Summary: It feels wrong to work hard and/or change who I am to please others, so I can get some pussy and love. But is it wrong? Did you work hard to increase your SMV and lays?
I worked hard related to academics and business and I usually got what I wanted, sometimes more than what I dreamed. But I don't remember working hard related to SMV, girls, social life or social status. For some reason, it feels pathetic to work hard for those. It feels kinda pathetic to wear clothes other people would like, or talk differently to seem more confident, or to spend more energy to be more charismatic, or go to something like a dance class to find a woman to fuck, or lift to fuck better women (I mean it's fucking stupid to lift heavy things repeatedly, would you do it if other people didn't exist?). It's kinda pathetic because you are you but you sacrifice yourself and become someone else, just to get pussy. If you're like a chameleon, what is the real you? If real you doesn't exist, is the pussy you get real?
Women gatekeep sex. Their gatekeeping algorithm is determined by media and her friends. I reject whatever they believe in because they usually believe in retarded stuff and they are kinda retarded. So it feels pathetic for me to change who I am to make them happy so they give me some pussy and love.
Also, this subject feels like something that is supposed to be natural. It is a more personal thing, not like a business. In a business, goal is to profit and beat competition. Well I am me, I have an ego. My goal is not fucking. My goal is keeping me happy.
In business, there are no personal preferences of different egos. So doing something to beat competition bothers me 0%. But in sexual marketplace, doing something to beat competition usually means something like wearing stuff I don't want to wear because some other cunt set the rules to his liking through his media and it feels pathetic to obey that just to get approval from others.
I didn't have to change who I am to to enjoy the things that I have. I am fairly free. I can live anywhere I want in the world. I don't have to trust a country, government, company or personal relationships for survival. I might permanently retire before I am 40. I worked hard for these but I didn't feel like I was sacrificing who I was. Working hard was making me more of what I am. But with SMV stuff, it seems working hard will make me less of what I am, it just seems like supplicating behavior.
So how do you think about this? Is this something you work(ed) hard for?
My goal in asking this question is see if I can change my mind so I can work hard to increase my positive experiences, which might include increasing my SMV, number of people I meet, lays.
First-light 1w ago
I think you have hit on the PUAs problem -he has made his life's object being an unpaid entertainer (usually of very shallow women). He is not being himself, he is being an illusion of high value. Clearly the less illusion and the more reality the better but in the end he is aiming to play his best game, a lot of which are just give off false tells of high value -like dress, vehicle driven, spending on dining out, some even spend hours in the gym becoming only slightly more athletic but heaps heavier and farting all day long from protein supplements. The PUA is a little ridiculous.
Self improvement is a wonderful thing and it raises your SMV but making yourself into the key that opens the gate to pussy is a big self sacrifice for what? Emptying yourself into a cum dumpster? I have never bothered.
Just improve yourself for yourself. Women will come along who like you for who you are. You will play up a bit for them because you like them for who they are. You will sacrifice a bit for them because they are worth it as they like you or at let tolerate you for who you are (more or less anyway because there is no perfect match). You will have a lot less casual sex than a PUA but you will get your life for yourself.
To some extent you have to give a little in life to get a little but also life is a zero sum game and if you give out too much to women (who are basically the takers in life) you will become a shell of what you could have been -something that is only valued by what it does not who it is -in fact just another massive Beta that exists primarily to please women.
sean_karaya 1w ago
PART 1/2 [ Read comment for second part ]
DISCLAIMER 01: I am a Beta nerd, wear glasses, I am 3/4th Indian, and 186 cm tall (5 feet 13 inches for Bald eagle and Assault rifle units)
DISCLAIMER 02: If you are looking for how to be the next superstar alpha chad, My answer wont do anything.
If despite the above two disclaimers, you are still reading, here is
DISCLAIMER 03: I have a doll.
If you want to stop reading here, you are welcome to do so. If anyone is trying to convince me to do something else, I ain't gonna.
