I hate lying, but I've had a few boyfriends, so at 26 I've now slept with 12 men. I'm thinking seriously about marriage now, and I know many men find women with a double-digit partner count not marriage-material, so I've been telling the last couple boyfriends that I've only slept with 3 people. I was wondering if RedPillWomen has an opinion on this. Will this help?
PaulMurrayCbr 10y ago
You have no choice but to lie to him if you want marriage. Problem is, any man worth marrying (ie: not completely stupid) won't believe it. I would suggest that you don't get married. You have already damaged your ability to bond with a mate beyond repair. Why make someone else miserable? I mean - what do you want to get married for, anyway?
mghow 10y ago
I met a girl who told me she had only slept with 3 men at your age as well and guess what, one day when she was all emotional and reminiscing about her past, she let slip another partners name. On several occasions since that, she had slip ups or said things that suggested the number was a lot higher and this was before she even had anything to drink.
What you don't seem to realise is that you are part of the reason why I no longer bother anymore. I noticed this woman would do everything in her power to appear less experienced than she was and when she found out that I had always been selective about partners, this got even worse. You can lie all you want because without realising it, you will give out an aura of your past, how you talk about men and relationships on an automatic level will not match up to your number (3), your attitude to sex and the relationship will not match up and in short, in time the truth will come out.
In the mean time, the guy will get a sense for that something isn't quite right and as he gets to know you, the more of this lie he will discover. In some cases it takes a long time to come out but the truth has a way of revealing itself.
That number 12 you mentioned is probably not even the real number because I notice women add little clauses to that as well. For example 'it was only oral so it doesn't count' or 'it was only for 2 mins' etc.
It is a shame that so many women are prepared to begin a life long commitment with a life long lie instead of owning their past and future.
dreguan 10y ago
You shouldn't give him any number cause itll be too much for him. And if he asks you you might consider leaving his insecure punk ass. Sexuality can't be quantified and having a new partner doesn't diminish your value. Jesus Christ, do dudes actually care about this shit? Sincerely, -And Incredulous Dude
alcockell 10y ago
Yes. Especially if HE is a virgin going in.
Aremorhaz 10y ago
Well he should not marry you. If you'll lie to him about something important like this you'll lie to him about other things. Your only justification is to get yourself out of trouble and again if you do it for this you'll do it when you have someone else's baby in your belly. Marriage is a religious ceremony. If you aren't religious then it is just a word and if you claim you are the fact that you aren't a virgin means you're a hypocrite and not worthy of it.
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Boss_Monkey 10y ago
So there is no point in going forward.
The_Ringmistress 10y ago
I have reassessed my initial advice. Do not lie. And give anyone you may be considering the option to know. Make it clear that you are not a virgin, have had a number of relationships, that you are willing to give him as much detail and numbers as he wants to know.
That may mean that you lose someone good. But the truth is that if you gained them through deception, you never had them to begin with. It is not fair to any man to have a false impression of your past. He should know what he is getting into.
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[deleted] 10y ago
Be honest and sincere. If a man asks, tell him and don't be ashamed but on the same note that opens the door for you to ask him.
My rule for when I start sleeping with a man is when I am sure he will keep my interest at least for a period of time. I am not interested in a quick lay or a short term thing, masturbation is better than the quality of sex in these types of situations (I have told men this and they understand).
The way to make a man want to be with you is to be interesting (read and have interests outside of just shopping and "girl stuff") and be just fine on your own. If a man is interested in me he will make an effort to see me regularly and try to engage me mentally, I will do the same for him. There is nothing a man can say that would surprise me of a sexual nature, I have been in a LTR and have been open about experimenting so nothing is new or shocking for me (which I also have told men).
Nothing makes me drop a man faster than focusing solely on sex. Focus on getting to know each other and seeing if there is some chemistry before having sex, making out isn't just for teenagers.
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jack500 10y ago
Probably yes. You've had your alpha fucks, now it's your turn to get the beta bucks.
I feel sorry for whichever man you sucker into marriage though, because he will wind up with a liar.
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redpillschool 10y ago
Thanks for the hamster fodder.
