It’s a problem.
Dating advice neglects one of the most attractive qualities a man can have. Charm. Charm goes against so many of the values pickup artists teach, because charm is a quality of agreeableness and even niceness.
Being challenging and creating sexual tension can work, but there’s an easier and more effective way to win women over. Learn to charm her, to make her feel good about herself. Women don’t care how cool you are, or how cocky your comedy is, they care about how you make them feel; and that’s exactly what a charmer focuses on.
Being charming isn’t exactly the same as being nice, charm goes further, charm is about more than just niceness, it’s about validation. And when combined with enough confidence, charm will make your personality addictive like a drug.
To be charming is to make people feel better about themselves for having met you. A woman who had dinner with the English politicians Benjamin Disraeli and William Gladstone captured the essence of charm when she said, “When I left the dining room after sitting next to Gladstone, I thought he was the cleverest man in England. But when I sat next to Disraeli I left feeling that I was the cleverest woman.”
We all have a divide between who we are and who we want to be, to be charmed is to be made to feel that you already are who you want to be. What could be more powerful than that?
The power of listening
We all make this mistake. And it kills any chance you have at being charming. You’re having a conversation with someone, they’re droning on about themselves, and you start thinking about what you’re going to say next. This is because you’ve lost interest in what they have to say and you’re turning your attention to something more compelling, yourself.
We all do it, and it’s completely natural to do this. But the rare person who turns this dynamic on its head will have a magnetic effect on everyone they interact with because it’s so rare to feel like someone actually cares about what you have to say.
It’s hard to market good listening, you’re never going to see a video product that teaches you how to ‘make her drip with desire using your listening skills’, but listening is one of the most powerful tools there is.
Bill Clinton’s a great example, he’s known for being extremely charismatic, and although he is a good public speaker, what people noticed most about him was how he gave them his undivided attention. Simply giving a woman your undivided attention and being genuinely interested in what she has to say will make you stand out from most other guys who are trying to show her how cool they are. Instead, make her feel like she’s interesting, show her that what she has to say matters to you, and she will be charmed.
What goes into good listening? First, make a point to make strong eye contact while someone else is talking, don’t look at your phone, don’t look at the surrounding area, make eye contact, this helps you to focus your attention on the other person and prevents your attention from flitting from thought to thought.
Second, develop patience. Our natural tendency is to think of the next thing we’re going to say while someone else is talking, we use their jabbering as an opportunity to set up our next interesting comment. If you kept track of how often you interrupt a person between sentences even though they’re not really done talking, you’d probably be surprised. Instead, make a habit of intentionally pausing for a moment before you speak. This forces you to develop patience, to learn to take your foot off the gas and take a moment to absorb what your conversational partner has to say. It will also make the women you interact with feel listened to, because they can tell you’re not just waiting for your turn to speak, you’re actually listening.
In conversation, take the mindset that you don’t matter, your whole goal in the conversation is to make the person you’re talking to feel good. When she finishes speaking, ask follow up questions, if you can’t think of anything, you can always use the classic, “Tell me more.” Don’t relate what they’re saying back to you, keep the focus of the conversation on what it means about them and their life.
Charm is more than listening skills though, it also means giving people the feedback they want to hear but haven’t been given. Tell a model-looking girl that she’s stunningly beautiful and she will be flattered, but tell her that you admire her intelligence or creativity, and that you want to know more of her ideas, and she will be charmed.
Validate women on what they aren’t confident about. Imagine how you would feel if a woman told you (in a non-sarcastic tone), “Wow, you have a really attractive personality, you have this animal magnetism. I bet you have to fight the girls off! How could possibly be single? You’re probably the most attractive guy in this whole club!”
Even if she wasn’t particularly attractive, you would feel amazing after hearing this feedback, and even though you might not want to sleep with her, you’d be a lot more likely to want to keep her around.
A very charming way to compliment a beautiful woman is to say something like, “You’re kinda funny looking, I bet you don’t get hit on a lot, but I bet when guys start to talk to you, they become really interested in you, and probably end up asking you out because you have such an intriguing personality.” (To be clear, if you say this to a woman who isn’t confident in her physical attractiveness, it won’t have the effect you want it to.) But if she is, she is being complimented on what she really cares about, who she is as a person, not what she looks like.
Imagine being a beautiful woman and every one seeing you as having value for something that was largely a genetic lottery, something you didn’t choose. It would feel somewhat dehumanizing at times, and you would put a lot of effort into showing the world that you have value to offer beyond your physical beauty.
