Sexual attraction is binary. A woman is either sexually attracted to you, or she isn’t. There’s a little bit of a sliding scale. For example, some men are sexier than others, and if a woman has a choice between two attractive guys and all other things are equal, she’ll usually fuck the sexier guy. But for practical purposes, you’re either attractive, or you’re not. She either wants to have sex with you, based on her genuine desire, or she doesn’t.
Getting laid is also binary. You either have sex or you don’t. It doesn’t matter how good your conversation was or how deep your emotional connection was or how well you think you did at “almost” getting laid. You either had sex or you didn’t.
This means that there are four kinds of sexual encounters:
1- A woman is sexually attracted to you and has sex with you because she wants to. This is awesome. This can happen whether or not a woman actually likes you as a person. If you guys are emotionally close, madly in love, or whatever, that’s great. But women also feel sexual attraction for strangers at bars and go home with them sometimes, in the complete absence of emotional intimacy. Or have sex with their husbands/boyfriends, even though they’re fighting about something and don’t feel very close. Sexual attraction is completely independent from emotional intimacy. It’s great if both things are there, but they’re separate things. Despite what women will try to sell you, sex doesn’t depend on an emotional connection. A woman can be sexually attracted without emotional intimacy, and vice versa.
2- A woman is sexually attracted to you, but chooses not to have sex with you. This might happen because she thinks you’re an asshole, because she wants you to commit, because you’ve been fucking other women, because she’s not feeling emotionally close to you and wants you to perform in some manner for her, because she wants to “punish” you for something you did or didn’t do, or any number of other reasons. Women aren’t total slaves to their attraction – a woman can be attracted to you but still choose to refrain from sex. It’s not like women lack sexual opportunity and by giving up sex with you, they’ll never fuck again.
3- A woman is not sexually attracted to you, but chooses to have sex with you anyway. This is classic transactional sex. You’ve been a good boyfriend or husband, so she is having the requisite maintenance sex with you once every 4-6 weeks because she’s supposed to. Or you’re a nice guy who’s good to her and you make a lot of money, and she wants you to stick around, so even though she’s not that passionate about you, she’ll muster up the will to fuck you. Generally, a woman can be emotionally intimate with somebody, appreciate that closeness, and make herself have sex with him, even though she doesn’t really want to. Or it’s been awhile since you’ve had sex and she’s just sick of hearing you complain, so she puts out this time because it’s less annoying than fighting about it again. As with #2, women aren’t total slaves to their attraction – a woman can make herself have sex even if she’s not genuinely attracted.
4- A woman is not sexually attracted to you and turns you down because of this. This isn’t exactly awesome, but at least it’s honest, and it shows you that you have some work to do.
Obviously, while #1 is the ideal outcome for an encounter with a woman, a man following a Red Pill lifestyle should be perfectly okay with #2. If you’re generating sexual attraction in women, you’re going to have opportunities, even if not every woman fucks you every time. It is far, far better to be the attractive asshole who didn’t get laid this time than the unattractive chump who won’t get laid ever. That’s really the core of an abundance mentality. You don’t need to sweat it about any particular woman, because you are 100% confident that there will be others.
Besides, not every single woman on earth is a super-slut. Women have countless sexual opportunities. So some women are perfectly okay not having sex every single time they’re attracted, because they’re holding out for a guy with whom they also have emotional intimacy. Good for them. However, don’t confuse this (as they often do) with the idea that women need to feel emotional intimacy before they’re sexually attracted to someone. A woman’s sexual attraction is independent of her emotional intimacy. She just might choose to withhold sex (even though she’s attracted and kind of wants to fuck) until she’s comfortable with a guy, which is totally okay. Don’t fault women for this. Instead, learn game and how to build comfort, or at least the illusion of comfort.
A Red Pill man can even be okay with #4. It doesn’t matter what you look like or how you act. Not every woman is going to be sexually attracted to you. Obviously, more gym time, better clothes, a more interesting life, and better social skills will make you attractive to a larger portion of the women you meet, but it’s not realistic to expect 100% of women to want you.
And if you don’t look good yet, and your social skills still kind of suck, and your life isn’t in gear yet, you know who you are. And you know exactly what you can do to be more successful, more often, with more women. If you’re not happy with your current level of success, that just means you need to do more work. There is no substitute for real world experiences when it comes to telling you where you actually stand. Be thankful for this, not angry.
The area that no man should settle for, where men get fucked over the most, is category #3. Negotiating with a woman for transactional sex. Trading good behavior (e.g., dates, chores, and gifts), paychecks, emotional investment, and the like for the occasional reward of sex. Essentially, allowing yourself to be trained via intermittent reinforcement, like a dog. Trying to “earn” sex from a woman who doesn’t want to have sex with you, but tells you if only she felt more emotionally close to you (via good behavior, paychecks, and emotional investment), maybe she’d be more open to the idea of sex.
Remember, if a woman ever imposes rules or conditions on sex, makes you wait for sex, or makes you perform or behave a certain way (e.g., an unofficial payment or trade) for the sex, the sex is never worth what you’re going through.
Sticking with a woman in category #3 is essentially giving up. Committing yourself to the path of the loser who thinks he can’t do any better. Deciding that you will never be able to attract a woman who actually wants you, so instead, you’re going to double down and be a good little dog – the best little dog you can be – and subsist on the occasional, intermittent scraps of sex you’re given in exchange for pouring your life into a woman who is secretly repulsed by you doing so.
You are better off not having sex in category #2 or #4 than working yourself to the bone for reluctant transactional sex. Having no sex is better than having shitty transactional sex that you’re over-paying to get.
If you are in box #3 right now, you are operating at a net loss, and the longer you stay, the more bad money you throw after good. Cut your losses, sail away, and find a woman who actually wants you. There are over three billion of them out there. And if you’re not finding any you like, do the work. Hit the gym, excel professionally, up your social skills, develop an interesting life, and learn and practice game. Never settle.
Be sure to check out The Red Pill's off-Reddit site for this and other content. Here's a link.

