives can go in front of the camera in outfits that cost 50,000 USD and complain about how hard life is, and people take them seriously. But when a man with what is, by definition, a physical handicap expresses frustration with his handicap, he's evil and insulted. It's crazy.
Worse, as the OP points out, it's by the very people that otherwise insist you have to treat everyone equally, insist on diversity and inclusion.
Survivoria 3y ago
In Holocaust concentration camps, prisoners who were especially loyal and well-behaved were given guard duties. Despite being a prisoner and being abused by his captors previously, the prisoner guard would become like his captors, inflicting the same cruelty on others that was inflicted on him.
When examining occurrences like these, I see many parallels when it comes to mods of subs like this one
I see mods demonstrate a level of loyalty and adherence to Reddit policy regardless of the fact that Reddit has silenced and censored subs they don’t agree with, and has done so impunitively.
I don’t understand this level of allegiance when this subreddit can be erased any day. I’d go so far as to say it’s not a matter of -if- this sub will be erased, but a matter of -when-
If I modded a subreddit like this one or any kind of community within a left-leaning big tech giant, I would use my position to influence those on my side to go to a place where they do not have to fear being oppressed and censored.
I wasn’t trying to advertise and I apologize for leaving a link to my MeWe group and I understand how this could give off a different impression than I intended. With that, I want to say:
If you do nothing else, please research Big Tech alternatives. MeWe, Gan, BitChute, Rumble, Vector. All sites that allow free speech and are more pleasant and civil places to be than the Big Tech apps.
I am a content creator and I take great pride in what I make. I once had a great audience on Facebook and thousands would see my articles every day. I was effective and people like what I had to say—Facebook didn’t like that. So they arbitrarily enforced rules on me that they didn’t on others. People threatened my wife and received no punishment. Meanwhile, I did nothing malicious and my account ended up being permanently banned.
Months of tireless work, down the drain.
Same with Reddit. I made an account for my writings. Over a year, I built a lot of karma, and I did it the hard way. All through my writings. But Reddit didn’t like it, so they erased me.
Taking advantage of free speech big tech alternatives has taught me something else as well: that Big Tech apps have some of the most toxic user-bases on the internet.
Throughout my time on FB and Reddit, I experienced unprovoked name calling, bullying, belittling, very bad stuff.
It seems that the big tech Liberal leaning apps all have something in common: Vigorous content regulation In order to keep the community a pleasant environment and free of hate.
Yet they remain the most toxic places on the internet.
I’m currently a member of three alternative social media platforms. There, I never see the level of cyber-bullying and mean-spiritedness that I saw on FB and Reddit
And this has nothing to do with amount of users. MeWe has a lot of users.
It has everything to do with the userbases of these sites. The big tech leftist sites tend to comprise of SJW types, mostly millennial. These people have been told their whole lives that they need to “call out” other people for bad behavior, yet are too stupid to see their own.
Meanwhile, the social media alternatives tend to comprise of older people who are sick of the hypocrisy of SJW sentiment or Millennials who are ashamed to be millennial (that would be me).
I have my share of negative interactions on MeWe, but they are usually over difference in principled positions. I take a lot of pride in running a group where any speech is allowed, as long as we are civil to each other.
In other words, if you want to say the KKK is great, then fine. But do not attack a person and call them names. We tend to be of the school of thought that everyone should be entitled to their position, so long as they are not directly hurting someone else.
That’s why when I make my small “excursions” to Reddit, and I see people who are a lot like me, still trying to make it by on this site, and it makes me want so much better for them. Because for men who think like us to exist on Reddit is a day to day struggle. Not to mention, it gives Reddit validation. It would be so much better, and it would have a bigger social impact, if all the folks like us left Reddit for a free speech alternative.
If nothing else, just look into it. Don’t make the mistake I made and build an account, make friends, and get comfortable, only to have it taken from you. I rest easy knowing that my MeWe account will not be taken from me because MeWe takes pride in not censoring others
InevitableOwl1 3y ago
The big problem is western liberals view men as "privileged" so anything that goes against that is just automatically assumed to be incorrect. No debate.
And this is compounded for white incels. How can you be both white and male and still complain? How dare you?
Whilst not related to the incel movement the casual and brutal dismissal of white males is a big factor towards some of the recent major political events that western liberals seemingly *still* can't (or don't want to) understand - Brexit and the 2016 US election
And should there be an election where a Trump like figure sweeps in but then is a lot more of a competent politician than Trump was then they will howl and wring their hands. It is currently what many on the left in the US fear the most. Yet they still don't understand that trying to put the boot into a pretty large demographic at every opportunity is not a particularly great strategy in the long term
Pic889 3y ago
In the UK, virtue-signalling liberals have even invented a derogatory term to that end: "gammon". Which is not only incredibly racist against white men, but also is an indirect admission that liberals have lost the working class they claim to represent (and dare I say they have also lost the parts of the middle class that don't consist of virtue-signalling liberals).
