I hit it off with a business woman. I kept my true emotions to myself the whole time we met because everything that would come out of her mouth were the thoughts I was thinking. Either she was a mind reader or she was a good fit for me. And I felt I needed it after several ons with vapid sluts or shitty plates with attitudes. I gamed her and before long she'd come over to my place, drinks, and in bed.
It wasn't long that it was over as soon as it started. I did try being less of an asshole and more of a I-know-whats-best man. I thought to myself if this is what pushed her away. You could right it off as me being "boring" but it bugged me why this turned her away. It's not like I stopped being a playful jerk. There was something good there between us. Why would she sabotage that? So I asked myself...
Why is it that when women find someone who is a good fit they leave but with a bad fit they stay? We say "excitement" or "alpha genes" or "game" but I wonder if it's simpler. I wasn't a pushover with her. I set firm boundaries and don't budge. We had common interests, she was responsible, manager of a new office in town, other people knew we had a thing going on (I never said a word) and said we were a good fit too. It's almost as if she realized she had a good thing and she wanted to sabotage it.
I think it comes down to how men and women have totally different lives. A man's life is reforged through pain and he seeks pleasure to comfort him and alleviate stress. A woman's life is completely catered to and on a silver platter. Perhaps she feels less alive because there's nothing to compare against? Let me make another comparison.
In his hit "Be Humble" the rapper Kendrick Lamar mentions wanting a regular girl with natural fat ass with stretch marks. He's tired of the models, the high class living, the cream of the crop. Even in his newest singles he looks for loyalty and that's what he prizes above all looks. Why would a man who has everything desperately seek mediocrity? Because he wants to feel something different. He wants what he doesn't have. Grass is greener.
For a woman who has it all and everyone treats her like a goddess, there are no flaws and imperfections. Like a living coma she slips away into auto-pilot zoning out as her day to day passes her by. No challenges. No struggle. No pain. A zombie.
Than a man comes along and gives her the gift of pain. Physical and emotional. Suddenly she's experiencing sensations she hasn't felt. Blood rushes to where her ass has been smacked by Chad. She sobs remembering what sadness feels like when Chad dumps her for the second time. Her spirit is riled up when he confronts her bullshit and she feels an energy in her chest that makes her feel like she can overcome and master him.
Because men wallow in pain we seek pleasure. We wrongfully think women must want this too. Women bask in pleasure and they want to get a taste of what we are forged by but they never want to bask in it.
I would have enjoyed to have been lovers with that business woman. We could have been a power couple, no lie. I'm in the right industry and I can (and will still) use her network. Both of us said we didn't want kids any time soon. We both were on the same page with non monogamy both of us being as busy as we were.
But I think it's not possible when what I want is pleasure and she wants the pleasure of pain. And that's what I think ultimately turned her off. She needed some drama, she needed me to give her pain, and what I saw was goodness. I was only interested in the bliss and hedonism that would come from our arrangement.
Women must need pain.
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[deleted] 6y ago
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awalt_cupcake 6y ago
oh my god that explains why she still calls me, invites me to things, and is in my life because I'm an intolerable monster.
Redpilledaccordingly 6y ago
She solely wanted to fuck you. You caught the oneitis plague and she accordingly left. Most career-minded women aren't interested in children for the time being, or ever. She verbally expressed that to you but you patently ignored. Stop the "We would be power couple dynamic" and optimize the FWB situation.
gateisred 6y ago
It's not this woe is me, wtf are women thing, she probably just didn't feel the same.
sorry_mommy 6y ago
There are a million and a half reasons that could cause women to lose interest in the middle of your interaction with them, it's impossible to know what it was exactly. We can examine our behavior to see if there was any glaring reason that might have caused it, but otherwise it's impossible to know and a waste of time to focus on it.
zyqkvx 6y ago
He's trying to cash in all the fat women money fool.
awalt_cupcake 6y ago
I can see where you're going with that. If that's the case that's brilliant. But I've never seen or heard the phrase 'fat women money' in action. I'd think that he would want to target the middle class women. They spend the most on dumb shit.
