Summary: Women have a dual sexual strategy. The want both alpha fucks and beta bucks, but the beta bucks does not give her the tingles; financial success is not the key to easy pussy.
Body
While TRP is generally a sub with high quality content there is one misunderstanding that is often repeated: the idea that income and money is alpha. You'll see it said again and again and you'll see posts stating it upvoted, even though it flies in the face of one of the central pillars of red pill understanding: the female dual sexual strategy and AF/BB.
The core of the misunderstanding seems to be a simplistic model of the female attraction along the lines of "traits women want = alpha". This is simply not the case.
Women have a dual sexual strategy. They want alphas for fucking and betas for support and provision. Women will pursue men with strong beta traits. However, this does not mean that the beta bucks role is enjoyable for a man. It might seem so at first glance as many women (especially as they approach or pass the wall) seem attracted to it, but the problem is that she does not really want to fuck a beta. Of course she will use sex and especially the promise of sex to lure in a beta, but what she really wants from him is commitment and if a man only gives good beta but very little alpha she will only give him the minimum amount of sex needed to secure his commitment. He will have to prove his loyalty before sex, and once she thinks he is hooked (due to oneitis, children and/or marriage) she'll dead bedroom him. Contrast this to how she responds to an alpha: she just wants to fuck him, no questions asked, no commitment required.
You will find no clearer evidence of the female sexual strategy than among rich people. Rich men almost without fail pick up pretty girl in their late 20s/early 30s. It doesn't matter if he's 30 or 50, he'll find a trophy wife about to hit the wall. Just as inevitably, she'll want marriage and children and after that it goes dead bedroom. There are so many sexually frustrated rich men; their wives were very happy to land such a catch but that does not mean that they want to fuck him. Financial success alone just doesn't make her wet. In contrast, she'll bounce happily on the cock of her personal trainer Chad, a man who has little income and doesn't do anything for her. But he is alpha, so he gets more sex, better sex, and for no effort.
Of course the dead bedroom is not the fate of all rich men. The exception is the men who also have strong alpha traits. While money is a beta trait, being rich does not necessarily make you a beta (ie. someone who lacks alpha qualities). Their women have hit the jackpot and find their dual sexual strategy satisfied in just one man.
A red pill man looking to spin plates will also see an advantage from financial success. Girls have a dual sexual strategy and they are attracted to beta traits too, and money is a great beta trait with no downside (compared to for example supplication which is a beta trait that kills your alpha completely). However, it is still the alpha traits that make her horny. It is the alpha traits that make her down to fuck rather than demanding 3 expensive dinners to prove your commitment before she'll give it up. Focusing on financial success over alpha traits is a huge mistake.
For men looking for an LTR, financial success is much more important. While alpha traits are what generates raw sexual attraction, beta traits are just as crucial for long term stability in a relationship. A woman will rarely stay with a man who can't provide for her if she has other options available; lacking income and other beta traits is a sure way to make her branch swing.
Lessons Learned
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Women want both alpha and beta, but remember that beta traits like money does not make her horny
- Do not rely on financial success alone; alpha traits will always be more important

aDrunkenWhaler 9y ago
Son, you are off your tits.
Money = High Status = Alpha
Money = DGAF attitude = Alpha
Money = More bitches = Validation = Alpha
Money = Confidence = Respect = Alpha
Money = High quality life = Envy = Alpha
Money = Top clothes/cars/houses/vacations = Success = Alpha
Money = Time = Freedom = Do whatever the fuck you want whenever the fuck you want to = Alpha
Sure, you can fuck a lot of bitches without money. Sure, money does not necessarily make you alpha, especially if you slave yourself for them 60+ hours a week. But the broke ass alphas will rarely fuck 9 and 10's, because they don't have access to them. The rich alphas make women wet their panties faster than a feminist screams RAPE.
Stop hamstering a reason for being ok to stay poor.
OscarPistachios 9y ago
Wrong. I make 96% more than people in my age group. I haven't gotten the time of day from women in years. They sincerely do not give a flying fuck about having money unless they can have a chad that has money.