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redpillschool 10y ago
Sure, maybe you don't. But to pretend a man's number and a woman's number are treated equally is bad advice. A lot of men do care. This isn't the spot for feel-good acceptance, it's a spot for realistic reflection.
To the OP, yes, some of your actions have consequences.
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redpillschool 10y ago
But really that's not what you were saying.
"who gives a fuck about numbers as long as you're clean."
"The way I look at it is the more partners you've been with the better you'll be able to please me."
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redpillschool 10y ago
You weren't banned. But it needs to be clear that although you may feel more nonchalant about numbers, advertising that as general advice is solipsistic and pointless.
It's like saying "I've never died in a car accident, and I don't wear seat belts, so don't wear seat belts".
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redpillschool 10y ago
We are here to discuss best strategies. Sure not all men think like this, but enough do that it's worth discussing honestly. Some guys also like being chained up and whipped, but advising women to use chains by default is bad advice.
I didn't attack your opinion. You're entitled to have one. That doesn't mean you're entitled to be right.
anra 10y ago
going from 12 to 3 is really lying. 12 isn't even that many.
and, don't lie to men about stuff like this (unless you're actively trying to do something they absolutely hate). just don't do it.
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[deleted] 10y ago
if you tell the truth you may lose him, but he deserves the option of knowing what he's getting into--a high trust relationship with a man can't be predicated on a lie from the outset. in the hierarchy of a high dominance male's needs in a mate, trust/loyalty is likely to trump number count. if you are accomplished in bed he is going to know you didn't get that way by accident. by lying you will be found out eventually, harm his ability to trust you forever and that's more damaging than anything. its better to get some form of the truth out there from the git-go and let him decide if he wants to pursue a relationship with you.
in my case i am a very high dominance female with a high count due to the fact that i was always fairly promiscuous when single but 100% faithful in a relationship. i was 32 when i met my future husband and we did in fact meet as a ONS in a bar, i don't think he had any doubt that i was no virgin. when pressed i told him this: i don't have an exact count, when i was a teenager in the punk rock scene promiscuity was just what you did, as i got older i was in LTRs almost continuously for 15 years before i met you, i was 100% faithful during them and when i was single i did as i pleased...that's how i met you. the ball was in his court to accept that or not, and he did, but i think it made him test me for loyalty and be way more demanding of my behavior than he might have had to feel he needed to be if i had been less experienced.
Captain__Murphy 10y ago
I would just keep that number to yourself and if he absolutely wants to know, then say a lower number. If you can just say you have only been with people who you were in a serious relationship with.
margerym 10y ago
No. Never. Own it. Move on.
un-coolmom 10y ago
And change the behaviour, or a year from now it'll be 15.
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puaSenator 10y ago
While I wouldn't like a woman with a large number, I wouldn't trust or like a woman that has a small count as 3. Three tells me she's either lying, or hasn't really lived out the joys of passionate lust with someone you hardly know.
Honestly, for me personally, I wouldn't consider 12 men a whole lot. However, some guys would.
DaddyMonster 10y ago
If you lie, either by commission (standard lie) or by omission (withholding the truth), you are denying the man agency. That is one of the most serious acts of disrespect you can subject a man to.
Besides, how on earth would you ever be able to respect a man if your first act was to deny him the right of choice?
If you deny him the choice, you cannot EVER claim to love him. You would be using him solely for you own selfish reasons. What kind of person would that make you?
There is a fair amount of hamstering going on in this thread. Beware of the hamster. It will lead you away from the truth.
Roseflowertea 10y ago
I don't know if I need to love my husband. I really want a solid companion I can respect and enjoy spending years together raising children. I think "love" is mostly the hormone rush we get when first infatuated with a new person. The important thing is "Can I handle and enjoy seeing this person every day forever?"
[deleted] 10y ago
imagine you had a husband, and after 5 years into the marriage he reads this.
do you think it will end well?
and how can you respect him if you can trick him into loving you, while you are just pretending? what else are you going to pretend? attraction? you want to give him duty sex once a year on his birthday?
and why should he respect you? for what? leading him on? using him to play your husband and provide for you?
you ask respect, but you dont seem to realy think this through.
Roseflowertea 10y ago
I think you ignored the second bit.
