Been a lurker here for quite a well, decided to create an account to post what's on my mind and ask my brothers for feedback.
I'm 47, live in a large city in the Midwest, executive, had one successful company I sold, started another one a few years ago, getting some real traction, paper millionaire. I've been lifting for years, muscular, 5'11" 190lbs, been told by plenty of women that I'm handsome, look 10 yrs younger than my age. Divorced for number of years, two kiddos, spend 1/2 time with me, 1/2 time with their mom. I am upfront on dates both about my age and my life if asked.
As far as online dating goes, I've had Tinder & Hinge mostly. Here in the US, at least in my city, Tinder is a wasteland. I have been to Mexico with Tinder and had much more luck, plenty of action. Hinge, on the other hand, gets me dates and this is where my question comes in.
I have matched with women from 22 - 40 years old on Hinge, mostly I find 30 - 35 my sweet spot in terms of getting dates. The flow of women under 30 is a trickle for me, I don't know if they filter out guys over 40. I have banged a few of them first date, but these never lead to repeat action except in one case, who became a plate for a few months. I nearly always make out with these girls on the date, but often fail to secure anything subsequent. I've had at least 6 or 7 in the last few months that are happy to stick their tongues down my throat but not show any interest subsequently.
Example: Out last week for dinner with a hot 37yo. Attractive, nice chemistry, dinner then drinks at a lounge. Made out at the lounge, dropped her at her car after, talk about meeting up again the next week, she takes off for some trip next day, texts me a few times. Then .... nothing. I hit her up today via txt, invite her for a drink, she responds quickly that she's unavailable but she doesn't counter. I simply say "okay" and leave it at that. Zero enthusiasm.
I'll be honest though, I don't get it. Why the cold shoulder and disinterest post date? Does my text game suck? Am I giving off f**kboy vibes? At least if I go in to make out with a chick and she avoids, I know where I stand. This has happened, and I am not getting any mixed signals.
I'm hoping some of you guys can offer some candid feedback and advice.
_do_not_read_this_ 2y ago
One of the older school red pill blogs did an analysis of whether kissing or not kissing on the first date led to more or less second dates. I wish I could remember the blog...
The long and the short of it was that kissing on the first date = fewer second dates/bangs, than not kissing. @mattyanon above I think gives a good reason. It releases some of the sexual tension; women want attention more than sex, and they need to feel desired. Kissing gives them all that, so they have no reason to come back for more.
pfeilmacher 2y ago
Did you try to get her back to your place? I've found that most my Tinder dates want sex RIGHT NOW after I charm them over drinks.
I'm older than you (52), and 6'4", but my average last 10 lays is around 23 years old. I just won't deal with anything over 30 anymore. Too much baggage. Too much bitterness.
Are your profile pics accurate?
LaskerV 2y ago
This is something to examine further if it's this much of a pattern. I think the first thing to look at here is what your logistics are like in terms of getting the girls somewhere to fuck on the same night.
This line (along with your preamble early in your post about being a good earner) indicates that you might be too concerned with being seen as a "bad guy," which could be a complicating factor.
JohnnyWalkerLivesOn 2y ago
Great, thanks for the feedback. When you say "...too concerned with being seen as a 'bad guy'...", are you referring to perhaps they see me as an asshole? Also, fwiw, I never talk about money, ever. But, I don't lie, also don't undersell, I just state that I'm an entrepreneur who's founded several successful companies.
LaskerV 2y ago
I'm saying you're too concerned with if they see you as an asshole/how they see you in general. It's why you can't help but yap about starting companies.
You're leading with your beta/comfort qualities here. That should be more understated so that they don't drown out your alpha/attractive qualities.
When you put it out there like that, it comes across as you're looking for her to pat you on the head, call you a good boy and give you validation.
But again, you're concerned with not "underselling" yourself, ie: making sure she doesn't think you're a "bad guy."
mattyanon Admin 2y ago
Tinder restricts by age difference.
Generally sex on a first date leads to poor retention.
Kissing on a first date often releases sexual tension: by confirming you like her, you lose some mystery.
If she's attractive she has options.
You have to be better than her other options.
It's best to leave it as a maybe. Let her be worried that she might have lost you. If you've agreed to meet up again, you will get zero more thought from her. If you don't agree to a new date straight away, you will be on her mind.
Ok, I don't exactly know, but here's some thoughts:
Online dating sucks. You're getting better results than most. You'll get better results in "real life".
You're probably attractive, but not THAT attractive. Good enough to kiss, but there are more attractive possibilities out there who are messaging her.
You give too much up too soon. Sex on a first date, kissing on a first date, agreeing to see her again straight away, texting her straight away. This is much too much commitment and reduces her uncertainty in you finding her attractive.
Look at it this way, in evolutionary terms: she can only get pregnant with one guy's jizz at a time. So she wants the best sperm possible. If you are easy for her to get, then clearly she can do better. Therefore your jizz is not welcome.
This is tricky to navigate because women don't do the work, so we have to. Women want to be liked and found attractive. But if we commit too much too soon to them, then it triggers their "I can do better" instincts.
Better is mixed signals. Showing you like her in some ways, some times.... but with enough lack of commitment/interest that she has doubts. Physically escalate, but pull back and stop touching her for no apparent reason.
Basically some push to your pull. Going for sex is good, but you have to push her away too. Some amount of shit testing her. Some amount of teasing her. Enough to show her that she's fun/attractive/etc but also that you're the man and you have high social status, indifference, power, control, options.
Also, remember what I said about meeting women in real life.
Not certain I'm right here, but hope this helps.
EDIT: you list your financial successes first. I hope you're not qualifying yourself to these women with your betabucks.
pfeilmacher 2y ago
A man fucking a woman on the first date is not an act of commitment on his part.