HeadingRed 9y ago
You missed one-
5- She is horny and you are "good enough". You know how most guys will fuck almost anything if it's easy and they're horny? Plenty of women the same way.
feminists_are_dumb 9y ago
I would add the caveat that transactional sex is okay, provided your are both upfront and honest about it being a transaction, i.e. I give you money and you fuck me.
Prostitutes are not the big deal a lot of people make them out to be. If you are struggling on the open market, banging a hot hooker can get your confidence up for a lot less money that going on a bunch of lame dates.
CommentsAndCriticism 9y ago
Theoretically all sex is transnational, not that I don't see and understand your basic point. If you take a man who is hot and a woman is willing to have sex based on that, it is transactional. The man doesn't give up any of his hotness like a man would his money or time in "transactional sex". However, being physically attractive is still a form of "sexual currency" that is being used to trade. It's all transactional.
Gelu_sf 9y ago
There's one more corollary for #3 - the woman has sex with the husband because she's disillusioned with the Chad, thus somehow punishing Chad via remote sex. "I'll show you! I'll fuck my husband!" . I still can't figure if this is worse than all the other variants or not.
Archwinger Endorsed Contributor 9y ago
It's a funny situation for the women, psychologically.
They actually feel guilty for fucking their husbands. They feel like they're cheating on their affair partner.
I mean, they're already cheaters, so they'll still fuck their husband occasionally to throw off suspicions and punish Chad, but they still feel guilty, like they're cheating on Chad, every time they fuck their husbands.
Gelu_sf 9y ago
Indeed, however in the case that I've examined seeing this, she actually justified things as getting close to the husband at the detriment of Chad. Yet she still professed undying love for Chad.
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fearl3ss 9y ago
If you're going to go for transactional sex, get it with a 3rd world whore. Low time cost, low monetary cost. $60 and you can have everything you want, at the convenience you need.
Spending months to years of your time and hundreds to thousands of dollars on some white American 7 or 8 to MAYBe fuck you is fucking ridiculous - overpaying to the extreme!
It was going to Brazil and paying for dime pussy on the cheap that caused the awakening of Patrice o'Neal, for example.
The problem isn't transactional sex - that's been around since the beginning of humanity. The problem is this ridiculous overpaying of US and European pussy by pussy men.
SgtBrutalisk 9y ago
I think this post sparked an interesting current in my mind: I was up to this point trying in vain to build sexual attraction in women through good feels, but now I realize that sex appeal is either there or isn't there at the very first second we meet. I should learn the signs a woman exhibits when she is sexually attracted and pursue the ones that show them in my presence, like a bloodhound chasing a wounded woman.
MattyAnon Admin 9y ago
Women are very good at pretending it's not transactional while insisting on transactions.
"We can't have sex because I'm tired, maybe if you did the dishes more often..."
"We can't have sex because I don't feel loved, maybe if you took me out more often...."
dxfifa 9y ago
Those maybe things aren't thinks they overtly say either, at least not at the same time as discussing sex. They try to imply you should do more for them in order to make you feel guilt
MattyAnon Admin 9y ago
Women feel entitlement, men feel obligation.
Free yourself from the bonds of the feminine sexuo-resource strategy and do what YOU want.
[deleted] 9y ago
An important point that Red Pill men must internalize. A woman can feel very emotionally intimate with you and have a pussy as dry as the Sahara Desert. Her emotional intimacy with you will not lead to sexual attraction and will not cause her to be sexually attracted.
Most importantly, her emotional closeness to you will not create sexual attraction where it doesn't exist.
Sexual attraction either is there, or it isn't there. She either is attracted or she isn't. And if she isn't, it can't be created by emotional intimacy, proximity, spending lots of time together, your spending money on her, or much of anything else, really.
Sexual attraction is always present at first meeting. A woman knows within 5 minutes of meeting you how far you will ever get with her. If she's not sexually attracted in the first 5 minutes of meeting you, she never will be. If sexual attraction isn't there for whatever reason, there's nothing you can do to create it. Even if you could create it, there's no reason to expend all that time and effort trying to do so with this one woman.
MEANMUTHAFUKA 9y ago
Excellent post. This is exactly why I come back here from time to time. Well done, thank you.
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logicalthinker1 9y ago
Attraction isn't transactional. Attraction is an emotional and a feeling.
When women say they find rich men attractive, they aren't consciously choosing to fuck him because they want to receive money in the future. The appearance of money, wealth, power, etc. actually turns women on in the same way a sexy girl in a tight dress turns you on. She isn't consciously thinking about resources, she just wants to fuck. Just like you don't look at big tits and think "oh my children will have great milk jugs to suck on."
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Entropy-7 9y ago
By "transactional" the OP means you are trading something other than or in addition to sex to get sex from her. Having sex because she wants it from you and want it from her is a transaction, but not "transactional" in this context.
logicalthinker1 9y ago
Transactions are made with rational minds. I partake in a transaction when I buy something from a store. There is an understood exchange of money for goods.
Attraction is not transactional. Rational minds aren't weighing the pros and cons of some situation and looking to exchange one thing for another. It just exists. People fuck not because they are thinking, "hello madam, I would like to trade pleasure for pleasure. Does that sounds like a contract you would be interested in?"
I guess m saying that "transaction" doesn't accurately describe what's happening. A transaction is rational. It's robotic. Attraction isn't.
Archwinger Endorsed Contributor 9y ago
It's a question of spending your resources down a hole and investing in yourself.
If you have to buy sex from a woman, you're just throwing bad money after good.
But if you spend your time and resources becoming the kind of man women want to fuck just by virtue of who he is and what he's like, that's the gift that keeps on giving. As an added bonus, the kinds of guys women want to fuck are also the kinds of guys who succeed professionally, make friends easily, and live interesting, badass lives.
In short, invest in yourself, fuck women, and never buy sex again.
TheRedPhillip 9y ago
As you've stated before, the true win comes when a man realizes that he can be the gatekeeper of commitment AND sex.
forcevacum 9y ago
True. I have a young plate who tried the "if you don't do this thing for me there won't be any sex" card out of her own naivety. The next two times we meet I decline sex (thankfully the backup plate took up the slack). After she left she mentions we haven't had sex in a month and accuses it of being my age. I agree and amplify but it sets the record straight that I don't need sex from her without losing any frame or mentioning my other plate. This sets the wheels spinning, I've almost friendzoned her and she doesn't know where she stands.