zyqkvx 6y ago
It's basic demographics. Shows and commercials are targeted to tween girls with lots of money who buy the most music, fat acceptance of men, fat acceptance of women, married women who own their husbands finances, rich mid-life crisis man who wants to shit some money to feel relevant again (jaguar for one), 'strong' women who wear mens suits and fantasize about being head of a company and spewing out drama to everyone below her, single moms who party and need to come off as wholesome, but 'daring' (aka single mom party whores). Yeah a lot of them are women based. Shows and commercials are tailored to make one more more of the seven sins justifiable to these demographics. Usually movies, shows, commercials are simultaneously appealing to 2 or more demographics at the same time. Example, for a woman a Fabreeze commercials is about getting to spray her husband like a roach. Same commercial, the man will carry away that the product is good because it means she will be doing more housework. I just made that up. that commercial never fooled me, but that's how they design them.
[deleted] 6y ago
Yep. That made me laugh out loud.
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imbeciI 6y ago
Right now she feels like [insert random emotion/desire]
What she wants right now might not be the same thing moments later.
kagetsuki32 6y ago
It is possible for you to have what you want from this woman, but it will be tiresome.
You must give her pain (drama) periodically, once she have her fix of pain then she will seek pleasure which is what you want. But this pleasure must be of short duree, then you must give her pain again.
That explain why lamar want a basic girl that is not blessed by grace and beauty, and is more down to heart. She is more likely to have enough pain in her live to seek pleasure by default.
[deleted] 6y ago
Even that one, if you love her of unconditional love, will find it unbeatable over time (yeah she'll be much slower to lose interest, but she will).
kagetsuki32 6y ago
She still a woman, so she need to be gamed too. They are just less a pain in the ass.
animal_one 6y ago
This is a great observation.
I can tell you're hurting right now, and I had a bit of an epiphany while reading this that I'd like to share. We've all read about not judging your value based on what women think of you, but the quote above from your post really drives it home. Men and women are different, we don't want the same thing. Deriving your sense of worth from whether a woman wants to stay with you is nuts, because what she wants conflicts with what you want. We may as well be a different species. Would the farmer get upset that his plow horse isn't satisfied with his lot in life, and would leave in an instant to run wild? Fuck no, because the farmer understands that the horse is a different animal with different motives. What we each want (men and women) is actually in opposition, which is why Patrice O'neal would always say "We are at war."
Women don't want what we want, and I think you've nailed down why. Men want a girl they can chill with because we're engaging in battle every single day. For women, we are their battle. Everything else for them is easy.
NorthEasternNomad 6y ago
That last paragraph. It explains SO much.
My LTR girl has had an EASY life. Good parents. Good schooling. From a young age, she started on a career at which she excels and never changed. She has literally never struggled.
Except with me. And with men. In general.
And.more and more I think it's because she - and maybe ALL humans to some degree - feel as if, without struggle, without fight, we haven't earned what we have.
So we look for fights and where none exist in relation to the things we want, we maybe even manufacture them. The better to feel like what we have is forged in fire and hardened like steel. That it's EARNED.
And considering how little an attractive career woman.has struggled and fought in this society - again, my girl has had a pretty easy ride, though she worked and paid her own way - I don't find it hard to believe that, on some level, she might crave conflict, and the emotional charge that comes along with it.
animal_one 6y ago
I agree.
What happens to me when I haven't worked in a while, or have gone a few days without closing a sale? I start getting anxious. My body/mind/nature whatever is telling me "Go out and conquer, make shit happen, get off your ass!" I imagine it's the same with them, but instead of closing deals, making money or hitting the gym, it's "Hey go fuck with that man."
StonerTigerMom 6y ago
I wonder if women would start accomplishing things if men stopped engaging in bullshit.
ChampOfTheFuture 6y ago
I get a different feeling from OP's writing, which I know too well, disappointment. And I like his observation that what we seek is linked to the hardship we go through.
All the little chicks I meet who come from middle-class families seek that dirty excitement OP is talking about through drugs or drama, and when you ask them about their past struggles, 99% of the time it boils down to being dumped or having some internal "problem" such as anxiety or depression.
So they see that I now have a comfortable middle-class life, which I love and there is a disconnect in that I am seeking more comfort when they seek to experience a wide-range of emotions.
They can't see that I only appreciate this life because it was built on being homeless for a while, working a hard job in a one of the world's shitholes to get started economically, breaking up with a woman I loved because I was worried about what to eat or where to sleep that day.
