Is cold approach worth it? My take after thousands of approaches
TLDR: Do you want to have fun? Worth it. Do you want to get a girl? Not worth it.
Before you spergs attack me saying I need to learn how to approach and game, please note that I am 35 years old, I've done thousands of apporaches and got hundreds of numbers, dated hundreds of girls, I had tens of ONS. My conversion rate is about 3%. I'm also goning to say that picking up american and north european women is way easier than picking up italian ones, because here everybody is catholic and slut shaming is huge. Most of the 9s I fucked where american girls in Rome for holydays. So read and think before trying to teach me something, because I did the real thing, probably more than most of you.
I had a lot of fun doing cold approach. I had some success in day game, but mostly in the evening in pubs and discos. I opened contextual and direct, I went out with firends but also alone, I did everything on the book and out. I met new friends and made enemies. I had to abandon some of my friends because they were only going out with me for my ability to interact with women. I had fights. I had the opportunity to see some real pussy naked and smiling at me. I got some love other than sex from women, and gave back both.
Now, I'm tired. When I see a woman, I don't want to spend energy on her just because she's beautiful. Most of the times it's not worth it. There is such a low probability that she is smart, interesting and with a personality. Even when she is giving IOIs, there is a good chance she just wants attention. She has friends that are going to cockblock, she will ghost and disappear at once for reasons not dependent on you. And while trying to get her can be fun in itself, after a while it's not fun anymore. It's like doing sales with cold calling: a blind, dumb, numbers' game.
Now I only do content marketing, if you know what I mean.
I prefer going to yoga or improv class, which takes more courage than cold approach. There is no alcohol involved, no saying stupid shit and trying to impress, you really get to know real people and be a real person. There is no game, because it's real life.
I'm not going to give a random woman the opportunity to reject me, she does not deserve that right. First I need to see she is worth it, and than I will take my chance. No more freebies for the opposite sex.
Sex is overrated, ask anybody who is really fucking what they think about it.
If all of this sounds crazy to you, because you are putting so much effort to learn cold approach, rethink your priorities. It's way better to study the kind of demographic you want to get, and search for pussy by hobbies and social circles. The girls are SO much better in term of personality, and if you have real value they are gladly going to give you space.
That's all I have to say after around 12 years of cold approach. Fun, but not useful.
Good luck boys
TXJohn83 4y ago
3% conversion rate is shit. I should be closer to 10% if you spend more than a few minutes on them.
pieroit 4y ago
IF you spend more than a few minutes on them.
mydogfartzwithz 4y ago
Yes i think you need to do cold approach. Let me explain, girls are emotional this is obvious. Therefore they don’t usually have the rationale to approach you. Unless they’re a hot “bar” rat that goes out often and is very comfortable there. Going out during the day to events is very important, not just random pickup at the mall though it can be valuable. Most guys don’t know how to do it. It’s a skill you should use to help you get better at what I’d say is warm game, or some kind of social value game where you know people around you.
Zech4riah 4y ago
As many have already pointed out in here, thanks for the honesty especially with numbers etc. Those are the realistic numbers if you only approach girls who are atleast considered "cute".
I think the things that you are saying will be the reality for most of the guys doing cold approach.
I'd say it was useful. Because you had fun and got various experiences. Also you are probably a lot more skilled socially now than you were 12 years ago. Social skills and courage helps you in every sector of life. The time was not wasted.
pieroit 4y ago
Thank you mate. I was a little unfair saying "not useful". Let's say "not efficient"
SaudFraud 4y ago
This is literally the definition of cope:
aka "I can't get rejected if I reject you first!11!!!"
If after 12 YEARS of cold approaching you haven't mustered enough game to have better hit rates, you're not as "chad" as you think you are. This is the #1 problem with our sub: people who think they reached their potential and are just better than everyone else now.
You're not who you think you are. And if my comment offends (not disagree, but offends) anyone reading, then you're one of those people too.
pieroit 4y ago
My rates are fine, but my time is not much. Anyway I am going to clarify for you.
I am not trying to reject first, I want to know who I am approaching, know it's worth it, and then go for it. At that point anything can happen and I will accept it.
I have no fun anymore, even when the hottie says yes. Hard to understand, right? That's because you have no experience. Bye
LastRevision 4y ago
Respect the honesty there.
DaRockLobster 4y ago
There is no method better than cold approach when it comes to learning how to seduce a woman. Cold approach affords a consistent high number of interactions which allows for the fastest growth. Once one can successfully do cold approach, they also earn a certain unwavering confidence. Even if one's cold approach skills wane, they will always know that, with some time, pain, and effort, they can be successful with woman. It is also worth pointing out that many, if not a large majority, of male hobbies have few woman that mutually engage. This leads to a situation where most men only have opportunity to engage with woman through mutual friends or cold approach.
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You are 35 years old and you have done legit pickup for 12 years. I can imagine your advice makes sense for someone like you. That being said, those that are younger and without so much experience should probably still do cold approach pickup, at least to the extent that they know they can succeed in it.
pieroit 4y ago
Cold approach should be at least paralled by a social circle, organic strategy. Both PUA and TRP focus way too much on cold approach and not enough on core social skills.
So if you are younger than me, you have all my encouragment to go approach, grow and have fun. Just remember, the hard work with high ROI is hobbies and social circles.
Xercister 4y ago
I know I am going to get roasted for saying this but I find cold approaching to be a waste of time. If you're chasing tail then you really haven't grasped fully what TRP means. I've found that when I stopped chasing tail and focused on myself, things just lined up naturally. Start working out, chasing money and achievements and the women will somehow manage to "show up".
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Just my two cents and what has worked for me not work for everyone.
pieroit 4y ago
Who cares if they roast you, keep your frame and only take constructive feedback.
Can you elaborate on how things "lined up" and women "showed up"? I am really behind at this, I need to know what to expect and how to recognize it and grow with it
Xercister 4y ago
Yea, I don't care if I am roasted or not just saying I expect it since so many guys are for "the game".
First I say this. The sidebar is your best friend if you're behind on things or new to TRP.
Secondly what I mean by how things linked up and women showed up, well that is simple. I quit worrying about the prize being the women and flipped my thinking. Once I realized that I am the prize and women should be fighting over me I gave up things like going to bars and clubs to pick up chicks. I did things that gave me more confidence. I started working out to obtain the body I want and picked up my side hustle to the point where I was able to get my dream car.
Why would you spend money you don't have on a woman who, more than likely, won't care for you once that money stops coming in? Focus that money and energy on yourself and women will start to notice. Building confidence was the biggest change for me since I was already over a 6 figure salary. There really is a difference when you look at a woman knowing that you're the target, not them as opposed to looking at a woman and thinking that you'll have to say something clever to get her attention.
Having this mindset really does allow you to weed out the bad women who are just trying to swing from one branch to the next. It also shows them that you're willing to walk away when they do something stupid because you don't have to put up with it. Without this mindset, you are left the victim to whatever crap they think they can pull because you haven't valued yourself as much as you should. I
love women just as much as the next guy but my life is more important and who I chose to let in it is my choice, not theirs.
theguytheguy1000 4y ago
cold approach is awesome, been doing it 5 years, i love the whole thing.
I've done thousands of approaches, slept with around 40 women, who have increasingly gotten hotter and hotter as i've gotten more confident.
admittedly the first thousand approaches were very unsuccessful but i've gotten exponentially better results over time.
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now it's just so fucking easy lol, not draining at all, barely feels like effort and it's so much fun. Cold approaching is like breathing to me.
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but ultimately the best thing about cold approach for me is my love of the game, like i just legit love chatting up women.
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Thing with me is i've always been an extrovert, even when i had no game the kind of guy at a party who is one of the loudest and always want to be centre of attention so cold approach just meshes with my personality so well. It's not a chore to me.
ebaymasochist 4y ago
The nights when you don't even feel like getting laid are the best. I would go find some guy all alone and make friends with him, then introduce him to a couple girls, then to the next person it looks like I have all these friends with me, and you end up surrounded by twenty people and your new friends are thanking you
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uwey 4y ago
All comes down to what you need.
If you need pussy? Start spin plate. If you need social skill, start making friends.
If you need to be calm approach girls, do cold approach.
Problem is it is difficult to evaluate what you need. Because objectively self evaluation is hard.
Overall, do a variety of difficult things will quickly show your overall skill bell curve. And if you add time/resources into the play, generally working out come out highest ROI, and making friends also comes out high because it net you social proof and networks to make more money.
When you have physique and money, 80% of trout is easy access, as man, you need to be above average to begin to able to pick what you want. You might start seeing a market value etc and invest less time/energy to get pussy.
Once you have enough experience, you would get few LTR, and eventually realized pussy just pussy, but a good cigar is a smoke. Pussy is never worth it.
Get gym time, friendship, business, and live the fucking life you want, don’t ever over invest in pussy, FFS spend money fly to Germany FKK club, is legal there. Spend few month in that if you are that thirsty.
Overly obsessed with something with low return is as stupid to put money into a shit car and try to make it F1 race machine: No matter how you polish a sandal it will not turn to a high quality boots.
One thing at time, and pick high ROI activity. Pay attention to your own health and find your own life purpose.
