Hey guys, single senior engineering college kid here (for reference).
Found this subreddit after a few months of being on reddit. Read Michael's Story, as well as many of the open letters/articles, and after a week of re-evaluating my own thoughts, I'm finding that I'm becoming very, severely angry. Seeing the subtle uses of sexuality in my team project to make me work hard while they reap the benefits of not doing the work themselves (It's just me and a girl for this project)...is now met with repressed anger. I know it's a natural/learned behavior on her part (Spinning plates article really helped solidify and recognize the behavior), but I'm worried that this swing to being irritated/angry/enraged is a new learned behavior that'll stick with me.
After writing that...I feel as if it's a phase, the Jaded stage that The Rational Male talks about (Link: http://rationalmale.wordpress.com/2012/07/25/the-5-stages-of-unplugging/)
This is such a weird feeling, reading the stories/theories, and seeing it with my own life. My anger is probably more directed at myself for allowing me to get to this point in life...
Just ranting, but if anyone has references to read, shoot it my way. Going to keep reading and learning. So glad I found this now...
EDIT: A last note: Found that r/nofap started me on this process, and that this anger might be paired with the testosterone increase expected during the 10-15 day mark. But damn, usually I repress this anger by rationalizing that women/girls don't want to have someone who can actually feel what I'm feeling. Pair that with some Eminem in the morning when focusing on myself for the past few months (6' 3", 190lbs, just hit 240lbs on the squat), and I don't want to deal with it (the manipulation, seeing other plugged in men, mainly because it reminds me of myself a month ago). Here's the song. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VOIetjsgxc
RedHonest 11y ago
Look, chumps aren't victims. I oppose that whole mindset. "She used her sexuality to get what she wants!" is lame, no matter how you say it. Don't be mad at her, be mad at the chump. Kill the chump in you.
But here's my own rule: If a woman is attracted/interested in you, she'll go out of her way for you. That's the litmus test, so to speak.
If she isn't attracted/interested in you, you're not going to "create attraction" by going out of the way for her. You're just showing her what a chump you are. Once she figures out you're a chump, she's not going bone you.
[deleted] 11y ago
that's a good point, completely. I know that if I had that type of influence/power, I'd use it in the same fashion, so maybe my source of frustration comes from not currently having that ability.
God damn people here have good points, you being an epic example. fucking hell this is weird that i'm being exposed to this new mindset at 23, thought I would have found this information earlier. for the past month/year I've been trying the r/seduction and r/relationships tab to find my happiness, but now this seems to somehow hit a cord that hasn't been strung before.
Thanks for writing this out man, really appreciate it.
Crackertron 11y ago
Think of all the guys who didn't find the red pill til their late 30's or after. You're in the sweet spot.
zionController 11y ago
Seriously. I discovered game at 25... laid 9 women in 6 months. I feel strongly for the brothers who wake up late, and even worse for those who are too plugged in to accept the truth (as a mental defense mechanism)
[deleted] 11y ago
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[deleted] 11y ago
Agreed, once I get over the self-anger (sounds kind bad), I think it'll turn into a deep fire that keeps me focused on my core and not get side tracked by a quick jizz or hope-y wish-y white knight mentality. I'll still help out those when I see they need that help, but god damn, it's an anger/nice feeling now, after a couple hours and calming my mind to try to see things objectively (try...because I'm still an animal with testosterone and neurochemicals that'll slant my view cognitive dissonance).
Thanks, appreciate the response. I feel like such a child going through puberty again, even tho I'm a big athletic guy.
zionController 11y ago
At a board meeting at work recently, they were discussing how unfair it was that the government advised wives to cook for their husbands and have newspapers ready for them in the 40's when WW2 ended. No one mentioned that these guys were forced by the government to fight Nazis. Honestly. Everyone was too up in arms that a woman was encouraged to cook to mention the millions of men who died in ditches...
Equality is the funniest joke ever told.
[deleted] 11y ago
perspective seems to be lost in favor of the short term gains. even in myself at times..good point mr controller.
WorkThrow99 11y ago
Well, if you've found out you've been told that a system worked in one way your whole life, just to find out that it's part of the system to lie to you, in order to control you, why wouldn't you be pissed.
Imagine tomorrow that you find out that putting your money into interests and what you keep hearing as investment is a fraud, and the real way to go about it is to join a club which it's member have access to the money printing presses, wouldn't you be pissed? Of course you'd be.
The problem is because you have expectation that a system is going to be presented to you, and it's going to be in your interests. The system will probably even tell you that it's in your best interest. And it'll give you small marginal results just to give you enough faith that it works, and that you're just missing a couple of steps. It's perpetually pushing the carrot just a little bit forward as you progress.