My approach is to be willing to walk away whenever this disconnect becomes too wide. That willingness at 100% creates tingles because it's based on something real and usually keeps them in check. But sometimes there's just nothing you can do and you gotta cut things off neat and clear (and then deal with months/years of them "trying to get back together" every once in a while).
[deleted] 6y ago
Which they'll do childishly believing it's they "love" you — when it is only a way of their ego to do things so that they can end by THEIR leaving instead of their being left. To "settle accounts" is maybe the right expression.
They want to be sure it didn't end with them losing (since their level of maturity forces their egos to make of anything a win-or-lose contest: that's the level)
[deleted] 6y ago
Ehh... err sort of true? I get what you're trying to say but you also have to keep your head in reality.
If you were more fun and still gave her tingles she would've stayed with you but you just wanted a normal relationship and to be real lovers too soon. She felt this and left for many things it implies to her.
Its fucking no joke how much women seek drama though, I have noticed this my whole life with probably over 4/5 of girls and no one can tell me its not true. Sadly for guys like me who seriously don't like drama because of all the suffering and bullshit we dealt with in life? It can be tougher for us to keep girls like this around for ltr, which is seemingly most of them.
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mountassar97 6y ago
Unavailability seems to work for women. Treat them like sub-human children and they will keep coming to you. Most women have low self-esteem and if you put them on a pedestal, her pussy dries up.
Kinbaku_enthusiast 6y ago
I think it goes for women with healthy self-esteem too. It's something base biological. He treats me like shit, he must be better than me. Hypergamy activate!
[deleted] 6y ago
Yeah but of course healthy works within a narrower range, while unhealthy (which is way less rare than one may think) goes to extremes.
Brickles09 6y ago
I was looking the facebook of my first girlfriend the other day. I dated her for one year when we were both in our early 20’s, roughly one decade ago.
That girl had depression back then, probably still has by her dull eyes look in the pictures, she was not that good-looking, but her body and voice turned me on I don’t know why, she was from a poor family compared to mine, I treated her like a princess, could have easily married her, yet she wanted to part ways at some point, called me and told me that she didn’t like me anymore, destroying a world of opportunities for her, while I lost nothing!
For example, now she works at a library, earning very little, never managed to travel abroad, while I travel abroad every year. I’m somewhat relieved that she sent me away because I managed to get someone better than her, but from her perspective, she should have seen me as a miracle happening to her, yet she threw everything in the garbage for no reason, and now she will probably die alone and poor. Women act irrationally, they can be their worst enemies.
[deleted] 6y ago
The kind of mentally disturbed (unconsciously self-loathing) girl you talk about is, well, self-loathing.
This engenders an (of course unconscious) self-hatred. Which branches into 2 mental "systems" that both make an healthy relationship viable for them (or, at least, push them to leave any non-painful situation).
1) "I am low value, therefore I deserve scarcity and trouble. I am unworthy of being with people who are OK, for I am not OK."
2) [acting on a deeper personality layer than 1): the mainspring here is inferiority complexes]:
I must not let anyone bring happiness, heck even pleasure, into my life! People who need others are weak. I am not weak I am not weak I am not weak I am strong I am strong I am strong (multiply this * 1.000.000.000).
Their nano-egos find a way to prove it: to basically go about alone.
They are locked in the mental development stage of a second or third grader who wants to do well in the school test without help, to feel successful. Their life is an unbroken series of 2nd or 3rd grade school tests, and they need to do them "on their own".
Of all complexes, complexes of inferiority are the most "down pulling" of all.
Brickles09 6y ago
Thanks for your comment. I agree with you, but there’s always hypergamy, they sense that someone better than us is always around the corner! BTW, her mother used to treat me very well, that older wiser woman could see that I was a good husband prospect for her low-value daughter, she would do all sorts of things to spoil me when I was in their house. And her sister ended up in the same situation: single 30-year-old something with a liberal arts degree and a low-paying job posting self help texts on facebook.
I bet they ask each other: “Where did all the good men go?” The mother probably answers: “You fucking sent them away when you were young, you stupid women!”
nondescriptpenguin 6y ago
You're overthinking it. Women just like feels.
awalt_cupcake 6y ago
I disagree. Women have many feelings throughout the day.