And then the same virtue-signalling liberals are wondering how Boris Johnson became president. Wouldn't be surprised if the dude wins the next election and gets an even worse haircut to celebrate*.
*for those not in the know, Boris Johnson gets progressively worse haircuts for every political win he lands as a way troll the people accusing him of being unfit for the position. I can't say whether he is unfit or not, but he does know how to trigger them.
warlocc_ 3y ago
That's what's so funny to me about Trump. These people howl and complain about him, without ever realizing that they are the reason he got elected.
D45_B053 3y ago
"All cry about the rain coming in, but none will move to shut the door"
TheLaughingMelon 3y ago
I think the issue here is that so many people use outliers (i.e. extremes) to justify generalisations of entire groups they disagree with but cannot say it publicly for fear of revealing their biases.
E.g. MRA groups, MGTOW etc. Most of them don't really have any negative meaning per se. In fact most of them are trying to support men or uplift them and get them to take control of their own lives and happiness.
The red pill in general just means informing men of how women are in today's world and how to deal with them as well as how gynocentric society is etc. I don't see anything explicitly wrong with that. But feminists can't have that because it means equalising the playing field and taking away at least some of the advantages women have.
The result? Feminists can't publicly say they hate men without revealing how crazy and misandristic they actually are (although we are at a stage where it is almost socially acceptable to just say "I hate men", "All men are trash" etc with absolutely no repercussions.)
So instead they look for an extremist/psychopath and use that to justify their hate.
Why look at an individual and attribute their actions to the group as a whole rather than to their own personal choice? Does the group advocate for/promote the actions of said individual? No? Then why do you tar them with the same brush?
InevitableOwl1 3y ago
Was disgusting? It still is...
Survivoria 3y ago
I’m speaking in terms of their initial silencing of the community. Given that they were successful in erasing them, I don’t see much incel talk anymore, other than it being a blanket insult, along with “nazi”
The_Meep_Lord 3y ago
Always was like that.
History is a play, we just rotate who plays what role then start up the play again.
Currently, incels are the current group that is fun to hate. When in reality they are just severely oppressed people who have been emotionally abused until they are a mental mess.
It is why they end up hating people, many are super toxic and they hate themselves so much.
Even the ones that could be attractive, usually end up unable to get up due to the mental damage the bullying causes.
After a few generations, this will switch again and hating on incels will be seen as bigotry due to lookism being bad. But then we will switch to ruin someone else’s life.
InevitableOwl1 3y ago
Oh - you mean mainstream incel talk? Was there every any mainstream talk that wasn't resoundingly negative? I thought it only became mainstream when those couple of shootings happened and the connection was made
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yeahnotmymainaccount 3y ago
"The first online community to use the term "incel" was started in 1993 when a Canadian university student known only by her first name, Alana, created a website in order to discuss her sexual inactivity with others"
-Wikipedia
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Ubi_societas_ibi_ius 3y ago
Any woman can have sex... With a man that she don't find attractive, that's like saying that any men can have sex by fucking other men.
Options are only options if they fulfill the most basic requirement: making you horny, of not, they're not options.
[deleted] 3y ago
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Ubi_societas_ibi_ius 3y ago
The SMV is a stupid concept of the PUA, what matters is if the person who is interested in you it's sexually attractive to you. If not, it's not even a choice, doesn't exist.
Then I must be a Chad, because I get good results on Tinder, despite being the loneliest and less desired guy of my high school.
[deleted] 3y ago
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InevitableOwl1 3y ago
Indeed I am aware of the other sub
I am glad I missed that thread because as short guy with an even shorter sibling it would have really got me down
As to incel - you are right - it has basically become a word in it’s own right with the meaning along the lines of “overly entitled man who rejects normal looking women because he is porn obsessed and only want blondes with big fake boobs” or something to that effect
As you say - no one acknowledges the etymology of the word and seeks to properly acknowledge the “involuntary” part
As point out by my view on what people now think it means - most seem to believe it is all voluntary despite the very term meaning the exact opposite
Survivoria 3y ago
Get this:
I once wrote a testimonial in a Reddit comment section about my experience being a short man. It got upvoted by about ten people. So seeing that, I figured the post would be viable. I made the comment into a post and it got downvoted.
But if I made the same post as a female who had awful experiences about her height and her weight (the ladder of which is something that she can control), she would garner much sympathy and upvotes, oftentimes even thousands of them.
