I always faced backlash whenever I stood up for myself. So it’s almost always been a lose-lose situation for me.
Today, I was taking the elevator down to leave my apartment building. On the way down, the elevator stops, an old guy with a baby stroller appears. As he’s pushing the stroller inside the elevator, he asks me if I’m going down, but all I’m focused on is him pushing the stroller towards me when there’s no space and I was already standing in the corner. There was cleaning equipment taking up some space in the small elevator. I said yes nervously while I was panicking trying to avoid getting hit by the stroller. He said “huh?” so I repeated myself much clearly, then as the door was closing, and I was literally back to the wall, with barely any space to stand, I decided to press the door opening button, and then proceed to exit the elevator, and take the stairs.
I’ve always had this expectation that people are courteous, because I was raised to be courteous myself. I was also raised to be respectful, considerate, nice, caring and put everyone first ahead myself (The perfect recipe for disaster as a man.)
I am skinny as hell at 180cm. I have been eating at a caloric surplus for the past few weeks. I’ve gained some weight, but I still need to gain at least 10 kg to physically exist. I intend on working on strengthening my neck, to make it thicker.
I have noted advice given on another post that I should work out and get bigger, but also become more assertive.
I think that becoming more assertive for me is much more important than the getting bigger part.
How do I become more assertive while I get bigger?
First-light 10mo ago
Getting bigger might help but alone it probably won't fix it. Lots of big insecure guys in gyms.
Getting out and about, getting involved in stuff with others, playing a sport where you fail, pick yourself up and try again while your mates encourage you will help.
I would not think at all about cosmetic benefits of lifting. Get strong in a useful way. Having a big neck should be very low on the usefulness list. A high calorie diet is only useful if you are burning a lot of calories, otherwise you will just be a fat underconfident guy before you know it. Make sure you do solid compound lifts, with 4 sets of fairly low reps. Get strong, then you will feel the results, you will measure your success as that bar gets heavier and that will make you confident that you can get stuff you want to do done. Some aerobic fitness can also do wonders for confidence, just gets the hormones regulating better. Seeing results from say running or swimming will also help gain confidence.
Apply yourself at becoming better not at appearing better and confidence will come.
coolsocks00 1 10mo ago
Read No More Mr Nice Guy and When I Say No I Feel Guilty. Google a pic of the bill of assertive rights, maybe print it as a reminder if needed.
Implement that shit.
100% right, but do both
Hamza99 9mo ago
Between those two books and The Way of The Superior Man, In which order do you recommend I read all three?
coolsocks00 1 9mo ago
I have the latter on my list but havent read it. Do nice guy first
Hamza99 10mo ago
Thanks.
I will start reading those books. I have never in my life heard about the bill of assertive rights before. I looked it up. I will have it saved on phone.
https://www.mhankyswoh.org/Uploads/files/pdfs/Assertiveness-AssertiveRights_20130813.pdf
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ObliviousDuck 10mo ago
Two mandatory reads: 1) No More Mr. Nice Guy, 2) When I Say No I Feel Guilty.
Also, 0) The fucking sidebar.
Hamza99 9mo ago
Between those two books and The Way of The Superior Man, In which order do you recommend I read all three?
Vermillion-Rx Admin 10mo ago
This typo is glorious
Hamza99 10mo ago
Where in the sidebar does it mention assertiveness(aside from being assertive with women)?
https://theredarchive.com/TheRedPill%20Sidebar%20-%20A3%20-%20Times%20New%20Roman.pdf
ObliviousDuck 10mo ago
The sidebar is not a single PDF. The sidebar is a collection of ressources some of which are books, comments archives, links to forums, etc. The PDF is a condensed overview.
With the amount of time you've been here, you should have known by now that NMMNG and WISNIFG are among the first books you must absolutely read.
Electrical_Tackle 10mo ago
Also it's important to stop thinking that you are the focus of the universe.
