"Conditioning "
Don't try and explain your side of things.
Don't tell her why you feel a certain way. Don't ask for a second opinion. Don't use facts to back you up, don't try to flip the situation back at her, don't cite her past instances, etc. It's a waste of time.
She's always going to take her own side. To her she's always justified. To her she'll always be right.
And what's more, by telling a girl that you're miffed over something she's done (withholding sex, etc.) or over something she said (overly shit testing, etc.) you're showing her by that doing/saying those things she's got an effective way to break you, your frame and to get what she wants.
It makes things worse.
Instead, show her dissatisfaction through action.
These're all effective ways of condition her to act or speak a certain way and all serve to get your point across:
Be distant. Don't answer her calls and texts. When she asks what's wrong tell her everything's fine. Give her attention only after sex. Barely look in her direction. Take longer-than-average glances at prettier women. Speak monotone to her and with a natural inflection with other people. Use blunt short words when talking or texting her. Turn your body away from her when talking in public. Be vague when she asks questions like what'd you do today or where're you going. Smile at other women. Act excited to see everyone else.
And if that doesn't work, disappear completely, move on and if she chases give her an ultimatum. No bargaining. No hashing it out. Either this or nothing at all.
There's also dread.
When she goes off on long tangents or goes on and on with shit testing, just play with your phone.
Chuckle to yourself a bit like some prettier girl just messaged you something coy. Act like you missed what she said. Set your phone face down and away from her on purpose and let her hamster up the reason why. If you get a call turn the screen away and walk off to take it. Be vague about who you're talking to.
Basically just make whatever going on in your phone seem more important than her. Get this right and its foolproof. It's also good for dates that're going nowhere.
Lastly there's silence.
Chicks hate awkward silences and will typically fill the silence themselves.
That said, if it's your first time together her IOIs or intensions for you seem unclear, force an awkward silence, pull out your phone and let the silence bake.
If she caves and fills it, she's likely invested in you (i.e. she doesn't want you to lose interest). If 40 seconds pass and she still doesn't fill it or if you're the one constantly keeping the convo going or filling in those awkward silences then it's not like to go anywhere. Just something to keep an eye on.
-Om

klk8251 10y ago
I find it funny how women are oftentimes teaching you (unintentionally) exactly how you should be behaving towards them. They typically exibit all of the behaviors that OP listed, because their solipsistic nature has them assuming that those behaviors will "work" with you, because she knows that it works on her. Sometimes it can be useful to pay closer attention to her antics.
bowie747 10y ago
When I was young, I always wondered why chicks would dance with another boy to get my attention. It'd turn me off her, and I'd wonder why she thought it would make me fight harder for her.
Then I learned that it's because if the roles were reversed, it would work a treat on her, so she thought it would work on me.
Girls/people do this a lot actually. I feel that online dating profiles largely reflect, not who they are, but the type of boy/girl they'd like to attract. It's very interesting.
kez88 10y ago
Exactly why BP guys talk to women about their feelings and problems and issues, because if roles were reversed thats how we'd like to be talked to or how we'd talk with other guys to try and work things out. Both genders are generally pretty clueless about what might attract the other. Girls are just lucky in that they are the non-initiating gender and have to worry about it less
[deleted] 10y ago
Well this is a ridiculously eye-opening comment for me. Pretty much all of college makes sense now.
a1004 10y ago
Very clearly explained comment. Also when women give hints on how to seduce women, they are just mentioning ways of recognizing when a woman is trying to seduce you.
[deleted] 10y ago
Women tend to become the female version of the man their fucking. Personality wise and interest wise, at least.
forbidden7ven 10y ago
Do you mean that people that say they like to watch series and read books want to attract people that watch series and read books?
bowie747 10y ago
Well that's an obvious example. I'm talking about when she says she's:
Not your ordinary girl
Very adventurous and confident
Attributes which are probably not reflective of her personality.
aanarchist 10y ago
if she says those things she is most likely ordinary, insecure, and lazy. oh and probably has those #selfies with the duck lips lying around.
[deleted] 10y ago
If she says she's these things, she most definitely is not.
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thebadmanpuntdbaxter 10y ago
I've said this before, conditioning is the same practice for training anyone/thing.