I'm not expected him to "love" me, either. Life isn't a fairy tale.
DaddyMonster 10y ago
Fair enough. Is this something you would tell him?
My point stands. Don't lie. To lie is to deny him agency. To lie is to steal his right to self-determination.
If you lie, you will never be able to respect him.
A sidenote: The only kind of man who doesn't care if his woman lies to him, is the kind of man who doesn't care about his woman.
Also... This is all very focused on you. Do your future man's feelings about being lied to enter into this somewhere?
[deleted] 10y ago
Listen, chances are your guys won't even ask you your number. No need to lie, cause you don't need to bring it up.
[deleted] 10y ago
Bad idea. If he finds out later on you lied, it could become a huge problem.
I wouldn't suggest giving him the info voluntarily (some guys just don't want to know), but don't lie if he asks.
Roseflowertea 10y ago
Wouldn't it be better for him to find out the real number, at least when we're in a serious relationship and he's attached to me? I particularly worry that if I let it on in the first few months of a relationship it could kill attraction before he likes me enough to look past a flaw like that.
HarleyWalker 10y ago
If you wait until someone's attached before revealing things it will probably cause more resentment.
As lying about your number, it seems to me that things like this only encourage men to cheat. If she can't be honest with me then I don't feel an obligation to be honest with her, and while I have no reason to assume she's lying (other than the fact that almost all girls lie about it) it's not a risk I am particularly willing to run. As a "redpilled" man I value honesty and loyalty more than anything else.
[deleted] 10y ago
dont tell him unless he asks, whatever you decide. talking about exes isnt a good idea at all, and talking about past hook ups in the beginning is even worse.
[deleted] 10y ago
I think you just kinda have to go with the flow. He has a right to know if he asks, I think... But if he doesn't want to know, he won't ask. There are really some guys that don't care, or just don't want to know.
If he asks and it turns him off, move on to the next prospect. Not much you can do about it.
redpillschool 10y ago
I personally don't ask because knowing is more trouble than it's worth.
Boss_Monkey 10y ago
We are talking marriage here.
redpillschool 10y ago
Ah, well my preference is irrelevant then, not getting married.
The_Ringmistress 10y ago
Exactly. A quality man may or may not care about partner count. He will most certainly care about honesty.
TempestTcup 10y ago
Honesty is the most important thing. Lies destroy relationships.
Roseflowertea 10y ago
Wouldn't all quality men care about partner count?
The_Ringmistress 10y ago
Yes, but what they consider acceptable will differ. Some will only desire virgins or possibly 1 other partner (youthful indiscretion allowance). Some may not have as great an objection provided they are assured of your devotion and loyalty. What no man wants is to believe that he is a meal ticket or a lesser option. High partner counts ups the risk that you will be pining for a more alpha partner from your past and comparing your spouse unfavorably. It also sends the signal that you were having fun and are now ready to become boring. Sis's advice is good. Whoever you marry is not marrying you to get a trained courtesan. He wants to be your best, and know that you want him, not merely the stability or respectability that marriage to him represents.
hotbox4u 10y ago
Why? All i what i would ask for are important relationships and something i should know about things from her past relationships.
I dont care much for aynthing that doesnt impact my own relationship with her. If she wants/needs to tell me im fine with that. But i dont concider it my buisness how many one night stands (if any) she had.
Roseflowertea 10y ago
Men are automatically less attracted to women who've slept with a lot of people.
[deleted] 10y ago
But to each man, how much a lot is will differ. Seems obvious.
md619 10y ago
Oversimplification in my mind. Here's why your count could matter:
1) It displays your tendency for hypergamy. The more hypergamous a woman is, the less likely she is to be loyal to me in the future.
2) Decrease in value. You fuck eveything that walks, am I suppose to feel special that I also get to have sex with you? Basic economics.
3) Shows lack of value. A woman's worth is often determined by her ability to lock down a male to support her. By having a high count, you show that you've been unable to do this, and that men are able to simply pump and dump you. Therefore, there must not be anything worthwhile to stick around for.