This is a direct and obvious hypocrisy. It’s also a simple concept that is so graspable. It doesn’t take a high IQ to understand it. But without fail, if you point this simple disparity out, you will be ridiculed, and told that you are talking nonsense. And no explanation will be given on what exactly you got wrong.
Because you got nothing wrong. It’s just a reality that they don’t like, and so they don’t accept it. Essentially, they reject it out of existence.
InevitableOwl1 3y ago
Because women know themselves that they reject short men. They know it deep down. For the reason of them not looking impressive enough both to themselves and their friends
And because they can’t possibly risk having a short man as a son. Because they know themselves how much things would suck for him
It is why some tiny girls are even more likely to reject short guys. I had a 5’2” tell me I was too short for her a 5’6” and advise me to go for shorter girls! There aren’t many below that!
[deleted] 3y ago
"You're cute, but you're too short."
She was 4'11.
Her Hobbit Highness is still trying to get with someone over 6' to this day last I knew and she is, well, no longer pretty.
I cannot understand the people who let one thing and only one thing color their perception of the opposite sex.
Survivoria 3y ago
See, I’m not questioning WHY a short man is not desirable. I know all too well the reason. And luckily for us, out of the billions of girls on this planet, we need just one to accept our height. Easier said than done and sometimes impossible. But there is hope.
However, my beef is when these women are liberal and supposedly so compassionate, when in reality they’re only compassionate selectively and they’ll never admit it. They live a lie and they’ll refuse to accept their bias. They’ll flat out deny their bigotry.
In many cases, a woman will have a subconscious hate and disdain towards short men and she will be nasty to them under the guise of something else.
“He’s a bad person” “He’s a bully” “He’s a bigot “
When really they are no different than a 19th century angry mob with pitchforks who think the Elephant man is a monster. It’s just a modern version of that
Plazmatron44 3y ago
They're not compassionate at all, every position they hold is simply a a way of virtue signalling so that others can feed their narcissism and colossal ego. They're utterly empty on the inside which is why thy fill that emptiness with ideology resulting in awful self righteous people.
Survivoria 3y ago
No I wasn’t talking exclusively about that. Just the misconceptions and the jump to condemnation and the irony that a supposedly tolerant society jumped on these men in pain as being hateful when really they were no different than an overweight woman who can’t find love.
It’s more of the same “it’s only sexist when men do it”
InevitableOwl1 3y ago
That is how the world seems to work now.
It is just like how there are people who claim only whites can be racist. Or that you can't be racist against whites. Seemingly ignoring that China and Japan exist as places...
I recently had a diversity session at work where an Indian heritage guy felt he had to read an article about "how to be a white ally"... (and I of course mean how as a white person you can be an ally to blacks. And somehow he had to be lumped in with the whites...)
mistralol 3y ago
This is more about trying to re-write what the words racist is and change its defination as a whole from the normal defination.
The effect this has is that the word is used in legal stuff quite a lot. So if you re-write the definition and then get the lawyers to use the new definition what is actually happening is a subtle way to change the written laws without going though the normal due process.
MrNeurotypical 3y ago
Well, I was an incel from ages 17-30. I think that's pretty much the age range for men when their SMV is lowest. I was pretty much a school shooter. I had the SKS, trench coat and the ammo and the intent. I was also pretty much a suicide. Put the gun to my head and pulled the trigger and then realized I forgot to load it.
All I can say is that when young men have no chance to have intimacy, a wife and kids, they have no obligation to go along with the tribe. The social contract is broken. This happens at many different levels and intimacy is one of them. There's also the socio-economic social contract that's broken. You can't even afford to have a wife and kids as an average worker.
Society reacted by blaming ME. Trying to sell me all sorts of self help books written by Chads, penis enlargements, Joe Camel cigarettes, girls nights at the bar, flashy cars, Tinder gold, etc. Eventually I figured out the problem wasn't me after wasting a bunch of money.
So I agree, society's reaction to incels IS disgusting. Not because they linked incels to school shootings and suicides, but because they did nothing other than to capitalize on it and blame men for the phenomenon. My father used to say "you can only push a man so far...". Well, modern women have pushed men too far and their greatest fear is that we will start talking and creating mutual knowledge between us.
Rollo was just saying a day or two ago that we need to create our own red pill content to counter the gynocracy. I'm going to be absolutely furious if the mods delete your post as not relevant to men's issues or whatever reason they give. We need more content like this and we need it in the spaces where we are.
Survivoria 3y ago
Well I appreciate this. And I don’t want to flat out advertise my website, but if anyone is interested in seeing more stuff from me, I can show them some pretty good free speech platforms that will not silence us.
Reddit is a slippery slope. Never get too comfortable here. But I run some pages on some alternative platforms and my audience is growing everyday. Again, I say this with respect and not to advertise, but just to make clear that there are other options where one doesn’t have to worry about censorship.