Finally, if you learn your entire life how to live, might start learning how to die when you turn 30.....
memento mori
learnfemalenature 4y ago
I used to do cold approach, had a decent success rate. But it’s just so draining.
Now I just wait for her to give some kind of indicator like she double takes, or when I sense she’s looking at me and look at her she looks away, things like that. The warm approach.
Warm approach is much more natural than cold approach and it’s actually based on something.
Cold approach is a lifestyle.
Warm approach > cold approach.
throwawaycunt1997 4y ago
Getting approached by girls is a whole new fun ball game. Only happened to me twice though and I autismo’d out because my brain was still focused on getting eggs and milk.
learnfemalenature 4y ago
I love when girls approach, complete power
RedGille 4y ago
One of the advises on the sidebar goes "get into the habit of talking to everyone".
I think it's a better approach to the approach problem cold vs. warm.
She is sitting/standing/walking not far from you? say something. Anything. Funny is ur best option of course. "Those tomatoes look like they had a rough night". "I think that old woman just tried to kick me". Just comment on smoething around you in a funny and non-formal way.
Und voila - It's not cold anymore.
From here, anything can happen. Or nothing (must likely). The point is - you didn't even notice it, but you've just approached her. This is indeed effortless, so much so that you don't even think about it as "approaching".
And by no means limit urself to women - really, talk to everyone around you, if the opportunity presents itself. And you feel like it, of course.
I'ts called basic natural human interaction, a new concept to many of us, too many. It's fun and it's adding energy instead of draining it, cannot imagine the amount of energy OP lost by non-natural interactions. Allow urself this great gift, it's amazing how it can change ur day sometimes.
And no, I was not born like that. I had to learn. I am natually a taciturn non-social guy. Took me long time to leave my old self behind.
Good luck all.
INNASKILLZ2K18 4y ago
This guy gets it.
Natural, organic interaction.
We talk so much about 'outcome independence'...but look at the guys saying how bad cold approach is and knowing their low conversion.
It's not true outcome independence unless you totally forget about the approaches, because you was just having fun.
RedGille 4y ago
just came back from the park, was doing some exercise and looking for someone to talk with, preferably a nice gal of course.
But found myself in a long talk with an older guy, very funny and probably more beneficial that a lame conversation with a young clueless gal.
the thing is - when you talk to everyone, inc gals, then gals become just another person to talk to, nothing special about them, just people with nice long hair.
No need for approach anxiety, coz I am talking to everyone anyway. And many times you realize pretty fast she is really not worth fretting over. But you didn't, you were just friendly, so bale out. was nice talking to you, ciao!
noNooodleArms 4y ago
The piece here in TRP on "how to talk to everyone you see" changed my life for the better. It was all about letting people into that inner monologue.
pieroit 4y ago
Reading signals and acting on it is a lifestyle :)
learnfemalenature 4y ago
Yep, and in that case it isn’t a cold approach, it’s a warm approach.
Tarmyniatur 4y ago
Cold vs hot approach (warm? what?) is not based on IOI, it's based on your previous relationship with the woman. If you met here then, it's cold. If you have a common friend circle and hang out constantly, it's hot.
learnfemalenature 4y ago
Hot approach would be having a common friend or some kind of social proof.
Warm approach is more than a cold approach in that you don’t know who she is but she’s giving you a signal that she might be attracted.
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throwabcdaway4 4y ago
Wtf cold approach = outside any dating / socially accepted meeting context.
Bar / clubs = no
Social circle = no
Rave party = no
Starbucks = yes
Beach = yes
Street = yes
Library = yes
Tarmyniatur 4y ago
If you are in a starbucks gaming a friend of a friend which you saw several times already but didn't yet approach, it's not cold.
throwabcdaway4 4y ago
Indeed. Glad at least someone gets it here.
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BriefcaseHead2 4y ago
every young man with high testosterone has been there
BriefcaseHead2 4y ago
I think cold approaching should be used specifically for practicing your 'initiating conversation skills', preferably with men. We all know having a vibrant social circle of men that actually go out and do exciting things is not only more fun but actually results in more pussy. We all need more male friends, whether or not we admit it.
Practice approaching men. Guys seem so damn 'warm' to approaches its actually amazing. Like we're all friends and are happy for another man to join our group if he doesn't seem like a murderer or weirdo.
A fun way to approach some guys is just to walk up with your phone out on tinder/bumble and ask the guys if they have a minute and tell them to think of a message to send to the girls. It's actually funny as fuck, especially if you lift and actually get more than a pathetic 5 matches a day. When you show them your phone with like 20 new matches they will be amazed "wow tinder actually works for you?" and instantly you have that pre-selection kind of vibe where they know you are high smv.
19abto 4y ago
Any type of girls that are more open than others? I’m probably gonna sound like a weirdo but I workout I’m in good physical shape at 5’10...and I’m very much into voluptuous/thicker women. But I pussy out in day gaming them because I think they’ll react the same as more athletic/what-most-of-society-considers-attractive kind of women..which in my experience is pretty cold (I do acknowledge that this is possibly my fault though because maybe i approach the wrong way). Any advice?
DoggodD 4y ago
You're not really wrong with assuming that they will react the same way as more conventionaly attractive women. When the society throws validation on women, even a fat hoe thinks she's a queen. Saying that won't really give you more confidence, but what you need is to build outcome independence, the conversion rate of cold approach is low, so you have to learn to not be affected by rejection.
Anyway, for a chubby girl, aim for those in groups of friends in the club etc., show them no attention from the start to break through her confidence from online validation. Chat up her friends, then at the end of the day pull her.
ebaymasochist 4y ago
Are you actually attracted to the athletic women? If you don't actually want to fuck them maybe you are putting off some kind of signs that you don't. And they are picking up on that.
jm51 4y ago
Act as if she was the sister of your best buddy. Pleasant chat, no (apparent) game and give an upbeat bye before the conversation gets dull.
Take note of any conversation starters for the next time you meet. 'How did your exams go?' etc.
throwabcdaway4 4y ago
Honesly 3% is low. Its not really because you have done 1000s of approach that you are doing it well.. your vibe might be off.
pieroit 4y ago
3% is high, almost pro level. Ask around
throwabcdaway4 4y ago
"Pro level" omg ><. Honestly it sounds just that you are not selective and blindly hit on every piece of meat. By choosing your right targets you can have up to 30% conversion on long term. Its not exactly the same autist mindsey that trying to get laid THAT NIGHT with THAT GIRL.. also no wonder you get bored with girls with such an attitude.
Also yeah like another guy said.. hitting on girls in bars & clubs is not cold approach... the girls are here for that, at least unconsciously.
pieroit 4y ago
I would be happy for your 30% and ask you to teach me. I doubt it is true because you would have no time for reading and writing in this thread.
assa_ssin 4y ago
OP men willingly believe what they wish.
That's my feeling with people being so fast to agree with you. Cold approach is tough and most people try to avoid it.
If someone is all day out cold approaching , drinking alcohol and taking drugs when is in a sensitive age and has to take care of his career- then yes it's wrong.
I personally allow myself to cold approach thots one day a week just for sport. It is fun and I see it like recreational activity.
It has't harmed my career - on the contrary.
BriefcaseHead2 4y ago
This is the right way to do it. Go out and spend a little bit of time approaching to practice your skills, especially if you actually enjoy that, which you should. I think OP is mixing up the actual act of cold approach and the intense, prioritisation of getting girls, which takes time and effort away from our mission. Approach, but don't prioritise over your goals.
mr_Tobbor 4y ago
I am saying it a lot of time before and some guys get upset.
I say: Cold approach is insane!!!
Now if you have fun it is ok! But I don't think this the case for many guys here.
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SuperCrazy07 4y ago
You say you have fun doing it and then list all the things that aren’t fun.
The thing that most stands out is that you don’t want to give a random woman the right to reject you. That sounds like the male equivalent of when a woman says “he used me for sex.” Don’t do it if you don’t enjoy it.
It sounds like you’ve already arrived at this conclusion.
I think most guys, especially younger ones, should do it at least until they are confident talking with strangers.
pieroit 4y ago
Another guy is telling the same as you, being that a novice needs to do this experience to gain confidence even if it's not efficient.
Not convinced about this. I know many guys who do great without ever cold approaching, because they started since teenagers to develop interests and social skills.
Also, by cold approaching so much I developed an insensitivity I am not proud of. I did things I totally regret in the name of getting confident.
BTW you got the main point of my post, thank you
user12345678654 4y ago
That's the entire point of cold approach.
You want something meaningful then you have to do shit meaningfully. Seems like you discovered that regardless but this post is useless.
pieroit 4y ago
What is useless here is the sentence: "do shit meaninfully".
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pieroit 4y ago
Oh yeah I can relate. I had some LTR who was creative and with good values... spending an afternoon with them is better than fucking "plates".
peacemakerzzz 4y ago
Is cold calling worth it? Picking up the phone and just start dialling has zero opportunity loss.
If anything it is just the ego not being able to handle rejections. However once the ego has been desensitised to doing it, it becomes second nature and you get better over time.
