Treat every accusations seriously. Remember you are not the court. Do not ask the potential victim for proof. This is extremely harmful to real victims.

If that’s the case then due process isn’t an issue, it only becomes an issue if you want to try and get someone who may be innocent convicted

or maybe dont support either until there is evidence

that's what i do

If I support the facts, I have statistically higher chance of finding the truth, than either of those fucked up sexist scenarios.

[Edit: Thank you for the gold kind stranger!]

How fucking stupid can you be fucking hell

"Innocent until proven guilty applies to both the accuser and the accused, and it's only proper to withhold judgement until evidence is forthcoming" Dr. Shaym

Fun fact some media outlets say something like 92% of rape allegations are not false, which is true but only like 3% are true 90% are not proven true or false and like 4% are proven false. Check it.

This kind of cancel culture "shoot first ask questions later" mindset is incredibly dangerous.

I remember way back, my first Ex decided to lie and say we were never together and that I was a creep who had a crush and obsessively followed her around. Obviously this led to being shunned by a large majority of people we both worked with for a while and I had no idea why. In the end, I was very lucky because I wasn't the only person she told lies about and once people started to hear the lies she told about them and got to know me better, they told me and I was able to provide proof that we were in fact together.

I was also lucky that the false accusations weren't quite as serious as abuse or rape because people lie about those and that ends careers. Don't get me wrong, the people who actually have done that stuff should 100% be removed from their positions and punished, but there's a reason the legal system states "Innocent till proven guilty" - it's because there are people that falsely accuse others, so due process exists to determine based on evidence what happened.

Unfortunately, cancel culture doesn't much care for that these days. There are people who engage in this almost recreational outrage and are constantly looking for the next thing to get angry about. This is why they don't care about whether the accusation is true, they just take it on its word because they get a weird satisfaction from being angry all the time, it's addictive.

It's massively present these days due to people who know this and take advantage of it to benefit themselves. My ex for example when confronted with everything confessed that the reason she did what she did was because she struggles making friends so she thought by saying what she did, all the other women we worked with would stand with her. Other times false accusations are made because it will remove someone from a position of power that they hope to claim some of for themselves. And sometimes you even get those who do it just cause they want to. Is every case this way? No, of course not. There are shitty people who do shitty things who are rightfully called out and tried on it. But there are those whose accusations are false and they're just as dangerous.

Whatever way you slice it, people who take advantage of the feminist movement as a means to further their own goals and bring others down are Ironically becoming what feminism is against (sexism and sex inequality) and it's frankly sick.

Or you can take a neutral stance until something is proven. Why are we normalising this guilty until proven innocent mentality

So if we accuse our accuser we end up neutral?

The thing is that this only really applies to a 'typical' case. When a girl comes in and says shes been raped most people jump to her defense, but when you wait 20 years and then claim that something happened when you were younger but can't get any details right and then other people come in and are proven to just be trying to sabotage famous men who upset them but didn't rape them, you're gonna be a lot safer believing that the man was just inappropriate at worst.

What statistics is she referring to? The authorities that gather rape statistics acknowledge that, for a multitude of reasons, they are ultimately unreliable. This lady and her ilk place a whole ton of faith on shoddy data and pure emotion. At best, these people are intellectually dishonest, and at worst they're just mindless, raving idiots.

hear that guys... not supporting the victim is defending the rapist....

How about, just bear with me, we wait until we have enough information to pick a side based of evidence and facts instead of picking a side and sticking with it no matter what?

I wonder... does she know that saying "statistically" is not the same thing as actually checking the statistics?

Unless that rapist is a democrat.

How about we don't immediately support anyone. We wait until the case has been proven with sufficient evidence to prove guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, just like in every other crime.

A great Witcher once said "If I have to choose Between a Greater Evil and a Lesser Evil, I will rather not choose at all"

These days even the most ignorant thinks they know a lot, and more importantly, can tell everyone about those things they don't know about.

A person that doesn't know about presumption of innocent should know they shouldn't speak about justice.