Nothing is certain, but these would be my initial concerns.
laughingdawg 10y ago
In this day and age, 12 men by the time she's 26 shows uncommon restraint compared to most women. The number of women my girlfriend knows who have been with hundreds of men by the time they hit their mid-twenties is sad.
If your guy grew up in the church, he might end things over a count of 12 men. But that wouldn't be a blip on the radar to most other men.
Lying about it, however, will all but ensure that any man you're with will leave you if he finds out.
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hotbox4u 10y ago
Fist of all thats a generalisation. And second, what is a lot? I think what "a lot" is, is entirly up to the individual to judge.
If she is 30 and she tells me she slept with 200 guys i would be wondering why and how she did that. Then i would feel the need to talk about it further. Because that would indeed raise a lot of questions for me.
If she is 30 and she tells me she slept with 20 guys i would say: ok, is there anything i should know that is important? If not i wouldnt think about it anymore.
I already had this discussion at a party once. And at that table we were like 7 guys and 2 girls. One guy was pretty much a walking cliche but the rest pretty much agree with what i just wrote. Just the numbers where someone would be start to asks differed. 15 partners was the lowest, and one said 40 wouldnt worry him. His calculation was 5 partners each year and the person would be single the entire time. (We were 28 at that time)
Why should i be concerned by the numbers of sexual partners my gf had before i met her? (If its not exorbitant high)
I would be hornest about it no matter what. But thats just me. If someone thinks lying is the way to go because otherwise there is the possibility to lose the partner then its not on me to judge that.
But i would be very disapointed if i later found out that my partner was lying to me.
[deleted] 10y ago
you should look up statistics about divorce and notch count. the more men she fucked, the more likely the divorce is.
also this article may show why some men do not like to relationship a promiscious woman:
http://laidnyc.wordpress.com/2013/06/05/the-parable-of-mark-and-lauren/
hotbox4u 10y ago
Why should i do that? And what does that have to do with anything? Im not gonna base my life on shallow statistics. Life is way to different that a statistic can help explain it. Statistics are only good if you work with hard facts like in constructions. At the moment you try to use statistics on opinions and emotions they are utterly worthless.
One of my favourite authors said:
"There are lies, damned lies and statistics."
[deleted] 10y ago
bonding happens through sex. on a biological, homronal level in your brain.
if you fuck 100 men, you will feel less and less to each man. until you meet your 101s man, who will be your husband you wont feel much of any attachment anymore.
he will be one of hundreds of men and sex with him will not form any bond. it will be simply harder for you to do.
hotbox4u 10y ago
Why all this generalizing? Do you know how it is to fuck 100 men? Do you know if this is true that you stop feeling if you willingly sleep with that much men and every single one was nice to you? What does make you think that someone, man or woman, would lose attachment to sex the more he/she has it?
As i said i think it doesnt matter much with how many people you slept. Bonding over sex can happen but a real and serious relationship is work on so many more levels.
And why so many people get divorced doesnt has anything to do with how much sex the man or the woman had prior to that relationship. There was this very interessting posts on /r/askreddit which were very much on spot imo.
I would suggest reading and thinking about this (Not just this one but the next are also interessting):
http://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/1gmlbq/boyfriends_of_reddit_what_are_things_your/calrofr
redpillschool 10y ago
I agree with redpillwifey here, with one caveat. Understand that if your number is high, and he finds out, it will have an effect on him emotionally. Even if he's progressive and says the number doesn't matter, it always does.
[deleted] 10y ago
There needs to be an insightful button here.
[deleted] 10y ago
While generally lying is bad, I dunno if telling the truth is the right call here. You say yourself it will possibly effect his attraction. obviously lying is not good for relationships, but how is he REALLY going to know your true number? I would not say something like 3 partners, but a more realistic 7.
Big_Man_On_Campus 10y ago
Well, if we're going to justify keeping the truth from a spouse based on whether or not we can get away with it, then why pretend to be honest at all?
The_Ringmistress 10y ago
The truth has a way of outing itself. Unless a large portion of that number are very short term or in a foreign country and not known to the wider circle of friends, saying 7 and then discovering #8 or 9 makes one wonder where it stops.
Don't lie. Reveal on a need to know basis, but don't give a hard number unless it is the real number.