Cold approach is no different from cold calling in the sales/business world. Cold approaching is just a small piece of the bigger pie.
Women just want to feel sold to what you’re offering whether in seduction or whatever aspect of selling. Cold approaching is just a method of selling. (Think door to door sales)
If you want to get the bread, you have to get better at doing the cold touches, with a sense of dedication, eagerness and passion.
jm51 4y ago
I read of a sales manager that would give his new sales guys 3 strong leads a day. After a month of them working those strong leads, he'd hand them a phone book. 'This is where I've been getting your leads from'.
pieroit 4y ago
is it really necessary in sales go for the cold call? What about inbound and networking?
peacemakerzzz 4y ago
That’s like asking if you could meet women through your social circle. If you already exhausted your network, best way to meet them is to cold approach.
It’s not necessary per se, but another way to expand horizons.
It’s all about resourcefulness.
pieroit 4y ago
Is there any way to have a continuous flow in a social circle? Do social circles definitely exaust or there are way to renovate them? That's were I want to put my "resourcefullness"
peacemakerzzz 4y ago
All boils down to “you”, bud. If you’re a people person, a natural extroverted go-getter, then you can easily make friends with anybody. It takes political dexterity and skill to maintain a large social circle because for one, it is taxing and tiring as hell to keep up with everybody you know.
One way to keep a big circle is to be the center of the circle, to be a huge grab of attention. Remember law 24 of power: play the perfect courtier.
Normally people that do these are in careers that require them to be a cult of personality. Politicians, CEOs, club presidents, even as simple as the coolest guy in the group.
uniquan 4y ago
It's been several months since I've come across a post that I like from this sub. Thanks!
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ForeverKarlMalone 4y ago
It’s not a numbers game. My conversion rate is 1/10. Your skill is simply not high enough
TheMailmanic 4y ago
Good insights based on real life grinding and experience!
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redmadcaterpillar 4y ago
I am from Eastern Europe. Cold approching girls is HARD here, because of slut shaming etc. Some girls say that even if they really like the guy they don't wanna be perceived as "too easy". I cold approached in the US and Western Europe and it's breeze compared to my country. I live in a city with population around 300k and I don't cold approach that often anymore. Also I am naturally aloof and kinda mysterious and that attracts girls, but it is hard to play that card when you approach because you are in a weaker position and have to be a dancing monkey in a way.
p.s. I dress well, am tall, athletic blah blah
ebaymasochist 4y ago
This is what pickup artists always taught. You have to have a strategy to get her away from her friends so she can do what she wants. You have to have the sense to know she will not kiss you within five minutes of meeting because of her reputation. She is not a guy who will go to her friends and say "I'm def going to fuck that guy tonight". So you build attraction and get her contact info to finish the rest later. I know you know this but for anyone else reading.
Sorry bud, but you don't have to be a dancing monkey. You're not there to entertain her, but to find out if she is the kind of person you want in your life. The most attractive women almost never get approached. Because guys don't think they have a chance with them. Approaching her is an action that shows you have the confidence and ambition to do what so many other guys aren't able to do. Then if you don't give a fuck what happens after that, you're ready to walk away at any point, and not putting her on a pedestal... That's the winning combination.
inbredostrptw 4y ago
How could approaching and conversing with people not be useful. You are constantly exercising your social skills, learning and experiencing new things, as well as potentially leaving your comfort zone. Very valuable in my opinion. As for not getting laid from it, it’s obviously not gonna have the highest conversion rate, but there are probably other things you can do like lift and make money that will help.
When you’re cold approaching I don’t think you should go in with the mindset of trying to impress. The I’m the prize mindset is what you want. A little bit hard when you’re talking to someone with no reason to care about you, but you should take an interest in them. Try to learn something about them and life, this will make the cold approach more interesting, make you more interesting, you can potentially learn something, and it serves as vetting.
I realize you have a lot of experience with it, but from my experience it can be extremely valuable. It’s also nice to just have the ability to talk to the hot girl sitting in Starbucks when before you would just walk away and think about her for the rest of the day.
pieroit 4y ago
What about developing social skills organically?
If you really think you are the prize, why should you approach?
inbredostrptw 4y ago
Developing social skills organically is fine to. I don’t see a downside to more practice however. I also think that you exercise some different skills through cold approach.
I also don’t think that cold approaching defeats the frame of I’m the prize. It puts you on the back foot, but the girls sure as hell aren’t gonna do it. Something I saw on some pickup video said a good mentality is, I’m the prize, you seem interesting, are you good enough for the prize. Just a thought. In general though, I think that there are numerous benefits to cold approaching besides having fun and sleeping with someone.
I can agree that it isn’t the most effective way to get laid, but that’s not the only thing that you gain from it.
pieroit 4y ago
I rarely watched pickup videos, I was busy doing it for real. Cold approach (without nonverbal invitation from her) is the opposite of being the prize.
inbredostrptw 4y ago
We all do it for real. I rarely watch them also, but it’s something to supplement your experience.
pieroit 4y ago
You really believe in pickup videos? Most of them are made to sell workshops and have nothing to do with seduction
inbredostrptw 4y ago
What do you mean by believe pickup videos? I take what’s useful to me and discard the rest. Same thing as everything, including here.
BrownGummyBear 4y ago
"If you really think you are the prize, why should you approach?"
You approach because if you are a man who knows what he wants you will go and try to conquer it, it's in our nature. It happens in nature very frequently, the males approach the females and humans are not the exception. What "being the prize" means is that you don't put women on a pedestal, what it means is that you have a mission as a man (instead of making chasing pussy your life's mission); it doesn't means "don't approach beautiful women cause you might rejected, they should be approaching you cause you're the prize!"
FLAWED LOGIC
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inbredostrptw 4y ago
Thanks for articulating this
pieroit 4y ago
If you have value people want to spend time with you and respect you. There will be women around just for that reason. At that point there is no real need for cold approach, that's the nature you talk about
I understand it takes time, but really believe me: cold approach is fun, but the worst (less efficient) way to get pussy
Mr_KenSpeckle 4y ago
It is a false choice to argue that you either build value or you approach. You can do both.
Mr_KenSpeckle 4y ago
Cold approach doesn't mean: 1. you have to literally approach every woman you see regardless of attraction; 2. you have to go out every day and every night; 3. you have to act like a retard.
pieroit 4y ago
Can't see anywhere in my post or comments any hint of 1, 2 or 3. Maybe that's your way of doing it and you are projecting.
Mr_KenSpeckle 4y ago
You are oozing it. I believe you when you say you can't see it.
pieroit 4y ago
You really have no better use of your time than trolling? And from 2 different accounts? Get a life weirdo
Mr_KenSpeckle 4y ago
Says the guy who keeps responding within minutes of my comments. "Two accounts": I have no idea what you are talking about. I'm going to leave you now. It seems like it's your nap time.
voncenti 4y ago
Oh another Italian brother like me
pieroit 4y ago
Questo governo non opera col favore delle tenebre
roco-j 4y ago
Esiste una community redpill italiana? Sarei curioso, spesso i post che vedo qui sono per me dissonanti, credo perché la nostra cultura, per fortuna direi, è ancora diversa da quella americana.
ceswk 4y ago
You lost me at "my conversion is 3%". How the hell can I read an article from someone who tracks his conversion rate like whaaat ?
ebaymasochist 4y ago
Seriously that's talking to 50 women in one night and taking home 1.5.. from 8pm to 1 am, that's one girl every six minutes. Most approaches don't take more than a couple minutes to figure out if they are good or not. I don't know how that is so bad but OP is too outcome dependent and that is probably the impression he gave while doing it.
juddshanks 4y ago
I think doing a few cold approaches is worthwhile as a method to develop a thicker skin and beat the fear of failure out of you. If you're naturally an anxious person, it can be good for you for that reason.
But yeah, if you're using it as your primary method of picking up, you're totally missing the point. If you're outgoing, have a social life and are reasonably high value, opportunities will start to present themselves.
theredsperg 4y ago
I noticed this years ago, not that i'm any good at cold approach but you are going to find it 300x easier going to meet people at places where you actually want to go
well yeah, that's obvious bucko
unamins 4y ago
-3% of rate success for what? Fucking of the total approached?
-"smart, interesting and with personality"
pieroit 4y ago
What can I say, I am a romantic guy and think women are people as much as men are
unamins 4y ago
So it's ok to change method of searching.
The cold approach has a different purpose, doesn't mean is a wasting time and doesn't work to get girls, is just not to find the prefect girl for your life.
What about the first question?
throwawaycunt1997 4y ago
I’m only 23 and I already feel this. I used to take a buddy of mine out approaching sometimes or even did it on my own when I was 19, 20 just to get out of my shell a bit more. I was an ugly little sperg at the time, but alas I had begun the process to cultivate a personality. Ultimately, that’s why I did it; I never got laid by cold approach alone but it certainly was a novel form of fun at the time. I’d probably have a higher chance of success now as I’ve made drastic changes in my appearance since, but every time the thought crosses my head I just tell my itself it’s not worth it and immediately shift my attention as I have more valuable uses for my time than playing flaky girl games. Approaching ended up just a phase for me, my hay day came when I had two LTRs at once and that was enough dread for me to burn through most of my sexual bucket list items for a while. Sex ultimately just ended up being another busted nut; it’s the same orgasm of dopamine in the brain as DIYing it, and the novelty has died for me. It simply isn’t worth the effort when I can be working on my craft or doing something good that isn’t related to sex.