AbusiveFather1 10mo ago
this is all correct and proper upbringing, but only when in the context of your loved ones and people that reciprocate with the same behavior. you're fucking up when you're like that with strangers (especially kafirs) - that's not part of the culture, that's not a failure in the values instilled by your upbringing, that's a you problem (i'm assuming you're muslim).
AbusiveFather1 10mo ago
i.e. letting an old man with a baby stroller comfortably ride in the elevator while you take the stairs is righteous (and sunnah), but feeling like you're being a push-over for doing that isn't - you're not doing this for the old man, you're doing this for yourself (for your iman). maybe that's what the old man felt about you when he said "huh" - that you felt like you're being wronged by the encounter.
AbusiveFather1 10mo ago
and don't try to get big muscles man, just to pose in the mirror like the rest of those queers - go to an MMA gym.
Hamza99 10mo ago
I was taught to be like that with EVERYBODY, and especially women.
I was taught to be selfless and put people's needs above mine and ALWAYS compromise.
AbusiveFather1 10mo ago
then you were taught wrong (twisted our tenets) and this is not sunnah. being good to people that will use and abuse you is self-harm, thus haram. don't be a push-over but also don't become a westernized egomaniac.
Hamza99 10mo ago
"being good to people that will use and abuse you is self-harm"
Literally my single mom's life story, yet she learned nothing and taught me to be the same as her dumbass.
AbusiveFather1 10mo ago
there you have it. her mind warped the teachings of the culture
Lone_Ranger 2 10mo ago
It's also important to stop over analysing every single interaction. You were in an elevator with not much room, some other guy tried to get on, no big deal.
I swear things have got worse because of the lockdowns - everybody's underlying mental health issues just got worse x100. So it might be that you are mildly socially anxious, somewhat spergy... no big deal. Sometimes there isn't some big underlying problem - you just need to get out and experience life, make some mistakes, re-calibrate and keep moving keep learning.
Sounds like you are going through paralysis through analysis. You end up seeing every little thing as a problem. There is another guy on this platform (more than one) that keeps saying that people are 'disrespecting' him, which to me sounds like mental illness. More likely is that nobody notices him.
Hamza99 10mo ago
I am getting down voted for explaining my reality.
wtf?
Boosted_Arrow 10mo ago
Don't take it personally, some guys are solipsistic tards that don't understand other's viewpoints. Take that for frame.
Hamza99 10mo ago
No. Men and women fuck with me even in professional settings, like with a dentist I dealt with a while ago. He was an asshole to me for no reason and would ask me "What did I gain from what you just said/What do you want?" after almost anything I said regarding my tooth or other things.
People I interact with push me around and fuck with me because they see I have a weak personality, as well as a weak character and a weak body. Seems I just come across as a harmless twink to most people.
Lone_Ranger 2 10mo ago
Not sure how I or anyone on this site can help you bro.
From this distance, it sounds like you are mildly paranoid. Not sure what to recommend. Try going out in the world, interact with people, make your mistakes but just adjust and carry one. Everything takes practice - and it sounds like socialising doesn't come easy to you.
Perhaps try some drama classes or groups.
Hamza99 10mo ago
"it sounds like socialising doesn't come easy to you."
Damn right it doesn't.
To make it clearer: I am an easy target. Always have been. Started at home with my two older sisters(sluts). Always had that problem, especially with guys. Had it at school(where I had a main bully for 7 years straight), language courses, university, any group setting I was in. Happened with girls as well. Every. Single. Place. where I interacted with people for over 5 minutes or saw them on a regular/daily basis.
No one respected me from primary school till I finished high school. Hella guys at school bullied me. I was called "faggot" to my face and did nothing about it but look confused. I did my best to avoid getting my ass beat by at school, so I would let the verbal/psychological bullying slide all the time.
Lone_Ranger 2 10mo ago
Sorry to hear that. I moved from one country to another when I was young, and I was bullied as a result. It leaves a mark, there is no doubt about it.
