I am constantly losing girls when going on dates. I lost 3 girls just this week. But this is the case EVERY.SINGLE.TIME. I am usually not able to get past first date, sometimes (rarely second). I have gotten farther than third date with only one or two girls, by sheer luck. I have also had sex with ONE girl from approaching but it didn't go past second date either.
Not that they are mine to begin with, but I am not able to go past 1/2 dates with them. I am not sure how fast to escalate (though I try to escalate), I can't figure out calibration (when to make a move to pull/kiss), I try to implement push/pull into physical/verbal game and i try to deep dive with every girl. Every new data point i get is contradictory and confusing.
I am also clear in my goals i am pursuing. I try to go with this frame in mind. I am trying to find a plate.
I will include a few examples below, but I have many more. I omitted some details i thought unimportant, if anyone wants me to include I will in comments.
Examples
Exhibit A: Persian girl I met in class. Second date. First meeting went well, imo (in interests of length i won't mention it).
I saw her walking by in class, got her to sit beside me, teased her and got her to give me her toblerone, and got her to walk me to my next class and sit with me while waiting for the prof to start. Told her we should meet up after class, but then she said that she is meeting a friend then. I told her to ditch her friend and come with me. Convinced her to hang out for a half hour, with the intention of obviously being longer. She came to our meet up with her friend (hate when girls do that), and i had alot of trouble getting the girl to leave her friend. Her friend is a giant fucking cockblock lmao. Anyways, we left, i showed her something cool and then told her to show me where she lives. As we were walking over, she got quiet and cold and her friend called (she was constantly worried about her) but i told her not to pick up and on the way back this got worse. Decided to see if shed give me anymore compliance, and she reluctantly gave it. Then she started looking for a wall socket to charge her phone and had closed off body language. She then found her friend and left for home on a bus cuz she was too lazy to walk. Her friend later texted me from the girls number saying "thanks for taking my friend away from me and leaving me stranded. Good night". I was like dafuq? Made no sense - she returned with her friend on their shuttle bus perfectly fine. But i said "didnt realize it was such a big deal for you. You guys get home fine on the bus?". She seemed cold and withdrawn when i tried talking to her again today. So was her friend. I won't be speaking to her again.
Exhibit B: Girl I met on bench.
I saw a cute girl sitting on a bench in front of the library and talked for her for a bit and asked her to grab coffee. She agreed. We grabbed coffee and hung out, but she seemed distracted and rarely made eye contact but engaged in conversation. Then I bounced with her from one building to sit in another to show her a 'pond monster'. We were talking and I gave her some gum because she was saying that her breath smells bad and told her that this gum would make her breath smell good for when we kiss. We hung out for some more and she followed me to another floor to explore with some complaining that i had to overcome.
I texted her next day to meet in library. She rejected. I texted her again today saying, "meet me in library tomorrow nerd". To which she replied that she had a date with someone she knew from highschool and that she "Feels like it would be better" if we wouldn't meet up (wtf does that even mean?).
Exhibit C: Facebook Girl
This was years ago when i was starting out, but a hot blonde girl messaged me on facebook in response to a comment i made on a public group saying something along the lines of "that comment was awesome". We talked a bit on facebook and she agreed to meet me out for a coffee date at a mall halfway between the places were we lived. I knew she was interested partly because she agreed to meet, she put a lot of effort into her replies (she wrote a long message in response to me playing along with jokes) and texted me to find out whether we were still on for the date the day of (hasn't happened since). She didn't know what i looked like in person (as we talked mostly over facebook) and when she texted i told her that I am wearing shorts, hoody and shoes to which she replied that I was creative. The only reason I include this last detail is so you guys can get a better idea. During the date, I did my best to lead - suggested new places to explore in the mall and tried to get us to sneak into a movie theatre for free. Having just started reading up on PUA at that time, I knew I had to try to kiss her on the first date otherwise she'd think i'm a pussy and friendzone me. So i tried a few times and she shot me down. Sometime after we separated to go home (I was getting tired), she texted me that I should come and get a good-bye kiss and so I did. I called her up a week later (because PUA theory at that time said it was better to call than text) and i set up another date with her at the movies (i know, mistake - but i didn't know what else to do) but I guess I asked what day she was available or something like that and at first she didn't notice it. But she called me back 10 minutes after our first phone call and said that she thinks I am a nicer guy than I let on. When we met for movies, she seemed distracted was constantly texting and during the movies she didn't let me escalate (I did standard kino, hand on shoulder, hand around shoulders, hand on lower back, hand on knee...) when i tried to move my hand up her leg or kiss her (saying that I already kissed her last time). After the movies, we went on a walk and I noticed she had grown cold and she would not go on a date with me again saying that "I was too horny".
