According to Casey Zander indifference turns women on and women prefer emotionless pricks (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CSXwOHr1nLY) .
This does not resonate with me because a lot of the women I encounter get clearly turned off if the man shows no interest or fails to show interest at the right juncture. Furthermore, a lot of pickup guides specifically say it is important to show interest at the correct times, and that is definitely my experience: if you fail to show interest at the right time, or worse, show interest in a different girl she will turn her back and move on right away.
So Zander's "be an indifferent, emotionless prick" advice seems a little off to me.
My experience is that the mistake is to show emotion WHEN UNASKED is when she gets turned off. If you get emotional spontaneously or when she is not looking for it, then she definitely gets put out. But if she is looking for emotion and you react, then she gets turned on. It seems like a matter of timing to me.
Any opinions on this?
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Vermillion-Rx Admin 2y ago
Indifference doesn't mean show zero interest, I have absolutely no idea where you read that indifference means don't put in an effort.
You're supposed to game without looking needy or like she's you're only option. No one ever said to not try
agent4 2y ago
Indifference is womaneze for frame. An eufemism, just rephrased/renamed.
Vermillion-Rx Admin 2y ago
It is not frame. Good frame do austa if having indifference, but they are not the same thing.
Indifference means if she does xyz or leaves you, you don't care
While frame has indifference baked in, they are not identical
agent4 2y ago
I think you are right. Indifference precedes the frame. You can be indifferent without a frame. But...On my experience, there is a chicken egg problem, if it comes to any actual relation: you can't hold a frame if not indifferent and you can't be indifferent without a frame.
Vermillion-Rx Admin 2y ago
This is not true. Do you need indifference to not care if a fat chick likes you? No? Why?
Indifference has to do with way way. Ore than frame, hence you're missing the point
Indifference has to do with other things, such as scarcity, mental point of origin etc
It's not a chicken and egg problem. Indifference and frame are not identical. They are different concepts outright
You should abandon the notion that one is is the other, they are not. You're oversimplifying terms in RP
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OPPTRP 2y ago
indifference basically means outcome independence. you are into her but you dont need her, thats what it is
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OPPTRP 2y ago
It’s nuanced I can’t give you examples of it. You just know.
Ever had a girl blowing up your phone ringing you texting you double texting you that’s needy
What about when she’s doing a healthy amount but texts you and responds when you respond that’s healthy interest
What about when she texts you and leaves you on read and responds again when she wants that’s indifferent
whytehorse2021 2y ago
When you have high testosterone you stay calm in the face of danger. Call it indifference if you're a dumb chick or whatever.
When you have an abundance mentality you don't act needy. Call it indifference if you're a dumb chick or whatever.
A woman's desires change based on ovulatory shift. This is probably the video you should have watched instead: https://youtu.be/UfiL-JjbxSY
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whytehorse2021 2y ago
The absolute level of T is just a measure of SHBG. It's the free T that is actually available. You might want to look into those 2 labs and see if you have a problem causing high SHBG and low free T. If those 2 are fine don't worry.
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whytehorse2021 2y ago
Something like that. A woman's greatest fear is picking a weak man. They'd rather die alone than get with a beta. So they try to suss that out immediately. They look at your posture, tone of voice, facial expressions, appearance, etc. You can try to fake it like PUAs did back in the day but it has limits(the chicks figure out the technique).
What's important to know here is that the man is the prize. Men are born with no value, the disposable sex. We have to work hard to achieve anything in life. Women, however, are born with inherent value, youth and beauty. Once you realize this, you begin to treat them accordingly. You develop a natural self confidence and self respect which then comes across as indifference to the outcome of interacting with one chick. We call it outcome independence.
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whytehorse2021 2y ago
Well, women do have agency. They can override their hypergamy just like men can override their repulsion to promiscuity. I don't know the reason why there's an increase in women with weak-frame men but there's definitely and increase in weak men. Maybe all the strong-frame men were taken? Maybe she never encountered a strong-frame man? Maybe the dudes have great game? Maybe they're easy to manipulate? Could be anything.
Disposability goes all the way back to evolution. Kill all the males after taking over a tribe sort of thing. It ensured only the strongest and most violent males passed on their DNA. Nature's weird that way. How that manifests in today's gynocentric social order is something else.
The point I was trying to make is that, both in ancient times and now, nobody is going to do anything for you just because you're a man... but they will just because you're a woman. Men have to earn value, women are born with it.
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whytehorse2021 2y ago
That's an overpopulation phenomenon we've also seen in China. Maybe partially cultural as well. If you're trying to grow your population, fertile women are more valuable than men.
I don't think people realize the symbiotic nature of the male-female dynamic in evolution. It's the foundation of the hunter-gatherer civilizations. Men would hunt dangerous animals and women would gather berries and make more people. It continued on with agrarian civilizations where men would plow fields and women would tend chickens, gardens, etc. The men always take the dangerous roles they evolved for and women always take the nurturing roles they evolved for.
You could even argue the war bride effect evolved as a response to so many males being disposed of. Keep in mind everything you mentioned is recent history relative to evolution.
financehardo420 2y ago
my roommate has the same misunderstanding and I watch him fumble bag after bag bc he never wants to listen to me.
It’s not going no contact; and it’s certainly not being a prick. You can see a lot of it in sidebar.
The idea is… don’t prioritize any one bitch. Prioritize yourself and your purpose. When you’re really 110% locked in on your grind, you don’t even think about or care to respond to your women until after you’re done with your workload. that’s the kind of shit women find attractive. It’s also a lot easier to achieve when you are actually locked in w the grind rather than just trying to pretend you’re too busy to reply if that makes sense.
Don’t be overly available; don’t reply fast as fuck; let these shawties orbit you rather than you orbiting them. That kinda shit.