I regret not standing up for myself more when I was younger. The times that I did, my life got better straight away.
The trick is finding balance and knowing when you are being paranoid.
For example, the dude trying to get into the lift - that is not someone 'disrespecting' you. You really need to learn the difference.
Side note: whenever I hear some dude (esp on this forum) talking about 'disrespect', usually in the context of strangers, I usually assume that the writer has some form of social retardation / aspergers. Because talking about 'respect' usually seems to imply that OP things that the world should 'respect him'. Why? WHat have you done that is worthy of respect?
The trick is to learn about stoicism and also assume best intent from others - learn that others don't owe you anything. With the example in question = some dude trying to get in the lift with a push chair...you can treat this one of 3 ways.
1 be a douche bag and stare at him blankly in some sort of douche stand off - not moving an inch to try and help the guy.
2 Get out of the lift but then be all but hurt about, write an essay about the massive 'disrespect' that some guy showed you on the internet. Stew it over in your head for days.
The right thing to do is 3. The douchey thing to do is 1. But you choose 2.
Why did you choose 2? That is the question that you need to ask yourself. Why?
Life is not the set of situations that we are given - life is how you deal with those situations. Do you get me?
Hamza99 10mo ago
He could have been that exact cool guy to just let me go down that one floor, then call the elevator(where he would also have the extra space), and wait for an extra 40 seconds in total.
But hey, it's about how I can fix/improve my situation.
I tried being a douchebag(at least put my mind to it/try), I can't pull it off, because I can't physically back it up, and because I have always been too fucking "nice". It's draining and depressing as fuck walking around waiting for someone to fuck with me so I can stand up for myself/fight back. That's a depressing mindset.
"Why did you choose 2? That is the question that you need to ask yourself. Why?"
A couple years ago, I would have been too pussy to even get out the elevator, and just "accepted" my fate in that shitty little situation, but I got a bit better at dealing with bullshit you could say.
Did I mention I used to have anxiety attacks 4 years ago when I moved to Europe for university and had a very stressful living situation(During covid nonetheless)
"Why? WHat have you done that is worthy of respect?"
In the same light, why would I respect or be courteous towards strangers, especially when most of the feedback I receive from them is negative?(While me and men at large are always expected to be courteous/sacrifice for strangers, especially women)? "Ladies first." "Be a gentleman!" Right?
"Life is not the set of situations that we are given - life is how you deal with those situations. Do you get me?"
What if the situations your are given are always stressful and reoccurring?
I have been dealing with being a pushover and not getting my personal space respected for years, while noticing how others personal spaces are always respected and how they react when I slightly get into theirs.
I thought that I MIGHT be SOMEWHAT paranoid about it, but no. With the sheer amount of situations that happened to me over the past few years, on a regular basis as well, it's not a fucking coincidence.
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Anbessa 10mo ago
Felt bad and deleted my comments, but seriously how old are you?
mattyanon Admin 10mo ago
Don't stand in the corner. This is inviting people to talk the rest of the space. People literally cannot judge volumes and regularly fuck up estimates of "will I fit".
Yep, pushover.
Correct answer is "there's no room".
they are mostly not
This is the horrid thing that nice parents do to their children: they pretend the rest of the world is nice. Mostly they are not. Get used to it.
Correct
Good
Correct
Do both
Look, this is a journey. You have to walk it to get there, you can't jump to the end.
You incrementally learn to put yourself first. You can't win em all...... this guy in the elevator..... you should have:
This exact situation won't happen again, but similar will. Get used to it. Practice doing better.
Think before responding. Don't answer questions straight away. No auto responses. Don't automatically be nice. You want respect, you don't need to be liked.
Hamza99 10mo ago
You get it.
"You want respect, you don't need to be liked." Yes. Respect first and foremost.
Thanks.
pofkaf 10mo ago
Lift. That'll pump more testosterone through your body, which will naturally cause you to act more assertive.
Lifting is always the answer.