Roseflowertea 10y ago
Well, most of those partners were in college, and I've moved to a different state since graduating.
The_Ringmistress 10y ago
Imagine your at the rehearsal dinner and everyone is on their third glass of wine. What information do you want your future spouse to discover under those conditions?
If you aren't going to reveal the total, be upfront that you have some experience. Don't give a number that can be contradicted by hard evidence. Withholding makes you reticent. Giving a lowball that is discovered to be false makes you a liar.
DaddyMonster 10y ago
FTFY.
The_Ringmistress 10y ago
Good point. Although it could also be fixed that the discovery reveals you to be a liar. Thanks. Low ball is lying regardless.
Big_Man_On_Campus 10y ago
As I mentioned in a previous post.... If we're going to justify keeping the truth from a spouse based on whether or not we can get away with it, then why pretend to be honest at all?
I have no solution for you for keeping your SO's emotions in check and his opinion of you high after being honest with him about this should you choose to do so. Who knows, maybe your N is low for him. But if you're going to justify not telling the truth on probabilities of discovery, then to modify a quote: "We've already established you're a liar, we're just mitigating the risk."
If you're serious about an LTR, you'll be honest with every man you attempt one with.
Roseflowertea 10y ago
I've been lurking around TRP proper a bit, so if you could clarify - why do I need to be honest? I've seen the idea that sexual strategy is amoral advanced several times there.
[deleted] 10y ago
what sexual strategy is amoral means:
trait/ behavior X makes you attracted to him.
there is no morality involved. whatever turn you on turns you on and whatever turns a man on, just turns him on.
you never decided what would make your V tingle, and a man never made the choice what would get him hard.
yet, i saw many times in TRP the posters have the position to always let women know they are dating/ fucking multiple women and not lie about it.
although, in their case that only makes them more attractive.
if you start lying, where are you going to end? i mean this isnt that big of a lie. now, if after a year he find out instead of 10, you fucked 100 men... well he will wonder what else you lied about.
its a risk/ cost analysis.
are you willing to risk losing a relationship after being in it for a year? are you willing to maintain a lie for maybe years? the rest of your life?
only you can answer your questions, but honestly: i would tell a man to lie about NOT being a virgin in order to get laid or not to be seen as a "loser".
so, in your case, if you are confident its worth it, that he has such a big issue with it that he would dump you on the spot (or the number is so high...), that you can lie to him without feeling guilty about it, i would say go for it.
Big_Man_On_Campus 10y ago
Uh, seriously?
Sexual strategies are amoral. Choices made by individuals are not. It's the difference between the abstract and the real. I can accept the fact that men by nature can be polyamorous to a self and society-destroying degree. I cannot accept the long-term successful PUA as an agent of morality. I can accept the fact that all women everywhere feel a pull to advance themselves through hypergamous instincts, that's a sexual strategy, it's amoral. It's quite another thing for a woman I met to leave me for a greater alpha that they used to know because their nature compels them.
Honesty is an individual choice that confers value in the intelligence of the listener. By being dishonest with your partner, you are forever insulting his/her intelligence.
I, personally, do not forgive people for insulting my intelligence.
Roseflowertea 10y ago
That's not at all what I've gathered from reading TRP.
My point was that sexual strategy is amoral. You might stick to your values, but those who have sex .. have sex.
That's from /u/redpillschool. I always figured the female equivalent would be "Relationship strategy is amoral. You might stick to your values, but those who get married, get married."
Big_Man_On_Campus 10y ago
You are equating the amorality of your innate sexual strategy with your decision to be dishonest with a long term partner, you cannot do that. They are not the same. You're rationalizing lying to a partner about your N because you've read that innate hypergamy is nothing to be ashamed of.
Innate hypergamy is nothing to be ashamed of. Lying to someone you care about is something to be ashamed of.
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Big_Man_On_Campus 10y ago
I think you said the same thing I did, with some semantic argument mixed in.
TDCRedPill 10y ago
That was a brilliantly worded point. I wish I had an answer for you, but I'm stumped right now. Well said.
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DaddyMonster 10y ago
Uhuh.
Lies of omission are still lies. To lie is dishonest.