I hate this logic cause if it is a false accusation assault is somthing but sexual assault is somthing else just the accusation can ruin a mans life like hes a good guy oh wait no he was accused what's wrong with him if it reaches his work place it can get him fired cause no one wants to to have a coworker that's accused or have an employee that's accused either way in America its guilty until proven guilty guilty until guilty cause with that it's over if people catch wind it can a d most likely will go south for that person and ruin there lives if it fals

Statistically shut the fuck up

Supporting people who claim to be victims of rape/sexual assault isn't the problem. I'm fully in support of investigating any accusations, getting evidence that can prove or refute a crime, etc.

The problem is that accusations are seen synonymous with a guilty verdict. And even if it turns out to be false, there won't be any consequences for the accuser and any corrections in the media will be a small article of two lines.

Idk where feminists keep getting this "false rape allegations are statistically small" nonsens

Similar stuff to this is commonly repeated. but that doesn't make it true. Based on conviction rates, we really don't know. There is a small percentage rapes accusations presumptively determined to be true due a conviction, and small percentage determined to be false through some mechanism. The vast majority of complaints are somewhere in the middle, neither determined to be true or false.

Nowadays, sexism against men & racism against white people is fully encouraged, tolerated & celebrated by millions of sexist women & racist non-white people.

When will this horse shit end? I’m a white man & have done nothing wrong. In my opinion, white men have been very oppressed in history many times like having the vast majority of combat deaths in wars. Those were millions of (almost all) white men who were killed but no one talks about them.

there are 3 types .. lies, damned lies and statistics - mark twain.

stats are low because women aren’t prosecuted for making false complaints or assaults

Supporting one without evidence is stupidity at it's best.

What about supporting no one until one proven guilty with evidence.

Notice how she wrote about supposed abuser in the later paragraph in order trick our brain that into thinking more probability is the innocence of of the supposed victim. This is beacuse when we read the first para, we read it analyse it and themln remove from the brain. Then we come yo 2nd para which indicates the innocence of supposed victim so that after we read it, it would be stuck in our mind until we read next post, hence giving more thought process to the innocence of the supposed victim.

You are not fooling anybody here.

They simply don't get it. And it's scary that many of this women are the ones study Law while men drop college in a critical rate. We're fucked.

I'd rather a hundred guilty men go free, than see a single innocent man spend one day in jail.

I’m not taking sides until I hear both sides claim

You're forgotting about due process.

This statistical analysis is supported by actual math calculations, no doubt? LOL

Can someone tell this moron that's why we have the court system?

Edit: I read the tweets. In the comments she said she supports the court system and was referring to personal relationships only. Also, someone made a crack about people supporting alleged victims unless the one they accused is a presidential candidate, and her comment showed she agrees that Biden shouldn't get special treatment.

I think she's pretty reasonable, after reading all that. If what she means is trusting your friend when they confide in you about something like being raped, rather than doubting them, socially, she is probably correctly defining a social norm. Like, if someone in this sub said they were a rape victim, we would start off assuming they're telling the truth, rather than interrogating them and trying to ascertain whether or not it's true, right?

A very poor understanding of evidence, our legal system, and the presumption of innocence.

But an excellent ability to mindlessly parrot feminist propaganda that assumes all men are rapists unless proven otherwise. This sexist pig believes that when a male is not convicted of rape or the charges against him are dropped due to insufficient evidence, he is just a rapist who got away with it.

This reminds me of the George Floyd case, celebrities and companies are labelled "white supremacists" if they dont publicly support the BPM but the ones that do only do it for marketing and media.

I won’t support lies even if people call them the victim. I support the truth, not someone playing victim to cover their ass.

How about you support "innocent until proven guilty", and don't support either party until something is proven

Rape and false rape allegations both have life long impacts on their victims. I’d rather take a non bias approach and let the evidence speak for itself.

It's really interesting they're spilling out their true mentality towards false rape accusations now. Yes, it's enraging but I also find it fascinating because it lets you know where their mindset is at. In the heads of people who support false accusers they are far more afraid of being seen supporting a rapist than someone who lied about rape because in their heads false rape accusations are no big deal.