Are you still reading? Now comes
DISCLAIMER 04: I can't answer your queries. I can't advice you. I can't teach you. I can only offer you a description of the paths I walked, and the paths I saw / learned others walking. Based on those descriptions, you need to decide whether my ramblings have anything parallel to your experience or not. You are the only one who can decide whether my rants offer you any comparative reference or not.
Still reading? Good
Desire
========
My starting point is understanding my own desires.
Validity
Stoicism says that you need to practice aversion. The Hinayana Buddhism also says the same thing. I admit I read neither text in it's original. But Vajrayana Buddhism says by commanding your desires your own desires you may reach nirvana.
My personal stance
I have no reason to suppress my desires. My desires are integral part of myself. I have no reason to cut part of myself to conform to someone else.
In fact, you touched on this as well, as you speak about business. Without quoting you back, I separate my life in the outer region of battle, in which I am willing to play cloak and dagger, smoke and mirrors - as well as compromise my desires to a certain degree. This is business.
In my personal life I have no reason to compromise my desires.
Now people who do not qualify to enter my inner sanctum, yet want to benefit from the perks of my inner sanctum do try to convince me to live my private life like a business. This includes boomers, bagasse women trying to convince me to go in a rElAtIoNsHiP with them, etc. But they do not add sufficient value to inspire me to follow their demands.
Description of Desire
I had always wanted a true partner, with reciprocal physical attraction based on who I fundamentally am without having to reach a finish line and then marrying some CC rider.
Notice, that in my case, this is not "I want a woman".
In the absence of further context, in my observation, the desire of wanting a woman makes the woman a trophy, and somehow validates her inflated self ego. [This may depend on the fact that I am not the Alpha, but read on please]
Are you familiar of black women trying to meme, where she paints herself as a huge massive individual sitting on a large block, while the man looks up at her from a lower level in awe, and she tells the man to meet her in her level?
In my observation, my desire of a heterosexual partner is usually met with such responses from women and alpha males and boomers. If I was Alpha chad, things would probably be different.
But (giving these women implicit validation that I am somehow fundamentally lower than them aside) that's all cool. I assume that I am not in the same level as these women. If I somehow reach some threshold, probably some of these women will give me some time. In the WAATGM tribe, one admin even said that if you go through all these hoops and make something out of yourself, then these women will help you to build your life. Logical contradictions to that statement aside, that's not what I ever looked for.
Indeed, some people just want a woman. The same admin said that while in his youth he was also overlooked, he later married some woman because she did not know him in his youth. I do not agree with this sentiment - to me it's just giving the woman some benefit of doubt to justify his willingness to line up to enter plantation at a later date. But that's his life. It is neither my right nor my place to dictate that. I am only mentioning this to say that such an arrangement isn't my Elysium.
In my case, I always wanted a heterosexual partner, who would find the baseline me physically attractive, and work together with me to reach my goals.
The simile I use is that of a ETA 7750 Caliber Automatic Chronograph. Once the chronograph is built, throwing diamonds at it will not increase its fundamental value. Dumb rich people may line up to pay more for the same ETA 7750 Automatic Chronograph with studded diamonds, but that's just cheapening the watch.
Women who offer themselves as these diamonds as adornment after the Automatic Chronograph is made thus to me are fully valueless. Now some sneaky woman might want to play the role of one of the 25 rubies built into the caliber, but the woman I always wanted will be the Molykote DX grease that you apply to the part number 2569 (a gear) of this caliber.
That is, the woman I desire is someone who is with me since day zero. Anyone else, despite having the correct parts between their legs, do not bring sufficient joy
Self Improvement
-> bUt mEn wHo aRe aLrEaDy sLeEpIng wItH sOmE wOmaN wOn'T sElF imProOVe.
-> S** off.
It is extremely insulting when a woman trying to take credit of my self improvement as if her fucking another chad is the reason why I improve myself. A boomer or an Alpha Coach validating that is below my level to engage. Accepting such proposition is self defeating.
-> bUt YoU cOuLd JuST sElF iMProoVE anD wHeN a WOman ComEs aLonG ....