That said, my priorities have simply shifted. I’d rather focus on the kind of lifestyle I want, not chasing another high. In that case, that is for me to figure out an avenue to find bisexual girls. My upbringing has always had me interested in the arts, and has left me with as a dandy archetype; I have hooked up with some some bi girls who have compared me to a lesbian. (Projecting her bisexuality onto me.) If it weren’t for my outspoken attitude and conservative viewpoints, you’d think I was a liberal art student. Hopefully with all these lockdowns they’ll either get lifted eventually or I can find an outlet where these types of dandy girls congregate, as that is the audience I want.
pieroit 4y ago
I think this is the right way to do it. Deeply study the demographic you want and go wherever they are.
Good luck mate
SvenAtLarge 4y ago
Cold approach isn't about the pussy.
Cold approach is supposed to change you. Sounds like it worked. I've noticed a similar change in myself. Your advice on where to meet women is spot on. Do interesting things with interesting people.
sony_anumo 4y ago
Trust me, when italian girls are out of the country they open their legs to anyone
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pieroit 4y ago
I can see you are a sales guy. Also username check out ;)
I respect your view, rejection is the price for freedom. Not the only way to pay, you know better than me there are other strategies to sell than cold calling.
I'm gonna stop cold approach for a long time, that right to reject has to be earned by more than beauty. Cold approach it's not fun anymore...
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pieroit 4y ago
Good luck to you friend, thank you for sharing
Russian_nam 4y ago
Idk, maybe because i've mostly done daygame, i get dumb sluts rarely and most of the time girls are atleast well educated and interesting
EnteredYourMind 4y ago
Fuck sales people, and I'm a salesman.
RafiqChique 4y ago
Cold approach is a waste of time if you’re on your purpose. ‘Cold’ Approach women in overlapping social circles that might know of you. Get social proof up and use that. Cold approach when you absolutely have to say something to a girl, but don’t expect an outcome. You will have a higher positive interaction rate, which is all that really matters anyway.
TheGreatConst 4y ago
Please read what goodlookingloser says about cold-approach. You can get your conversion up to 10% or even more. It is just that your conversion suffers from "taking numbers". You should set the date immediately if a girl shows interest in you. Either go for "instant date" if she is free or set the date's time for a little bit later this or the next day if she is not.
" First I need to see she is worth it, and then I will take my chance. No more freebies for the opposite sex. "Yeah, right. You shouldn't do cold-approach to get laid. You should do it to chose women who are worthy. You are basically testing/screening them by approaching. Instead of trying to get laid. The latter will make your frame weak AF which is the main reason why guys have low conversions from cold-approach and most PUA suck. Alphas don't chase sex. They test girls to see if they are worthy of some dicking.
This " And while trying to get her can be fun in itself, after a while it's not fun anymore. " is your problem. Don't try to get her, it is the same as actually entering HER frame. Test. Screen. Choose.
With a 10% conversion rate, you can get a new girl every day as long as you are willing to spend 1-2 hours to do 10 approaches or more. It would take you literally a week to get enough plates to have sexual life better than 99% of men. Well, that being the case, even 3% is enough to achieve that in 2 months. Most guys can't do it in their whole life. So, in a sense, cold-approach is a cheat code.
pieroit 4y ago
Yeah right, you approach girls just to select them, not to get them. And after a few lines of text you contradict yourself by counting how many approaches it takes to build plates.
Come on man
TheGreatConst 4y ago
There is no contradiction. "Getting a plate" means finding a girl who is willing to do what it takes to be yours. Being nice, submissive, hot enough, etc. You deciding the rules and if she isn't following them then you'll choose someone else. There are two ways to react when a girl shows you that she isn't interested for whatever reason. "I suck" or "she sucks". It is up to you to choose how you view the same situation. Moreover, if it is "she sucks" reaction then you still can give her a second chance by holding a stronger frame. If you are nice enough, that is. And depending on your frame you'll either feel bad or nothing at all. Reading your post I can physically feel how deep you are in the scarcity chasing mindset. A girl can't reject me, she can only do something that sucks. And if she does then I'll tell her to behave and to stop trying to prove herself so much. If she isn't willing to make efforts to meet my standards then she can leave at any point in time, I'm not gonna try and convince her.
LiveAFTSOV 4y ago
Cold approach isn't limited to bars and clubs.
Cold approach is talking to the cute girl walking near you in the mall.
Cold approach is started a conversation with the pretty woman at the store with you.
It's flirting with the checkout clerk cus you think she's got the goods.
Malls, book stores, and especially school are all good places to cold approach.
You're right about one thing: Hobbies and Social circles are great ways to meet women. Going to a CO-ED hobby (my go to is poetry) and then dominating that hobby will get the women interested in you and you will have the pick of the litter.
Do things you enjoy doing and talk to the women that also enjoy those things. And as you're on your way to enjoy those things talk to the women on their own way to places.
Johnfeb94 4y ago
For a long time my co-ed hobby was dancing. Obviously a great male to female ratio there. As soon as they learn you're not gay you're drowning in ppoooon
pieroit 4y ago
That's what I am talking about. Good for you mate
pieroit 4y ago
Fair point on the extended concept of cold approach. You need to tell me, how many times it worked? Do you got a measure on it? I do.
LiveAFTSOV 4y ago
Why do you say it's not worth it if you had success with it?
adam-l Senior Endorsed 4y ago
He's from Italy. Many of the different opinions about cold approach are probably just cultural differences. It might very well be totally worth it in some parts of the world, while not at all in others.
pieroit 4y ago
Conversion rate for organic approach is almost an order of magnitude higher
LiveAFTSOV 4y ago
And by organic, you refer to meeting through mutual activity, such as a club, same class, or shared hobby like rock climbing, yes?
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BrownGummyBear 4y ago
"You need to tell me, how many times it worked? Do you got a measure on it? I do."
No one give a fuck about your diary and the amount of times you got rejected at clubs. Who cares about your stats if you're only considering cold approach to be picking up club thots at clubs and bars.
pieroit 4y ago
Oh you give a fuck, you just commented on it
BrownGummyBear 4y ago
I'm only commenting to POINT OUT that your data is FLAWED. Cold approach means meeting any one outside your social circle, it doesn't mean picking up club/bar sluts. Your stats are (almost) exclusively provided by picking up club/bar sluts, your data is therefore IRRELEVANT.
DURRR
pieroit 4y ago
No more attention to you, troll
BrownGummyBear 4y ago
How is telling you your data is wrong trolling? Stop being a snowflake, you act like a male feminist who thinks anything which disagrees with their narrative is “trolling”
And the bunch of pussies downvoting me for pointing this out, ya’ll are pathetic. As if ya’ll guys never heard of using a REPRESENTATIVE SAMPLE.
You are ignorant OP, you don’t even know what cold approach truly means; it’s not used exclusively as a term for picking up bar/club hoes. Learn words before posting nonsense
Franek715 4y ago
I have a question. Did you come to this realization after 12 years?
If not, what kept you going? What is different now compared to the time when you had let's say 800 cold approaches?
pieroit 4y ago
In the beginning it was a challenge, then it became fun, then frustrating, then fun again and so on for a few cicles.
In the last year it has been boring to know new girls and even when I am successfull I don't get satisfaction or any personal growth.
It has been a slowly growing awareness that it's not worth it. In the beginning I was "not enough", I had to prove myself. Now I see I have too much value to give away time and attention for free.
I prefer getting less action but only interact with high value women. They are hard to find with cold approach, that's why I am resolving on organic growth. Hope it works, I'm tired.
INNASKILLZ2K18 4y ago
I see it in the comments here, but it really depends on what 'cold approach' means for a guy.
If it's literally going out to pick-up, scoping at the mall to just go up and talk to women then yes that isn't optimal.
That's a gue waste of time, and can be creepy and weird.
I make my approaches organic and natural. I don't make it in aim to 'cold approach', 'get that number', blah blah.
I have quick, fun flirty conversations. I took all the 'game', 'sex', 'trying to pick up' stuff out of it a while back.
I have a brief conversation, and by the very end I actually have to remind myself to get a number.
Shared interests are great. I study, so college is a gold-mine. Gym can not be bad. I'm getting back into spoken word poetry once restrictions lift fully.
Those send of a good vibe that you're not there just to pick up. Think about it, guys coming up to you randomly in the mall or whatever is just creepy. Their is no context.
trollreign 4y ago
Whether it's creepy or not mostly depends on whether she likes you, and to a much smaller extent on location.
At least a dozen women have told me that they would really like it and would find it ballsy and romantic if someone just randomly approached them because they liked them. All of them (mostly 6s, 7s and 8s) said that this has never happened to them.
A lot of women in dating apps have bios that go something like this: "I'm here because you didn't bump into me in the supermarket / you didn't approach me in the book shop / we weren't splashed by the same car on a rainy day" and stuff like that. They crave meeting men in real life and they actually fantasize about it. The man just needs to be hot and charming.
