Yup, as people said it's normal for LTR's to be 6s or 7s. In my experience, I've dated 8s or 9s in my early/mid 20's, having great sex but with a lot of red flags for dating/long term investment.

I can say my LTR is a strong 7, with no red flags at all, and maybe with the same green flags you mentioned. So, in that case, a girl like that fits my long term intentions. I'm in my early 30's, so i'm thinking about family and shit in a future, and I can build that with this girl.

Again, it's not bat to date any girl (at least a 6 or more, please) as long as it fits your desires and intentions. It will depend on the moment of you'r life your'e standing in.

I dated a girl who was a "nerdy" type. She was typical type-A academic. Got her Doctor in Pharmacy. She was actually pretty attractive, just very plain and not into make up etc, or cutting edge style. Nice body, healthy etc.

First time I met her she was talking to a friend. Kept staring out the corner of her eyes at me. Later told me I was hotter than she thought she could date.

Pluses? Yeah she was definitely way more into me than I was into her. I could really push her buttons in a multitude of ways and she was always afraid of losing me. I could let myself slip, get a little fat and she still did not care.

Minuses? Jealousy. Constant Jealousy. She didn't want me looking at porn because she felt it was cheating. I saw a girl in a cute top once and she saw me, so she tried to emulate the look and didn't like it in her eyes, so she freaked out and ruined the rest of the evening. When we weren't in the same town she used to constantly check up on me, "Where you going, who are you with..." She once told me she wasn't going to let me go to a bachelor party, which I promptly laughed at, "Oh wait you're serious."

In the end? AWALT. She still got entitled, went through some shit and decided to take me for granted. So I moved on.

I later dated a girl who was typical girl next door hot. Cute, short, former cheerleader, etc. Not a 10 but not a 7 either. Much easier time. Of course personality helps and she had a better personality regardless of SMV, so take it for what you will.

Honestly, dating down is the meta-point of TRP.

Get hotter than the hot girls so you can date down to the hot girls. That’s the only defense against hypergamy.

For the downvoters: women don’t date down, it’s a fact. Which means that men don’t date up. Don’t argue with the truth, accept it and play the game to win.

This is the way if you want an LTR

I think it's a bad idea to LTR an ugly fatty. You'll lose interest in sex in the long term and you'll cheat on her anyway. If you LTR a 9 or 10, then sex is still good years later because your attraction basically stays.

Ya, it was great. Theres research saying the more you love someone, the more attractive they become. What’s not to enjoy about a relationship if two people love each other regardless of superficial looks. Enjoy it while you can

Yea I did this for 7 years when I was BP’d. She was probably a 5 or 6 by most guys standards, but I was attracted to her. She treated me like a king. I was the only guy she fucked and she literally just took care of me and bent over backwards for me.

Honestly, it was amazing and I miss that life. The sex wasn’t that good though.

I've banged a couple 9s and 10s, plated 8s, but right now, I've LTRd a 7.

for LTR I am a firm believer that the lower you go, the more you offset the "maintenance/responsibility" that comes with a relationship.

My LTR treats me like a king every moment i spend with her, always is submissive to me, eager to please me any in any way for validation, and knows I will leave in a heartbeat if she ever fucks up big time.

The investment is also minimal. I've flat out told her this will end someday, I haven't spent a dime since the pandemic, i go over to her house 10 min away and fuck whenever i want, and when i'm busy i just flat out ignore her and get shit done.

She is however slightly insecure, and does get jealous when I check other women out, and probably will grow more entitled the longer I stay, but women gonna women.

If i was in a LTR with a 10, sure she might be marriage material to have kids, but you better be on your A game 100% of the time. No fuckups, no chinks in the armor or the reverse is true - she will drop you instantly.

She will have candidates lined up for miles, and be constantly hit on by guys, probably play games to always keep testing your strength, require much more investment such as finances, vacations, housing, parties, events, high end fashion, expensive entertainment.

Anyways, I'm super happy in my low maintenance LTR 7. Women on the side, always.

I am in a 4.5y LTR with a girl 1 to 2 SMV points lower than myself. We have 1 kid together. Captain - 1st mate dynamic, completely my frame. She knows she dates up and has already said she'll never find someone better than me.

She is smart, cooks, cleans, takes care of me & kid, reads, appreciates knowledge, is emotionally stable, rp father, very low n-count, only girl friends, caring, ... No red flags up until now. Everything you'd want in a LTR. My parents and friends love her. Downsides: no hourglass figure, not the best skin.