This whole situation has started because none of them received any kind of education on how much a false accusation can ruin someone's life so they naturally don't give a fuck as a result. Their parents and teachers have a lot to answer for.

Ah yes fuck innocent until proven guilty right

Here’s hoping this person would immediately support the idea that if victim is indeed a liar, liar should face prison time for fucking up an innocent person’s life. A lot of these cases don’t seem to end this way however, and sickens me that I’m gender-connected to people with this twisted “logic”.

I bet she supports Biden.

in other words; When she jumps to conclusions she should not have any accountability whatsover and damn those who stand in the way for truth over ignorance.

It’s fine to support someone but don’t attack the other person.

I choose to put all black people in jail that are accused of crimes because they are more likely to commit it.

That’s what you sound like.

Innocent until proven guilty is not supporting a rapist it is following the righteous path towards justice. Feminists wants men guilty until proven guilty and women innocent until proven innocent.

The only way to support the victim is to determine who the victim actually is. This person has no interest in reserving judgment or even conducting an investigation.

This is code for let me weaponize any allegation I make at any time and all women are victims and all men are bad.

Okay, so they're for supporting statistics now?

Okay

Inserts FBI Crime Statistics here

Most people prefer facts, dumbo.

I statistically wait until evidence is provided.

She’s trying to cover up her sexism and hide behind statistical probabilities. Unfortunately, it not only shows that her gender prejudices, it also shows that she’s doesn’t understand how to use probabilities correctly. Sad, really.

Here's a statistic. The more blindly you believe accusers, the easier it is to abuse that. Also, they're always hypocritical about this because people like Joe Biden are always immune to accusers.

This assumes that the statistics include rape and sexual harassment allegations that aren't actually counted, because they never go to court.

I cant tell if I'm misreading this or not. In support does she mean side with? Because I completely disagree. You shouldnt side with anyone until the facts come out. Presumption of innocence exists for a reason.

If she means support in the sense of being there for someone who says they got raped I actually agree. Assuming said support doesn't include anything that negatively impacts the person being accused. This goes both ways, you should be there for someone who gets accused. Nobody's life deserves to be ruined over an allegation. But that does happen. Someone i consider a brother was falsely accused. Before anything even came out he got death threats on social media, got kicked out of JROTC and some other things. I was obviously there for him through that. Even had he done it, I wouldn't have any regrets. Everyone deserves to be treated as innocent until proven otherwise.

I will not believe either person until evidence is placed in front of my face

What a cunt. You don't support shit until you have evidence.

This applies to every court case/allegation

I would like to take this time to point out that this lady beat up and racially assaulted my black grandmother

By this logic we should just imprison everyone accused of committing a crime because The Innocence Project has estimated that between 2.3 percent and 5 percent of all US prisoners are innocent, and this is within the false rape accusation tolerances that shes talking about

All I’m trying to say is when someone is accused of sexual assault they are automatically guilty rapists. Except when it’s political. She’s saying Biden is a rapist. She’s voting for him anyway. These people actively dox accused people and ruin their lives. However they are actively helping one become president of the US.

If I do immediately support a victim Im supporting a false accuser and trying to imprison and innocent person, if I don't support a victim after the accused was found guilty then I am supporting a rapist. The accused isn't guilty until proven guilty.

Exponentially this is dumb cause of people that do false accusations this becomes irrelevant

If those who voted to allow women to vote could see the welfare state, family court horror cases, and false rape scandals like Duke & Kavanaugh would they allow women to vote?

I'll support whoever has evidence.

What a stochastic shithead.

Why is a post about a potential rapist with no specification of gender posted in a subreddit dedicated specifically to men's rights?

The only thing here problematic is the “IMMEDIATELY” part; ya gotta examine facts

This is a major issue. The only response should be, what are the facts? Then think on them

The only time retards want to use math and statistics is to be as dumb as possible. We should ban people like this from math for life.