NietzscheExplosion 9y ago
Don't agree and amplify an insult, just laugh.
logicalthinker1 9y ago
Her saying that you haven't had sex in a month because of your age is a joking way she can bring up sex without seeming like she is begging for it. She wants it, but she can't outright say that for fear of being considered slutty or whatever. If she knows how long it's been, she's been thinking about it a lot.
p3n1x 9y ago
I'm confused, if she played this card, how were the next two times "your choice" (assuming you didn't do the thing)? Logical flow broken for me.
Its just shit talk on her part if she creates a transaction and never follows through.
forcevacum 9y ago
Yeah, she brought up something she would never follow through on, but even the mention of transactional sex is enough to discipline her. It was shit talk, I refuse to let something like that enter the relationship.
p3n1x 9y ago
I ran into the ugly side of that recently. She held steadfast to her "demand" during our next meet up. She is in a 3 week soft next at the moment.
Even at the end of the 'next', I don't see much of a future. I'm not sure there is much salvation once they go #3.
I agree, good on you.
harsha_hs 9y ago
Oh good hamster. This is the way game has to be played
slothsenpai 9y ago
What if she wants you to go on a few dates with her but she pays for her own drinks? Only a sucker or someone desperate would resort to transactional sex though myself personally, it's mainly the 5-6s (and sometimes 7) that'll jump in bed with me straight away but as for the 8s and above, they always suggest going on a few dates so is that them trying to gain something from me or are they just merely trying to build some trust?
p3n1x 9y ago
Nothing wrong with this. Minimalize the date, don't 'wine and dine' out of fear of "impressing" her. Make her impress you also. Hold frame, talk about sex, kino. The basics.
kez88 9y ago
Could be both. Some girls can be really attracted to you but just won't sleep with you on a given night. Some girls will, some girls won't, even the very same girl would have slept with you the first time 6 months ago but didn't tonight because maybe she just didn't feel like it.
The trick is to have enough going on in your life that this doesn't matter if she takes 1 or 2 or 3 dates to sleep with you, because you have other options, and you're taking her out to have fun and amuse yourself, not to 'get' something from her.
This is why abundance mentality is the core aspect of being an alpha male, and women find it extremely attractive.
slothsenpai 9y ago
Hmmm that's perfectly logical. I do have other girls lined up as well as plates though that girl in particular who I went on a date with was just on another level of hot. I can understand conservative/modest women who'll bide their time in order to jump straight in bed with a guy but that woman in particular goes to all these festivals, wears very risque clothes/bikinis and wore such a revealing dress when we were hanging out in the park on a sunny day so is that normal for a girl with a slutty demeaner to make a guy go on multiple dates? She honestly paid for me more than I did with her so I know she's defo not using me for money or shit like that but I dunno if she's putting me in the 'beta' category.
kez88 9y ago
You're putting her on a pedestal. She's just a girl like the other 3 billion on the planet who shit, burp, fart make dumb decisions and do whatever they want to. Stop being worried if you're 'too beta' or if shes trying to use you as beta bux or the other million things going on in your head. Just relax, be your best self, be funny, be confident, fuck around with her, stop worrying if shes a 'slutty' or 'good girl'. She's just a fucken girl, good girls will sleep with guys quickly, sometimes a 'slutty' girl will make a dude wait, shit just happens sometimes. Just enjoy your date for the enjoyment of the date
nuferasgurd 9y ago
Chances are you're either not escalating properly, forming enough comfort, or she's just a tease.
slothsenpai 9y ago
We both did kiss twice when we said our goodbyes (we each had somewhere to go to after) though the thing I hate about dates is the general anxiety of being unsure of whether or not a girl wants to see me again. Then again, I'm quite bad with dates and a lot better with "let's cut the civil bullshit, straight to the point" sex.
p3n1x 9y ago
Just like a dog that can smell fear, women can smell this. It is apparent in body language (micro transactions). Your tone of voice and your wit.
/u/nuferasurd hit it on the head, improve your escalation game.
If she is taking care of herself and not expecting anything from you financially, then you are failing to hunt aggressively enough. She's hot and you are scared to fuck it up. Hence, you are fucking it up. "She's Hot" and you are treating her differently.
slothsenpai 9y ago
I meant anxiety as in the dread of texting and awaited confirmation if she's interested in seeing me again. No matter how hot a girl is, I honestly don't suck up to them, put them on a pedestal or even pay for their shit but I just felt like taking the gentleman approach and not becoming too sexually aggressive. Last time I tried touching and escalating on a date, it didn't go well. We still kissed in the end though I'm not sure if they do it because they feel invested or if it's just merely out of politeness.
Then again, maybe I'm just so used to the whole Tinder dynamics of "sex talk, go straight to their place, drink, fuck" that I've forgotten how to properly banter or hold real conversations. Regardless, thank you so much for your advice and though I may have come quite far since my blue-pill days, I've still got a long way to go and a shit load more to learn!
p3n1x 9y ago
Technical objective breakdown, not taking a shot at your character
This is 'selfish' on your part. I know the mantra here is always do what you want to do, but if what you want to do is bang this chick / potential LTR, don't assume the "gentleman" is what she is looking for. Are you feeling insecure about being the "bad boy" and then getting revealed later? Will you resent a hot chick for wanting the "bad boy"?
I'm not saying that you are using a pedestal, but you may be sprinkling her in Disneyland fairy dust for your own vision of what you want her to be.
Awesome personal observation. It does smell of laziness / instant gratification complacency. Rejection from Lower Value females is easier for the ego to deal with, because you already mentally dumped them before pumping them.
Listen to her actions, she has met with you more than once. Interest question resolved.
She takes care of herself (paying), hence passively telling you, "don't woo me that way". Gentlemen may bore her.
Funny how we magnetically oppose ourselves sometimes. This woman may be dying for you to "take" what you want and at the same time you decided to be "the nice guy" for a change.
We all do, the learning never stops.