[deleted] 6y ago
Pretty much, any emotional feeling whatsoever whether is ups or downs is what she's after
Thotwrecker 6y ago
Women like changing feels. They don't want to feel one type of way for too long. Make them feel sad so they can appreciate feeling happy, and vice versa - they rely upon men to give them a full emotional spectrum or they start acting up. If it ever seems like you're with a bitch and she's acting like she's trying get smacked across the face, then that's how you know you need to put her in a negative mood for a while and let her marinate.
ViktorCage 6y ago
You become tired by changing those feels for her. That's why at some point most guys will become MGTOWs.
Kinbaku_enthusiast 6y ago
Most guys do not become mgtow. Men like sex and plenty of men like children too.
I know that there are some men that get tired of mowing the lawn and taking out the trash and stop doing it and the same goes for men fed up with dealing with women, but it is not most men at all.
Stop blaming women for your laziness and accept that they aren't disney princesses.
It kinda sickens me when you hide your desires behind male group identity to absolve your own responsibility. If you want to be mgtow it's fine. It's up to you to shape your life. But don't lie to yourself and others and act like it's the only or most commonly chosen option. Be a man and choose your life based on your own desires.
[deleted] 6y ago
Yeah. Along with a provider of money OR sex she truly enjoys, or more broadly, transactional AND/or validational rewards for her, you are also hired as an entertainer.
"He must have sense of humour".
Which they, of course, absolutely lack.
[deleted] 6y ago
It was very eye-opening asking a female friend once why she liked all these movies that made her cry. She said "It feels good to get a good cry every now and then." Women are every bit as addicted to feels as druggies are to meth and if they go long enough without a hit they'll do anything to get one.
awalt_cupcake 6y ago
exactly. crying is emotional pain.
nondescriptpenguin 6y ago
Feels aren't half bad, men just aren't governed by them like women are.
ThrowFader 6y ago
Don't listen to them too much
MAGAManARFARF 6y ago
My wife used to watch those Dateline/ 20/20 murder mystery shows all the time. She would get so upset and terrified, but would keep watching. More recently it's the This Is Us sobfest. You're right, it's like crack. But it's also their porn. And the more I think about it the more destructive it likely is to relationships -- women are getting their emotional rocks off through these books and shows, leaving most beta men sitting around wondering why their girls aren't jumping on their dicks. It's because the feels weren't created by you, someone else gave them to her.
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Redpillandrew 6y ago
Oh shit, my gf is really into them as well
Dargalo04 6y ago
Right! OP should just remain MGTOW and keep shit moving.
[deleted] 6y ago
It's all about uncertanty and agency.
Men--life is uncertain and I'm the only ally I will ever have. Women--Life is uncertain and I will always need allies.
A man who cannot reduce his option to one is lost. A woman who only has one option is lost.
Kinbaku_enthusiast 6y ago
This does not seem true to me ar all. What am I missing here?
When I look at women their friendships are shit, mostly. Maybe it's the low quality of women I've dated previously, but they did not have the certain friendships that I had.
Of course they had male orbiters instead. And I can see how you would say women depend on other people in a number of ways.
But I seem to have friendships that would help bury a body if need be, whereas women seem to have semi friendships that are continual competition from females and desire for sex from thirsty males.
[deleted] 6y ago
That's the beneath-the-surface.
They live on the surface, their hundreds/thousands "friendships" are never put to a real test (since they subconsciously know they are pasteboard relations).
and the #happy posting and #love sharing
on their Fakebook wall go on
There's nothing more to it than that: it's a cover. But again, they don't have any ambition to more,
[deleted] 6y ago
The only way to trust anyone, is to first trust yourself.
Because women do not develop themselves, at least instinctually, they develop relationships--with everyone. Why? Because everyone is a potential benefit. But everyone is also a potential rival or resource drain. So, they have a pattern of behavior where they try to maintain maximum relational status, why vying for higher ranking withing that status. Every women hope to use everyone else while not being used by everyone else. That's why their friend ships are so low quality, the entirety of it is about syphoning off from others without getting cut off.
Men don't need to befried everyone (they DO need to be civil enough that they don't just go around killing each other) because they-at least instinctually-develop themselves. They don't NEED others. This allows them to actually form real friendships. They can be and have friends without alterior motives.