I have been lately working on implementing a sexual frame and saying sexual shit to girls all the time, not just on dates.
I am frustrated and lost on what i am doing wrong. I really hope someone will guide me through my errors. I see betas getting girlfriends and though i've been on dates with hotter girls, I am not able to get them as plates or even the ugly ones like they are. I am sick of this not working. I really need some help. Thanks.
Some dates I try to move slow (in response to getting blown out on the dates I move fast), I get blown out. Some dates I try to move fast and get blown out too. Getting mixed signals, so I am deeply confused.
I try to keep a positive outlook and keep approaching, but sometimes I feel like its all hopeless and it will never get better for me. That's why I am turning to you guys for advice.
TL;DR I know its long but please read, there is no way I can possibly cut down past dates to fit into a few sentences.
XT3M3 6y ago
bro i read this whole thing. the last exhibit covered it perfectly. you give out rapey vibes.
in exhibit a you literally tell this chick to forget about her friend and focus on you. then you wonder why she seems so distant and etc while you are out with her. she really didn't want to be there with you but for god knows what reason came. her friend now hates you and by association this girl does too.
In exhibit b. were you actually making out with this girl ? cayse if she already seemed distant . she not into you as you make it. then saying so we can make out just seems creepy if she's not into you. as shown from her refusrmal to even give you another chance.
in c. you're trying way too hard to make something out of nothing and again creeped her out as you creeped out or pushed too hard.
I think you have to fix how you approach these things.
Chaddeus_Rex 6y ago
Been thinking, how do I fix these things? It's killing me inside.
Chaddeus_Rex 6y ago
How do I not give them out? How am i supposed to act?
XT3M3 6y ago
act normally. like if your end game is sex don't try to achieve asap. moreso off cold approaches. you have to make the girl feel comfortable with you first. which in all 3 situations you either never fully had, or just shitted all over it. by pushing too much.
chill speed racer.
which now I will ask again. did you at least kiss girl b
Chaddeus_Rex 6y ago
nope. did i need to?
how long do i need to wait to make a girl feel comfortable? that's why i didn't kiss girl b, thought it would be moving too fast.
XT3M3 6y ago
I mean with what you said I wonder if you had the balls to actually go for it seeing how she wasn't interested from her attitude. but yea if she wasn't already into you. saying " for when we kiss" isnt going to help you out
Chaddeus_Rex 6y ago
how do you know she wasn't interested? she did go hang out with me for some reason.
XT3M3 6y ago
I had girls not into me agree to do shit just to kill time. it's easy to tell
Chaddeus_Rex 6y ago
how do you know they just want to kill time and not hang out on a 'date'?
nofilmynofucky 6y ago
Dude you have terrible social awareness, that was a fucking cringe fest
Serious question: are you literally autistic because that would honestly make sense
Chaddeus_Rex 6y ago
I have a learning disability (diagnosed as a kid), i dunno if i'm autistic.
[deleted] 6y ago
Plow those green beans Mrs. Tittlebum ya filthy whore
RPBulletDodger 6y ago
Long shot here, but I'd guess that you talk too much.
atticusfinch1973 6y ago
You obviously have conquered approach anxiety if you can pick up a girl randomly in front of a library. You just need to work on what happens after that. Don't think you have to F close or even kiss every girl the first time you meet them.
I get the sense you're being way too aggressive physically too soon without the proper IOI's in place that they want that. For example, date 3 you say you tried to kiss her several times - after the first rejection you need to read her signals carefully before trying again.