Just today I had a date from Happn with a late 20s girl (a good 7.5). She complained that in 2020 (and being 28 or 29) there are no opportunities for real-life dating anymore, only online. She claimed that she literally goes to coffee shops and libraries regularly with the ONLY purpose of hoping to be approached. Noone has ever approached her, not once.
INNASKILLZ2K18 4y ago
Yes, and you need to make those approaches cool, calm, and sort of organic.
Remember not to totally listen to what women say.
They want to be approached, but do it in the wrong way and you'll look creepy.
I completely agree with you. I'm saying the art is in the approach.
This is basic stuff...be cool, make it seem organic and don't try too hard.
McBlakey 4y ago
As a 33 year old man's very refreshing to hear someone my age talking about this. Isn't it incredible how time flies by feels like all the young man last year but really it was over a decade ago.
I can say that women are like NPCs because they are very similar to each other in a lot of ways maybe it's my subjective view but it feels like there are more differences between men than women.
I think you may also be right to say this not worth it I had a lot more success with tinder and online dating than I did with cold approach. And as you say the sort of people you meet on cold approach will ditch you in a heartbeat for reasons that are not even to do with you that is one of the reasons genuine connection is important. It does seem like this cold approach idea is something that was drawn out of the world prior to smartphones and that these other ways of meeting people are denigrated on the basis that they are somehow cheating.
I would agree that cold approach is like doing it on hard mode and if you can succeed at it you've done something that is remarkable in that very few men actually take the trouble to be good at it. It's not really worth it for me and I feel that would make a much better connection with women I get to know in other circumstances.
Totally agree that sex is overrated as you say. But if you haven't had it before and then it is very important to pursue it. I do recommend any inexperienced guy they go out there and try and make something happen with their relationships with the opposite sex. Unless they're gay in which case I wouldn't be able to advise.
Rkingpin 4y ago
Planning to restart cold approach at big malls in the next few weeks when I have weekends off. I can understand your sentiment after years in the game.
However as a young 22 year old still establishing himself for me there is still plenty thrill in new kills. But I can see why you'd be burnt out by your 30's.
Once established and grown I dont plan to be chasing tail at malls lmao.
pieroit 4y ago
Good luck to you brother, enjoy ;)
gbnz87 4y ago
I disagree. If I didnt start to cold approach in the last year I wouldnt of had a GF for 6 months nor a FWB with a girl visiting from Germany.
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I would still be on sites like RSVP/eharmony paying to message girls and hoping that they either look like their photos/arent socially awkward or are attracted to me. I would probably get 1 date a month if I was lucky when I did online dating. I think a few rejections from cold approach is worth it in my opinion. It is also fantastic practice on how to behave around a woman for when you do meet a good woman.
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I feel like ive grown my social skills significantly in the past 2 years not just from cold approach but putting myself out there more and more. We have recently just lifted lockdowns where I am, when I went back to the gym I spent nearly an half a hour just talking to everyone coming back (people were coming up to me) 5 years ago I doubt anyone at my gym would of known I was alive as I never spoke and just blended into the background any chance I could.
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I do respect that you did put down a number of 3%. I would say that is fairly accurate. 1 in 20 is fairly reasonable imo (anyone that says they get more are either really lucky, have been doing this forever or are just have a natural charm or charisma to them)
​
Meeting women by social circles is obviously the best way but a lot of us have really limited social circles. I have 0 females in my social circle other than my friends wife. Its easier said than done to get invited into another groups circle. You are essentially having to charm a group of people rather than just the one.
pieroit 4y ago
Of course cold approach can be fun and beneficial. I'm talking about efficiency here.
​
That is the problem, you see. I think as a community we should spend way more time talking about social circles than about cold approach. How to make friends, how to cultivate interests, how to grow your own social life.
It's easy PUA lingo to say "just go talk to her", but ROI is low and there is no organic growth in that.
gbnz87 4y ago
It is a double edged sword though. There are plenty of people that dont have great women in their social circles and that great women could just be walking by and you may miss it if you arent actively cold approaching. Ideally you should be cold approaching and trying to build your social circle at the same time.
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Both approaches require a lot of luck in either crossing paths with the right girl at the right time or by getting the right girl in your social circle at somewhat the right time. Doing both boosts your odds of finding a great woman.
MilkMoney111 4y ago
My problem is bitter bitches. If I meet a girl in my social circle and she gets mad she gets REALLY mad. And there goes my social circle bc she’s causing drama
the99percent1 4y ago
Sex is not overrated.. and this is coming from someone who frequently gets it..
Wtf is wrong with you??
pieroit 4y ago
We may have different libido levels pal
Maybe_Im_Confused 4y ago
It’s a young mans game, you’re about out of your prime.
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pieroit 4y ago
True, but I don't feel like recommending 20 yo guys to invest much energy in it as I did
Finexis 4y ago
Suppose you never do let alone learn cold approach and solely do online dating consistently.
Now suppose the opportunity arises for a so-called 'warm approach', for example in your dance or improv class, at work, university, etc. Such a warm-approach opportunity is pretty rare for most lads unless you consistenly do activities with lot of females involved (so this automatically excludes most engineering / tech / finance university degrees / jobs, martial arts classes, the gym for most ppl, and obviously / studtying working on your own) .
Now you have two problems before doing the warm approach:
1) You have more approach anxiety that you would have if you practised cold approach, which decreases the probability of approaching.
2) You don't know how to open, show premise, qualify, escalate, close, etc. The whole game procedure is oblivious to you. You haven't internalised it.
Hence your probability of actually closing the warm approach will also be significantly lower than had you done cold approach regularly.
pieroit 4y ago
So your point is, cold approach is going to make you good at warm approach more than doing the warm approach itself? Does not look logical to me, neither emotionally sound.
Cold approach gives a lot, I never said it's not useful. It's just NOT EFFICIENT
Finexis 4y ago
No the point is that many people don't have enough warm approach opportunities to practise gaming girls, so they're not prepared when an opportunity arises
darkstar1031 4y ago
Yeah, I stopped with the one night stands years ago, because I really felt like I was giving my energy away for free. Now, if I get IOI and I really thing she's more than just a wet hole I might decide to engage, but really I've reached an N count high enough that empty sex is just bland. I also don't give two shits about looks. I've been with 10's and I've been with 3's. You wanna know the difference? The 3s are genuinely into it, and want it. The 10s know their 10s, and are always judging, and looking for a reason to branch swing. The 10s are looking to be the next piece of eye candy for a pro sports player, or a rockstar, or whatever. They're drapery, not much different from a nice set of curtains, or a really nice necktie, and they know it. Me, I'll take the three, and have a hell of a lot more fun, and when she starts to nag, and get on my nerves I just show her the door, and go find another one.
badass_monk 4y ago
Its funny cause guys assume there is game.There is no such thing as game, you just talk to a girl if she likes you whatever you do dont matter much, she decided that she likes you, if she doesn’t like you still whatever you do dont matter she wont.All we do is try.
Mr_KenSpeckle 4y ago
Game exists. Game is basically sales training and your dick is the product. Do you doubt that it is possible for a salesman to improve through training? Granted, there are some prospects that aren't going to buy no matter what you do but that doesn't mean all sales training is bullshit.
El0vution 4y ago
Agreed 100%, but until someone has learned all this they should continue to cold approach.
throwaway-aa2 4y ago
That’s a decent point but here’s the thing (as someone who has done hundreds of approaches myself over the years).
To be honest I can’t in good faith recommend anyone do this anymore. The Book of Pook basically covers it (this resource by the way is basically the ONLY thing you need to read on the Red Pill philosophy basically) but a lot of men are valueless, even on this forum. 99% of you fucks can’t even bench 225. Most of you don’t make past 100k. Most of you still play video games and jack off, and sit here arguing “durrr everything in moderation“ without understand the science it.
Game teaches you to be a man by shortcutting the learning curve of female interaction. Game has a very low transaction rate even at the higher levels (1-3% of approaches that lead to sex) based on the guy we’re talking about, and we’re not even counting females with very high value, money, status, etc. And what generally happens in the approaching community, is you meet a girl off of game, start dating, you get busy (because approaching takes time and is momentum based, meaning you get rusty and takes some weeks / months to get your mojo back), then you basically end up LTR’ing the girl you picked up, until you break up (this leads to non abundance of mentality) and then repeat the cycle.
Fuck all of this shit. I honestly wish I wouldn’t have listened to any of it if I could go years back. If I could go back, I would have told myself to focus “fully” on lifting, to focus on dropping video games and porn and go “yellow pill”, to read the book “cupid’s poisoned arrow” and stop orgasming in every fucking girl, to focus on my finances, to eat healthier, and to build a social circle of friends I want to be around, and to pick up hobbies I’m interested in, and attract females into this powerful life, rather than run around approaching unimpressive women and giving them my precious time and attention.