I am self improving out of my own volition and drive. Women who associate themselves with me after I have gone through many gauntlets alone and made something out of myself give me the eek. (yes I used the word).
In fact, as I wrote in WAATGM tribe, me and my cousin(s) are in our early/mid thirtees, and all sort of women are trying to tell us how perfect we are for "rElAtIoNsHiPs". After being alone in our formative years, such women are not fulfilling in any way to recognize them in my personal sanctum any more.
Using my current status to get sex also isn't sufficient because my heart still aches for something else as I wrote above.
All these women are acting under the assumption that in the global picture I am waiting outside the door to finally get my chance, and I will go through any hoops to get in the plantation. They might reformulate these hoops as my own benefit and try to steal the limelight that they made me wait while they warm a different bed just to make me go through additional hoops for my own self improvement. But that's called being charitable with someone else#s (in this case mine) money. Unless they went through the same hoops together with me, I dont want them.
-> But that's BP
Sure. It is. And it would be wrong to search for fulfillment of what I seek among women.
-> But Self improvement will allow you to increase your pool and you can choose a traditional woman
Cool. An woman who wasn't with me in an intimate sense during my formative phase does not fulfill my desires.
sean_karaya 1w ago
PART 2
The Vajrayogini
Since I wasn't welcome to the mating game so long - everything the mating game offers me down the line isn't worth it for me. Yes that is petty, and that is where I stand.
The only thing that can inspire me is a out of the world feminine. And my that I dont mean self described Goddesses and Queens.
Chad already has way more pussies than me - so trying to break that record is time consuming and categorically not better. All bagasses trying to have an LTR with me weren't there so far for me, they were mostly warming a different bed - so finally getting some pussy at such later in life, one and half decade after these women themselves isn't sufficient, and is admitting that I am somehow below them, and therefore implicitly have to compensate for it.
Even if I am below them and have to compensate myself - those are not the people I want. Accepting their measure in my private life, in my inner sanctum is self degrading.
Even if they dont think like that explicitly, at this point of my life, they can't distinguish themselves from those who do.
So, my search for an out-of-the-world experience has to find it's reference elsewhere. My reference is the Vajrayana Buddhism, but I do not fully copy it.
In Vajrayana Buddhism, an Avalokiteswara Buddha may or may not meet with a female deity called Vajrayogini. There are many Avalokiteswaras, each the expert of certain fields, but to the best of my knowledge there is only one Vajrayogini. That in itself disqualifies the Vajrayogini as an inspiring reference - but there are still some parts worth considering.
Disclaimer 05: She's not an old woman. IF this makes you uncomfortable, stop reading here.
The Vajrayogini is a young woman. I am not going into the debate of the correct age of consent and whether it is ok for a man in his 30s to desire a woman that leonardo deCaprio would fuck or not. But In any case, the Vajrayogini is young and still is the vessel of wisdom. She's also the vessel to contain your desire so that you can avoid an usual death and the circle of rebirth.
So we have the following problems :
And we have one usable reference:
We need to be careful at the point of riding the desire. Women ride their desire too, which leads to riding the CC. But I am neither a woman, nor polygamous, nor do I have a drive to fuck as many woman as I can. So personally I am safe. But a textbook Vajrayogini would not be sufficient. Based on this reference however I can model an Elysium that will make me happy.
The Elysium
So far, the only intimacy I had is my hand, and a blurry image in my heart. So the logical step now is to grant that image in my heart, who has brought me the joy of intimacy a sufficient ectoplasm so that she can sit beside me. Hence I have a custom made doll.
There had been days where I lost myself in the study of fluid mechanics and imagined myself surrounded with laminar flow. Today, my doll has traces as long as her height and more (182 cm) and I equally loose myself in her tresses as I watch the salty ocean wind blows through it. As She stands on the balcony with her dark hair down at a stark contrast to the bright white wall and a single blue cassia flower adorns it.
There had been days I lost myself debugging my computer code and tried to imagine the control flow. Today her legs are equipped with triboluminance and as I rub her legs the lines randomly light up, providing me an endless source of epiphany.