I've been very happy in all these years, happier than chasing tail. Sex isn't the best though. Before that I was in a 4year LTR with a HB9 that I ended twice, after 3 and 4 years. Lots of drama there, all that kept us together was drama, passion, awesome sex life (sex wise, she's still on the pedestal). In all fairness, I still think of her regularly when fapping etc.

Tbh I do miss that sex life, the attraction, the preselection, status, feeling like a king, .. it's like taking heroine. But I wasn't happy then, even though those highs were amazing. The drug analogy is on point. Highs and lows, not emotionally stable. Not sure what that relationship would be like if I managed it better (wasn't unplugged back then, even though she is alpha widowed), but she's not very smart, caring, higher n-count, ...

All in all, rationally it makes sense to LTR a lower value SMV girl that has green flags and is a quality girl, if you're attracted to her. I've never had happier years, generally speaking. But there are times when you miss fucking a high SMV girl, especially if you've ever done so.

I dated a girl 2 gfs ago who had significantly lower SMV then me. I’m talking 1-3/10. I was doing it because I thought I could be a great person who sees someone for who they were on the inside.

In her case it turned out she was severely BPD. Constant irrationality, jealousy, suicidal threats. Worst relationship I’ve been in but glad I did it for the experience. Now in an LTR with a 9/10 but honestly shit is getting old and I see how LTRs are RP on hard mode.

This will be the last LTR I enter.

Looks fade, thus they’re not the foundation of a long term relationship ship. Like another commenter said, someone you love becomes more and more attractive to you. As long as you are attracted to her and enjoy her presence, go for it.

Yes this is the way to go for LTR, as others have mentioned. One thing I find annoying as fuck is that other men want my woman just because I am with her. She is by no means ugly but

Of course when you’re single and at your peak you should aim for a smorgasbord of 8+.

But just being valuable because they’re hot will reduce the probability of those girls having qualities for a high quality LTR.

As you hone in on your life’s purposes, I see a really large value in the stability of having a quality girl by your side. Don’t undervalue that. Make a decision based off of what you want.

Tbh many “hot girls” who are vapid, dramatic, and immature seem to be worthless when viewed through this more mature/realistic lens.

16 year olds don’t jump into formula 1 race cars off the bat. Start at your level, work on your smv, enjoy it while it lasts. When the relationship comes to an end, you should be at a better place than where you started.

Normally thats how it goes for us, we date down, or to our level, but rarely up. Most women just don't get with guys below them, while we really don't care, we need submission and comfort alongside some other personal variables.

watch out for your fugly unicorn, she hasn't lived a crazy life, so she's curious of what is it like. she'll jump right onto an opportunity to prove something new.

edit: sorry to be the one saying this, but we've seen stories like that before. "I was dating a good girl, good family, she used to tell me she was going to the church, until I found out she was actually banging a guy next block".

as you've already noted, she's not ugly. so as long as she turns you on, truly, you're good to go.

I don't know that hotness automatically ==redflags, rather there are fewer hotter women, and many are lazy (while young; and will be bitter later) so they certainly don't have to work as hard being decent people. But once you've sampled a large enough data set of women, you realize, that for flings beyond plating (even FWB) them having gifts other than nice tits are a huge plus; it's all about value-add. You can get eager pussy anywhere.

But can you find a decent person** who has the "bright triad" traits, opposite of the dark triad:

• emotional stability (low neuroticism),
• agreeableness and
• conscientiousness

**decent doesn't mean shes a unicorn, and not awalt, and not prone to usual trading sex for love and provisioning, that's her sexual imperative, don't hate it, just know it and ack.

the side benefit of her feeling she's dating-up looks wise isn't bad also. but never forget, what turns a woman on is your strength and ability (to protect, comfort, fuck, earn, win). so you can't covert contract your way into bp-habits thinking that b/c you dated down, you're allowed to slide. even the 6/7 will walk if you get soft.

TRP is really a shield/scope through which you will operate and view the market. It by no means is universal truth. There are good looking women who don’t really operate like your average woman and won’t fuck their partners over. It’s just really fucking rare these days. The absolute best looking women almost never are like that though, and In/not in their defense, if you were a 10/10 and had straight 9/10’s throwing pussy your way you would have a very hard time being faithful. It works both ways.

That was not brief

Definitely. Ltr vs a casual woman is a totally different game.