Then you find out you can just turn around, smack the guy with the stick on the nose, and take the fucking carrot. There's also fucking fields of carrots everywhere but you were so focused on the carrot in front of you, because it was always closer, that you didn't even see the fields out there.
Just smack the guy with the stick, and realize that he didn't even realize he's just driving the coach, he's a servant to the owner of the coach, he just doesn't realize it's as bad a position than yours, because he keeps going forward without any efforts either. He just doesn't get where he want to go either.
TL;DR: Smack the guy with the stick, and don't pay him any attention anymore.
[deleted] 11y ago
Good example to compare it too. Reminds me of learning the hard way about how business/investments should be based on facts, and not hopes/aspirational stories that I used to get pulled into.
God damnit...just read what you said about "the system will probably even tell you that it's in your best interest...that you're just missing a couple of steps...pushing the carrot." I feel so dumb, angry at how dumb I could be to fall for this type of mentality (even though I'm doing great in my classes and fitness)...going to have to spend some time reading more of the forum articles.
A part of me feels like I have to read more to be sure I'm not just drinking the cool-aid and looking for a place to give me confirmation bias for being so unsuccessful in the past, know what I mean?
But even when I do look at the counter-argument to the red pill, it's all starting to look like complete bull...I'm going to go workout, focus on senior project and give myself some fresh air instead of letting this get to me so hardcore
TL;DR: God damnit, fucking carrots, I want some damn meat. Thanks for the reply.
WorkThrow99 11y ago
You shouldn't feel dumb, how the fuck are you supposed to know.
You were also told that when you get taught something, you should listen to it. It's a system, not some isolated parts.
The only remedy is the following. Take all the theory you hear, and TEST THE FUCK OUT OF IT.
Think one way is going to work, or it's kool aid? Just go out and test it out. The only way you can evaluate something is by it's merits. Otherwise, people might have motivations to teach you something else.
Unless you've seen results for yourself, it's basically all faith.
Also, don't compare your results with other's, in the sense that people are always going to bullshit. Test one system, note the results, test another, note the results from that, compare your own data if you want to be sure.
And think about this, in a system which is trying to control you, what are they going to do to make sure others don't teach you something else? Make it shameful and unacceptable behavior. That's why the "players" you know, people who get results^*, are just "huge douchebags you shouldn't never listen to", because, otherwise, you could get a new perspective.
^* Of course, doubt this too until you find things that works for yourself. Please do feel free to doubt me too. Trust yourself and your results above everything else.
[deleted] 11y ago
testing out sounds like a plan, and even unintentional testing today while at lunch with some old friends reinforced my thought processes. It's like once you're exposed to how the system works, you see it everywhere, and I'm damn happy I'm seeing it now.
What do you mean by testing systems? I'm guessing I'll run into exactly what you mean by that in the coming days with all the reading.
And that last point is damn insightful, test what works, discard what doesn't, add your own flair, repeat until you die. Your willingness to question even yourself ('feel free to doubt me') shows more honesty than what I've encountered elsewhere, and it's an honesty that reinforces my thought that this is the right path to look into. god damn exciting for once.
redpillschool Admin 11y ago
The best part of the red pill is that it's independently verifiable. No need to take our word for it. Learn game and watch the results.
I can really connect with you on the anger thing. In fact, that's why I added Confessions of a Reformed Incel on the sidebar. I wanted it easy to identify with. I think most guys here would report a similar unplugging. Anger, bitter anger. For a while I couldn't even stand to think about women. I was angry at myself. I was angry at women. I was angry about the system. I even considered joining a group called men going their own way and doing a thing called "ghosting" where you remove yourself from society, stop pursuing women altogether, and only interact with society at a bare minimum to continue existence.
Over the course of a year the anger subsided and I was able to start looking at these things more clearly, start understanding who I am and what I can do. Sometimes I still get angry. But it's less and less as time goes by.
Welcome to the red pill.
[deleted] 11y ago
I still feel that anger, going to for some time, but I have a feeling that continuing reading the forums and testing out the theories in my own life will change that perspective. For three days I was brooding until I decided to just let it out on this site to see if anyone else had experienced it, so now I at least don't feel like I'm crazy.
Your personal story is fascinating, and before I would say it sounds extreme, but with how I'm feeling now, makes complete sense.
It also might be that I'm not actually angry, more just experiencing unbridled emotion and some god damn respect for myself for once.
this is the beginning of something big...
[deleted] 11y ago
Yeah man, as a person who tends to prefer quiet observation in many social situations this subreddit connected all the dots that I had observed.
The more I dislike women, the less I trust them, the more I challenge, disrespect, and deny them the more attracted they are towards me. I haven't gotten all the kinks out so I'm not seeing any lays yet. But god damn my results are noticeably improving.