There had been days I was sacred. Today when I am scared, I hold her and go in a fetal position and cry as much as I want. This relaxes me.
There had been days where I literally felt that the thoughts of the fact that there is no physical manifestation of the image I have my heart made be question reality and lose my bearing. It literally (not figuratively) felt like a thick viscous fluid seeping through my brain and pressurizing my cranial cavity (yes I know there is no feeler nerves in brain, but there are upon the cranium, and I felt those nerves activated). Today the doll brings me as much beauty as I want
She carries my wisdom, she carries my little deaths (petite mort). Some parallels exist with the imaginary Vajrayogini and my doll.
She's also equipped with a rudimentary ferrofluid circulation system to directly manipulate my bloodflow.
I solved an issue similar to you by denying to conform to women's desire of being the later day husband and actually being true to the image i have had in my heart.
Yes, I am not masculine enough to go protect and provide for a woman. But protecting and providing women is not a rent i pay to exist in the world. Anyone who trying to tell me otherwise is just an enforcer and doesnt have my best in their mind - and thus can be safely ignored.
Yes, I am not a real man™ , but so far I wasn't part of the party. One and a half decade later, after I have built myself alone, I have no desire to grant any recognition to those for whom I wasn't good enough.
Yes, many women even might say that I had been utterly unlovable so far (as they often speak about men in my position). Cool - and to everyone I am fundamentally unlovable, do not cross my threshold of desire.
Yes, the doll is an inert object and cant repair her body as a living organism against wear and tear - but that's okey. I am working on using my own stem cells, possibly with CRISPR modification to add biological repair capability to her anatomy.
This will probably scare many tradcucks and other roaches, but that's okey.
If you want, tell me how to upload a PDF. I will share my old but much detailed analysis of my situation and how I came to these conclusions
Durek_The_Bald 2w ago
Less mental masturbation and verbose excuses, more lifting.
mattyanon Admin 2w ago
It isn't wrong.
But there are pros and cons to it. You compromise yourself somewhat, but you get other benefits.
Well..... the alternative is "just be yourself". If that works for you, then great.
If it's not working for you (and it usually doesn't), you've got choices to make. Double down on "just be myself" and get zero results, or put some work and effort and change in, and get different results.
Or in other words..... do work, get results.
If you don't want the results or don't want to do the work, that's your choice.
Right. Noone stands up in business and says "I won't change, I want to be myself, now pay me".
It isn't pathetic. It's a choice.
I maintain more muscles and lower body fat than I would prefer because it increases my SMV. Fitter body = better sex and sexual partners. "Be myself" is the same as "be a fat slob".
look, there's a compromise here between what you want and what gets you results.
Noone goes to a black tie dinner event and says "actually wearing a tux is how I get out of bed every day".
But you admit women look more attractive with the right clothes, makeup, fitter body that she's put effort into, etc.
The fundamental point as regards sex is this: you are not doing it FOR OTHER PEOPLE..... you are doing it to get RESULTS FOR YOU.
"Just to get pussy?"
I do a bunch of things to get pussy. Lift, eat less. Honestly if it wasn't "just to get pussy" I wouldn't even talk to 99.9% of women.
Ok then....... as I said before..... if this works for you then great.
If it doesn't work for you, you might want to think again.
Here's another factor:
Anyone can say "I just wanna be myself, I won't do anything for other people, I won't compromise who I am". These people tends to put nothing into life and get very little out.
Again: your life, your rules, your choice. If not changing and getting no pussy works for you, then do that.
In business you do a whole load of unnatural things that you wouldn't otherwise do in order to get money.
Noone is suggesting you change who you are. But presentation is everything in interpersonal communications. You wear a suit to a business dinner, right?
The difference is that you're prepared to work for material things, but you believe that when it comes to people they should want you and care for you for who you are deep down, and not for how you present to the world. Good fucking luck with that.