Or maybe show support for the supposed victim without condemning a potentially innocent man of being a rapist. It's easy to do two things once. Just don't be a dick. Not every story has a clear bad guy and good guy. For all we know, she was indeed raped but is accusing the wrong guy.

The chances are actually about the same.

I love how she said defending a " rapist" and not an "accused", these misandrist pigs have already made up their mind.

Its not about what you fuckinf think it at first, its about what you KNOW at the END.

It is called the Prosecutors Fallacy. It is a dangerous line of argument that can ruin innocent lives.

Going by statistics, most rape allegations don't end in conviction. The"statistical" decision would be to doubt the"victim".

Wtf has happened to basic principle of justice, presumption of innocence? I have seen at least 2 cases of false allegations in my life costing one person 2 years inprisonment and other his job.

So what is the source of this statistics, apart from someone’s ass?

What if the victim is male?

Can I play devil's advocate and say there is a difference between support and ruin a mans life. If someone comes forth and says I was raped, then yes we should support her and take it serious. If that is what this post meant then I agree with her, but if she means we should immediately convict someone then I dont agree. Its unfair to assume which she means in this post. In my opinion its guilty until proven innocent.

Yeah, you don't have to go all in right away. You can reserve judgement. We can support both accusers and the accused.

Also, even setting aside her fallacious "reasoning", she's basing it on propaganda rather than actual statistics or numbers. Feminists simply found the study with the lowest number of cases where accusations were proven to be false, and use that to sell the idea that therefore the rest of all cases must be 'true'. Nope. The vast overwhelming majority of cases are proven neither false nor true.

So not supporting the victim = defending the rapist? “Better ten guilty men go free than one innocent man be wrongly punished.”

Me too. Due process.

You shouldn't believe in women or men, you should believe in facts

Since when was up to 60% a very small risk.

I get it. No really I do. We built a society that said that men would gain social standing bestowed by women in return for providing for them so we had to give them social purity to make them capable of bestowing social standing.

​

But here's the problem. Women don't have social purity. We could pretend it in the past because we gave them limited rights. So their ability to cause harm was limited.

​

But now they have the same ability to cause harm as any man, and society is still pretending. It's like we're still small children projecting our mother's flawlessness onto all women, it's time to grow the fuck up.

I have three issues with her position

1. Yes only 2-8% of rape accusations are provably false. But 35-40% are provably true. That means that roughly 60% of accusations are NOT provably true. Now this is not to say that the majority of accusations are undoubtedly false. But it is to say that the veracity of most accusations are questionable.

2. The typical process by which we establish guilt in modern nations is through investigations and legal trials. We don't establish guilt based on probability because even if you have a 99 to 1 chance of a truthful accusation, you don't know when the 1 out of 99 will occur.

3. A criminal going free is a miscarriage of justice. But an innocent person being punished is a travesty. She seems to not understand this. In criminal law, this is based on a concept called Blackstone's Ratio. Which states that it is better to let 10 guilty persons go free than to jail one innocent person. The US Supreme court affirmed this sentiment by stating that it is better to let the crime of a guilty person go unpunished than to condemn the innocent. The only leaders to take the opposite approach were despots (Pol Pot being notable).

Statistically, the chances are closer to 50/50.

Even if it was 5/95, their "logic" still = guilty until proven innocent, which, of course, is completely abusive.

The right wa would be comforting the victim and waitning for evidence. If evidence supports victim, you support victim. If no, then support the accused. Done and done.

Anyone else kind of want to blame her on her own post of sexual assault. There is a statically small chance we are lying.

You gotta find out who the victim is first.

Google “% proven rape allegations”

— every google result is “FALSE rape allegations are extremely rare” (usually they cite 6 or even 1%)

Google rape conviction

— turns out only about “1% of rapes” (they don’t even bother writing “allegations”) end up with an arrest.

Now, I am not a savant of statistics, but something tells me that the numbers do not add up. And I’ve got a funny feeling that it has something to do with the lack of the word “proven” in the first search result. Call it a hunch.