Theotropho 9y ago
I think this sub needs to understand that "beta" is a truly successful survival strategy. They fuck around on the fringes, eat the fruit left behind, and don't gotta fuck with territory. Most of the alphas on this sub are just successful betas. Slinking around, cheating, no long term bonding, no pack loyalty, just like a beta. They just use empowering terms to pretend they're alphas xD
thawayred 9y ago
this is the truth. money=freedom=not slave=alpha
JackGetsIt 9y ago
Good comment. I'd agree there are a lot of guys with lots of money that don' have any of these traits. That's why the ultimate female fantasy is an alpha with financial security. Because he will protect the wealth, grow the wealth, protect her, guard her from others, etc. Money alone doesn't do everything a women needs but it's certainly a powerful tool to provide what women need and to access high value women.
[deleted] 9y ago
[deleted]
aDrunkenWhaler 9y ago
I said 'rarely', not 'never', and that is true, because they don't hang around places 9 and 10's hang around. No high end clubs, no high end circles, no office parties, different neighbourhoods, different friends, no vacations etc. They can slay 7 and 8's, but 9 and 10 you have to be at least middle class or really have to go out of your way to make it happen.
[deleted] 9y ago
Money is completely tangential to alpha, but extremely correlated with provider status. Read through rollos first year 'alpha' post, and the accompanying chateau heartsie post that it links to.
This is the most basic sidebar material that OP is referring to. Guys often make alpha traits, based on what they think they are.
rollo
CH
Next time you come in with full on AMOG, do your research first. If you want wealth, that's great, every man should have a mission. If you want it to slay 'bitches' then you're running at beta full tilt.
It's as ridiculous a statement as the guys who work out just to get laid. Those are the men who barely work out, only hit chest, biceps and shoulders, and then quit every few months.
aDrunkenWhaler 9y ago
I think you either skipped or failed to understand the last part of my argument where I said you can fuck a lot of bitches without money and that money doesn't necessarily make you alpha. Never did I imply you NEED money to slay bitches.
Money doesn't make you alpha any more than being ripped makes you alpha, or being well dressed and groomed, or fucking a lot of women, or being successful, or being a leader, respected etc. But these are still alpha traits, together with not giving a shit, being cocky, a rebel etc. There is no alpha standard, there are different types, mature, like Jocko Wilink, immature, like Corey from Rollo's article, and plenty in between.
Can you be a broke ass homeless alpha? Hardly likely, but not impossible. Can you be a skinny weak fuck and alpha? Hardly likely, but not impossible. Can you have poor hygiene, have no career, be a virgin, be a nerd or be a general loser in life, and still be alpha? Hardly likely, but not impossible.
But how many would doubt that a jacked, well dressed successful self made millionaire getting out of a Ferrari is anything but alpha? How many would look at a poorly dressed guy living on food stamps and say this guy is alpha? How many women would fuck the first and how many the latter? Or want to be in their pressence for that matter?
And to reiterate what I said, most (not all) 9 and 10's won't give broke ass guys the time of day, no matter how alpha they are. Those that do come with daddy issues, the other, they have plenty of alphas to choose from that are also succesful. It's like a man choosing a 7 over a 9 just because.
[deleted] 9y ago
you are telling the truth man
[deleted]
Sepean 9y ago
I suspect you don't actually spend time around rich people?
I know many people with money who do not come across as high status, at all.
Lots of people with money have no DGAF attitude. Many have low self esteem and take offense at the smallest (even imagined) slight. There's a certain group of rich people who even seem to have grown rich mainly from the drive to prove themselves because of their low self esteem.
Many rich men don't have access to "more bitches", at all. Getting dead bedroomed is common in the upper class.
Lots of people with money don't come across as confident and don't command respect. As soon as they leave their office where they have authority, they lack the social presence to radiate confidence and gain respect.
So anything anyone will envy is alpha? Lol, no.
Success isn't necessarily alpha. "Alpha" doesn't mean "good".
It sounds like you have this idea that anything that anyone will see as positive is "alpha". It is not. Alpha (in the TRP sense) is the set of male traits that make women horny, that make them want to fuck a man irregardless of commitment or anything else.
