Summary: 20-year-old guy learns that the moment he meets a girl, she will try to shove him into the beta/omega box, & is incredibly pissed off because he wants to be seen as an alpha.
Body: This is kind of a Field Report, kind of a Rant... YMMV. A little background info, I'm a finance major at a university in Toronto, 5'11'', 155 lbs., skinny (but lifting, getting bigger & with emerging abs), mixed-race Italian/Indian, 0 fade haircut with 3-day stubble, RP for a little over a year.
Anyway, over the last 2 weeks or so, I've been noticing that girls have acted, & still act, incredibly entitled around me.
For example, last Thursday, when I was getting off the subway & rushing to class while chewing gum, one girl was standing in the escalator in front of me. I didn't want to say ''excuse me'' while chewing something, so I just tapped one of them lightly on the arm without saying anything as if to say, ''Excuse me.'' She, an HB7 blonde, looked back and moved. Her friend, who looked just like her but with pink hair, square glasses, & red lipstick, yelled at me, ''DON'T TOUCH HER!'' I just ignored her as I kept rushing to class, but inside, I was furious, because this is the first time this has ever happened to me.
Another example of their behaviour that used to happen is this: sometimes, when I approached a girl, they would look at me weird like, ''Do I know you?'' What's weird is that they would never do this with other guys, at least from what I've seen, & that this happened particularly with South Asian girls & girls buried on their phones; all other races/situations are fine. But then again, you hardly see people going out and trying to meet new people where I'm from, as everybody's already got their own little clique, so yeah (side note: This frustrates me even more because I'm not in one of these ''cliques'', making it virtually impossible for me to have a social life).
A part of me wants to think these girls are shit-testing me, but I'm worried I might be too beta/low-SMV for even that. Still, I guess if I just mind my own business, keep going monk mode, & genuinely DGAF, everything will be alright.
Lessons Learned:
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If you just mind your own business with girls & genuinely DGAF, everything will be alright. Walking away is the best & most powerful option you have.
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Girls think they deserve to be treated like a queen (literally) by anyone who is not the best man they've ever seen, & that said ''other men'' should be her slaves. DO NOT FALL FOR THIS TRAP, it'll only make them disrespect you.
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If you're not high-SMV, talk to women just to practice getting rejected & shit-tested & to get comfortable with both for when you do become high-SMV. From what I've seen, you'll get rejected & shit-tested a ton when you're high-SMV, anyways.
- Life optimization tip: Monk mode is not an excuse to be a hermit. At the very least, talk to girls/people on your way to & from your daily activities as a way to get social practice.

derk702 9y ago
I think you might have some anxiety when dealing with the opposite sex that this Alpha/Beta complex isn't helping. Women aren't goals they're people try not forcing a conversation but just let it happen naturally complement a book, shoes, food..etc. Also never touch a woman from behind and eye contact is a good sign a women is interested when approaching them. Hope this helps.
empatheticapathetic 9y ago
Do nofap, and get your murderer game on.
For better and for worse, people are scared of me and would never pull that shit, but it doesn't necessarily translate into IOI's either.
saucedup2 9y ago
I'm currently running testosterone "through doctor prescription of course LOL" idk the rules here don't wanna violate anything. Anyway my sex drive is insanely high should I still only fap every 7 days. My friends already noticed how I walk into everywhere like I own the place and how I never turn away when someone makes eye contact until they turn. Would I still benefit from this nofap? Can women sense I haven't fapped?
empatheticapathetic 9y ago
Depends what your goal is. If you want women, stay on no fap and seek them out throughout your day, using your inner drive to guide you. If you want to drop your sex drive and get on with other shit then rub one out or whatever. Walking in and owning the place is never a negative in my experience. I miss the periods when i am missing that dominant behaviour.
saucedup2 9y ago
My problem is I'm still in college so going on no fap means I'm gonna have nothing but women on my mind until I fap and I have a lot of exams coming up very hard to study when all you wanna do is fap
empatheticapathetic 9y ago
Yeah well don't bother then. The point of my answer anyway was women act like that because they think you'll put up with it, and you want to come across as a person who doesn't put up with it.
bossplayaintraining 9y ago
What do you mean by ''murderer game''? Never heard that one before
empatheticapathetic 9y ago
I'm indian as well btw. I just walk fairly slowly and people are scared of meeting my gaze. No one would ever react like that to me (OMG EXCUSE ME), because after looking them in the eyes for a few seconds they'd just move the fuck out of the way. I bet you're more attractive than me and therefore don't have as much of a murder gaze. You should just be lifting (like you said) and i'd recommend nofap. There's something about this 'fuck' energy you have when you're on it where your body language is less submissive and you have no problem being more dominant.
vandaalen 9y ago
You fucking cucks of nofap have some nerves, spewing your bro-science bullshit here...