VickVaseline 9y ago
You say that if a woman "makes you wait for sex," then it's not worth what you are going through. Generally, I agree, but what constitutes "waiting" in this case? Sure, 'weeks or months' is waiting. What about 'after my period?' What about 'after the movie is over?'
Archwinger Endorsed Contributor 9y ago
If you don't understand the difference between, "I don't want to fuck you right here, right now, in the middle of this coffee shop table where we just met five minutes ago" and "I don't want to fuck you because I've been hurt in the past by the 84 other boyfriends I fucked within 3 dates and want to take things slower with you", you should fix that basic flaw in your skillset before bothering yourself with Red Pill ideas.
dr_warlock 9y ago
Relevant Reading
1) If You Settle for a Deadbedroom or Duty Sex, You're a Loser
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2) Every unhappy wife is a rape victim
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3) You Can't Negotiate Desire
Jax77789 9y ago
Guys what are your thoughts on chumps who agree on open relationships ? Is it transactional sex ?
Rooster1111 9y ago
Those guys are basically managing the cow and giving the milk away for free. You are either exclusive or in a casual relationship. Open relationships, polyamory, and nonmonogamy are words YOU use on these "modern" women to make them feel better about being a plate. NEVER let them use that shit on you.
If are you both of similar attractiveness she will always have more sexual options than you while still having you as her cushion while she gets pounded by guys hotter than you.
And yes it is a transaction, you're basically admitting that you aren't enough to satisfy her and will trade your dignity for (shared sex).
fatbstardsa 9y ago
The term "open relationship" is a woman's way of describing the alpha fucks/beta bucks mating strategy
Luckyluke23 9y ago
great post man
i really needed to hear this thanks for posting
nevva_Again 9y ago
The most important redpill truth every incel needs to learn is that women aren't anti-sex. They love sex as much as men do, if not more than. They love sex, just not with you.
Understanding this will awake many incels from their bluepill world.
Snowbattt 9y ago
Funny you should mention this. I just dumped a woman for precisely this reason. Long story short, she feigned interest by allowing kissing and rather innocent stuff but wanted me to work in her house that she just bought. She needed a male to do chores like drilling holes, digging holes, painting, etc. Basically, holding a carrot to keep me interested just enough in the hopes I'd follow my dick and be her free labourer.
But I said "fuck that" and next'ed her.
MrBowlfish 9y ago
Couldn't agree with this post more. Sex is men's weak point and it's pathetic to watch how so many will compromise their integrity for scraps. What really gets us is when it's been a few weeks/months and we start getting desperate and thinking "Anything. Give me anything for tonight." That's when we're at our weakest.
DisgruntledWolverine 9y ago
I'd rather sleep with a 6 that finds me attractive than a 9 that wants transactional sex from me any day of the week.
fatbstardsa 9y ago
I disagree. A 9 can fake attraction (or at least satisfy me sexually). A 6 cannot fake a beautiful face and tight body that makes me hard just looking at her.
DenyHerYourEssence 9y ago
This is tenet is so true that it needs a name. Perhaps the 69 Rule...
seattleron 9y ago
Well done. Let's get this added to the official cannon.
DisgruntledWolverine 9y ago
Don't get me wrong, I'm still trying to find the 9 that also wants me that bad ;)
rp_newdawn 9y ago
I like that name. I support making it part of the canon.
The only issue that I see is even IF I was fucking an unenthusiastic 9, I tend to greatly enjoy sex more with a hotter woman and end up creating an atmosphere of better passionate fucking. I digress...
69 Rule FTW.
Transactional sex sucks
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Snazzy_Serval 9y ago
Would you rather sleep with a 4 that finds you attractive than a 9 that wants transactional sex?
That's the choice that most men have. Few men "settle" with a six.
CoupDeGrace22 9y ago
Going for 4's while armed with RP knowledge is an oxymoron at least,if not a waste.All guys here who follow the basics are capable of pulling 6+.
That said,plating lower smv girls is always a more pleasant ride if you're still improving IMO,the difference is always made up from them with increased affection,nonexistent bitchiness and malleability to your kinks.
Current plate is a 6-7 with makeup and shit,but quite bland au naturale,took minimal effort to get her to dress up like a slut everytime she's expecting me to drop by.
Don't settle for scraps even BP losers can get.
[deleted] 9y ago
Now THAT is some real truth brother. Well done.
nsareadsmyemails 9y ago
4 any day, with the only exception that she not be a fucking whale. Can't stand whales, will fuck uglies. Learn to be in the moment, and very little will turn you off in terms of looks.
nezamestnany 9y ago
Being a whale instantly makes you a 3 or below in my opinion
seattleron 9y ago
Hmmmm...will think on this one.
DisgruntledWolverine 9y ago
I'd fuck them both, at least the 4 will be enthusiastic about it.
Snazzy_Serval 9y ago
Fair enough.
Yeah a woman's enthusiasm makes all the difference.
[deleted] 9y ago
But even this shows the problem. We're so obsessed with getting laid that the idea of not sleeping with either of them doesn't even enter into it.
Fuck a woman because you want to fuck that woman. Not because it's been a while.
Remember, every time a high SMV male fucks a woman well below him, it raises the value of pussy. This is where hamconfidence comes from, guys who just want to get their balls drained without any effort pick up a landwhale and now said landwhale thinks she's deserving of a guy of that caliber.
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seattleron 9y ago
May be a good idea in theory, but in practice on the internet with anonymity, it's going to be a trainwreck. Especially with WK's, SJW's, and women making up fake accounts just to troll.
seattleron 9y ago
6's can be the best sex at times. So much less bullshit to put up with, so much more gratitude, and so much easier to stay detached.
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seattleron 9y ago
The appreciation is the best part. And the ease to act like an alpha without feelz getting in the way because you're blinded by beauty. Those girls are much better LTR material as well.
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seattleron 9y ago
That's why the 6's are better LTR material. What you described doesn't happen very often, if ever.
slay_it_forward 9y ago
Thus why hookers are no good. A lot of p4p proponents on trp preaching how awesome they are. Unless you're fatass going to mexico to bang a coked up whore while she shoves tacos in your face, up your game and find a bird that wants your sausage.