[deleted] 9y ago
Agree with this. For many years, I have worked with very wealthy families taking care of some of their financial interests. Some of the very, very wealthiest of them are near pathetic. Avidly they follow the "happy wife, happy life" motto. They affectionately call their women "princess". They often are openly supplicating and cowardly with their women. Mostly they just believe that their women are equals and put them on pedestals. They often are looking forward to birthdays and anniversaries so they can have sex with the princess. Very wealthy, high social circles, some are self made, high income, but they are beta-bux to the core. Many are trained by their family, from a very early age, to be beta.
aDrunkenWhaler 9y ago
I can assure you women will fuck a guy driving a Ferrari rather than a guy driving a Kia irregardless of commitment. Guess what other traits make women wet? Vacations in Bali, mansion with a swimming pool, you owning the company they work for, irregardless of commitment or anything else.
[deleted] 9y ago
depends how he looks. Looks > Money when it comes to just fucking. Don't try to hamster away that it's not so. We all know it's true.
FALCONFX007 9y ago
You are high buddy, go home.
[deleted] 9y ago
when a girl goes to the club, she's looking to hook up with the best looking guy there, not who has the most money.
lmfao can't believe all the hamstering some of you TRPers do.
FALCONFX007 9y ago
The ones who go to clubs are usually cheap whores. Im talking about high profile parties where actual successful ppl are with real money. They dont go for the good looking one. They go for the guy with fatest bank accounts
[deleted] 9y ago
Not all the ones that go to the clubs are not cheap whores. Do you know how many girls go to clubs? 95% of the good looking girls these days have been to a club or a bar.
Stop hamstering. Money matters, yes. We agree. But most of the ones that go for money first are gold digging whores anyway. So how is that any better? Stop denying that looks don't matter. Looks matter. A lot. Half of the goddam posts on TRP is about improving your physique and your looks.
TomRoberts2016 9y ago
Which bars and clubs?
Because where I'm at the past few weeks, I see mostly fat Mexican chicks everywhere.
Yes, there's a decent amount of fat white chicks. (Southern California)
[deleted] 9y ago
Nailed it.
Just so everyone knows, this is a reactionary thread to my topic on how and why financial success is actually incredibly "alpha." Which the mods deleted.
The butthurt reaction to my premise in the comments was really something to see. Always follow the butthurt when you're looking for the truth.
[deleted] 9y ago
See above, you've missed the basics of CG and rollos first year 'alpha' posts.
Your post wasn't well thought out, and was more you projecting, than any actual RP truths
[deleted] 9y ago
Fair enough. I don't attest your (EDIT: the mods') right to delete a post that does not suit the sub's established narrative.
I advise anybody interested to read the post in question from my history and decide this for themselves.
[deleted] 9y ago
I've read it before I posted, which is why I gave the suggestions I gave.
The money you make for you. the same traits that work for internal motivation can be used for alpha behaviours. Using it get women is skipping the masculinity filter.
Then, like seapan says, shows the women that you are using it to get them, and encourages BB. It's no different than a girl who dresses like a whore to pick up guys. No one will wife her up, but they will happily pump n dump her
[deleted] 9y ago
I wasn't suggesting that you hadn't. Although I do find it a little disheartening that you're the final say on whether my post is "well-thought out", because in structure and coherency this reply reads like you're roleplaying a cave man.
Edit: my mistake. saw the red flag and assumed you were a mod. Needless to say, I don't give name flair much weight or attention.
PaperStreetVilla 9y ago
RPS is the final say.
If you disagree with red pill tenants, thats fine. Keep in mind experience of many members, and the main contributors of RP praxeology set the bar high. Posting something thats opposite to whats already out there has to involve a more persuasive argument than "Bro" "Dude" and "fuck dem bitches" along with dollar signs for 'S'
perception is projection
[deleted] 9y ago
Who said I was?
Sepean 9y ago
Indeed. You're far from the first person to make that mistake though.
Why do you think the mods deleted your post? Probably because it was wrong but getting upvoted.