I write and make videos about societal and generational issues as a whole, and the MGTOW and incel category is among the issues that I like to cover. On my main page, we currently have 400 people and a very active chat. And all the subject matter brought up here is very well-taken there.
MrNeurotypical 3y ago
It's very important that we communicate and maintain knowledge. Rollo publishing a book we can all point to and get knowledge from was the first step. I'm not in "the game" but I have 2 sons and one is entering it so I am hyper-focused on learning the cutting edge stuff the manosphere has to offer and passing it along to them. The only way to do that is to read these posts daily, watch Rollo's channel, etc. Just keep creating content from the heart and watch as you sow what you reap. All the fakers and me-toos will fall by the wayside.
[deleted] 3y ago
[removed]
[deleted] 3y ago
No linking to other sites.
InevitableOwl1 3y ago
I thought about the "not being able to afford a wife and kids as an average worker" thing the other day. Was browsing netflix and started watching Bill Burr's "F is for Family". As far as I can tell the guy has a wife and three kids (in the 70s) as an airport baggage handler
They aren't well off. But you'd be pretty much destitute in the modern western world with that kind of setup
Same as people point out the most unrealistic thing about "Married with Children" is how the main guy works in a shoe shop but has a house big enough for his wife and kids and can support them
But it goes beyond average worker. A qualified professional (accountant) in the UK that I knew was supporting a wife and two kids and was pretty much budgeting to the penny. He gave up the private health insurance plan the company included because he could get an extra £400-500 a year. Speaking as someone who used that plan for a couple of operations - not having to wait for the NHS was a massive deal and well worth the extra. But he couldn't afford it...
*
The social contract is incredibly valid and really resonates with me. I honestly have no incentive to bust my ass at work to move up through a company when I live comfortably now and have no immediate prospect of having to pay for a wife or to raise kids. More money would in theory attract women but would I want said women? Sure the prospect of some nicer holidays, an earlier retirement etc would be nice. But if I take years off my life in order to retire early?
I used to remember when we had work Christmas parties that you got to bring partners to. I literally was never able to. The one year I had a partner at that time of year she was back in her home country for it. At these parties we were asked to applaud the "partners" for the support they offered (we might have even been asked to stand up).
And I couldn't help but think how much I could have done with some of that support. And how with said support I might have had the foundation (as well as the motivation as previously mentioned) to propel myself further in my career. But I didn't and pretty much never have. I seem mainly a target for women who need to repair their self esteem after being devastated by the breakdown of a longer relationship (and even then it isn't common). And once they are back feeling happy about themselves they decide they can do better
So no real motivation or incentive.
And if that is cycled though 30-50% (or more) of the male population - what happens then?
warlocc_ 3y ago
The world is stacking the odds against men. No only do you have the topic of this discussion, but then you have the education system and hiring processes prioritizing women, while the costs of everything get out of control.
I make twice what my dad did at my age. I live okay because I'm single, but he was able to buy a house for a family of 4 and pay it off, 2 cars, a camper, and more. There's no way I could do that today on my paycheck.
Chgralac73 3y ago
colleague brought his wife, and she was lovely. he divorced her few years later because she had depressions and refused to take meds. also he had to do not only his job, but he essentially run her law practice of registering companies. you cant make this stuff up
MrNeurotypical 3y ago
Well you basically see the exodus of men we have going on today. I checked out 17 years ago. Quit my shitty job, sold all my junk, and got an airplane to the island of the gods. Met my LDR wife and started the greatest life you can ever imagine together. Something like 10 million people permanently left the US in 2020.Go ahead and be mad at me or whatever but men are leaving.
InevitableOwl1 3y ago
What possible part of anything I have written (pretty much ever) would give you the impression I would be mad at you for spotting how shit the rat race is and leaving it?
I am not from the US so there is no weird patriotic thing where I consider it an insult - which is about all I could think of?
MrNeurotypical 3y ago
I was referring to the people who are mad at MGTOW, incel, etc movements. Like yeah go ahead and be mad and try to shut it down but we can and are leaving.
Traksimuss 3y ago
As Dalrock wrote, men without family work like women - they take 20 or 30 hour shifts to get by, and spend rest of time relaxing.
Why should they work harder, as bit more money or career will not make them happier, but relaxed time will?
That also brings us tax catastrophe ahead - as those people working minimum reduce tax income heavily. And single mothers are very negative tax on society.
Why men who were ignored and attacked by society should care if society burns?