I am actually not surprised that it's an Indian who really believes that refraining from choking his earthworm will give him almighty powers and help him to establish dominance.
You also have dried tiger dick for breakfast?
empatheticapathetic 9y ago
Haha i haven't been on nofap reddit myself for a long time, but there's plenty people here who feel the same way as i've stated.
[deleted] 9y ago
Plenty of people need to start sucking on an exhaust pipe then and make some room for people working to be worth a damn
[deleted] 9y ago
I was gonna go with a healthy pour of bleach and tonic but I can get behind this
bossplayaintraining 9y ago
Yeah I remember trying nofap out for like 1-2 weeks at a time (due to the study that you should masturbate every 7th day for optimal testosterone)... I noticed a lot of hot chicks would purposely sit next to me on the subway.
What would be the effects over a longer period of time, though? I've heard it makes some people lose their sex drive, & in my case, the one time I hit 2 weeks, I was violent towards the end, always smashing stuff & shit & just feeling like punching out everybody (though I never fought anybody during that time).
empatheticapathetic 9y ago
1-2 weeks is fine. 30 days is a peak. People who have porn/masturbation addiction could go for 90 days which is helpful. I wouldn't mess with it too much at your age actually, just keep it 1-2 weeks like you have tried, and keep it infrequent.
Well exactly you just said it, you put up with less shit when you're on no fap. Less time for bullshit, and it comes across in your body language and attitude. This causes woman to drop an entitled attitude. Women act with an entitled attitude if they think they can get away with it and apparently they think they can with you for some reason. It'll be partly your body language/how you carry yourself, partly your size (i'm an endomorph so i've never been 'skinny'), and partly how you look/dress.
[deleted] 9y ago
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[deleted] 9y ago
First off if you're 265 at 6'1 you're overweight. Clearly not a 7 or 8.
Secondly, and most importantly, not being talked down to doesn't have to do with your fucking shoulder to waist ratio or not jerking off, it has to do with the fact you're 265 pounds and above average in height.
22 inch shoulders aren't even broad lmao. I have 21 inch shoulders and I'm 6 inches shorter than you
[deleted] 9y ago
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[deleted] 9y ago
I was just looking at BMI, which at 35, falls into the obese category. If you lift a lot though that might not be the case.
Improving is the name of the game. Good man.
My shoulders are actually 20.5 (I rechecked), which I guess is good for my size but could be better.
clme 9y ago
The "Do I know you?" reply you get makes me guess that in terms of facial morphology you are only average or below average. There are limits to how much lifting can pull you up in SMV.
Specifically, the structure of physical attractiveness:
Variables one cannot change:
Variables one can change:
INTJokes 9y ago
I change my age every year actually.
circlhat 9y ago
He has no game, changing your outward appearance is important but his internal self is far more beneficial
abdada 9y ago
Can be cosmetically adjusted by beard/mustache changes, hair style, neck gains, traps size, etc.
posture, shoes, clothing tailored and haircut/beard/mustache can affect the appearance of height in person and photos
bullshit myth -- eat more, lift heavier
Not true. I grew a crazy hobo beard since october and I look 10-15 years older. I get free coffee at McDonalds and senior discounts at some stores. I'm 42. Before my beard people said I looked 32.
Not true. Lose belly fat and penis size will actually be longer. Also manscaping can make it appear bigger. High nitrate diet can affect length and girth when tumescent.
Not true. Take vocal lessons. Talk from your diaphragm. You can lower timbre with practice and training.
clme 9y ago
Re:
You are counting the evidence twice: I did mention that there are variables such as weight loss, grooming, style, clothing, that can be changed. So you cannot count facial structure (i.e. the genetic morphology of your facial bones) as changeable, because the little things that can be adjusted to make your face look better have already been mentioned under "variables you can change". Same for your other pseudo-rebuttals.
bossplayaintraining 9y ago
Got any neck exercises for me? I kinda don't know what to do there
abdada 9y ago
Neck bridge but be careful.
neck isometrics.
My neck is pencil thin because I never work it out. I need to. Maybe this summer.
iamneptuno 9y ago
Maybe they think you are a hobo and do it out of pity, son?
Even if it happens for the right reason, this only happens to facially blessed. It is obvious that the OP doesn't have that. Your humble brag is useless.
wheresMYsteakAt 9y ago
I don't think him saying he is getting mistaken for a senior citizen is a humble brag.
Cantloginhere 9y ago
https://i.imgflip.com/nkocs.jpg
abdada 9y ago
Actually there is good evidence that higher (natural) nitrates in diet leads to higher nitric oxide production in individuals who have lower nitric oxide production -- and higher NO can mean more tumescent fullness.