It also sounds like you're approaching the second date wrong and coming off as needy.
Work on your skills like conversation, flirting, reading body language during the first date.
life_is_dumb 6y ago
100% you need to not worry about girls right now. Focus on yourself. Your post reeks of neediness, validation seeking, and incredibly low self-esteem. No doubt all of that is coming through to these girls in your mannerisms and speech and they're scattering like cockroaches when the light comes on.
When you can get to a point where you truly believe you're the prize and these women are missing out and you don't need them, then you can move forward.
Until those issues are fixed, you're pretty fucked.
UncleWarwick 6y ago
Stop trying and stop caring.
Classes? You're in college? Study, get jacked, make friends, join clubs, party. If you're resorting to cold approaching random girls sitting on benches, you're doing college wrong.
Don't fucking take girls out on 1-on-1 dates. It's college. Dates are for girlfriends - not a coed you just sat down next to in class for the first time ever.
To address some specific questions of yours:
If it feels weird to you, it's weird.
If it feels weird to you, it's weird.
See first sentence.
Stop. That's weird and creepy coming from you.
"Implementing a sexual frame" means you look them in the eyes when you're talking, fucking around when you're talking to them, and being a confident, cocky, charismatic, flirty guy.
Being overtly sexual is going to turn off 99.9% of women off the bat. You develop a "sexual frame" through your confidence and demeanor. Which should be your general frame throughout life.
Overtly sexual things do not need to be said until the clothes come off.
Last girl I hooked up with was solely based on me picking up IOIs from her, while I was just my normal self. I didn't do a single "sexual" thing, until I pushed her against a wall and made out with her. (But please don't start doing that - I did it because I read the situation correctly)
So if betas are getting girlfriends, what does that make you? Stop judging others.
Well not with that attitude.
Chaddeus_Rex 6y ago
That's what I've been doing all the time. What am I supposed to be doing? How am else am I supposed to hang out with girls if not 1-on-1 dates?
I study hard. Working on getting jacked (working with powerlifting coach). Have a few friends, but not many. Never get invited to parties. My friends don't party either.
Also, I'm confused. Everything you're telling me goes against what I learned about gaming on this forum/sidebar.
Finally, how is it supposed to look like? from start to finish?
UncleWarwick 6y ago
You're suppose to hook up with them at parties (or late night having a smoke with one outside the art building if you're into those kind of chicks), and worry about the hanging out (re: fucking more) when they start blowing up your phone to hang out with you.
Make new friends (join clubs and/or a fraternity) and become more fun.
Kids in college hook up from group projects, clubs, fraternities, and parties. I'm 99% certain you're an engineer so the first one is out for you - but the other 3 aren't. That's your source of fun.
Fuck gaming in college. All you need is a cocky, confident, and fun demeanor.
It's fucking college dude. I once grabbed a freshman girl to play beer pong with, made out with her right after, took her home, and that turned into a 5 year on-and-off thing. And I was nowhere near the SMV back then as I am today - I was slightly-below-average at best.
Chaddeus_Rex 6y ago
I am a pre-med. We don't even have group projects.
I am in Canada, I know the Frat scene isn't well developed.
Don't go to parties because not invited to them.
I don't smoke.
You made out with her right in front of everyone? Damn man that's impressive.
What do you mean by "being more fun"? Is that making more funny jokes? Being cocky/confident?
Plus i commute 3 hours a day. Makes it hard getting into the partying crowd, though i will be trying more.
UncleWarwick 6y ago
This is going to be really harsh, but listen up:
You're a straight up loser right now, and before you worry about girls, you need to get that shit in check.
Why do I say this? Everyone in college - including the nerdy aerospace engineer who's married to an ugly fat chick right now (seriously, I just saw the wedding pics), at one point made out with someone in the middle of a party in front of everyone.
That. Is. 110%. Normal. In. College. Fuck, it's expected in college and weird if you NEVER have. The fact that this impresses you is incredibly depressing, honestly.
You have unfortunate life circumstances out of your control (I have no idea what to do about a 3 hour commute).