Its also made me realize how absolutely batshit crazy the majority of women are.
[deleted] 11y ago
there's a part of me that can't blame them for using their assets/advantage for their own benefit. Reminds me of now national diplomacy works (don't take this analogy too seriously). If you don't have nukes, you tend to be seen as not have a lot of military strength. But if you learn hwo to make it, forge your own, and then demonstrate that you can use it...the rest of the nuclear armed nations (women) will see that, and then respect it. Such a shitty analogy, but you get the idea. You use the power your provided, so instead of hating, just learn how they work, then you're good to go. Lost my train of thought there.
[deleted] 11y ago
That is an excellent analogy. As for men to learn game is to learn how it works.
[deleted] 11y ago
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Crackertron 11y ago
What about metal?
[deleted] 11y ago
electro house is my focus, but since the anger spree hit me, rap, hip hop and metal all have taken over for some reason...and i like it.
zionController 11y ago
I have also come to this conclusion. "We don't love them hoes"
VZPurp 11y ago
Yes, but you should also find relief as you no longer have to play according to the propaganda.
zionController 11y ago
They gave trophies to every female manager in my company this year. The best female manager got one and the worst one and every one in between, no men. Blue pill applause everywhere. I just shake my head at the pandering to the feminist imperative and move along.
VZPurp 11y ago
That's hardly appropriate for a youth soccer tournament, let alone a company.
GaiusScaevolus 11y ago
The anger is real and legitimate. Even myself and the strongest of Red Pillers in my circle still feel it. There have been moments where I've even seen it get the better of me, and others that I know.
I wish I could tell you that the anger goes away, but in my unplugged time (12-13 mos.) It hasn't. The good news I can give you is that the fire eventually turns to just embers as you learn to stop looking at it from an emotional standpoint and view hypergamy, the feminine imperative, et al as simply facts of modern existence. The carnal benefits to your journey also ease the anger. Just beware of letting your anger eclipse everything else.
[deleted] 11y ago
"letting your anger eclipse everything else." - That's the point I've been wrestling with, finding the balance between using emotion to drive me to a new height, but then not lose it and turn into a bitter old man who is angry at everything, like how Bill Burr fears he might become later in life.
I love being who I am, just now seeing that there's so much more potential to be tapped.
[deleted] 11y ago
Taking the red pill is only part of it. Neo ate the red pill, was pissed off about eating gruel in sweat pants on a shitty little ship, dug a little deeper to see just how fucking crazy the whole plugged in bit is, and even watched someone turn their back on the red pill.
But that wasn't the good part of the movie.
The best part was when Neo accepted the reality, stopped believing in the spoon and learned to be the one.
Now you know the truth. And now it is time to go beyond knowing, and to start changing and molding your reality. Oh no, it sucks, now you have to be a man. Now you have to develop yourself, push yourself, lead others, and be confident. Darn.
Stop being angry about the red pill, and learn to be the one.
[deleted] 11y ago
that's a good one, i've only just begun to understand the basic idea about what's actually going on...going to take me months and years to master and overcome the harder obstacles on my path.
[deleted] 11y ago
I think a lot of men go through a really pissed off phase when it comes to the red pill. Just remember that at the end of the day there is really nothing to be pissed off about. This is the world and this is the way it works. Being angry won't change a thing, but knowing the truth can certainly help you to adapt and make the most of it.
[deleted] 11y ago
after reading a lot of the replies, feeling more calm. it was more self anger for allowing it to go this far, but the first step to change is admitting where I currently stand. It's time to start climbing
TimothyGeithner 11y ago
Similar age here... I was confused/disappointed at first, but then I felt very fortunate having unplugged at such a young age. As you read more material, you will realize how much pain the older generation (30,40,50 yrs old now) went through.
Its not very common to be unplugged in your 20s and you will feel very lucky in time to have avoided so much pain later on. Realize how much of an advantage you have over others- behaviors of others that seemed random now make perfect sense. Life is so much easier when you know how people are going to react.
I would really recommend reading through all of Rational Male and The Red Pill Room. If your into the evolutionary biology components of Game, I would recommend The Selfish Gene by Richard Dawkins and The Red Queen by Matt Ridley. Attached is a nice FAQ about evo bio as well:
http://www.anth.ucsb.edu/projects/human/epfaq/evpsychfaq_full.html#plasticity
[deleted] 11y ago
I'm about 1/4 of the way through rational male, all if it makes sense...wasn't expecting to find a source of new understanding after reading so many PUA forums and subreddit information.
damn straight about being lucky to learn about it now, course there's a long time before I can say I'm on the right path, seems like right now I just crashed my car at the intersection, and now need to rebuild myself before I can start out on the new path.
Love richard dawkins, and haven't heard of matt ridley, I'll have to check him out.