I smell small furry creatures.
PaulMurrayCbr 10y ago
Small furry creatures leaving pellets.
Roseflowertea 10y ago
This is a really good idea, thanks.
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Roseflowertea 10y ago
Oh gee thanks, Dr. Phil.
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[deleted] 10y ago
I stumbled on my girl's list one day that she made during a drunken talk with a girlfriend. I'm still having issues with it.
Honestly, I had no issues with her past when I didn't know about it. Now, so many questions and concerns that I refuse to reveal to her, opting to simply remain vigilant. Her Facebook and phone contacts are now purged of those names which was the sole upside to the whole situation.
Roseflowertea 10y ago
Why can't a woman be in contact with any man she used to have a relationship with?
[deleted] 10y ago
What's the point? To talk about completely platonic things? Doesn't happen. Men and women can't be simply platonic friends. So what's left to talk about? The past? The chances of that happening are 100%. Shit like that reignites old feelings.
Part of being red pill is, once in a relationship, fiercely guarding your relationship either by mate guarding or recognizing situations where shit might go down and avoiding those situations.
Besides, chances are that if you split on friendly terms there won't be bad feelings and more than likely very good feelings towards that person. There's no better tinder to feed a flame than history and good memories between old lovers.
sunflowergirly 10y ago
I feel ya, girl. I went through a bit of a wild phase in high school (I can still count the number of people I've been with on one hand, but at the time I was so stupidly reckless and really regret it!) and worry about this too.
I agree with the people who said, "don't tell him, but be honest if he asks". Honesty is always the best policy.
Good luck and know you are not alone!!
The_Ringmistress 10y ago
No.
Zamarski 10y ago
For all you young ladies wondering about sexual partner count, read the Parable of Mark and Lauren: http://theprivateman.wordpress.com/2013/06/17/the-parable-of-mark-and-lauren-by-laidnyc/
FleetingWish 10y ago
Ok, you're in a bad situation. You're going to look bad, so the first thing you need to do is stop sexing guys you don't care about. The second thing you need to do is go on a massive self-improvement plan. Anything you do to make yourself more attractive, your appearance, and your personality, anything you can think of. See men don't like to feel like they are getting "played". If you slept with one guy for the price of a drink, and you’re asking the next guy to sleep with you for emotional commitment, the second guy is going to wonder why the price for sex went up. What you have to do is have a reason, be able to let them know that the price went up because now you are of higher value.
For example, let’s say you're fat. If you lose 50lbs, you can say "oh yeah, I had a lot of partners, but that was when I was 50lbs heavier." Now instead of looking at himself as a fool, he'll be looking at all those other men as fools, for sleeping with you when you were heavier; he's getting a better deal. He'll be able to see that and even pay more for the opportunity. This can work with anything, your personality would work too, and being more feminine. You just have to be a better deal now than you were before.
redpillschool 10y ago
This is very true. I have walked because a girl who was previously very promiscuous (and proud of it) decided it was now time to settle down.
She said to me "the days of hookups are over for me, I need commitment."
She literally wouldn't have sex with me unless I committed to her. Needless to say we didn't have sex, and I walked.
She asked me why, and I just told her, "because you're charging me for something you've been giving away freely. I'm not an idiot."
She's post-wall age but still looks good for her age. She's really depressed that she can't find anybody who will commit, but she's still quite disillusioned by the fact that she gets so much male attention.
Roseflowertea 10y ago
One of the reasons my partner count is so high is because when I was graduating from college (which is when I realized I needed to start seeking out an actual, committed relationship), I went through a phase where I would start dating a man who said he was serious and then after we started having sex he'd suddenly go back on that. :/ How can I determine which guys are being honest? There were also a couple assholes I broke up with because they'd yell at me and never seemed to respect me - they'd order me around, were really bossy and demanding about sex, never wanted to do anything I wanted to do, one expected me to do his laundry for him. 0_0
I don't think I'm fat or unattractive - I'm a size 6, and pretty enough. And I take care of myself and cook well.
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FleetingWish 10y ago
This is going to look badly on you. Men are going to see that other men weren't willing to commit to you, and they're going to wonder "why not".