Zech4riah 4y ago
Good comment and I agree
This is something I've thought a lot. I haven't wanted to admit it to myself that bad streaks really hurt your drive for your mission and mental stability. PUAs keep telling that getting rejected is not bad. It doesn't hurt you; Well the thing is that you don't lose any limbs or die because of rejection but it does hit you mentally more or less. You may lose significant part of your confidence after couple of bad nights. Then you think alone in your head "Am I really this weak? Why am I upset like a little bitch when some random girls rejected me?" and it just worsen your downward spiral - You are not only rejected but you think you are a sensitive little bitch. All this gimps your performance in other areas of your life.
My advice would be that one should concentrate on game maybe 6-12 months and go out 2-3 times a week. Over that time you get the basics right. Then you move to "cruise mode" and just maintain your skills at some level by interacting with girls/people here and there. Once you have learned basic game skills and proved to yourself that you have balls to cold approach, you don't have to go for a kill in every interaction. If you feel like interaction isn't going anywhere and the girl isn't interested, that's probably the case. It's sometimes good to protect your ego and just leave it there and not ask for a number or date etc. If you don't feel that the girl is interested, she probably isn't. I rather avoid unnecessary rejection (and miss couple random opportunities here and there) and feel more intact and positive rest of the time.
Don't fear rejection but be smart about it. Otherwise it will take it's toll and your productivity will suffer.
_DonDraper_ 4y ago
Point #3 is not stressed enough around here. After you get a taste of success for a few weeks/months in a row, suddenly going through a rough phase of one week or more will seriously mess you up if you're not mentally strong. And then you'll start looking for that rush in other places... it's basically an addiction like any other.
BriefcaseHead2 4y ago
Yup. Any man who dedicates real time and effort and becomes successful at getting more than enough girls will tell you that its just not THAT good. Having close male friends is better than having a stupid, brain dead plates you use just to bust your nut into.
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Thank you for your comment.
DigitalDragonSlayer 4y ago
Fucking thank god fuckers like you write about your experience. I’m grateful you reaffirm that’s the right mode of operating for young guys like me.
Thank you for sharing your post-worthy comment.
unamins 4y ago
"Lot of men are valueless, don't bench 225, don't make 100k Euro per year, play video games etc"
If you would make 100k, bench 225, has high status and qualities, you would not need to start writing here, no need for any game any approach because the pussy would come to you in abundance without your effort (the same ever female experience).
So what you are saying is non-sense.
This forum and lessons are for the majority of men that are not on the top 5% and need to improve and lessons to get pussy.
beginner_ 4y ago
True but I think the point of cold-approaching or in general doing any type of approaches is helpful for say a guy that was married 2 decades to his high-school sweetheart and now is in his 40ties and divorced. He doesn't have any game (or in general flirting skills) after that time and 0 outcome independence. In general no skills in dealing with women.
Completely different situation compared to being 20 and having some success with women. In your 20ties it makes sense to focus on your education and finances and networking vs ONS.
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littleshepherd- 4y ago
Is cupid's poisoned arrow better than book of pook?
throwaway-aa2 4y ago
The Book of Pook is the Red Pill in nutshell. Read that first. It falls in line with everything talked on this sub. Cupids poisoned arrow will lead you towards Married Red Pill though and is a ferocious “red pill” on top of red pill. It’s another door that... once you open, you can’t close. Go read some Amazon reviews if you’re interested but it’ll basically teach you a lot about sex, addiction, how orgasms fucks with your reward system and your happiness.
pieroit 4y ago
I agree on all your points, the last sentence in paeticular. I see so much value in my time and attention right now, that the idea of giving it for free to a rando (just because her ass and tits) makes me ashamed.
My last ten years of life would have been so much better if I developed a solid social circle instead of cold approaching. Yes I fucked many, but nothing of them stayed with me. And my heart is cold as ice.
Sucks so much to realize the waste of time
bmw1999m3 4y ago
I appreciate the insight from both you guys (Pieroit and Throwaway-aa2). Do you guys think that a man amassing knowledge can achieve the same confidence levels as you have over years of cold approaching? Do you think becoming the charming character that women want can be learned through reading and self-reflection in the same way it is learned through experience? Thx.
trollreign 4y ago
That's dangerous grounds, that path leads to one of the biggest mistakes a man can make: going into permanent monk mode.
Knowledge and power - and to be honest, even being fit and strong - are completely useless if you don't have social skills. If you don't know how to interact with women (or people in general), your career, knowledge, power, strength, wisdom, etc are worth jack shit. Women are not going approach you or put in the effort to learn what a great man you are. It's your job to be among women and to be able to talk to them and convey your value.
pieroit 4y ago
There is a big risk in amassing knowledge if you don't also grow in physical fitness and social skills.
To grow social skills you can avoid cold approach, but you need to develop social circles (around hobbies is the easiest).
You need to become smart, fit and fun. At least two of the three ;)
BriefcaseHead2 4y ago
Fuck i'm learning so much knowledge in this comment thread/post. Thank you.
throwaway-aa2 4y ago
Point 1: If you’ve ever gone out with “actual“ people who run game, “most” of them are fucking losers. I’ve went out with some “celebrity” gamers too... fucking losers. This is 100% fact. I’m tired of these fuck faces lying like this isn’t the case. Sure, you have a couple of cool guys. But a LOT of people running game are losers. It’s very common for people to only focus on the winners when building a rationale for doing something. But very rarely do they focus on the lowest denominator, or even the median denominator. Be careful of the people on this forum that you listen to. Just running game will not necessarily make you cool, and even if it DOES you will 100% get rusty.
Point 2: 99% of people that game don’t press over 135, bench over 225, don’t squat over 315, and don’t deadlift 405. Again, remember this, it’s very very important. Women like masculine men. Most men don’t lift this much, and if they do, they’re gay and pussy. These numbers along with the right attitude automatically puts you in the top 10% of men. If one of the first rules of the sub is to lift, and most men that game don’t lift, that sort of communicates a lot, don’t you think?
Point 3: No one said you shouldn’t be interacting with women. Didn’t say that. However I don’t think game is the worthwhile vector for that. Build power, do things you ENJOY, and get into your flow state. Women want WINNERS. Women are evolutionary leeches. When you’re at your most abundant, powerful, and joyful, is when women will be drawn to you. Go skiiing, go to a gym and lift, go running, go to a random book club, go take a random salsa class. If you dress well, take care of yourself, are confident, are not jacking off constantly, if you have decent lifting numbers (this is not that hard people), girls WILL notice you.
Point 4. ”Amassing knowledge” depending on the context it comes from ”can” be beta as fuck. The main thing that you should be doing, is “doing”, if that makes sense. I read because it makes me a better person but unlike some of the fucks in this sub, I’m also working and making insane amounts of money, I’m working on the side business I’m trying to start, I’m lifting HARD, I’m working on establishing the right habits, I treat my body with respect... and with the time that I don’t spend anymore watching pointless youtube, movies, music, porn, I use the remainder of that time to “amass knowledge”. Essentially, knowledge is good, but do NOT use it as an avoidance tactic for real life.
Point 5: Yes it can be learned naturally. The Book of Pook talks about this. It’s hard not to be amused about life and women when you’re hammering yourself with challenges each day, when you’re lifting and you see your muscles getting bigger, when you notice the reverence men and women start to give you both consciously and unconsciously. That being said you should absolutely 100% still talk to women. But do it from a place of abundance. Do you know how easy it to start a conversation with a bitch in a certain domain, when you have mastery of that domain? It’s “effortless”. You know how many times cute (but worthless) women start conversations with me because I danced with them? They ask me where I’m from, where they’re from, how I learned, etc. It’s all very natural and this is evolutionarily how it should be. We were hunter gatherers once upon a time ago. We didn’t “game“ women. We hunted and amassed resources and earned a high value woman. This is quite fucking literally how this shit works optimally in the real world. This is why Elon Musk / Jerry Seinfeld / etc get these hot young fucking women and have babies with them easily. Get good at a hobby or domain, it’s really that fucking simple, and watch how many women open you. Then you talk to them if they’re interesting. Once you get to a certain mastery level at a given thing, along with the requisite muscle, girls will COMMONLY open you, and validate themselves for you. This alone will give you all the practice you need.
silvereddi 4y ago
This is the best advice I’ve read in a long time, thank you!
noNooodleArms 4y ago
I once opened a couple girls by laughing about how some dudes were running game on them. It was a hoot.
Yep.
BriefcaseHead2 4y ago
Yeah I always found it weird how the guys in this sub big up the PUA who 'game' women but every single one of those pua look like fucking incels. Beer gut, ugly fucking facial hair. They approach 1000 women (because its their jobs) and get laid twice. Maybe its worth it entirely due to the fact that approaching is also their business. But thats only the top, most popular PUA you see on the front page of Youtube when you search for that shit. Other than that, they all seem like depressed losers.
But one thing missed out in this discussion on this post, is the important of cold approaching, not to approach women. But to initiate conversations with men. That's how im making new male friends after university. Practicing cold approaching means you can easily go up and speak to someone new without feeling like a social retard. Practice it to improve your social/initiate conversation game. Not for approaching girls with a fuckin 1-3% success rate.
throwaway-aa2 4y ago
I agree with some of the stuff you’re saying here. I had something longer here but to make it short: talk to everyone. Talk to the cashier, talk to the old lonely lady you’re sitting next to on the bus. Go volunteer at a soup kitchen, talk to the bus driver, talk to the people at the bus stop.