Kinbaku_enthusiast 6y ago
Again, everything you write makes sense. Yet.... doesn't the fact that men can have friends without ulterior motives contradict the idea that men don't have allies?
[deleted] 6y ago
You're confusing the recipie and the process.
Taxidriver98 6y ago
You're very poetic, this unfortunately is who I am as a man. It is incredibly lonely and I wish I could break my programming to be like my female counterparts who I see enjoying each others friendship instead of being a lone wolf my entire life
*Edit: this unfortunatly IS
[deleted] 6y ago
They are just using each other — they use "lovers" "hubbies" and "friends" alike.
Surely they do so subconsciously or unconsciously — but it doesn't warrant our envy trust me.
[deleted] 6y ago
you emotionally invested in a plate. you can argue but you wouldn't have written this or have put so much thought into it if it weren't true.
awalt_cupcake 6y ago
She isn't the only woman I've been gaming others trying new ways and coming to the conclusion they do not want a healthy, happy, or successful man.
When I'm in a terrible mood and letting it out at their expense, they're interest spikes. This isn't about one woman. She was a setup for the rant.
izschnitzel 6y ago
I'm in control of everything in my life that it's relieving when a guy takes a little control. I don't know if that's true for every woman. I don't like being worshipped because I make mistakes like everybody else. I don't want to be seen as infallible. I like a partner that challenges me. I value men that are willing to stand up to me cause l know they'll stand when shit gets real. I would rather be with someone who stands up even when they're wrong than someone that submits to me all the time to keep the peace. What if you're resenting me? If I'm in a relationship, I want my partner to tell me if I'm bothering them cause I want them to be happy. They also have to know that I'm going to vocalize things too because I don't want to have pent up aggression towards them either.
Btw, most women know when you're not putting up a fight and sometimes rail you MORE to get a reaction because we want you to stand. It's the wrong tactic cause men typically do better with encouragement than being provoked, yeah?
As far as crying goes, if I'm stressed, I'll put in a sad movie cause crying relieves stress hormones from the body. There's a biological reason people indulge in crying.
THEDICKDEALER 6y ago
Spoken like a true spinster!
izschnitzel 5y ago
Hehehe, I just saw this reply. 25 is a terrible age to be unmarried at. ???? Definitely spinster material if I were in a Christian cult. ???? But seriously... basically anything I say at this point is talking out my asshole cause I don't have a ton of girlfriends to even begin to understand what women want.
RandyBumgardner85 6y ago
Good post.
I was willing to give 4 of my previous 5 LTR's a good stable relationship, good sex, guidance, friendship, support, love, children, the prospect of a financially stable future.
Every single one of them threw it away because they either insisted on creating more pointless drama than I was willing to tolerate or they felt I eventually became so beta they had no choice but to treat me like a bitch. I honestly consider myself more Alpha than 90% of men but that isn't saying much these days.
In these situations the only way to regain her respect is to walk away and never come back. It's frustrating as fuck but at least I know what I'm dealing with now.
scissor_me_timbers00 6y ago
I think the key is that they need to feel like they’re earning that great life you’re giving them. Women like a challenge and need to feel like they need to perform to keep it. Attractive women are given shit their whole lives, they resent a guy who doesn’t make her earn it, doesn’t give her a challenge, gives her the world without holding her accountable.
[deleted] 6y ago
Ok, but working as a pedagog for 2nd or 3rd graders isn't what a man aspires to in "love".
I understand it's what's needed, but it hardly makes it the less frustrating.
ThrowFader 6y ago
90 percent?
Maybe like 30 at least, I'll give you that.
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Low_Cost_Chimp_Meat 6y ago
I've had a harem of women my whole life and it just makes me miserable because THEY NEVER GO AWAY! The more you push them away, the more they are drawn in. And this can go on for 20+ years.
Honestly, you will be much happier as a blue-pilled beta neckbeard chasing women around than having them tirelessly stalk you.....and THAT is what women crave more than anything.
Alpha fucks = misery.
Kinbaku_enthusiast 6y ago
It's like the real life guy from "catch me if you can". He pretended to be a doctor and got a job as one where he didn't need to do anything. One of the residents in his flat was a doctor and always wanted to talk doctor stuff with him, which was a distinct risk to his impersonated persona. Did he try to avoid him?