So if the average guy reaches 80% tumescent fullness, a higher nitric oxide level might give him a little extra length and girth.
scarletspider3 9y ago
I think what you need to do (besides the obvious of raising your SMV) is to reject and/or demonstrate that you won't put up with their shit. Females are so used to spineless betas taking their shit that when you don't it intrigues them. If you can get one or two chicks to respect you as a man, pretty soon they all will. I had the same thing happen to me before with some chicks that thought they could make me into their beta bux. When I nexted them they couldn't handle it and started to chase me around, basicly giving me social proof.
Thotwrecker 9y ago
The reason this happens is not because girls try to box guys into the "Beta bucks" box. They do, but that's not what's causing this. It's not a function of race, of Toronto being a shitfest of pussified males and entitled females, or of your physique.
It's your demeanor and attitude, your behavior and body language. I can tell from how you are describing. You want girls to respect you? You want them to perceive you as alpha and not give you the same treatment they give other low SMV guys?
You have to command it. Wanting it and craving it - and being upset when you don't get it - is the hallmark of a beta.
Look at your example. You were blocked by a girl hogging up the elevator door or whatever. You hovered behind her for some time, unable to just immediately say "Excuse me" in a friendly but assertive manner. Then you reached out and LIGHTLY touched her - which is weird, light touches are fucking weird for women. Light touches communicate "I feel weird and unentitled to actually touch you, but I recognize I'm supposed to but don't get mad at me..."
That whole interaction screams to me that you do not feel entitled and comfortable in your own skin. Next time just immediately tell her excuse me or coming through if you want to get bye, and walk straight up to her and make eye contact so there's no question of who you are referring to.
You want to be considered alpha based on what? Your finance major at a major university? Your physique? Get real man, I hope you don't take this the wrong way, but you wanting and craving this kind of "recognition as an alpha" is part of the problem. You can't want it. You must command it through your behaviors.
Also that part about you getting furious because some girl told you not to touch her... Stan, why are you so mad? Try to understand you need to chill and not take this seriously, these are college thots, there is literally nothing going on in their heads other than trying to assess who has social value and who doesn't. Like you said, you don't have a clique, you aren't a known factor on campus, you're not part of this group or that group. It's not personal, it's not a reflection of you, it's just that you came up on them and telegraphed low value, which translates as creepy. You want to be alpha but your brain is getting pulled all over the place reactively in response to what 18 y/o chicks do.
Again, you seem to be upset that these women aren't engaging you with flirty shit tests or trying to qualify themselves to you, or engaging you in some kind of back and forth, or giving you IOIs. And I get it, it sucks. But the answer here is not to conclude "whelp, I guess high SMV men don't get that either! Women are just unbelievably entitled and rude!"
The answer is that you're just not high SMV - quite the opposite in fact because in college SMV is predominantly SOCIAL and you're not part of any social cliques, let alone a high value social clique. And you're further conveying low value by your social and physical behaviors and approach strategy.
Hopefully that is helpful. I'm not trying to tear you down to be a dick, but you have to be able to identity hamstering from your end to improve.
dudeguymanthesecond 9y ago
So you're saying about half the time it works 5% of the time.
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rubenbrasil 9y ago
You may not want to hear this, but you have the symptoms of Low SMV. You may be good looking and have potential, but you will soon find that when youre 180 pounds lean and more alpha in general then things will be way different.
Hell, even the SJW landwhale in the elevator will try to smoke your meat cigar
HappySmaug 9y ago
Put in 15lbs/6.8kg and all that will change. The change in how they react will give you cognitive dissonance. I'm speaking from experience here.
PaulAJK 9y ago
"5'11'', 155 lbs., skinny (but lifting, getting bigger & with emerging abs),... RP for a little over a year."
You've been red for a year but you're still 155lbs? Without abs at that weight? Clearly you haven't been lifting enough.
[deleted] 9y ago
Gain 20-30 pounds of muscle first.
[deleted] 9y ago
Your problem is that you are acting alpha without actually being alpha. Just physically speaking, 5'11" 155 is skinny as fuck and abs don't count on a skinny guy any more than boobs count on a fat chick. I'm guessing your example of touching the girl to get her to move was incredibly awkward and all they saw was a skinny guy rushing to class like his life depended on it.
It's ok to be this way as long as you own up to it and fix it, but don't act like women don't respect an alpha because they don't respect you. If women are mostly treating you like shit, you're not alpha. It's much harder to fake it than you think and women are good at sniffing out betas in alpha clothing. After all, propagating their genes depends on it.
failingtheturingtest 9y ago
The OP made ALL of these points in his post. He points out he's skinny, that he doesn't have high SMV and that things may change when he improves more.
