I'm interested in asking this because looking at this post made me think of my own mother and how she seems to embody the principles of NAWALT.
What are other members of the community's experiences?
Does your mother embody AWALT or NAWALT?
Does your father embody AF or BB?
Why do you think this is?
I'll go first. Parents were born in the 60s if that's relevant.
My mother is a nurse, has been for 30+ years - a TRP "high risk" profession. My dad is largely beta with a few alpha tendencies that shine through from time to time.
- Mother was supposedly a virgin until marriage. Don't really have reason to doubt her given how strict my grandparents were, and given that my mother takes a very dim view of me sleeping with women outside of a committed relationship. (though you can never know for sure)
- Dad is beta and isn't particularly high SMV, but mother still continues to show IOIs towards him and has done for as long as I can remember.
- Parents still have a regular and active sex life after 30+ years of marriage
- Parents never argue. In 28 years of life, I have never witnessed my parents argue once.
- Mother has a reverence towards my father in his presence. Submissive, submits to his frame, never disrespects.
- I have never witnessed my mother give my father a shit test.
- Whenever speaking with my mother about women/relationships, BP fantasies come up. She talks about how she fell in love with my father and knew he was "the one", you can see in her eyes she genuinely means it.
- After 30+ years of marriage she still continues to do non-sexual favors and acts of service for my father.
Is this merely a generational thing? All of the women in my family of Gen X or previous are the same.
Or is this a case of that some women are NAWALT?
I'd be interested in hearing from some of the older members of the community who may be of a similar age to my parents (~50s) and perhaps currently or previously married to see their views on this.
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RedPirate751 2y ago
I think that these things were more common in previous generations. There used to be serious social consequences for a lot of things that are considered just fine and dandy now.
Basically I think a lot of it was socially enforced, to the point where AWALT stuff was kept much more under the table if it was going on. Nowadays its much more of a free for all, but women got the message before men and the results have been trickling down ever since.
The tough part is that you can see NAWALT in relationships like your parents. Its a wonderful fantasy, but these days that's all it is for the vast majority of men.
Vermillion-Rx Admin 2y ago
I think there is a misconception on AWALT/NAWALT here
Individual women are not AWALT/NAWALT
AWALT is a collective assembly of traits women tend to commonly have (part due to evolution etc but I digress) and therefore, subsequently, a typical set of female behaviors and reactions women tend to exhibit that is common to women specifically, rather than your average man.
However, different factors, including life trajectories, temperament, situational context, etc manifest women's capacity for and likelihood of expressing these AWALT traits
It's not that there are individual NAWALTS out there or that there is some generational gap in AWALT, it's that there is a ton of entitled bullshit etc that was not around for our parents generation nor ideological progressive overreach encouraging sluttery or preventing women from unabashesly acting like entitled hoes.
The modern era has drastically incentived the capacity and desire for women to express their natural AWALT tendencies that previous generations did not have the incentive for before. The modern era has taken existing AWALT potential of women and injected steroids straight into their AWALT capabilities.
Women back then didn't have a dozen dating apps where they could fuck Chad on the fly with 3 year old bathroom selfies, they actually had to go out to meet Chad and then happen to be near their home phone to even get a call from Chad, or respond to his voicemail later.
There was no instaneous female entitlement, validation , and unfettered access to the top 10% of the sexual marketplace to any remote degree that there is today. The average woman in 1980 couldn't just instantly get the validation of 100-2000 simps looking at her insta and get 100dms a week, a fuck ton of free meals and then SNL a tinder bro unless they dolled up, went to a bar, and put in the time for Chad to pick them out of the 100 women there luck out on going home with him, while otherwise having to temper her expectations if Chad didn't want to SNL her from a bar and shoot for men in her realistic SMV range
It's not that there is a mystical generational AWALT difference, I suspect if women had the same societal and logistical capabilities to get Chad, and same lack of social consequences for any of their behaviors 100 years ago, that they would likewise being demonstrating steroidal AWALT signs.
AWALT as we know it is heavily shaped today by a near complete lack of accountability for women combined with unfettered access to quick HVM and societal encouragement to maximize their natural female tendencies.
So, in all likelihood, your mother probably had to shoot for a man in her realistic SMV range, was taught some reasonable and modest social values growing up, and understood that if she squandered her best choices given the access to men she realistically had in the old sexual and relationship marketplace, that she'd be fucked.
So, it's not that she's NAWALT, it's that the generational AWALT at the time was women who had to play by more realistic rules that were more conductive to complimentary male and female dynamics. Today's society is a female-centric hellhole and so they all get to have unfettered female tendencies till they become spinsters or get saddled with a beta
I've already digressed quite a bit from your original question here, but the growth of soyboys, simps, gamer boys, and men generally lacking any identifiable masculinity has also greatly contributed to the rise of shit testing and other relationship-hurting behaviors. Women nowadays are always testing their attraction for anyone who's not Chad.