DisgruntledWolverine 9y ago
Completely agree, even if you go a few attractive points lower, its better when she actually wants you.
[deleted] 9y ago
IMO hooker is an entirely different category. Transactional sex above is a lie, where the woman in question will never admit the truth. A hooker is a business woman. She does her job, and is honest about it.
slay_it_forward 9y ago
Yes but in both cases they don't want to fuck you, so the end result is the same - unfulfilling sex.
[deleted] 9y ago
Not true. Though I don't have experience myself, from what I heard some hookers are very professional about their job.
slay_it_forward 9y ago
Keep telling yourself they want you
p3n1x 9y ago
Yeah, but with the hooker, you already know that going in
Way too subjective
With the non traditional hooker, transaction is not always apparent or does it even exist in the beginning. Depends on the chick and her game style.
Meat-on-the-table 9y ago
I've said that if men knew how to weaponise commitment the way women know how to weaponise sex, society would be a whole lot different.
As it stands, transactional sex is accepted as the norm is society. How many sitcoms or stupid television shows do you see the man being rewarded for being a good boy with some starfish sex?
Once you accept #3 as being a standard, you've elevated pussy beyond anything even close to its value. And that's when and how they get ya.
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getRedPill 9y ago
People think christianity is the most popular religion in this world, or whatever religion. Truth is, PUSSY is the second biggest religion in this world next close to State Worship which is first place
Your_Coke_Dealer 9y ago
Of course men can weaponize commitment. It's called dread game.
Brixylian 9y ago
Ya, transactional sex is abhorrent. Especially, when she's transacting w an attractive successful guy, giving him free reign to objectify her to his hearts delight. Oh yeah, I forgot, when every part of her is soaked in your cum, remember It's all about her tingles. Right...AWALT. Cuz attractive non-beta guys don't need no stinking transactional poon.
vagbutters 9y ago
Weaponizing commitment is exactly how societies thrive/flourish. The only way my son marries your daughter is IF she is a virgin, IF she can be a good wife to him, IF she can cook/clean, etc. otherwise she can go fuck the sheep for the rest of her life.
When beta males surrender commitment easily, it allows women to use sex as a weapon.
Entropy-7 9y ago
Marriage is a one-way commitment, and in Canada shacking up can get you tagged to support the bitch and give her a bunch of money if she leaves you. Similarly, women are about twice as likely to default on child support payments in the rare cases where the man ends up with full custody.
There is no way to weaponize commitment when there are no consequences for women to walk away from their commitments and then have the courts and police enforce yours.
p3n1x 9y ago
Absolutely none of that makes your son "Alpha" in this scenario.
Just saying.
If you are RP, a father and have a son, maybe focus on that and not some horseshit marriage rules.
Having "demands" pre-marriage and trying to make it sound "hardcore" is pure bitch. So is forcing your son to fuck a specific pussy.
Better option, Don't get married.
[deleted] 9y ago
We only have so much energy. If your spending all your energy on bitch management your not building an empire. If you have an empire you can't have the openess and trust you want. You won't have enough time to develop and if she presents it you'll have to worry she is trying to game you
vagbutters 9y ago
It can go either way, but you've missed the point entirely. In a RP society even the most beta of males are guaranteed a woman who isn't a slut and has good values of domesticity. This is because even the beta males of such a society do not sell their commitment at a low price.
There was no assertion of "forcing" one's son to marry a specific woman. Maybe you should learn to read closely before you type.
p3n1x 9y ago
This statement says you are claiming control. You even capitalized IF to intensify the mandatory requirements.
You also said "societies" (plural) No way I could infer you were singling out RP
"Weaponizing commitment" vs. "sex as a weapon", the easiest way to nullify this is not to escalate the warfare, but to remove "commitment" as a whole. Male currency is "Time" and "Attention" which are much more valuable precursors to commitment.
Maybe I missed your point, but you are overlooking mine also. You can't weaponize commitment/monogamy/marriage (whatever label you want to use) if it does not exist.
vagbutters 9y ago
What do you mean by "singling out RP?" Multiple societies in the past have been (and currently are) RP in nature. This means patriarchy, respecting what alpha fathers have to say, etc.
Good luck with that if you're trying to build a sustainable society. Like it or not, women as faithful wives and mothers have been a major hallmark of successful societies. When most women become sluts it's the beginning of the end. It's a sexual free market at the end of the day, and you don't have to sell your commitment if you don't want to. In a day and age like today, I agree that selling commitment at all is a bad idea. My point is that in the "natural" society, males do generally sell their commitment, albeit at a high price.
[deleted] 9y ago
Lets make a good work of my financial skills.
Pussy inflation will cause a sexual crisis because men will realize that they're making a mistake. (Im optimistic!) If this happens, the value of a pussy will drop immensely. Probably birth rate might even drop by 50-60%. We might assume it as the end of the world.
But
It's just a typical bubble like the financial crisis. The world will move on and probably men's rights will improve by then.
Meat-on-the-table 9y ago
You really are optimistic. The sad truth is that men will always be thirsty and try to rise to what they perceive to be the challenge of their failing masculinity, rather than examine the fundamental flaw in their overall reasoning.
[deleted] 9y ago
[deleted]
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^0.9185
TheRedPhillip 9y ago
To quote Dave chappelle and Talib kweli, if pussy was a stock, it would plumit on the Nasdaq. The market is flooded, and they did it to themselves, so it's not worth much of anything. That's the mistake category #3 makes. They put it on a pedestal. It's men's mistake, not women's.
skoobled 9y ago
I consider it a failure of self control on the part of men - you just need to get enough experience under your belt to realise that any relationship with a woman has its price, and its risk of blowback... Or perhaps just that aging decreases the sex drive, which at least makes one harder to fool...
p3n1x 9y ago
no, keep it at experience.
There are plenty of heart broken 20 somethings that can barely get it up ... 30 something porn / pot freeks that are "soft" at their hardest.
Men just need to learn to move on from chicks that aren't into them. We see it repeated here a lot, but less and less information on why guys fall into their self built ego trap. Women manipulate it and men fall blind to the hypocrisy.