All you've done is reword his post as some advice.
dinosauralienspirits 9y ago
This. They smell the bullshit OP, and throw shit back at you.
franz1980 9y ago
At 180cm with 70kg at 20, his BMI is 21.6 which nearing the top of the healthy range. OP might be on the chubby side if anything. I don't see where the problem is...
It is, however, true that you cannot easily fake confidence...
Alpha/beta... these terms belong in ethology studies not psychosocial evaluations; do not forget the modern human has many other factors to take into consideration.
Confidence is built over time by facing fears. Period.
bountyhunterdjango 9y ago
I'm 5'11, 154lbs and it's not really that skinny, slim yeah but you can still have decent sized arms/shoulders. Rest of your comment still stands but I'd argue it's more tempremant/social status that is holding OP back rather than being skinny.
wheresMYsteakAt 9y ago
At 5"11 170-175 I've been called skinny a few times before, by women.
bountyhunterdjango 9y ago
Christ, maybe it's an age thing then? I'm 19 and at uni surrounded mostly by people that are very skinny so maybe your environment plays a role.
abdada 9y ago
If a woman is pressing me too much, I fade her INSTANTLY.
I had an insta-date with a gal over coffee. 4 minutes later I told her I was out. And I left. This story has been repeated at least 100 times in 25 years.
A woman who shit tests exclusively is a waste of my time. I should also mention that almost 100% of the gals I nexted within 5 minutes of sitting down with them are now fatty fat years later with 2 sick dogs and a handful of cats.
Nexting is god's plan for most women. Do not put up with her shit for long if it's early on and she hasn't proven any value.
franz1980 9y ago
That minute when you realize that a woman you were idealizing is actually broken as fuck and you dodged a bullet by catching it early on; feelsgoodman.jpg
Such moments help you put women in general into perspective. Quality vs quantity etc...
bossplayaintraining 9y ago
Yeah but what are you supposed to do when ALL the women you come across don't even try to prove their value to you, & shit test you all the time?
abdada 9y ago
Never happened to me. There was a year there where my LTR was boring as hell and my plates were even more boring so I was approaching 10 women a day in public and probably converting one to an insta-date every 3-4 days and none of them were shit testers at all. Months of coffee dates and most were pleasant and sweet but had a red flag or two otherwise that prevented further research.
If you're meeting a lot of shitty women, maybe your hobby suck and revolve around losers? What ARE your hobbies? Were do you meet these princesses?
bossplayaintraining 9y ago
I have hobbies, but they're mostly solo/guy-only stuff (e.g. writing, playing basketball, going for walks, driving around).
Like I said, I live in Toronto, & from what I've heard (and seen), girls are naturally super-entitled here. I'm meeting these girls in class, on my university campus, at the malls, on the subway going to school, etc. I went to a club for my friend's birthday just before I found this place and it was this times 10: Girls basically laughed in my face/ignored me there.
arrayay 9y ago
I wouldn't consider walking out driving to be hobbies.
abdada 9y ago
My buddy works in Toronto a few weeks every few months on a gig and I'll travel with him a few times a year. Toronto is like any big city. No uniqueness.
TONS of pretty gals there, and combine urban abundance for a pretty gal and you get entitlements and women hitting the wall with 3 cats by 35.
Disciple_of_Libertas 9y ago
You seem to have met a feminist SJW OP. These people are highly unstable and consider any contact between male and female to be sexual harassment. You did well to simply move along.
kez88 9y ago
I mean the pink haired chick probably over reacted but I'd think it was weird as fuck if im standing there and some guy just poked me. Man the fuck up and say excuse me, don't randomly touch/poke people
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Disciple_of_Libertas 9y ago
C'mon bruv, we all know the stereotype and I can probably ballpark her bmi. Agreed OP probably came off as an autist, but the SJW has no tolerance for any autism besides their own.
kez88 9y ago
Doesn't matter. If OP is still acting like a autist then focus on that because thats what we can control
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kez88 9y ago
Honestly if I had to take a guess i'd say you're approaching them weirdly or at the wrong times and you probably have a lot of outcome dependence. When you approach a woman and she feels like you're trying to get something from her (her number, sex, validation etc) she immediately shy's away because it feels gross and weird.
My advice is to youtube RSD Tyler outcome independence and watch everything on it
VanityKings 9y ago
Don't even acknowledge the existence of those who wish to make your life more difficult if you can't avoid it.
Focus on you and just you and things will fall into place
Dookiestain_LaFlair 9y ago
Well here's the problem, you're half dago wop greaseball and half curry nigger, no wonder women don't want you touching them. They are probably afraid you'll drop trow and shit in the street right in front of them.