InevitableOwl1 3y ago
I mean I work pretty much the required minimum 35-40 hours. Not shift work
I happen to like where I live and not being on “get by” level but I don’t entertain stress I don’t need
If I wasn’t paying a mortgage I would definitely either reduce my hours significantly or get an easier lower paying job
Ideally I’d actually manage to get up a few rungs at work and then move to a 3 day week to net a similar amount to now. But I think the effort to get there might not be worth it and even on a 3 day week I’d have so much more stress and responsibility
Also I don’t want to imagine how much tutting and incredulity I would get as a single man with no kids only wanting to work part time. I’d imagine I’d be punished at performance reviews just because (another female privilege no one mentions - can never be any questions asked if you work part time hours)
[deleted] 3y ago
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Traksimuss 3y ago
I'd argue that reducing unnecesarry military expenditure and solving medical greed would resolve some of the budget issues, but all kind of lobbies and special groups will prevent that.
Weimar republic is maximum 10 years away, as Fed only solution is to print. And other economies are actually moving away from dollars, reducing need for them.
UBI is not issue yet, college debt for useless degrees and too expensive rent are pushing people to embrace UBI and flirt with socialism.
yellomachine 3y ago
That's why it's so important to pay off your personal debts. Money will soon be worthless.
InevitableOwl1 3y ago
How much are people actually getting ? Is it actually easy to get ? I legit don’t know the answer here. Didn’t I read some states have turned this money down? Or was that only extra covid related money?
We have welfare schemes in the U.K. (and I have always assumed historically much more generous than the USA) but from some people I know it is a real endeavour to get most of them. Like you need to go in weekly and prove you are searching for work etc
The theory behind UBI is that once people are secure they can go and pursue endeavours that drive them. I am skeptical about this in practice. Especially when combined with what we are discussing - lack of incentive for men to do this
And I actually think it is a vicious cycle. Some women of course pursue careers out of drive and greater purpose. And of course they want to be able to afford nice things. But many assume it is like with men and it will help them land a better guy and one who can let them “retire” early with the kids
As Kevin Samuels proves - if given the option most women would not return to work after having children. And most women do want children (although that number is going down)
If men stop striving for success then the women have a lower chance of their early retirement option. So then they will be left with the choice of slave away in a high pressure job or chill back with an easy one and just get buy
So I guess there is a risk that a vast majority relax back and society stagnates
MrNeurotypical 3y ago
You get about $700/mo for food if you have a family of four. At pre-pandemic prices that's enough to have King crab and lobster once a month plus tenderloin steaks every night.
InevitableOwl1 3y ago
In every state? Any admin required ?
How cheap is your food? Unless you mean that is all you use the 700 for. When I am pretty sure people would use it for everything ? Rent, bills, day to day food.
700 doesn’t seem like enough for 1 person to live on where I am from
Unless there are other benefits covering things like housing and utilities ?
Overkillengine 3y ago
This. We have multiple types of welfare programs. All of them get abused because no government is capable of the level of investigative administration it would need to prevent abuse without gross abuse of human rights.
So the useless eaters will continue to consume and replicate and the system eventually collapses and then there is far more total strife and human misery generated due to that than if one had simply had the intestinal fortitude to offer the progenitors at the start a choice of becoming self supporting or starvation.
MrNeurotypical 3y ago
I don't know if it's every state. You can only use it for food. There are other programs for housing and utilities. There is absolutely no reason any person in the US would go hungry or be homeless or jobless. It's a choice. Usually people who want to party. I laugh at the bums holding signs for cash while they stand next to a store owned by some immigrants that have a "now hiring" sign.
OwenWentFullMGTOW 3y ago
I've had the female of the species interested in me since I was about 12. So, I can't say I completely relate to incels. And yet, there are far too many of them (and most of them seem like pretty decent guys) for me to think there's no merit to what they say.
Seems like policies in this country get completely rewritten overnight for isolated incidents involving the various alphabet people all the time. Is it so much to ask that incels are allowed to talk to each other and share their stories?
InevitableOwl1 3y ago
Aren't there stats saying something like 30% of guys under 25 (or perhaps 30) have never had sex or a relationship? Or is the age cut off a bit lower than that
I assume it is in the US
It is definitely a shocking number. Will people take notice if it tips over 50%?
BluepillProfessor 3y ago
People will ONLY take notice when women become affected.
Men die by the millions? Well you know, these things happen.
Women are SLIGHTLY inconvenienced? OH MY GOD, IT'S A CRISIS. WE MUST DO SOMETHING.
InevitableOwl1 3y ago
I guess my musing is - at what percentage of male incels do women actually become negatively affected ?
We already see tiktoks of women screaming that they want a man and can’t find one (due to standards). But I still don’t think it is truly widespread
I have often chuckled as when women try to claim that “incels” actually talk about “government mandated girlfriends”.