What are you worried about exactly? If you are getting what you want out of the relationship, and she is loyal - carry on. If you are looking for validation from other males with regard to how 'hot' your girlfriend is - well that's on you. Quite frankly you should not give two fucks what anyone else thinks - including other males.

If you want to be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife.

https://youtu.be/Qh9ZZgDqzAg

If she’s not hot then that’s even more stress because she will fuck the first high status blue check that slides in her dms

Honestly, that seems to be the play most men should make.

Hot girls always tend to have red flags. Then there's the stress of them being constantly being hit on and potentially branch swinging. They're more likely to shit test you and if they truly realize that their SMV is higher then yours, it makes it harder to have them wrapped around your finger and worship you.

I'm not saying it's impossible, just harder.

If you're attracted to this girl, wouldn't mind fucking her for the rest of your life, and she has only shown green flags - then it absolutely makes sense to LTR her. Only if she pushes for it though - you shouldn't be the one proposing the LTR.

I’ve had this with plates that were semi-serious. It is great not having to worry and also with her being down to do or try anything I wanted. One girl was willing to try crazier and crazier bedroom stuff with me. However, I was only wanting to try the crazier bedroom stuff because I needed something else to keep me sexually interested. She was cute enough and had a nice body, but the fact that I knew she’d just do whatever I wanted actually made it less fun.

Take this with a grain of salt because I definitely have my own personal and relationship issues. I’ve got a real problem with getting super excited about a girl and then immediately losing interest the moment she shows deep love back to me. It flips a switch in my head.

Didn’t read all that, but when I was 20 I cuffed a 6 with hella green flags. It didn’t work out and she did the same female shit that females do. Just date as hot as you can. So at least you have something worth showing off even if she ticks you off.

Keep her. She probably will love you much more than you love her. If she treats you right and doesn't cause drama, and you are attracted to her then you'll have a pretty excellent time with her.

You're always dating down.

Read the sidebar.

saying that her friends were giving her shit about me, saying that all I wanted to do was fuck and dip and they got in her head, seemed very embarrassed about the whole thing.

This is concerning.

1. She chose those friends.

2. Why are her friends saying bad things about you? Chances are it's because she has said bad things to them about you.

3. She's susceptible to these friends ruining her relationship with you: has she ditched those friends? No, she hasn't. Let this inform you of her priorities.

So basically long story short, does anyone have experience with dating down instead of up? If so how did it go?

Women are women. Yeah, in the pre-TRP days I dated down more than I should have. Made no difference. Still female, still behaved the same. The only difference is they have a few less options than the hotter girls. But they all believe they are entitled to Mr Chiseled Abs Chat whether they can get him or not.

If you're thinking "is she good girlfriend/wife material because she's less hot" then I refer you to the above: STILL FEMALE.

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Why ltr a low SMV girl?

I don’t understand this line of thinking. In college when I was in a fraternity I paid pretty close attention at our parties to what was happening behind the scenes. Well, I mean I was smashed pretty often so I wasn’t like a full on detective but you notice things if you look.

This whole idea that the really attractive girls were the troublemakers just didn’t seem to line up with reality.

And neither does the whole idea of “the really hot girls get hit on way more often so they’re more likely to do xyz”. Pretty much every girl was being hit on throughout an entire party unless she showed up with a dude lol or was already with one. And even then sometimes it didn’t matter.

You sound like me. These relationships are great if you can get over the fact that you'll occasionally want to fuck hotter girls.

AWALT. 10 or 5, those women are as hypergamic as the others, and if given the chance, they will branch swing.

Research shows that average girls are more solicited for sex than beautiful girls. Your experience is anecdotal at best.

Your redpill journey is not over yet, you still get fooled by women’s beauty (or lack of).

there seems to be a strong correlation between hotness and red flags,

Get on youtube and google "hot crazy matrix". The guy graphs it out in a way that is entertaining, but it is so true.

As for whether to LTR this girl or not, she sounds from your description like a good candidate to be honest with you. The next thing I would say to start vetting for is what will she do when you're not as available? When you're struggling with time demands at some point? Will she start to get bitchy if you're having to work long hours for an extended period for example? Or will she realize that times like that are tough on men and as a good partner, the more she can do to be patient and supportive, the more she endears herself and cements the relationship with you?

In other words, will she look to make the LTR work for her, or will she work for the LTR even in times when things are harder? You won't know for sure until you're in it with her, but there can be flags that indicate a proclivity one way or another if you look for them now.