But before you worry about girls, you need to worry about yourself. Mentally, physically, socially. Get your confidence and attitude in check. Get your body in check. Get good friends, get invited to parties, get a life.
Once that's done, THEN start worrying about girls.
Chaddeus_Rex 6y ago
I am trying to work out consistently, hence why i work out with a coach (he's a really cool guy).
How do I work on myself mentally and socially? what do i need to do to improve?
I am 6'2. I have started dressing SIGNIFICANTLY better (following tips from Real men; real style). 190 lbs. So i'm not overweight or anything. I have a receding hairline though, maybe that's what's causing it?
How do I become friends with all the cool dudes who go to amazing parties? I know a guy like that (he's pretty chadly imo) and he seems like a nice dude and asked him if he knew of any parties. He said he didn't. Maybe rapport wasn't close, i dunno.
Guess I will stop worrying about girls then and just watch porn until i get more friends and start going to parties.
UncleWarwick 6y ago
Jesus fuck.
Porn is going to make your situation worse.
Well it's definitely not helping, but I don't think that's your biggest issue. (Although maybe look into the bald look)
So funny story. I was playing volleyball on Tuesday, and afterwards was chatting with this guy. He started to then get TMI about some things - nothing horrible, but it was along the lines of "Dude, why do I need to know you're still on your parent's insurance?"
I then got a text from him later that night, asking if I wanted to play volleyball in a league with him. I never gave him my number. I have no fucking idea how he got it. I ignored his text.
Why am I sharing this? Because I'm guessing you've done something along the same vein. That was a completely needy and creepy vibe I was getting, which is why I didn't even bother responding to his text.
That's the attitude you need to change. This whole neediness thing.
If you think about "maybe the rapport" isn't good, you're intellectualizing this and not being a "normal person with friends". Yes, I know you have few friends. This is a case where you have to fake it until you make it. And yes, I literally mean look in the mirror and tell yourself you have a million friends every morning. One day it will come true. (I'm seriously not fucking with you here. See one of my recent comments about "how to lie to yourself")
Creating friends, unfortunately, doesn't happen over night. (It also doesn't happen sitting at home jacking off) Combination of exposure therapy, shared values, and providing value is the recipe for friends.
So what's my advice for you? Join clubs. Pick up sports. Try to join a fraternity (you might have problems getting in from the sounds of your social skills). Make small talk. Find small shit you have in common with people. You need to get out there, meet people, socialize more, and make friends.
Also, you don't need to go to "amazing parties" (though it doesn't hurt). You simply need an engaging life - something to do Saturday nights with other people out in the world.
Chaddeus_Rex 6y ago
I will look into it, thanks.
I was going to say, "I definitely don't do this" but I am not sure at this point. I know 100% I definitely don't do the "text random person I talked to without asking for their number". Maybe I do the TMI thing, but I am not sure.
Maybe I'm intellectualizing, but I what specifically made the guy give off a creepy vibe? Maybe the guy was just a little awkward and happy to talk with someone? What is a creepy vibe anyway?
People are friendly with me, but I dunno if they are my friends. Some dudes gave me their number and I asked if they wanted to go to a bar with me, but they never responded so I went out by myself and never texted them again. Is a creepy/needy vibe why?
I've tried this, but every time I feel like i'm lying to myself. I will try saying it.
I can make friends in class. But they never invite me to do anything with them, not even grab food. if we bump into each other, sure. but they often won't invite me to grab lunch with them.
I will go find some clubs to join. I used to play sports as a kid (and soccer well into my 20's) but I never made friends with anyone from those teams - they never invited me out.
That would be the gym for me. I talk to a few guys I know, but figure nobody wants to talk to a not jacked guy anyways.
Sometimes I want to get laid, so if i can't go on 1-on-1 dates with girls (since none of them are my gf), what do i do?
Just so you know: I saved your last reply to my google keep as a note. So its on my phone and I can view it to remind myself. Hope you don't mind.
empatheticapathetic 6y ago
You were talking big game on threads a few weeks back. I knew it was too good to be true. Guys who succeed don't need to posture so much.
I have the same success rate as you ftr. Good luck with it.