Reward what you like, ignore what you don't, correct what's dangerous.
Whether its your dog or a broad, the most devastating thing you can do is starve them of your attention. Attention is your most primal currency as a man.
Semper_I 10y ago
If, when I get home from work, I don't touch or acknowledge my dog until I've taken off my helmet and jacket, boots etc he goes slightly crazy. He'll speak to me all annoyed then try to rub me. He'll even try to push or fall on my feet like DUDE FUCKING PLAY WITH ME. He then goes and gets all his toys to see which one I need then he gives up. After he calms down and when I finally come in the living room and say hi it's a huge rush of feels goods and belly rubs. I just don't like being rushed when I walk in the door.
I treat my women the same way, give me a second then you'll get an hour.
Entropy-7 10y ago
Law 4: Always say less than necessary.
Law 9: Win through your actions, never through argument.
Law 16: Use absence to increase respect and honor.
[deleted] 10y ago
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Entropy-7 10y ago
It pisses women off if you say to them "you make me [feel/do] X" even though they have no problem invoking it for themselves, or simply feeling or doing for no reason at all.
Saying "When you do X I feel Y" is only slightly better. Much better is "You can't do X because it is wrong (and you are a bad person if/when you do)" Best is "If you do X, I will do Y (because you/I deserve it)" and then follow through if she does it again.
MattyAnon Admin 10y ago
This is important and very hard. You do absolutely get (slightly) better behaviour by punishing and rewarding. But often they are so dumb they don't even know when they've done something wrong. You have to find a way to tell them, but without being reactive. Basically something bad has to happen to them and not you. They respond to consequences to themselves, NOT to you being upset.
Eg silent treatment (apparently for girls this is a punishment whereas for us it's a reward), excessive flirting with other girls, dread, etc. THEN tell her what she did wrong. But never YOU being upset about it.
Point is... as well as what you say u/omlala there is sometimes benefit in actually telling her directly what she's done. Like a child.
NightwingTRP 10y ago
Specifically it's inbetween what you two guys say. As Om says, don't tell her your reasons for whatever. But as you say tell her what she's done. It's more on the side of leadership/commanding her to fall in line. "This behaviour is unacceptable." It just depends whether you can be bothered disciplining this child or not. Not a bad tool to have in your box but it's something a blunt one. That said, you need her full trust in your leadership for it to work or else she'll just continue testing boundaries (as women always do.)
weirdlywalking 10y ago
I agree with this. It's more about just being in charge and being very clear no matter what you do. Whether it's through actions or words. And I would also add, that the best discipline is to seem as if you could leave at any moment. Like you have no reason to stay. You don't want to seem distant. Just unconcerned with a negative turnout.
Don't let it turn into a desire to leave though, because if you actually want to leave, it comes across strongly and can just turn into apathy and even come across as beta because you're showing that you're staying against your will.
StoicCrane 10y ago
In what instances is the silent treatment a reward for males? Aside from the fact that it offers peace, quiet, and serenity around women who can't shut the hell up when is it a plus?
MattyAnon Admin 10y ago
This isn't a big enough plus for you!?
MentORPHEUS Senior Endorsed 10y ago
This works particularly well for short-term game and with low self-esteem women. You can get plenty of hookups and plates spinning.
If your target is LTR-grade high smv women with a healthy sense of self-worth (raised by a good father figure), high levels of obvious dread and playing games with things like your attention and body language will work against you. You have to actually BE her best option, among high-quality men whose commitment she is a serious contender for.
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cj_aubrey 10y ago
All social interaction with women is governed by dominance, which is really about who gets to make what decisions. Its is not about the facts of the situation.
Explaining yourself to her implies that she gets to make the decision and you need to petition her to change her mind. You may be factually right but you've already forfeited the real game that she's playing.
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These are all tactics that a submitting individual uses to try to convince an dominant individual to support them. Do this and you just designated yourself submissive.
Yes, because you're losing the game that really matters - who's dominant and who gets to make the decisions.
You're implicitly accepting that she gets to make those decisions and you need to petition her to make them in your favor. You're a dog begging for her treats whether you realize it or not. I promise she realizes it.