You’d be surprised how much easier it is to then talk to everyone in any situation. It becomes easy to “cold approach” guys. It becomes even easier to cold approach women.
BriefcaseHead2 4y ago
This is exactly what I've been recently working on. I want that old man social skills, the old guy who will just start a conversation like 'nice helmet, I used to have that colour in vietnam'. I want practice initiating conversations with people just like that so that when there's actually a guy who seems cool or a women who I want to fuck, I can approach without that usual restraint, fucking up my words, overthinking etc. I think I'm on the right path. Thanks for your knowledge today.
mal-sync 4y ago
Essentially, "shoot the shit" with everyone around you; And you will soon become automatic and connect with people on a genuine level. I recommend "How to win friends and influence people" by Dale Carnegie, hits this nail right on the head.
BriefcaseHead2 4y ago
I keep seeing that book recommendation so much. I will order it immediately after I finish The Rational Male. Cheers
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BrownGummyBear 4y ago
I feel like OP is just trying to flex his stats and a bunch of betas on this sub are up voting this post because they’re too scared to cold approach (which means talking to any random women, at morning, day or night; at the mall or library; IT DOESNT EXCLUSIVELY MEANS PICKING UP BAR HOES).
BrownGummyBear 4y ago
How the fuck is this post so upvoted? OP doesn’t even knows the definition of cold approach, he thinks cold approach is a term exclusively used for picking up bar/club sluts. He then claims to have reliable stats about cold approach in general (which is bullshit because different guys in different parts of the world cold approaching girls who are not bar sluts will have VERY different results).
OP is then a retard and calls talking to random women outside of clubs/bars “organic” (THIS IS ALSO COLD APPROACH BUT OUTSIDE PARTYING DERP). OP is actually arguing against pursuing bar/club sluts; something which is pretty common knowledge here. This post provided no new insight
proactive-defense 4y ago
“There is no game because it’s real life” What about inner game?
pieroit 4y ago
Inner game is more solid with an organic strategy because you develop relations instead of starting from scratch an interaction every time
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BrownGummyBear 4y ago
"I'm not going to give a random woman the opportunity to reject me, she does not deserve that right. First I need to see she is worth it, and than I will take my chance."
Why the fuck do you care so much about getting rejected? You saw a beautiful woman and got rejected, big deal. You clearly care too much about what others think of you
learnfemalenature 4y ago
Yea I picked up on a scarcity mindset.
A true cold approach dog doesn’t care about the reasoning behind why he was rejected. He understands being rejected is part of hypergamy and that to some women he will come off as thirsty and low value.
inbredostrptw 4y ago
I’m also curious about this. How do you see if she’s worth it without cold approaching? Unless it’s in a social circle. If she’s not worth it you shouldn’t care if she rejects you anyway.
pieroit 4y ago
Exaclty. You don't, and in order to see you give out too much of your time, attention and confidence. Better the other way around: first the signals of her value, then your actions.
Mr_KenSpeckle 4y ago
I think you have a very misguided idea of what is (or usually should be) involved in an approach. Integrate your approaches into the natural flow of your life. It takes only a few extra seconds (if any) to chat up the barista or the woman ahead of you in line at the grocery store. If you try to chat up the woman on the subway train, well, you are both stuck there anyway until the next stop. If you go to the art exhibit, or whatever your thing is, it is natural to speak with that hot single woman who has also shown up at the art exhibit.
You aren't wasting your time if you game women in places you would be anyway. Your attention is not worth anything if you only hoard it and never spend it. And then we get to the crux of the matter: your confidence. You are just protecting your fragile ego. Who gives a fuck if some woman you never met before deflects your advances?
DareyFathom 4y ago
I'm in a very similar sentiment to the OP. Chasing women is a HUGE time expenditure, especially cold approaches. As you get older (I'm also 35+) it becomes increasingly evident that chasing pussy is a major detriment to accomplishing many other objectives. The relative value declines as well. You can BS yourself all you want, the reality is we all have finite time. If you want to excel in any activity, you have to dedicate massive amounts of time to it. After about a decade of consistent approaching, I can tell you that the OP is right. Cold approaching might develop social skills, but the overall time lost is simply not worth it based on the opportunity cost. Have one negative accusation against you, and it becomes even more indefensible to continue chasing women. There are just so much more rewarding activities that I can pursue where my satisfaction is much more directly dependent on my effort rather than factors outside my control.
pieroit 4y ago
I feel you mate. Time has so much worth, pussy is nothing in compare.
TheGreatConst 4y ago
Of course, it is. You can cold-approach without chasing and then it isn't. The problem most guys have that they can't do cold-approach without neediness and scarcity mindset. But they can do it in social circles because they can just demonstrate their social skills and attractiveness, giving women enough time to be attracted first.
DareyFathom 4y ago
Approaching falls under the umbrella of chasing. And in order to have success with it, the vast majority of men will need to dedicate time to go to places where women are, and refine their ability. Both of which are opportunity costs. I'm not discouraging men from doing it, but the notion that pursuing women coincides strongly with self improvement is simply unrealistic.
TheGreatConst 4y ago
Nope, you can approach without chasing. It is the difference between attempting to buy a car and a test drive. Doing a test drive means that you aren't sure yet if you'll buy the car or not. You are just testing it. When talking to girls you are testing them because you aren't sure yet if they worth your time. The problem is - most guys have no standards other than a girl's appearance. This is why they are always in the "chasing mode".
DareyFathom 4y ago
I don't have the ability to stop time- which is what I am defining as chasing. Approaching is just a subcategory of that. You are expending time when approaching. Chasing is spending time on women that can be otherwise spent elsewhere. Unless you have access to women without investing time, you are chasing. And the only men that have that are in the most elite.
TheGreatConst 4y ago
Read my analogy again, pretty pls. It explains perfectly the difference between chasing and choosing.
DareyFathom 4y ago
It's semantics. Reality for the vast majority of men is that pursuing women is a massive time sink to yield any success. I'm sure a very small minority can structure their life around approaching during the normal course of daily life. However, that is a very small minority of men.
TheGreatConst 4y ago
The point is - if you view it as you chasing girls then you'll never be truly attractive.
KinkysMT 4y ago
I have more or less the same experience as you. I'm also Italian, but I have to say that abroad in other countries where I lived for multiple years cold approach gives much better results and potential for for LTRs too.
I think here in Italy social circle game works way better.
Se passi da Firenze fai un fischio haha
pieroit 4y ago
Can you elaborate on the difference between Italy ans the countries you had experiemce in?
Ciao caro ti ringrazio...
KinkysMT 4y ago
I think that abroad girls are more open to meet and socialize outside of their social circle. Guys abroad approach and catcall way less than in Italy, so girls are more open to it. I lived several years in the Netherlands and for example I had a LTR that lasted 4 years, I met her a party via cold approach. I also had several relationship tha lasted 5-6 months with girls I met via cold approach in bars or parties, and Tinder too.
For me it's mostly a socio-cultural thing..here in Italy girls will look bad at you when you cold approach if you're not a hot guy or it's in social circle situation. At least that's my experience. Also, just have a look at italian girls profiles on Tinder vs the ones of international girls.. the italians one are super entitled and full "I don't want this/that/etc/". Most internationals tinder profiles are more relaxed and you feel they genuinely want to meet new people.
Clubs.. in italy people goes to clubs to show off and "tirarsela"... abroad girls go to have fun, drink and meet new people.
In the past year I closed many girls of tinder here in italy but 90% were internationals who were here only for a short period of time, ence no future for LTRs.
So now I decided to work on social circle game here, will start to organize small events/parties with some friends and see which results this give. But doing social activities like yoga or other courses like you said could be the right way. I have more or less your age, so I can relate.
I have a group with two friends from Rome too into game and self improvement if you wanna connect.
pieroit 4y ago
I lived in north Europe for a year, can confirm your view. Why the hell our girls are so picky. Could be the church and slut shaming, could be us males being too aggressive.
Great to talk to you, I will be happy to contact your friends in Rome and get a beer together
ASTRA-LUX 4y ago
Which is ironic because sleeping around is equally shameful and lowers your value overall. A traditional high value woman wouldn't look at you twice.
​
You're lying to yourself now. We both know you would never go after an ugly woman. No one does. Intelligence and integrity are both irrelevant if the woman isn't attractive.
​
What else is there?
pieroit 4y ago
Sleeping around was an error, better realizing now than never
Of course I want her to be pretty. Pretty AND interesting, that is what the "just" is for
Dustin_Bromain 4y ago
A conversion rate of 3%. Hmm.
Indumentum97 4y ago
Pretty much average for a male unless you're a 10. We play the game on hard so we often lose. Much easier as a female ofc.
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_ernesto5 4y ago
Cold approaching is fun but tricky. Just this year, before corona I had started to perfect my approaches, here are some notes if they are any useful
1) Redefine 'Cold Approach'
The Cold Approach just means getting a totally new lead. It doesn't necessarily mean getting it immediately. It can take days, weeks, months to get the lead. What matters is that prior the cold approach you were total strangers with no acquaintances in common. It's a rookie mistake to try too hard to get her number in the first interaction. Why?