No one was butthurt, what you posted was just wrong. You got called out on your misunderstanding, you had your post deleted by the mods, and still you are so sure you're right and everyone else is just butthurt and out to get you.
Could it be that you might just be wrong?
[deleted] 9y ago
The measure of a man and a pivotal component of his SMV lies in his utility to the tribe. Men are replaceable nobodies unless they prove otherwise.
Today, your ability to accumulate wealth just happens to strongly correlate with your utility as a man.
It's a generalization, but if you seriously think it's a wrong generalization then there's a pill you haven't swallowed.
I can't speak for the mods or their reasoning.
Sepean 9y ago
Lol no. Useless criminals can have high alpha, while most men who are useful to society are useful due to their beta qualities. You got it backwards.
Then take it from me (and the guy who reported you who explained exactly, and the other guys explaining it you in your thread): your post was deleted because your post was about how a beta trait was the key to success with women.
[deleted] 9y ago
Are these men really "useful"? Or are they replaceable components? I don't think we are referring to the same sort of man. I'm talking about men with ambition and entrepreneurial spirit. The type of men that are responsible for those men having a job to fill as a cog in the machine.
In that vein, I don't understand how you can possibly hamster that getting money on your own terms and being industrious is a "beta" trait. You have a dogmatic and seriously warped approach to the alpha/beta dichotomy if you see it that way.
I guess that same approach has been adopted as the narrative of this sub, but you know what? Just because a subreddit moderator said it's "wrong" doesn't necessarily make it so.
I can flip your original question around back on you: why was my thread getting so many upvotes while yours is still sitting at a networth of 0? Possibly because, while your post is more in line with the principles of this sub, my post offered more inherit value in itself.
Sepean 9y ago
You seem to think that entrepeneurs are some sort of super studs. They are not, and their business acumen don't make them alpha. At all.
Some of them have alpha qualities, but it is a largely unrelated skill set.
Beta traits are those of provision. Wealth is that.
This is the basis of the female dual sexual strategy, of AF/BB. It is not something I "hamstered", it is red pill 101 and easily observable in reality. Don't you know that there are rich men getting dead bedroomed and divorce raped? If financial success is such a turn on, why is that happening?
If you don't accept the "narrative of this sub", just leave. We don't need you.
The newbies outnumber the men who get it, but unfortunately everyone gets a vote.
Look up the fallacy of appeal to the masses.
[deleted] 9y ago
Ambition, pragmatism and persistence are the general underlying traits of "alpha" that attract both wealth and women in abundance. But I'll agree to disagree. If your life experience runs to the contrary then I can't change your outlook. Likewise, mine runs contrary to your viewpoint, and you won't be able to change mine.
My point stems from the more generalized, more grounded definition. That being: beta traits are those of weakness. Alpha traits are those of pragmatism and power. The ability to acquire wealth, not wealth itself, in most cases is a form of power won by pragmatism. It goes without saying that you still have to know how to leverage it.
It goes without saying that you still have to know how to leverage it. There are men with chiseled bodies and perfectly symmetrical faces in the exact same position.
Thanks for the offer, but I can glean plenty of value from this sub without an unthinking, zealot-like dedication to the tenets.
Look up the fallacy of appeal to authority.
Sepean 9y ago
That is not the TRP definition of alpha and beta. You should read the glossary on the sidebar (and the resr of the sidebar really, it seems you haven't grasped even basics like AF/BB).
[deleted] 9y ago
Oh go on. "Beta" is used as a catch-all term for weaklings around here all the time. There is an accepted secondary usage for the term within the community. Maybe not by asskissers like you, but definitely by the community as a whole.
mexaboy 9y ago
Money is money. It's not inherently Alpha or Beta. It's what you do with it that matters.
Spending money (directly) on women is Beta. It might get a woman to begrudgingly settle for you.
Spending money on your lifestyle so you have a blast is Alpha. It also gets you surrounded by women who want to fuck your brains out. Oh, make no mistake, they'll also want your money. You just don't give it to them.
Theotropho 9y ago
money and success are alpha, for sure. Sleeping around without being successful is the sign of a smooth beta, which is a totally worthwhile goal.