The real transaction with dominance is that the dominant person asserts their right to make a decision and then pressures the other person to accept it. All the tactics in the post are a variant on this. You get to decide whether you have sex and you'll punish her by withdrawing attention if she doesn't let you make that decision. You get to decide whether her behavior is acceptable and if its not you'll withdraw commitment. Her shit tests are exactly the same. She asserts that she gets to decide that your behavior was unacceptable (dishwasher was loaded incorrectly) and she'll criticize and withdraw her approval (i.e. grumpy silent treatment) if you don't let her make this decision. Defend yourself and you're still letting her make the decision because you're petitioning her to change her mind. Effective shit test defenses all just deny her right to make the decision. Shrug and walk away. Ignore her. Make a joke. This is the real game.
FrameWalker 10y ago
The harshest punishment ive given out without going nuclear has been a simple "let's go" opening the door and escorting the girl out when her words and actions crossed the line. No yelling no explanation. Listened to apology acknowledged it with an ok ignored the crying and took her home. Soft nexted for a week and last two months have been peachy
dmystery 10y ago
College guy here (not currently in an LTR/no plates and have no desire to do so until I build my empire) but I still use TRP everyday in my female interactions.
I am currently in a teaching group of 7; 2 guys (me included), 5 girls. I have no desire to fuck any of them (and shit where I eat metaphorically speaking) but I have used some TRP strategies to my benefit over the past few months. So far push/pull strategies (going hot & cold; being talkative during interactions and then completely ignoring them/looking bored; periods of radio silence on group chats). So far it has been useful in getting them to invite me along to parties they go to, make introductiions to their girlfriends, obtain their written notes/essays and other small favours. They seek my validation as I am slightly older than them by a few years and took time out before college to do other things. I would however like to "condition" the girls further. I think it would be useful tool to practice for managing female co-workers in the future.
Do you think further use of your strategies would work on girls like these or do you necessarily need to be physical with a girl (Plates/LTR) in order to condition them?
j0hnan0n 10y ago
They'll work. The limitations will be slightly different from an LTR, but no: you don't necessarily need to be physical with an organism in order to condition it.
clonegreen 10y ago
What does one do if she starts mimicking these actions as a form of payback?
thebadmanpuntdbaxter 10y ago
She cant play that game, she will always fold first because you don't need her. If you've been reading anything here you should have an amazing life to immerse yourself in with or without her.
MRPguy 10y ago
Who cares? You have to develop a ZFG mentality and be a man. You have a life to live. She is welcome to enjoy portions of it with you, but you don't put it on hold for her to catch up.
MattyAnon Admin 10y ago
You should already be in a position where you are insulated from female manipulation, abuse, etc.
If these things could happen, they already would be happening from her (hypergamy driven "behave as shitty as possible" behaviour).
Eg... you've got other options.
Regularguygamebrah 10y ago
Ommy's back. Great advice. Women listen to action. Arguing doesn't work. Only handling them in a way in which they can't handle themselves works.
Elfclan30 10y ago
I completely understand, but I hope you can answer my question, isnt this being passive agressive? Shouldnt we be more straightfoward?(this is what I have grasped from trp these few months, be more direct etc)
taco_roco 10y ago
Ive done some of the things before, and its kind of like flipping a coin. You may get the desired response, you may draw her in and force her to come to you, but it's a short term solution to what is often a long-term problem. It all depends on what kind of game you want to play
dxfifa 10y ago
Women like men who are aggressive and masculine yes, but to get them to understand what you want you have to speak in their language (act how they do). Passive-aggression and then demands is how females approach changing things about a man so they understand exactly what a man means when he exhibits those behaviours.
[deleted] 10y ago
Not in this aspect. Being too straightforward in this context will make you look butrhurt. You have to be subtle and ambiguous about it.
throwawaysarenotok 10y ago
In the beginning you have to be more subtle and ambiguous, but as the relationship progresses into whatever you want it to be, you can be more direct. The more invested she is in you, the more direct you can be.
[deleted] 10y ago
Yeah exactly. You gotta keep the mystery going though, keep her guessing.
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djrobme 10y ago
someone once told me "You can justify anythin" he then proceeded to beat a guy because of that guys watch. thing I learn from him. Yes you can justify/rationalize just about any behavior.