Just wanted to clarify because I am seeing some misconceptions of AWALT and NAWALT here.
Women had substantially different incentive structures in your parents' time and a woman back then with unrestrained female tendencies (AWALT) did not have good social response to it back then. Nor were there incentive structures driving women to have unrestrained female tendencies
Durek_The_Bald 2y ago
Yes. This.
AWALT = women's nature, women's instincts.
AWALT = the underlying machinery
It's the basic hardware that drives women's emotions, and (secondary) how they behaviourally respond to those emotions.
There's no such thing as a "NAWALT", but also:
AWALT ≠ "good" or "bad".
AWALT ≠ any particular outcome
Example: Hypergamy
Hypergamy is most definitely a large chunk of AWALT. So is dual mating strategy or AF/BB. All Women Are Like That. This is a basic, fundamental part of the machinery, and a driving force for a woman's state of mind, happiness etc.
But the outcome of that can take many different degrees of direction. A hypergamously satisfied woman will probably be both fiercely loyal and a pleasant person.
However:
AWALT ≠ loyal and pleasant
Vise versa, a hypergamously dissatisfied woman will probably be disloyal and difficult.
However:
AWALT ≠ disloyal and difficult
These are both circumstantial outcomes, although both are directly linked to her nature, her AWALT.
The concept of "NAWALT" is really a wishy-washy absurdity. Guys tend to ascribe "NAWALT" to any positive trait a woman may display. But a "NAWALT" is really just a successful and competent AWALT. The outcome of her internal nature manifests itself positively, because she's competent at being a woman (an AWALT).
So why even talk about AWALT? Because it's important - if you wanna have positive experiences with women - to understand both the nature of women, and to understand that all women are AWALTS - no exception, just different outcomes.
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whytehorse2021 2y ago
I can give you a perfect counter-example. My mom's a nurse too. Both parents born in the 50s. I consider my dad Alpha Buxx(fought in Korean war, masters degree, good salary, house, car, fit, etc). My mom abandoned our family to go "find herself". She bought into the feminist lie that she had unrealized potential and that being a housewife is slavery to the tyrannical patriarchy. Oh she's also a raging narcissist. Fights every night. Total chaos.
The carnage of GenX watching their families destroyed by female supremacists empowered by exclusive control of the reproductive process and the ability to control the vote through tyranny of the majority... led directly to where we are today: MGTOW, red pill, etc. Rollo is GenX, I'm GenX, Clarey is genX, Joker is genX.
So there is a generational thing going on. You have 2 generations raised by the Boomers: GenX and the millenials. X went batshit crazy and said "fuck it". We walked away. Millenials bought the bullshit. What's interesting is the Zoomers come from both millenials and Xers. My Zoomer sons are red pilled as fuck. They grew up in a stable home, traditional conservative marriage, strong father figure, etc. My neighbor's kids are being raised by a millenial single mother with 3 baby daddies, short red hair, shacking up with a bad boy, working as a bartender, tats, nose ring, and she doesn't cook or clean. Child protective services has been called over there many times.
So you're going to see a bifurcation in the Zoomers. Red pilled and blue pilled. This is where you'll be able to make generalizations about AWALT/NAWALT. I was trying to come up with a red pill for women when I realized Rollo had already done it: Hypergamy isn't a straight jacket. You see, women have agency. They can choose to date down, not sleep with Chad, look for men who make good husbands and fathers, etc.
But here's the kicker: Men have agency too. And women have a serious public relations problem to overcome. As the Zoomers get older we'll have 50% red pilled men. Is it a coincidence that Morgan Stanley predicts that 50% of women will be single and childless by 2030? Men don't mind dating down, or going to another sexual marketplace in a foreign land. Will 50% of men be childless and single? I doubt it. The stats may work out that way but it will be skewed by men who left the country and immigrants who arrive already married. 40million Americans don't live in America and only 1.2million of those are military. All that's left are the blue pilled Zoomers, basically.
I know this a very long answer but you will see that all women are the same in that they have agency and make choices. Choices have consequences. You can pretty much look at a woman's upbringing and predict the choices she will make. Women like your mom and my wife made good choices and women like my mom and sisters made bad choices.
mattyanon Admin 2y ago
NAWALT is not a principle, it's a lie.
AWALT for me. Lazy, narcissistic, feminist, finds subtle and "sort of acceptable" ways to blame men for everything and "nice" ways to exonerate women (or better still: blame men) for everything they do. Very clear roles for men. Very clear that female roles are oppressive and should be eliminated. Asking a woman to do something is sexist. Men have very defined roles and responsibilities and duties.
Largely yes. This is why "only a marry a virgin, and in a country and a time that enforces female fidelity and good values" makes sense.
She's not as NAWALT as you think though. She and your father are actively misleading you about her true nature.
kvakerok 2y ago
Dad literally told me: "women look for a special man to have babies with, and a whole other man with provider qualities to raise kids with, only if you can juggle both you will have a long lasting marriage". The red pill didn't even exist.