Because my theory is that it is far more likely that the government force men to marry or pair up first (perhaps not “mandated partners” but forced due to punitive measures)
Perhaps it will be forcing Chad to breed with whatever woman thinks they deserved him and then forcing a beta to raise the child. Or just the latter part for those who already snared a baby after a one nighter - that is the true horror scenario
Or maybe it will be forced partnering in such a way that the hawt guys are forced to settle down with the hottest women and then everything lines up due to looks. This would be spun as negative to the women and as “mandated girlfriends” when really it would only be triggered in the first place by forcing the guys at the tops to settle and creating a cascading down effect
Either way - in either (albeit far fetched ) scenario it starts not with government mandated girlfriends for incel guys but the other way round. Mandated partners for women who can’t secure commitment
That is my theory at least
Any woman who seriously believe we still live in a world where they will be allocated to a guy is clearly not paying attention
[deleted] 3y ago
It was a study done a couple years ago finding that 1/3 of men surveyed had not had sex in the previous 12 calendar months.
mistralol 3y ago
Yes there is plenty of evidence for it as well https://news.iu.edu/stories/2020/06/iub/releases/15-sexual-inactivity-young-men-united-states-no-sex-debby-herbenick.html
There loads of data been collected. There is also a deeper reason why its happening. Its mostly to do with the complete removal of consequances on women for their dating habits which has happened because of the rise of online dating.
The result of this has been known for some time. Okcupid did a bunch of data processing how people rate each other. The interesting things is men actually rate women on a farily even distribution curve based around the average.
Women however don't. They basically rate 80% of men below average.
https://techcrunch.com/2009/11/18/okcupid-inbox-attractive/
This is also like wild fire because it basically says mens perception of the dating market is reasonable and their expectations are resonable. Its the women's which are massive screwed up.
| It is definitely a shocking number. Will people take notice if it tips over 50%?
No. They don't care. There only 2 areas in which they seem to actually care. How much child support can be paid to have the mother raise the kids and how many kids are being born. This is why the child support laws are going further agaisnt men. They courts in the UK, Canada, USA are starting to pin things like child support, alimony on people outside of wed lock and outside of the paternal father. They are are starting to change the law so that if you played "a father figure" you become responsible for the child support. This basically outlaws dating another example of this is courts ruling for alimoney equivlent after a releationship breakup where the people didn't even live or have kids with each other.
Source: https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/no-home-or-kids-together-but-couple-still-spouses-appeal-court-rules
Thats a real problem in many countries around the world. It takes about 2.2 births per adault women to just keep the population level stable. In much of the western countries its falling (very quickly) lots of EU countries are now less than 1.5 and the USA is falling at something like 5% per year its currently down to 1.73
If you have a figure like a birth rate of 1.5 that basically means your going to have a 30% population reduction. This stuff is indeed being noticed by countries.
Note: The number of men involved isn't important because with only 20% can still get 100% of the female population pregnant. What is being noticed though is the men who are not respionsible are being forced to pay for it. They are starting to refuse on mass.
What seems to be happening to the 80% of men in their 20's get basically nothing. Then when the women have kids they are expecting the 80% of these guys in their 30's to bail them out. So suddenly these men get a whole pile of options. But they are of course also now starting to refuse to commit to any releationship and raise another person kids because all their 20's they were treated like shit by these women which is why the single mothers is also increasing at alarming rates.
ONEJOHNSON 3y ago
Well said sir. Well said.
InevitableOwl1 3y ago
I knew I had seen the figure somewhere
I kind of disagree on the “if it goes about 50%” and people not caring. Seriously if the number gets to 50 or 60% AND the age extends to all men under 30 I think the effects will ripple through
More guys will check out or just scale back work effort. Tax incomes will fall. There will be even fewer cases where courts can find men who have played any kind of father role
And those father role things so far seem to be in the US and cuckistan. Ridiculous alimony doesn’t seem to be a thing in Europe (yet)
Sure the response could be to raise taxes but most politicians are reluctant to do that and can’t get away with it in the long run. Indeed in the U.K. our government sooner took to cutting all the services than raising the taxes to pay for them. People complained - but keep voting them back in anyway in favour of the ones who would try and fund the services
mistralol 3y ago
The thing is.... its actually already more of less there. There like 30% of guys not having sex by the time they are 30. There also an estimated 25% of guys in sexless marriages.
In the UK here its estimated about 40% of the male population is actually single (not married) So when you add up the single and the no sex marriages you actually are at about 50% already.
| Sure the response could be to raise taxes but most politicians are reluctant to do that and can’t get away with it in the long run
Whats actually happening is the men who are working and the majority of the income holder. As the tax rates increase (they are doing this). They are basically bailing out of work in strange ways myself included. I am trying to drop down to a 3 day week in the next couple of years.