Your_Coke_Dealer 9y ago
We don't practice the ideals of TRP for women. We do it for ourselves. Fact of the matter is, while TRP is predominantly sexual strategy, it also encompasses other SMV-enhancing strategy, like specifics to working out, with the general goal of making you a better man (which is only really quantifiable by SMV). Financial success does increase SMV, even though it alone does not make you alpha. After all, you need money to impress high status women.
Sure your pickup game at a bar is more important than wearing a Rolex, but if you're trying to even get in to the kind of clubs where you'll find models to pick up, you're gonna want to roll up in a Maserati rather than a Toyota. Money isn't everything, but it's social proof enough to get women to give you the time of day to approach
Theotropho 9y ago
in the wild:
Alpha has territory, beta is fringe
Alpha fucks in front of the pack, beta has to hide
In many pack species the alpha ends up having less sex overall because of the time and energy dedicated to maintaining territory and protecting that herd of females.
Sepean 9y ago
No, you can't compare those. What a biologist calls an alpha pack leader is not what TRP means by an alpha.
In humans, the rich CEO (pack leader) can easily lack "TRP alpha" qualities so his wife refuses to have sex with him, but she she will gladly fuck the low status pool boy if he is ripped and confident.
The power structure and hierarchy between men simply does not translate into what women find attractive.
Theotropho 9y ago
TRP has ignored what the terms mean and instead focuses on declaring itselves an alpha organization. What it needs to do is recognize that there's a variety of paths to biological success, you don't have to call your methodology "alpha" for it to be worthwhile.
[deleted] 9y ago
This has to be one of the most beta statements I've ever heard.
Sepean 9y ago
Well, it is beta. Beta means "traits of provision".
Since you then proceed to call the statement "beta" I assume you have entirely misunderstood what "beta" means. What do you think "beta" means?
NeoreactionSafe 9y ago
Child Support Law (1950)
Before 1950 one could be Alpha and rich and marry and everything was consistent with masculine polarity.
It was the Child Support Law that invented Divorce Rape. (inverting nature)
Ever since they split Alpha off into beta we have AF / BB.
So it's externally applied now by "the tyranny".
If those laws were erased things would revert to nature.
[deleted] 9y ago
Exactly. So many guys misunderstand women and think that they are attracted to money.
They're not. If being rich is getting you pussy it's because they want your money, not your dick.
If you want to get laid, the single most important thing you can do is look good
[deleted] 9y ago
Money sure helps though, even to help you look good. You can afford better food, get nice clothes, won't drive a rusty vehicle that is embarrassing to be seen in (even a clean looking sedan where all panels are the same color will do) money decreases stress, no worrying about bills, having a place to sleep, shutting off AC/heat to pinch a few bucks a day etc.
Not to mention you can afford decent gym equipment and with enough money a personal trainer. No one needs a trainer but a pro that knows what they are doing can net you better results and do everything for you except the actual pain and gain.
Theotropho 9y ago
no, the best is being funny. Second best is being in good shape. You can have an ugly face but if you're funny AF and have a nice/tight body you'll pull 8s and 9s easy.
[deleted] 9y ago
It's the tight body that the girls are attracted to, not the sense of humor.
You can quote me on this: being funny has absolutely no effect on female SEXUAL attraction
Theotropho 9y ago
laughter produces both dopamine and endorphines, both of which are linked to sexual response. I haven't seen anything on oxytocin yet but it will be there.
[deleted] 9y ago
That's way too loose a connection to say "humor creates sexual attraction". Graspin at straws there
Theotropho 9y ago
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0160289611000523
[deleted] 9y ago
Correlation, not causation. Invalid.
DontBeFredo 9y ago
Definitely don't rely on financial success alone. But I never think making a cautionary post warning others not to become super successful is a good idea. Also, if you're into the money and success for pussy, you're going to have a very miserable life.
Sepean 9y ago
Where did I warn others to not become successful?
DontBeFredo 9y ago
The title of your post included the phrase, "how financial success is beta".
Not "how even with financial success you can still be beta".