A man can be more easily manipulated through his ego vs. sex drive. Being a bug-eyed goofball horndog just simply adds another option to the female toolkit.
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41ph4 9y ago
i figured that was MGTOW. the weaponising of commitment, by total withdrawl of conmitment, and resources.
Meat-on-the-table 9y ago
Optimally,yes. But women only care about the commitment of men they find appealing to begin with. Unfortunately, that precludes a good section of MGTOW.
Appleseed12333 9y ago
That is true, but also true for society as a whole, so largely irrelevant.
Archwinger Endorsed Contributor 9y ago
Nobody cares if the mangy, smelly, stray dogs that nobody was adopting form the pound anyway refuse to participate in dog shows.
bowie747 9y ago
I would like to say that I was banned (despite protestations) from MGTOW for saying that biologically, evolutionarily, we only need ~40% of the males we currently have. Implying that in nature 3/5 young men would die, because they failed life's tests. Mods said it was RadFem.
It's more a circlejerk of justification than it is a philosophical assessment of life. They make some good points, but overall I think they're either too unintelligent or too lazy to grasp the greater concepts. Or too cowardly to face them.
BluepillProfessor 9y ago
MGTOW //=// TFL
MGTOW includes short term relationships with girls but no LT commitments. Maybe you haven't seen all the whining about guys refusing to "commit" coming from the media henhouses?
[deleted] 9y ago
Yes, but it used to be that MGTOW was comprised of men who really were going their own way and having relationships on their terms, including relationships with women.
They were men who could get with women, but didn't have relationships except on their own terms.
the MGTOW banner has been almost completely coopted and subverted by
--Omegas who can't get laid no matter what work they put in
--Omegas who tried to improve and still can't get laid
--Omegas who cant or wont put in the work to improve
--Incels
They are unattractive men who spend all their time complaining and bitching; and telling the whole world about how they're GTOW.
Men who truly go their own way STFU about it, and just go their own way. They live life on their terms. They don't avoid women or talk shit about women constantly. They actually have liaisons with women sometimes. They understand the ebb and flow, the waxing and waning of attraction and relationships. They don't complain all the time. They just go their own way.
[deleted] 9y ago
exactly this. if you truly don't care, just go on with not caring. you don't go online and whine to a bunch of men about how much women suck (which is passive aggressive AF).
yes there are MGTOWs who do it right, but there are increasingly beta/sigma/omega losers moving in on the MGTOW campgrounds, and using it as a place to vent. i always found it hard to be associated with MGTOW because of this. i like to fuck sluts. i like what i have built. it's not marriage 1.0, but times are changing and so are the rules. whining about the rules is for losers. i'd rather just play to win.
tallwheel 9y ago
Well, let's say his point would be correct if we were talking about what MGTOW should be, not what it's actually comprised of. LOL.
Yakatonker 9y ago
Your definition of MGTOW is PUA if anything, a problem with men who's egos are hinged upon the framework of pussy. I don't blame you as you're sadly the norm in the bell curve.
What is MGTOW?, It's a quality of life philosophy for the super majority of men and it's also the core of the red pill. MGTOWs are interested in the decimation and reduction of Gynocentrism in a human system, they interested in some form of egalitarianism amongst the sexes where most men won't be harvested by the Gynocentric system.
MGTOWs are also interested in the community of men, the creation of a framework of male thought detached from women, Gynocentrism, and the tribalist men who uphold the system as the minority of beneficiaries in a Gynocentric system.
So you see you should STFU and take it like a man, because as a PUA with no foresight of the red pill besides as a means to fullfill your sexual hinge you have a ways to go.
Archwinger Endorsed Contributor 9y ago
This.
The valuable men who opt out of commitment with women, that women wish would commit, aren't the ones posting on the internet about how they're opting out of commitment.
[deleted] 9y ago
Strangely enough, if some of these men would get off the internet and really go their own way, and live life on their terms, that might actually increase their sexual attractiveness.
PaperStreetVilla 9y ago
bros before homes
[deleted] 9y ago
Society has been completely reordered and reengineered to prevent men from weaponizing commitment.
In the US today, if you're married and have a kid or two with a woman, you are effectively barred from "weaponizing" commitment. In fact, withholding commitment for ANY reason, including her poor treatment of you, is "abuse".
Threaten divorce because she's treating you like shit? verbal/emotional abuse.
Stop working or work less because she's a fucking bitch? Financial abuse.
Control her spending because she's a spendthrift who's spending you into bankruptcy? Financial abuse.
Put her on a budget? Financial abuse.
Push for sex? Emotional abuse, rape.
Ask her not to cheat on you? Verbal/emotional abuse.
Engage in a loud verbal fight with her? Verbal abuse.
Hold her to standards of conduct and character? Emotional abuse.
Having any expectations at all of her or your marriage? Emotional abuse.
Threaten to withdraw commitment because of her shitty treatment of you? Verbal/emotional abuse.
RedBigMan 9y ago
I say fuck the bullshit 'financial abuse' crap. Financial abuse is just a buzzword by SJWs and won't stand up in court if you argue logically.
Alternatively, lots of married guys find out that once they get divorced barring 'child support' stuff they tend to be better off financially.
Women as a whole are parasitic, they expand their needs to fit the income of the man they've attachd to.
sd4c 9y ago
Most of this abuse, which is, by the way factually true (I have seen all of these line items on a state government printed "circle of abuse" chart)- most of this abuse can be avoided by refusing to cohabitate with a woman.
DO NOT COHABITATE WITH A WOMAN UNLESS SHE IS PREGNANT WITH YOUR BABY. Ever. Under any circumstances, yours or hers. Get a motel room. Let her sleep in your car. Borrow money, sleep on a friend's couch. But anything more than 72 hours together and you, sir, are fucked
Meat-on-the-table 9y ago
Abuse basically means a beta doing something that doesn't please the woman or let her do whatever she wants.
sd4c 9y ago
Fuck "abuse". Figure out what will stick in criminal court in your area and what won't, and do anything you please that's legal. For example if you yell at a cheating woman in Portland, expect to be killed by the police. Whereas in Latin America (NOT Spain!) the cops will probably join you in yelling at her.