Ok, if you did not catch those mental gymnastics:

All unproven rape allegations count as rape unless you have proof that the woman lied. Three cheers for STATISTICS and journalism

Or, OR, you could wait for all of the details to come out before you assign blame and pick sides.

Shouldnt we support the available evidence?

That's a nice false dilemma that shes presenting.

And false rape accusations actually aren't a statistical anomaly when put into context.

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2018/oct/7/false-sex-assault-reports-not-rare-reported-studie/

This mentality might have ruined Johnny Depp's career and possibly also his life. And this is a celebrity example of it, it happens way more often amongst other people as well. Immediately supporting the accuser is a very bad idea.

Yo what ever happened to innocent until proven guilty? That just disappear?

This may be one of the longer and more irritating ways of saying "I can't distinguish between real and false dichotomies!" that I've read this week.

I was raped by this woman... Oh wait I have a penis sorry I forgot I can't be raped, I got lucky.

It's easy being distant when we talk about numbers. People who believe in this stuff should imagine themselves in that situation. Falsely accusated, with somebody else that thinks you are guilty "because statics"

Statistics don't apply to individuals.

This is the same thing as saying that we should just assume all black people are guilty of any crime, no evidence needed, because black people have higher conviction rates...

Not supporting someone who is an accuser does NOT automatically mean you support the accused rapist. There is such a thing as not taking a side. Wise people who aren’t utterly reactionary are the kind of people who stop and carefully consider their actions BEFORE choosing a side. There is no reason to be a reactionary idiot who doesn’t listen to the details and just uses completely biased thinking to choose a side based on being a bigot.

It’s so funny how people who accuse others of racism and bigotry are the biggest hypocrites I’ve ever met. They are universally biased bigots and racists themselves, who are demanding everyone else feel EXACTLY the same as they do. You can tell someone is biased when they are insisting you HAVE to agree with them, and that you have no choice in deciding for yourself what to think.

If I fire a 7.62x51mm semi auto rifle out my window in a random direction with my eyes closed, I run a statistically very small risk of hitting someone.

You okay with that?

Or you could maybe just reserve judgment until all the facts are in.

Crazy idea, huh?

I was going to tweet back to her but she's hidden a lot of the comments someone doesn't like hearing others opinions.

I hate it when females play the pussy card

Whatcha want? Equallity or not, there are always 2 sides of the coin, you cant just coose one side without the other, sadly society allows exactly that....

Edit: I had to correct my german autocorrect

I dont think these people know how to use statistics

How about you immediately support the actual evidence coming from each party

Soooo. About Tara Reade

those statistics would be flipped around pretty soon in that case

False dichotomy.

The support the Victim, which in many cases means supporting a victim of false accusation.

We statistically ruined a economy over stats and models. Why not lives?

'Prefer' is not really statistical terminology.

So, is Joe Biden a rapist or a victim? #BelieveAllWomen

femeneo

And this is why I drink

How dare we ask for PROOF that a crime occured? I don't support either side immediately. I hear the story and then ask for supporting evidence from both sides. That's how things are supposed to work in America. Innocent until proven guilty, but that seems to get lot in translation when it's man's word versus a women's word. Cause we should just automatically believe her cause she's a her. That makes no sense. Salem Witch Trials.

And even when the females get caught lying, they rarely ever face consequences for their attempt at ruining a man's life. While even an unfounded accusation can ruin a career.

Or, you could, and bare me with me on this one- not take any side at all and wait until the facts are out???

Innocent

Insane person alert

Everything up until when she conflated lack of belief with disbelief was correct.

When somebody makes a claim, they have the burden of proof to demonstrate its validity, not the audience. Demonstrating a lack of belief in the face of little evidence is siding with the de-facto “innocent” not “not-guilty”. One also doesn’t have to side with the claim the moment it was produced by the accuser to desire it to be investigated fully.

That being said one should always handle serious accusations seriously.

Yeah, women like her that think that are honestly trash.

Objection your honor. Foundation.

How about we don't support anybody until after a thorough investigation uncovers the facts? Or is that too reasonable for the world in 2020?