So, it all started with Jordan Peterson telling men to search for meaning in life. A ton of people in the manosphere then speak about purpose. Even Rivelino's men that are not cucked "look like they have purpose".
I am currently in a high paying job where I can do something I like, have a great gf and pursue some hobbies. The only time I feel unhappy is if I do something half arsed or try something new and then not see it through. Probably everyone here has shown up for a music / dancing / skill class once and then never again.
Purpose to me sounds super lofty. "I want to make the world a better place", "I want to build a well in Africa", "I want to help children or end climate change (lol)". I don't really feel like that is something you have to do. I like to make a positive impact in my local community and help people in need, but is that my purpose? To me the purpose is the sum of the parts of everything I do and love, after all, life can be quite meaningless.
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Guyandtheroadtovictory 4y ago
Your talents, what you do without struggle, except, learning and topic/theme combo of your first two jobs.
Durek_The_Bald 4y ago
I think "purpose" has at least two meanings. On one hand, there's the mundane, every-day-life kind of purpose; to have purpose in the things you do, to set goals, and to be consciously aware why you're doing what you're doing. This is what you're alluding to when you say the only times you feel down is when you do something half-arsed.
Then there's a different kind of "purpose", which is more existential in nature, the purpose of being anything at all. And personally, I think you'll be hard pressed to find any purpose in that sense, if you subscribe to a philosophically materialist view of reality, which tells you you're nothing but a lumbering, biological robot in a meaningless universe.
To me, the question of whether it's matter or mind that's fundamental, is a a completely open question. But most educated people in this day and age take matter as a given, as if that's in any way proven somehow, and not just a philosophical hypothesis. It's the default world view which you're an idiot if you don't subscribe to (at least in the West).
But if it really is a dead race between philosophical materialism and idealism (which in my mind it is), I might as well lean towards the side that is scientifically proven to be healthier for you, and take that in itself as a clue. Because that opens up a lot of doors for "purpose" or "meaning" on a more existential level (which is probably why it's healthier).
It's hard to explain, and impossible to prove, but I do believe there's a moral imperative on which I'll be judged, that consciousness survives bodily death, and that this existence is just one out of many forms it will take and has already taken. And in that, there's purpose and meaning on an existential level. The whole "God is dead" trope is probably one of the most toxic concepts humanity ever convinced itself of.
TheAurora 4y ago
Thanks, I think your two-pronged approach is pretty accurate! I do believe that Nihilism plagues our time and is reflected in the current abortion debate or the open arms with which the NPC welcomes lockdowns.
Thus one gaze would be focused on the present and on building something that one is proud of. A family, a good income (which in turn brings freedom) and some good challenges in the physical and mental realm. For example, I get very stimulated by learning new exotic languages (also by moving where they speak it). And you probably know the feeling after you really exhausted yourself physically, it can fuel a whole week.
I personally prescribe to Christian morals although I do not, for example, believe that sex should be exclusively for reproduction, that is a big trend I see with many god-pillers. Roosh probably started this. This side of the purpose is probably best fulfilled within your own family, by living these values, and by helping your community or whatever social project you would like to support. Again, having money (and thus freedom) is pretty central to this.
One of the work-related RP's for me has been that, unless you are someone extremely gifted and lucky like Elon Musk or Steve Jobs, your work is unlikely to be your purpose. I enjoy my work a lot but I am not fooling myself and I am aware that the main thing I am doing is trading my time for money.
whytehorse2021 4y ago
My purpose was to have a wife and kids... so I did that. Then it became to raise my boys into men... Then it became to leave something behind, put a dent in the universe, so I wrote a book and worked to leave my kids something. Sometimes I get on these forums and help out other guys who need it through advice.
TheAurora 4y ago
I think this is great and one can not understate the value of family, especially if you are even remotely religious. One can think what they will about third world countries, but usually, they treat their family (and also the extended family like cousins, and aunts) with much more love and respect than we in the west. It is sad to see that family drama and "I don't speak to my father/sister/cousin" has become so common in the west, and often for banal reasons. We can try our best to set good examples with the families that we build. That makes a good and worthy wife even more important.
whytehorse2021 4y ago
I'm not religious. My desire for a wife and kids was purely out of self-interest to reproduce and have companionship.