BluepillProfessor 9y ago
Most of these only apply on Facebook and Twitter, not in courts or even the real Blue Pill world. They can cry "emotional abuse" all they want on these items and I can cry "fuck off bitch."
Yah I know, Duluth Model. These ARE the standards used by "therapists" and "marriage counselors" which is why we say 'just say no.'
a_scourge 9y ago
Firstly, I cannot see my son unless I go through a 12 month Duluth model course. Courts disagreed but social workers have overridden them. I'm actually happy to do so because I'm aware that years of trying to fit my manhood into a blue pill box has fucked me up in ways that even Duluth model might help.
Secondly, you are wrong, one can be charged with crimes for exactly the kind of thing that /u/PemBayliss listed. It's actually a good development because a) only the very stupid will get married now and good riddance to them and b) it reduces the need for a woman to cry "he hit me" or "rape" just to get a big fat divorce payout. In fact I think that a woman should be able to say "I want 90%, no reason given" if a man is stupid enough to get married to an abusive woman: forcing them to lie to get the payout only makes a bad society even worse.
EDIT: Please note that the above mentioned law has so far not ONCE been used against muslim men who beat and mutilate their women and force them to walk 10 steps behind them. However it has been used to go against non-muslim men already (not surprised that they have started with the crazy stalker husbands who could have been charged under a dozen other laws anyways, or resolved with a restraining order which has always been part of the legal framework. Isn't it great that a woman would rather have her husband sit in prison for 2-3 years rather than just separate and if necessary get a restraining order)
BluepillProfessor 9y ago
Ahh, glorious Red Coat land. The U.S. is only a few years behind
skoobled 9y ago
Is it not also the standard used by the police (at least in the US)? Ie. She gets the benefit of the doubt, you get locked up
sd4c 9y ago
Roll tape of all verbal arguments, always, no exceptions. The tape should consist of you calmly requesting she leave. It is your only defense, since their word is gold, even if you are a judge (literally- this happened to a judge in Texas, cleared of domestic abuse which was self-inflicted by his gf who he caught on video framing him)
BluepillProfessor 9y ago
Yes, that is the standard of police, protective services etc. That is also the standard of the prosecutor and the judge. Only in actual jury trials is it actually assumed "innocent until proven guilty."
[deleted] 9y ago
[deleted]
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^0.0707
[deleted] 9y ago
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[deleted] 9y ago
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^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^0.4547
seattleron 9y ago
Holy shit, you got a link for that?
[deleted] 9y ago
Link for the divorce rate statistic?
rorschach34 9y ago
I think a study by American Sociological Review explains this phenomenon. The actual rate is a 3.3% probability of divorce in a year if the husband does not have a full time job. People who have full time jobs have a divorce probability of 2.5%. So unemployed men are 33% more likely to get divorced in the next year as compared to men with full time jobs.
http://time.com/4425061/unemployment-divorce-men-women/
http://nymag.com/scienceofus/2016/07/husbands-job-predicts-divorce.html
PanzerBatallion 9y ago
It doesn't exist.
Like, it literally doesn't exist. It's one of those things where something similar was said one time, and now it's been repeated and overblown and now it's "fact." It's one of those things that hurts this sub quite a bit.
There was a July 2011 article in a lot of online publications that referenced a study that is no longer online in the target link that states that stay at home dads have higher divorce rates, but it doesn't say what that number is, or much else, mostly because news reporting is complete shit and numbers don't sell. This is an example of the article, there's a bunch more out there. You'll find no actual numbers, and a dead end link to the study - https://marriagegems.com/tag/stay-at-home-dads-have-higher-divorce-rates/
Regardless of the reasons why, it's a shit statistic just like the "50% of marriages end in divorce" statistic which is always taken out of context too. 50% of marriages do end in divorce, that is true, but what's not said is that guys like Larry King are bringing down the average. Most couples actually do stay married.
[deleted] 9y ago
[deleted]
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^0.7701
PanzerBatallion 9y ago
Right, which makes the whole "you have a 50% chance of getting divorced if you get married" thing that's bandied about completely inaccurate, and it needs to be called out.
We need to be making our cases with facts, not statistics we modify for our liking.
[deleted] 9y ago
[deleted]
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^0.8908
rp_newdawn 9y ago
Thank you for posting that information for us to learn from
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Benny757 9y ago
Great post! I experienced this transactional sex business with a recent relationship. About a month in, "she" starts using the old "ahhh if you don't do this, or keep that up, no blow job for you!" My immediate reply: "Fuck that, non-negotiable, no transaction, you lose. Women are abundant. I could replace that in a heart beat." Saying this to her literally shut her up and never, ever did I hear that from her again. Worked like a charm.
Archwinger Endorsed Contributor 9y ago
You're still negotiating with her by calling her out and confronting her with an ultimatum.
She's saying: "Do X or no sex"
You're saying: "Sex and cut this out or I dump you."
That can work sometimes, with the right girl and the right circumstances, but a more universally applicable, blanket response would be to either say "okay" and leave (or kick her out) then fuck her if she comes back in a week or two, or to agree and amplify and tease her a bit about the kind of women who request payment for sex.
Direct communication and ultimatums are the nuclear option when you've run out of better options. You can't hit every minor shit test with a full-on nuke. Ultimatums, especially, are a fairly weak alternative when you've got nothing left. An ultimatum doesn't say, "I'm awesome and will stand my ground." It says, "I'm too weak to control this situation in any way other than a direct, overt threat."
Benny757 9y ago
Good points. And true. The relationship never lasted. I was able to step back and walk away though.
red-adherent 9y ago
Recently I encountered a women who views me in #3 terms, she wants me as a beta orbiter. In the past I would have just completely tossed her aside in favor of my dignity or pride.
This time I am thinking of keeping her around and using her as social proof, she's just hot enough for it. She is in my social circle and abuses drugs and rides the carousel hard so I know exactly who she is. I bet if I bring her to the club with me, I can use her as social proof and probably end up fucking her every once in a while too.