Humm... that's an interesting question. I've always been good at figuring this out with my intuition, so it's a little hard for me to describe. In /r/fPUA we talk about something called the "Emotional Hookpoint". There's two main hookpoints for a relationship. The "Physical Hookpoint" where he is willing to have sex with you, and the "Emotional Hookpoint" where he is willing to emotionally commit to you. As you've figured out, the physical hookpoint is super-duper easy. Where as the emotional one is very complicated. Both creating it and recognizing it can be hard.
The best I can describe to create it is to exhibit (traditionally) feminine behavior. Care about him, think about his needs, be empathetic, be loving, be supportive, be nurtring.
To recognize it, I would say the best clue is emotional vulnerability. Remember that men are very guarded creatures. They are unable to express their feelings with most of the world. In fact if you spend some time reading what men desire in relationships, one of the number one things that keeps popping up is someone to be emotionally vulnerable with. They want so much for someone they can do that with, because they don't get that outlet anywhere else. If they do that with you, you're in.
Roseflowertea 10y ago
So should I not have sex until after the emotional hookpoint?
mghow 10y ago
This is the tip of the iceberg concerning what you should have done back in your college days, but doing so now would not work because it is too late. It would be hypocritical to say the least. That's how men will see it anyway.
HarleyWalker 10y ago
I think it's too late for that. If a girl does that to me after already sleeping with 12 guys I will dump her. What makes sex so special all of a sudden to do that and why should a guy accept it?
It's like putting the price up and providing the same service (or a lesser one depending how you look at it)
FleetingWish 10y ago
Umm... that one's a little tricky, it you're waiting for the one signal I gave you, then probably you shouldn't do that. In general I would say no, don't have sex until you have reached emotional hookpoint. But, you should know relatively fast, because men, unlike women, develop emotion connections fairly instantaneously. (Where women it takes a process of "getting to know him")
enticingasthatmaybe 10y ago
Why would anyone stay around after sex if sex is all you have to offer?
I can personally guarantee you that a high value man will stay if you are putting forth the effort to make yourself valuable for something other than sex.
Here is the crux of the issue; entitlement. You have to earn respect - being born female does not grant respect by default.
Roseflowertea 10y ago
Well, I don't think sex is all I have to offer, but how am I supposed to demonstrate that? Should I not have sex with them for a long time? And how am I supposed to know which men are high-value and not?
And how do I earn respect? Do I have to prove to men that they shouldn't boss me around and use me for sex?
enticingasthatmaybe 10y ago
By not being demanding or entitled. Be feminine, his strength will be greater than yours so accept and submit to him. No one should be 'bossing you around', but at the same time; he is driving the bus. If you don't like his leadership; leave. Chances are you won't ever be happy with a man letting you lead. In fact you'll probably end up hating anyone who defers to you.
Understand when you are shit testing and fucking stop doing it. He's proven his strength; if you're constantly testing an alpha's fitness you're like to find out just how fit he really is when you find yourself next'ed.
You know how to find high value men, but you probably don't know how to get them to commit. As I said above; you don't deserve anything. The second you are feeling like you deserve something from him; you're probably projecting behavior that's putting you in the pump-n-dump-zone.
See also below;
You've answered your own question. High value men will take command.
Roseflowertea 10y ago
But that's totally unhelpful!! I naturally like the man being in charge, so I trust them and have sex with them when they want, but everyone here agrees with me that I need to stop having sex with guys who won't marry me.
So how do I find out which guys are marriage-material before we have sex?
rds4 10y ago
Tell him the number that he can find out, plus one for safety.
No need to mention all one night stands.
In_Omnia_Parata 10y ago
I can't find it now, but I remember reading a story somewhere on the manosphere about a very LTR (talking decades here) breaking up after he found out she had lied about her previous sexual experiences. He felt (quite rightly, I think) that a core aspect of their life as a couple was built on a lie, and it was a deal breaker. Honesty is the only option here.
[deleted] 10y ago
I remember that article... Can't remember where I saw it.
[deleted] 10y ago
figure out what he thinks about it before you make the decision. maybe you dont have to lie. if you have to, think hard if you can maintain the lie and if its worth it.