2) Put yourself in her shoes
How does it feel when you're walking down the street, minding your own business, and a salesman comes up to you trying to sell you something? Just as you see him coming you already have the 'No thank you' at hand. You don't even know what he's selling but you already declined him.
This is how girls feel when you cold approach them. Women feel when you're selling yourself to them. And if they aren't looking to buy. They won't even listen to the first word you have to say.
Then when are women willing to buy / listen to you? At parties, bars, clubs, weddings...But Cold Approaching isn't about that, cold approaching it's about talking to the girl in the subway, or the bus stop. I agree. The problem is that in they are too focused on their daily hamster routines. Most of them aren't willing to buy when you meet them at the bus stop. Why? Because they know they just have to wait to the weekend to get some dick. They aren't in hurry to buy.
So, solution? Don't sell yourself to them. Plain and simple. Just be there, regularly, become familiar to them. Make small talk, BUT don't ask for her number in the first interaction, wait until the second or third. If you don't ever see her again, well too bad, it's just pussy and you see a lot of it every day.
E.g. Just two weeks before the lockdown started I joined a Muay Thai gym. I get off work an hour before training begins so I decided to hang out in the bus stop outside the gym. On the first day an 8/10 sitting on the bench alone. All I asked was "What bus are you waiting for?" to get the chit chat started and eventually her bus arrived and she left.
Second day, I had to do some errands so I went directly to the gym. Third day she was there, but catched her just as she got in the bus. We exchanged smiles.
Next week, I see her again. We chit chat. No moves made. In the third week, I ask for her number, I casually invite her to a show. And I got myself a new plate.
TL;DR Approaching a girl for the first time and expecting to get her phone number right away is perceived as needy. Patience is the answer. Plan your interactions.
ebaymasochist 4y ago
Hey man I'm glad that worked out for you but most people don't have set schedules where they interact with the same strangers, or if they do it's only a small amount, like less than ten... And yeah if your goal is to get "a girl" then it's not necessary to get their number the first time. But I'm not looking for "a girl". If I want the girl that I approach, then I have to get her number or Facebook or snap because there is a great chance I will never see her again otherwise. And women know this, so they expect you to ask for the number or whatever. They make it easy by giving signals that they will or will not give it to you.
The danger is that a few weeks go by and she has got a boyfriend now while you were waiting
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BrownGummyBear 4y ago
TLDR;
OP considers "Cold Approach" picking up women at clubs and bars. He thinks that approaching women at yoga and impro class is "organic" and not cold approach (facepalm)
When he actually approached women during the day "I had some success in day game, but mostly in the evening in pubs and discos." he would still approach bar sluts.
"It's way better to study the kind of demographic you want to get, and search for pussy by hobbies and social circles. The girls are SO much better in term of personality" well no shit OP! You're telling me that the cute chicks at the library or archery class have more personality and brains than the intoxiceated CC ridden sluts from bars and clubs? MINDBLOWN
nexuspalisade 4y ago
It's about abundance mentality.
Cold approaches mean you can always generate more leads, whether it be friends, girls, or whatever.
If you limit yourself to "social circle game" or waiting for girls to come to you because you bench 200 or learned to do a backflip 360 ollie, then you are going to be necessitous to some degree because you lack confidence in the ability to generate options out of nothing.
pieroit 4y ago
Depends on how much time you have, because if you don't jave much you are forced to go on the route with highest return.
Let's say you get to a point of your life where time and work are more important than sex. Let's speak about this then.
nexuspalisade 4y ago
I mean, I totally agree you should never make women the focus of your life, this has been red pill canon for a while now. Focus on yourself and bring a girl into your frame.
But cold approaches are a useful tool for generating leads to bring those girls, or friends, or jobs, or anything into your reality. Game is also fundamental to this, no amount of status or money can stop Elon Musk from acting like a beta chump.
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wowYoudiditgudjobbud 4y ago
Jesus just read the post and realized the sub has been quarantined for A WHOLE YEAR.
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SpankKing_ 4y ago
cold approaching is really weird. i dont see it as showing confidence or whatever you guys try to do with it. if shes not giving you signals to approach, you are a fuckin weirdo unless you have a really good reason.
pieroit 4y ago
Some guys don't get signals, or get too few. Developing a social life takes time, so many of us (I was the same) end up squeezing their balls and going talk to random girls in order to make something happen.
I'm not here to condemn cold approach, I want every young guy here to know that an organic strategy is way more rewarding
SpankKing_ 4y ago
its just very clowny, and in my opinion really low value of a guy to walk around trying to get validation from a bunxh of strangers. i suppose it can get you out of your shell or comfort zone, or to thicken the skin a bit.
i also believe that if a guy is getting absolutely no choosing signals whatsoever, everywhere and at all times, theres a very good reason why.
BloodSurgery 4y ago
I mean, going out only to cold approach has never been adviced lmao. Thats some PUA shit.
Buying some stuff and you see a cute girl? Why not have some small talk.
Why wait for signals and be passive when you can try approaching and be active?
As u/BrownGummyBear said:
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pieroit 4y ago
Tell me the rate fo success of cold approaching without prior invitation from her, vs the rate after IOIs.
acos12 4y ago
Most males in human history got their lay, partner, wife whatever through 'cold approach' technically. Its just that when you do it deliberately and in high volume it takes away the magic. Its not that cold approach doesnt work: of course it does. Its pure math. Wether you do it to get laid or to find a wife, the solution is always in numbers.
The problem is finding out there really isnt anything "more" than this. Just numbers and a repetitive, predictable outcome.
redmadcaterpillar 4y ago
20 century is not most of human history. Arranged marriages was a phenomena across cultures.
LiveAFTSOV 4y ago
I dont believe this is accurate. Humans had tribes/villages where everyone knew eachother.
Supposedly, going up to random people to try and fuck them is a modern day phenomena
ebaymasochist 4y ago
They also had to constantly expand those villages and tribes to bring in new people too, which is where kingdoms, and then nations came from. You are in a massive village known as a country, is one way to think about it.
acos12 4y ago
i meant: except for religious arranged marriage every married couple had their "hi, my name is john" moment. So rephrase my previous statement to "modern times".
pieroit 4y ago
"it works" it's not enough. The point is how much it works in respect to other strategies.
acos12 4y ago
Nothing beats volume. Nothing.
And you can come up with an answer like "but muh looks" or "but muh social circle and status" or "but muh personal development". Well of course. But then still: add volume to THAT and you still have an insane advantage.
pieroit 4y ago
Can you argument around that? My experience tells the other way around: volume is wasted energy
acos12 4y ago
How can a single shot at success be more fruitful than 100?
If your high volume is a waste of energy or not giving you the results you desire then thats because there is a problem with your approach, yourself or your environment that needs to be looked after.
You not going to fix it by doing less volume. Unless you lose good quality dates and relationship opportunities because you are spinning too many plates.
pieroit 4y ago
3% cold < 20% organic
My game is probably better than yours, with all due respect
jasonbrodyn 4y ago
What do you mean by organic ? Elaborate
pieroit 4y ago
Social circles, hobbies, work and family... Organic is every situation in which the context for interaction is already open, while with cold approach you need to create it.
acos12 4y ago
But its you complaining cold approach is not worth it. How does that make you conclude your game is better?
If you have a good social network or a job, social environment with a wide variety of women then organic could be an advantage. But i dont see how this can compete with a cold approach where you have access to EVERYTHING in the world.
Basically: cold approach gives me instant access to your social circle. Just 1 opener away and im in. Thats power.
pieroit 4y ago
Did you compare cold vs organic? I did. After 12 years that's my recap. Curious to know your numbers...
And no, cold approach is giving you the impression of access, not real access.
acos12 4y ago
I bet a week in my life would open a whole new reality for you, with all due respect.
pieroit 4y ago
Happy for you. But I'm not seeing your numbers, or any factual evidence.
JaFaRr9 4y ago
Damn, with dedication like that you’d absolutely kill it in Network Marketing
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JaFaRr9 4y ago
Not necessarily the same thing. What do you know about NM?
BoJvck34Empire 4y ago
After a while cold approach should be natural. You see what you want and you go for it regardless if it’s a library, gym, etc. “What’s your name? I’m John Doe, are you single?... here’s my number” boom that simple. It’s always exhilarating and never gets old, just don’t be a creep, just got for it. It takes literally 20 seconds and it will have you feeling on top of the world when successful.
pieroit 4y ago
1 - I did all that for years and got results. I don't need lessons, I'm giving my recap on everything I've learned. What gets natural is picking up IOIs and acting on them, all the rest is ego driven bullshit. 2 - What do you think of a woman who gives so easily herself to a stranger? Are you going to get a wife like that?
BoJvck34Empire 4y ago
Or simply, how many guys actually approach that aren’t total weirdos? Really, sometime those how girls go ages without a guy showing clear interest and acting on it in this Beta society. A cold approach can become a wife no problem.
TheMailmanic 4y ago
Nice to see an 'older' guy giving his perspectives. Agree completely that you can get burned out on approaches. Better to shift to social circle game so your reward to effort ratio improves
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