What do you think? I want to start using these women for a change
[deleted] 9y ago
this is fine as long as you limit the 1-on-1 stuff to ONLY situations that end in sex. if you're with her, it's either in a group (so you get social proof) or it ends in sex. anything else means she's abusing you as an orbiter.
she can't friend-zone you if you fuck-zone her.
Archwinger Endorsed Contributor 9y ago
If a woman is willing to have sex with you and thinks you're going to trade her something for it, but you never make good on the trade, it's her fault for paying before you did. Take the sex that's freely given.
But hey, what you propose sounds like fun. Some girl thinks you're going to take her out and show her a good time and spend money on her while she ends up not fucking you -- but then you spend the whole night at the club talking to other girls and never buying her any drinks. And every time she comes to try to pull you away or divert your attention, you try to escalate, and when she stops you, you go back to other girls. That could be fun.
DisgruntledWolverine 9y ago
That is the fucking play right there. Archwinger, you are a genius.
BluepillProfessor 9y ago
That would be fun to record!
Prediction: Assuming you are flirting hard and other girls are smiling/responding/laughing, she will stop her coyness by the 3rd escalation and hump you right in the club.
red-adherent 9y ago
Thx for the advice bro, this is part of my red pill transition. Not being buthurt and instead turning these situations around on them. Otherwise I waste my time figuring out if they view me this way and have to move on until I get one that wants to fuck. I'm getting better but it's just too much sunk time between lays, I want to get something out of every single one of them.
Joseph_the_Carpenter 9y ago
DO only spend your time on women that you can get something from in return for it.
DON'T approach women in a predatory mindset (ie how will I get something from this one?).
I think it's worth a shot trying to use a woman as social proof for yourself, but don't make it a go-to strategy or a crutch when the best strategy is still be attractive. Being 190lbs of muscle, for example, is your best shot and life on easy mode with women.
[deleted] 9y ago
Most RP newbies learn #3 immediately. Is what brings here in the first place. #2 however didn't get in my mind until very recently...there are many women despite being sexual attracted to you won't have sex with you!
BluepillProfessor 9y ago
Very great work Arch!
It's all good to this point.
I disagree in part here. In many cases of category 2 the man IS the asshole, or the pussy and needs to change. I agree in most cases it is simply the woman manipulating like a whore by slinging access around but not in all.
Further, in Category 3 (not attracted/will still fuck) you can sometimes fuck her good and get her attracted quick. The Book Sex God Method is the go to for accomplishing.
Category 4 (not attracted/won't fuck) is what we call "a typical marriage."
want2playzombies 9y ago
if you have the spare cash and looking for a good time i see no issue, if you make a habit out of it and dont have the means then i see your point but splurging on a hoe in a blue moon isnt bad man.
ingenjor 9y ago
Well said. Exactly the reason I broke up with my LTR. After that experience I've been obsessed with never being #3 again.
DisgruntledWolverine 9y ago
I was in a LTR for about 2.5 years , things were never "right" I always wanted more out of it, it was a total #3 situation.
I kept trying, and putting in more effort and energy.
But the truth is, you literally can not negotiate it... no matter how hard you try.
Then I found the red pill and woke the fuck up.
So from there forward if a woman isn't "fuck yes" when it comes to being around me, with me, fucking me, then she isn't worth my time.
I will never put that much effort and energy into a relationship/women ever again, and I am probably better for it.
Pragmaticpandas 9y ago
This is such truth. Wasting your time on women who aren't enthusiastic to be with you or fucking women who aren't enthusiastic to be fucking you is foolish.
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Godtiermasturbator 9y ago
What about whores? Like a plate who gives out enthusiastic sex she seems to even enjoy, for gifts that are quite affordable?
Archwinger Endorsed Contributor 9y ago
Why not try to give them sex without the material goods?
If you're paying for sex, you're paying too much. There are too many women giving it away for free. To the right men. Instead of spending all of your time and resources buying sex, invest it in becoming the right man.
MGTOW_player 9y ago
On the flip side, you could say if a man can't regularly pay a hot prostitute for sex he isn't making and saving enough money.
I have a few plates and still regularly visit prostitutes that are more than affordable given my current income. I doubt many full time working men can regularly smash 3+ new hot plates a week if he so chooses without paying for it.
Big money plus game is fun.
Papiless 9y ago
One of my plates is literally spending money to have sex with me. Change the paradigm, become the prize. Make her your beta bucks.
HS-Thompson 9y ago
If you're a man of some means you will literally never find cheaper and more efficient sex than paying for it. I have plates that will literally come over on command, but it is still often easier to swing by and bang a K-girl on the way home from a business dinner and then get some well needed rest.
officerkondo 9y ago
Finally someone who gets it. TRP often throws out the sex worker baby with the beta bux bathwater.
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aanarchist 9y ago
as much as i've always believed in compromise being a healthy thing, it's not healthy to compromise with a woman. the moment you compromise signals the decline of the relationship.
sd4c 9y ago
Compromise? Do not negotiate with terrorists. First it's hot pizza then eventually they want weapons and a helicopter.
As for oneitis, no pussy is better than bad pussy- and all pussy goes bad, like milk, unless kept cool with the chill emanating from other pussy you can bang (dread game).
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p3n1x 9y ago
Oneitis is a good word for this.
postreformedpua 9y ago
This is so spot on. In my marriage I once allowed wife to post to GW for a blowjob, thus cucking myself for sexual attention. I felt so bad after I didn't do it again. I was an idiot so please don't be like me, listen to Archwinger.
BONUS CRINGE taking sexy pictures of her just so she would shut up about it, which she later shared with a work colleague / best friend. Winning!
LordThunderbolt 9y ago
Are you gonna link to her pics or what?
harsha_hs 9y ago
I think he can do it, now that he's divorced.
get_unoffended 9y ago
Legitimately great post OP. Thanks for sharing this!
circlhat 9y ago
Some deep shit right there, Its easy to fall into this trap because women communicate covertly, she is never going to say the sex is transaction but rather lets focus on emotional connection which is code for get the fuck out
Banned_For_Opinion 9y ago
Everything is about sex, but sex.
[deleted] 9y ago
And sex is about power.