Its just how the proportional tax system works here. If I drop 2 days of work from my typicaly week. I actually only loose 1 days worth of pay because the tax rates are soo damm high.
| but keep voting them back in anyway in favour of the ones who would try and fund the services
Yes. This happens. But look very closely at the last UK election where labour (the left) here lost 30% of their voting base in the last election as a whole pile of people suddenly realised that... well they had been voting for these promises of services for 50+ years and its got them nowhere.
InevitableOwl1 3y ago
I am from the U.K.
In the last 40 years Labour have been in charge for 10
So they may have been voting them but the side promising them hasn’t actually won
The switch was mainly due to Brexit + hopeless opposition. If it sticks through the next general election then more investigation is needed
*
As to the percentages - for the purpose of the “motivation of men in society” as perverse as it sounds men in sexless marriages probably aren’t a factor when we consider if the high percentages will have an impact . Because it is often secret anyway.
Complex to think on. I certainly wasn’t thinking about them
I was thinking more about if the figure who “never” have any activity gets to that. If the true incels (in the no derogatory definition but the factually accurate one) become a majority of men
But based on what you are saying the answer might well be “nothing will happen” and the men will shuffle on meekly.
polishknightusa 3y ago
MGTOW is a godsend for incels because it allows men to find their inner strength. The paradigm that's pushed on men by the larger culture is that women define men, "real" men. By learning that we need to define our own identity first, we have a chance at healthy, happy lives even if not ideal ones.
What makes the west so cruel towards young men is a toxic intersection of feminism, "identity politics", and consumerism. Young men are shown how great it is to get laid and are mocked if they don't and no other choices are seen as honorable. Men were even mocked for masturbation and prostitution is illegal particularly in the states. Roosh have gone religious, and I respect him for that, but his stance is impractical for most men in that he was able to find God only after having sex with thousands of women. It's another to ask someone whose lived like a monk, involuntarily, to then become a monk voluntarily.
Indeed, our modern culture is ugly in many ways including self-hating white guilt, consumerism, and a lack of protection for men who do take the risk and start families and get divorce raped. It's not only "ugly", it's unsustainable. It's being invaded by cheap workers who have been imported to replace them similar to a bunch of Romans getting drunk while the Barbarians come in and just slaughter them off.
It's an astounding turn of events from the end of the USSR when GW Bush proclaimed "A new world order" and the belief that the world would move towards peace and prosperity. A mere decade later we'd be living in a police state taking off our shoes at airports and living in a continual state of economic and cultural malaise.
If you want to see how a woman will treat you later, watch how she treats an ugly guy. If she treats him with disdain, that's where she'll treat you when she gets bored. Above average men who sold out and supported this brutal hunger games wind up getting thrown under the bus as well but it will happen with divorce rape. In some ways, incels are lucky (although they don't know it) because, like I said, MGTOW is what happens when men who COULD get laid, but realize it's too risky, VOLUNTARILY drop out.
I'm not, say, involuntarily not an Olympic athlete. I just realized that the risks/work was too much for me, like for most, and didn't compete. But imagine if everyone was shamed if he didn't compete in the Olympics. Wouldn't that be a depressing society if everyone who didn't have a medal was mocked as a loser?
In the meantime, the society drips with virtue signaling arrogance as it cheers on abusing the most weak and vulnerable men.
https://youtu.be/oWLByMshYIU?t=64
Truth to be told, such a society doesn't even admire beauty, really. Look at how it lauds depraved and tattooed up talentless celebrities. Consider by contrast how "normal" singers and even actors looked in the 1950's compared to today. It's not admiration of beauty that drives most in this decadent culture but rather fear of being ugly. A bunch of high school teenagers terrified of being unpopular who never grew up or, worse, that became how the grownups think as well.
Survivoria 3y ago
I agree with you. I find MGTOW to be the self help alternative to the incel movement. And I also like to see it in the sense that any man can benefit from the material.
[deleted] 3y ago
I tried living "women define men" and it gave me years of a mental breakdown.
Going hermit was the best decision I've made.
KangarooCrapper 3y ago
WOW Dude..incredibly spot on!!!!
polishknightusa 3y ago
Thanks so much.
Compare and contrast these guys to "artists" Justin Bieber and Lady GaGa:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjLFMCj82PI
The "girls" I knew from that era were in love with them and still are. Our culture largely died off during the 90's. Yes, a few singles here and there I enjoy but for the most part, this is a wasteland.
Plazmatron44 3y ago
Call me cynical if you want but I reckon that Roosh only "found god" because the whole pua thing was becoming more bother than it's worth and he wanted a way out that would still allow him to carry an air of respectability, he was always prejudiced against Jews and gays but now he does so with an air of self righteous piousness. I know his sister died but we all lose people we love, most do it without becoming like him.
basically_a_genius 3y ago
He was a ticking time bomb for a #metoo rape accusation (that stuck), and I think he sensed this and evacuated the building before it went off.