Sepean 9y ago
Beta doesn't mean "bad" or "turns women off".
makeyourpoint 9y ago
from what i understand its less having all the money thats beta. but rather spending a large portion of your income on keeping a girl around thats beta
theredpill1000 9y ago
Very interessting. I thougt about it and i came to the conclusion that women nowadays are in some kind of dilemma.
Let me explain:
Before thousends of years, the alpha was obviously the alpha. But the alpha WAS the alpha because he was the leader, the strongest one. Therefore he had automatically the most resources--> because he was the strongest and fittest.
So earlier the alpha was, what is alpha AND beta at the same time novadays.
Today the strongest one is not the one with the most power. Instread the most intelligent one (often the richest.) is the one with the most Power or resources.
Alpha and beta divided into two parts.
PaperStreetVilla 9y ago
♂
Clearly the clarification on dual mating strategy, and alpha traits is needed.
Sepean 9y ago
Thanks man.
Unfortunately this particular message is unpopular with many people so it gets downvoted out of sight.
PaperStreetVilla 9y ago
whinemoreplease used to get downvoted often for very basic stuff. It's first year Rollo and chateau Heartsie posts.
The fact that there's even discussion on the more basic stuff shows just how many people have read the sidebar in it's entirety.
[deleted] 9y ago
Women want both..
Take two good looking men.. One rich, one poor.. They will always choose rich.
As far as ugly guys using money to get a girl?? Whatever works I guess, better then nothing
Sepean 9y ago
Exactly, women want both. That is why we say they have a dual sexual strategy.
Ugly you can overcome. Lack of an alpha mindset, that is a different story. Without it, if you attract a woman with money you're heading towards a bad relationship with lack of respect, lots of demands and nagging, and starfish sex at best.
[deleted] 9y ago
Disagree completely with your last point. Rather be Mgtow than be with girl only using me for resources. It's a good thing I don't want to be mgtow
[deleted] 9y ago
Not everyone is like you.. Some men would be content.. Actually, many men would be
skittles_man 9y ago
While I agree with what you say, never underestimate the power of what women will do to lock down a provider, especially if you're a big catch. Many times women will give a great performance and will give you some of her best sex in order to lock you in as her beta provider. However, this is contingent upon the man giving up his commitment. The more he puts up a fight for his commitment, the more she'll try to persuade him (either sexually or through manipulation) to give up his full commitment i.e. providership. Conversely, the less of a fight he puts up with regards to giving up his commitment, the less sex, both quality and quantity he is going to receive.
This is not a bad strategy to pursue for men who lack "traditional" characteristics of being alpha, such as good looks. Ultimately though, these beta men need to have the necessary self awareness to navigate such a strategy as we all know that women are more unforgiving of beta men, as opposed to their alpha counterparts. It takes a certain amount of skill and intelligence to do this successfully.
Sepean 9y ago
Absolutely. What women will do to lock down a provider is probably where this confusion about "money being alpha" comes from. They see a girl chasing a rich guy and they think that the rich guy has alpha, but in reality it is the beta leg of her dual sexual strategy she is acting on.
NeverDieAlone 9y ago
Don't agree. Once those dudes reach 30 or so and have failed to create income streams, their ability to pull anything will be impaired by younger versions of themselves, which they won't be able to compete with.
Sound familiar?
[deleted] 9y ago
Status and money are just multipliers.
If you do not have an alpha mindset from the beginning, your money will just make you a beta provider.
But if you have an alpha mindset, the money will increase your alpha status.
[deleted]
justgotalpha 9y ago
I DISSAGREE!!!
to be alpha is in fact to have MONEY.
you cant keep a girl around for too long if you don't have lets say a job or you don't have something going on for yourself. I don't care how alpha you are she will still try to turn you into a provider that's the whole point of her wanting your commitment.
If you have money the ball is in your court.you could have the freedom you want and live how the fuck you want.but you must use money to your advantage!!!!
of course if we are talking lets say about a guy in his 40s nerdy type,with no social skills of course she will put him in provider role right away.but if we are talking about a a buff,good looking dude ,she in fact will be intimidated because she will think he has it all and will not even commit.