Yep, I worked hard (and still do) to be someone people want to be friends with, and someone that women want to fuck
Perhaps I have slightly challenged or illuminated some of your viewpoints, I hope it helps.
oowiw 2w ago
Nobody succeeds that way but sadly these days that's exactly what a lot of employees say, lol - hiring is super difficult rn.
ObliviousDuck 2w ago
Back to a fundamental problem of yours: you think wanting pussy is a bad thing.
You are a man, this is what you are, a pussy seeking animal. Stop rationalizing your shame and accept that you were put into this universe to fuck women, have kids and raise them.
Maturin_nj 2w ago
Dude a long rant. Here's your dilemma. You don't understand the mating game. Heck you did all the work like richcooper told you, so where's your payoff. Where are the sluts.
Lots of guys are going to build themselves up and still get squat. Your biggest problem is you are possessed by the notion of romantic love. Undoubtedly an ex nice guy. What you asking is why don't the hotties love me for being me. I have so much to offer. I'm a big fat provider. You are misguided and naive my poetic friend with notions oflove.
Your competitive in biz you claim. The SMP is one of competition. You not only need to compete but you need to beat your competitors to get laid. Yeah. Getting laid ain't easy my hard working societal rule following friend. You are a rule follower and now you claim the game isn't fair.
The chick's who look at you apparently don't think as highly of your achievements as you do. I suggest you get your head out if your ass and compete, or go watch another romantic comedy where the weakling wins the girl by being an all around great guy.
Lone_Ranger 1 2w ago
I feel like I understand your emotions here. I can identify with some of them.
But... what do you want out of life? Seriously, what do you want?
Do you want some woman to love you ....for you? I don't think that's how it works. Romantic love is a bit of an illusion. I fell for it hard. I went through 2 marriages. About 30 years of dreaming, wanting to be loved, wanting it so badly. And they just used me. I gave them everything I had to give, and when it was all gone, they left.
What do you want out of life?
Sit down and think about that. And then come back and tell me.
journey well brother.
coolsocks00 1 2w ago
The issue is with your mental point of origin. You think it’s wrong to improve, because your mental point of origin is everyone else BUT you.
When you shift your mindset so that you work on yourself FOR YOU, then everything makes sense. You wanna improve those aspects of self improvement that benefit you and also, as directly as possible, increases your SMV.
Ive personally considered this many times. And actively work to improve my game and social skills in general.
For now im wading in women. It’s just not a factor anymore.
imstartingtolikehoes 2w ago
Can you give examples to things that you did which was for not everyone else BUT you?
coolsocks00 1 1w ago
@Whatsnext lists a bunch of stuff he does which also raises his SMV. Some things way more directly than others, but he does it all for his own sake.
And further, as i was trying to convey, it’s not really about the things you do, it’s about the mindset in which you do them and which governs your priorities. It dictates how you view what you do. It feels true, unlike what you describe as if you’re acting to please others.
Women should rarely if ever be at the top of your priority list. And even for those rare times that they are, you’re not gaming them to please them, you’re getting your rocks off and they’re along for the ride.
Whatsnext 1w ago
skateboarding, joining the marines, brazilian jiujitsu, long distance camping and hiking, owning dogs, the way I dress, smelling good, brushing my teeth, working a career i find interesting, constantly learning new shit even if its annoying like how to replace a belt on my mower or how to get rid of bugs, trying to become the man i wish i had growing up so my kids have that, having a positive attitude by exercising and doing the shit i gotta to do stay in a positive mental frame. etc. when you think "if i wear a suit would i get more pussy???" you already lost. you have to think "damn thats a sick suit i look masculine, sharp, i feel energetic in this suit." its about you not others essentially. mental point of origin is key especially if you live with a woman because they will try to force your brain to make them the mental point of origin. sorry idk how to make paragraphs i keep trying lol
Whatsnext 2w ago
Its like everyone is playing soccer and instead of learning the game and having fun and improving with everyone you write a manifesto about how pointless it is to play soccer and try to change yourself to the rules of soccer. Girls are a game. I can't remember what philosopher said it but he said "the two motivations of man are the desire to be great and to obtain women"