No instead he decides to deluge him. Tell boring stories. Each time he saw him he swarmed him and ignored any sign that the other didn't have time or wanted to leave. After a while the other doctor would say as quickly as possible: "nice to see you I'm in a hurry!"
scissor_me_timbers00 6y ago
Stfu dude, there’s no way this is worse than inceldom
kemchik 6y ago
which anime did you get this idea from?
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japan-bible 6y ago
Sounds like she just wanted to smash, even told you so (no monogamy, which for women means only smash).
You got oneitis for "this special chick, different than all the rest" .. hard.
Without viewing the relationship with objective eyes, who knows what happened. Maybe she always just wanted to fuck you only, period. Maybe there was a spark but you became needy, desperate, and chodey, putting her on a pedestal.
Just be you, stop giving so much of a fuck, and stop putting women on a pedestal.
[deleted] 6y ago
You just gave me a real big epiphany
[deleted] 6y ago
Women are emotional creatures. It's the world they live in, it's what they feed on. These can be good emotions or bad emotions, as long as they are powerful. "Having a good thing together" is bland, it's dull, even if it is solid.
If emotions are lacking, a relationship gets discarded.
Chad triggers emotions. Good ones like excitement and love. Bad ones like anger, agony and sometimes even fear. This is what she wants and needs from her partner.
There is no rationality to it. Just embrace the facts and apply according to what you want out of her.
awalt_cupcake 6y ago
I completely disagree. Good thing doesn't imply morally good. I explicitly say 'power couple' dynamic. There would be lots of ground covered, money made, and many more doors opened with a public-facing "relationship". Good for PR.
While all that is exciting -to me- (who doesnt like making money and killing it socially?) it is opposite for her because she already lives comfortably. That's why I assert she must want pain.
ThatOneDrunkUncle 6y ago
This is actually hilarious. I'm in an LTR where I manufacture drama, start fights, ignore her, spike her emotions positively, sometimes insult her, etc. She's still insanely attracted to me, and it's all fake. I would fucking hate it if someone did this to me, and she eats it up.
infamous3238 6y ago
No women want excitement. And for whatever reason you weren't exciting enough, so she branch swung.
awalt_cupcake 6y ago
Excitement in the form of what- drama, uncertainty, anxiety, toying with her head
Completely negative and unwanted in my life. Hardship/Pain. But thats because as men we struggle already. But for her its what she needs.
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SirAttackHelicopter 6y ago
No this is completely wrong. Only women trapped in the endless cycle of trying to realize their feminism dichotomy in a world where reality is proving them wrong in their face, are the ones who want pain. Because that is all they know and think about.
There is another name for these kinds of girls: damaged goods.
[deleted] 6y ago
You mean they bang against their impossibility to reconcile their socio-cultural programming (super ego or: what they want to see themselves as like) with what they are (ID, instincts, "primativeness"), I guess.
Too much of cognitive dissonance, cognitive overload to be avoided, and then... to much of personality shutting and splitting.
You see their stare in their countless selfies — estranged from the smiling lips and feigned body pose.
AriesAsF 6y ago
Maybe its just easier for you to shove this off on her than to accept where you may have gone wrong. You got her in bed with you, therefore she WANTED you.... but then you said it was 'over before it began'. Somewhere along the way, you fucked up, lost frame. If the sex was bad, it would destroy her attraction to you instantly. You say you'd have enjoyed being lovers with her, but did she enjoy being lovers with you? Be completely honest with yourself and start over reading the Red Pill from the beginning. Work on your game. Work on yourself. Take responsibility.
[deleted] 6y ago
Women want a wide range of emotions, not just pain.
awalt_cupcake 6y ago
Pain is being used as an umbrella term. A catch all for negative emotional (and physical) spikes compared to her catered life.
biglaughingcock 6y ago
This belongs in your diary.
Get this shit off the sub for fucks sake.
ThrowFader 6y ago
You are getting downvoted but you are 1000 percent correct.
OP should focus on his career and shrug this off easily. It's a clear case of oneitis coming
Taxidriver98 6y ago
Bruv why r u here if only to criticize. C'mon OP wanted to share and we all got something out of it. Lets support a fellow brother on the second journey