[deleted] 3y ago
That's only part of it, I think. Like anyone else, Roosh is on a journey. I've followed him for 10 years. He was becoming increasingly tired and disillusioned with PUA and life. He was noticing that repeated casual sex with different partners didn't bring him the "fulfillment" he wanted. He was one of the first in the 'sphere to coin the term "Player Burnout" referring to the monotony and boredom with casual sex. The women he was having sex with were all the same and that it was the same statements and routines he was using to get them into bed. Return of Kings got too hard to keep going because his advertisers pulled out and he was getting deplatformed. His "neomasculinity" concept didn't take off like he thought.
Two things happened: The sphere moved more toward video. Roosh isn't really well suited to video - his videos never really took off. Second, his sister died of cancer, and I think that was a wakeup call for him.
He's like anyone else - he's on a journey. He yearns for a life with meaning and purpose. He didn't find it in PUA. He didn't find it being a manosphere impresario. He ended up where we all do - looking to God.
CSM_Pepper 3y ago
I liked some of Roosh's videos. He comes off more as the proverbial guy you'd like to have a beer with than someone like Vox Day.
moorekom Mod 3y ago
While this is off-theme content, we are going to allow this because it comes from an empathetic place and reminds us of one key truth that must be remembered: silencing people in an attempt to sweep problems under the rug does not work. It just drives people into a corner where they become more rabid and come back worse.
SidRcr15 3y ago
Accurate!!
ONEJOHNSON 3y ago
Wanton hypergamy creates incels, (30% of usa men are "virgins", in an age bracket i cant recall however) And than the women that created said incels attack and pariah these men further for not being or doing as women want. Why should any person be overly amiable and gracious towards those that do them wrong like that?? And the gynocentric based hypocrisy of it makes it all even more egregious and exasperating.
WhereProgressIsMade 3y ago
Yeah makes you realize we like to think we’re smarter now but maybe just maybe they were on to something by pairing every young person off into a marriage. Young women gave up hypergamy in their twenties but were then taken care of in their old age. The beta guys got to have a wife and sex and society benefitted a lot from them being more motivated. Alpha guys probably lost the most from that system but even then they probably banged whoever they wanted on the side it was just covered up better. The evidence for that is in our dna where a much lower % of men succeed in passing on their genes and many probably didn’t realize they were raising another mans kid.
Pic889 3y ago
I disagree with the "beta men got to have sex" bit. They MAYBE got to have token sex once a month after lots of nagging, bitching and "headaches". The single worst thing than being alone is being with people who make you feel alone, and being married to a wife who doesn't want to be married with you but was forced by societal pressure is exactly that. Don't let tradcons fool you into thinking these were "the good ol' times" for the majority of men. Push for the legalization of sex work instead. You'll get sex more than one a month at much lower cost, financial and mental.
Ok_Management4634 3y ago
Amen brother, well said.
Legalizing prostitution would seriously be the best thing to ever happen to men.
Once it's legal, there will be no social stigma to it.. Imagine the average guy now,he can go to Sex-Mart and get laid for $50. It won't be with a "10", maybe a "5" but it all feels good and it doesn't break the bank.. She will probably give some watered down version of the girlfriend experience like strippers do in order to keep the guy coming back.. Prices for prostitution will fall greatly if it's legalized, because just like OnlyFans, young women will see it as very easy money.. If a woman can legally make 50/hour being a whore and not be shamed for it, many will. It's easier than working a real job.
Anyhow, that would get rid of the incel problem. It will put an end to men having $200 dates and not even getting a kiss at the end of the night "Thanks, I had fun.. bye"..
ONEJOHNSON 3y ago
If i remember correctly, throughout history 40% of male DNA has been transmitted, whereas ~98% of females DNA has been.. I may be wrong yet those are the figures my mind is telling me.
But the shrinking of the dna pool is of concern now, given how many women are fathering children to such a small group of men. Time will tell the impact of it.
Ok_Management4634 3y ago
One effect of fewer men passing on their genes.. The average male height is getting taller over the last 30-40 years.. I remember as a kid, the average male height was 5'6". Now it is about 5'8" , I believe. They credit better nutrition and nonsense like that, but come on, people are getting worse nutrition now. Women are selecting for taller men.. I Am a shorter guy, but I can admit the truth. So basically, what happens when 50% of the male population becomes Chad-like? My guess is that only the giga-Chads get laid then .. lol.. funny, but not funny.. Women will always only want the top 10-20% of men to mate with if they have uncontrolled hypergamy.