DeepNutted9 4y ago
I find purpose in my work. I help people every day by providing goods and services. Took a long time to find it though.
TheAurora 4y ago
I think it is part of my purpose and I was destined to end up doing what I am doing (the foundations were laid out during my childhood even). But it is certainly not my sole purpose. I make it to make money primarily and it is great that I can make money with something that is fun to me.
I actually believe that this can be dangerous to some extent. Some Technocrat like Fauci or Drosten probably believes their work is their calling and that is precisely why they force their "work insights" on the whole world. Having a bit more distanced look at your work could probably help in those cases.
r3z01v 4y ago
Yes. You got it right. So is this post rethorical?
Meaning is built. Purpose is created by your will and continuous effort invested. If you listen to the substance, the follow up of what Peterson says - it's this. A life with no expended effort is meaningless. He actually says something really smart - if you have no goal, no point, no effort - you are essentially creating the life of a depressed person, it's learned depression. Whether it's the brain chemistry imbalance or the depressed life first is debatable, but we know they are corelated.
Find something that moves you emotionally, that gives you a tingle and makes you wanna explore. Try it. If you like doing it, persist and become excellent at it. That's it. Arguably you don't even need the first part, look at the japanese - some of those motherfuckers spend 50 years just perfecting dumplings. I guarantee there's no horny 16 year old forced to work at his dad's dumpling shop that says: I wanna pinch dough for half a century. But the persistence, the focus and the innate want of men to excel brought him to a life that was more satisfying than what most of us will experience.
TheAurora 4y ago
This is some really great thinking. I feel like JP's thoughts have been distorted by all the "life coaches" on IG and Twitter who make "purpose" out as something lofty. I always feel a great deal of satisfaction when I am overcoming difficulty. Take boxing class as an example. I show up, get exhausted to the point of almost passing out and then I do not want to go again when it is the day of the next class. But going again shapes my mind and my body. How many people have picked up a guitar a few times and then stopped because it was too hard? Or ridiculed themselves at a dancing class one or two times and then stopped. And how many of those look at a great musician or a great dancer and think "damn I wish I could do that!". Same is true for cooking, of course. An art of its own. I am personally passionate about learning languages as it gives me the keys to access whole new worlds.
I think what JP faces are a lot of young people who grow up in this hyper-consumerist reality with porn as the ultimate dopamine rush. They do not have to face challenges anymore, and their horizon is limited to the next government "stay at home order". Build instead of consume.
r3z01v 4y ago
Travel is great - I think besides sex, the myth of "no place like home" is the biggest failure of our culture. You don't know what you don't have, until you see others have it. If you are sitting in the same comunity, city and / or country - you don't know what other options are out there. You don't know how happy people can be. How unimportant shit like TV, the internet, cheetos or a BMW can be.
It's not the government - it's us. We demanded freedom and we used it to create the society from Wall-E.
TheAurora 4y ago
Haha, during university I held a presentation on Wall-E and people did not understand me. I wish I was wrong and I find no joy in telling people "I told you so" but I was very very early in seeing these developments.
I think there is two approaches to travel. One is the blonde backpacker "fuck as many guys as possible" approach. My approach is to "move" somewhere and stay there for a year or so, and try to learn the language, join the community and understand the culture. Also put down the pink glasses. Right now I am in Mexico and there is a lot to love here, and also a lot to hate. As you said this has helped me to shed most of my consumerism early and focus on what matters. Of course, this also brings me the freedom to escape whatever restrictions dumb technocrats come up with.
I always return home to visit my mom and it always surprises me that my German small town has stayed almost exactly the same while I am a completely different person.
r3z01v 4y ago
Be careful, you seem to separate yourself from society. To be human is the only way we can be beautiful.
I kinda get bored after a month or two. But I am also very precocious in finding a "guide" or two very early on. And once you're inside of a insider, you learn the specifics of an area very fast.