Unfortunately, most men would focus on and give attention to you just for you beauty. But the rare man who dismisses your beauty, and is interested in your personality would have a powerful effect on you. They would be offering you something that you deserve, but rarely get; recognition as an interesting and unique human being, not just some kind of work of art to be gawked at.
To make your compliments doubly effective, paint a picture. For example, if I told you, “Wow, you’re really charismatic.” That would be validating certainly, but imagine if I said, “Wow, you’re really charismatic, you should consider public speaking as a career, I could definitely imagine you giving Ted Talks.” This would be far more powerful, when I tell you this you actually imagine yourself as a public speaker, it lets you fantasize about the picture I’ve painted.
You can create a scenario for most compliments, if she’s funny, tell her she could be a standup comedian. If she’s passionate about something and hard-working, tell her she should start a company. We all love to fantasize, use this human tendency to make your compliments extremely charming.
If you want to develop your charm rapidly, make a point to give a genuine compliment in every interaction you have. It doesn’t have to be good, the point is to start focusing on what makes people you meet interesting and unique. This positive focus will help you to break the habit of thinking about yourself while interacting with someone else.
Perhaps more than anyone I know, I’ve put effort into being more confident, charismatic, and interesting. And this effort is reflective of why charm is so powerful. Why did I want to be more confident and charismatic? So, people would notice and react positively to me, so I would feel validated.
Everyone wants to be liked, to feel appreciated, and they go to great lengths to get this validation, the charmer knows this, and they’re wise enough to reverse this dynamic and focus on making other people feel good about themselves. You want people to like you more? Make people feel charismatic and intriguing, no one but yourself really cares about how charismatic you are, but they definitely care about how charismatic they are.
For a dating advice book that doesn't suck, check out: https://www.amazon.com/Master-Game-Practical-Abundant-Dating-ebook/dp/B06XV14VDN
Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDyD-S-52EnbphdlvB8VUUQ
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Aghayden 6y ago
Thanks man, I appreciate it.
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Aghayden 6y ago
Haha, clever- didn't see that coming!
DatingCoach111 7y ago
It's not gay if you don't make eye contact.
[deleted] 7y ago
Do you have any tips on visualization? I'm currently reading The Charisma Myth and the author says using a visualization technique can put you into a charismatic state. I'm having a bit trouble with it.
max_peenor 7y ago
This post about charm is not gay enough. Maybe Matty can help out.
TheSingularity01 7y ago
Great thread with lots of depth
talkloudsaynothing 7y ago
Hi Avery, I just read the sample of your book and decided to buy the book. I am excited to go through it and see what I learn from it. I'll be sure to stop by your YouTube channel as well. Thanks! :)
meh613 7y ago
Very much bluepill, giving compliments doesn't work, being nice doesn't work. Downvoted...
Aghayden 7y ago
To me, bluepill thinking is oversimplified thinking that can't appreciate nuance and paradox. Compliments can work, so can teasing and lack of investment, they can coexist.
meh613 7y ago
In theory they can, practice proves different. You sound like one of those keyboard jockeys whose only experience of sex is with your own hand. Read the sidebar.
Z33ger 7y ago
Heads up these walk through s are misguiding for noobs don't become one of those mofos that constantly relies on suplicating it doesn't work sometimes you need to just keep it real and be a douche
I've said it before and I'll say it again the best way to improve social skills is by talking to people and not worrying about some magic formula
Z33ger 7y ago
In addition women see through that glib shit like X-ray vision they want to get hammered by a chad not complimented by some pseudo Machiavellian
CumForJesus 7y ago
What would you say about someone getting an art degree ?
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yomo86 7y ago
Charm works only if it comes from a position of power. Never ever use charm as your approach tool if you don't have an established power base either social like pre-selection or a higher status job or economical like just oozing money.
mrgrigsad 7y ago
So your advice is good for becoming an orbiter then.
WolfofAnarchy 7y ago
You say you need to give them your undivided attention. Others on this sub said you need to kinda look at others now and then to make them work harder for your attention.
Which is it?
Maleden 7y ago
In this case, the attention is given supposing she is actively engaged with you.
rigbed 7y ago
If they're into you you can be aloof otherwise you need charm
RcskaSedd 7y ago
Charm works and women love it. Recently told a girl (who I was interested in) that she was honest and real person, I needed an opinion on something about myself. Ever since then she cant really take her eyes off of me.
[deleted] 7y ago
Charisma Myth and How to Win Friends and Influence People are relevant books.
I managed to go from a very quite introvert to an outgoing person by reading and understanding it and applying it(most important part).
I've done a lot of these things on women before. They reacted quite well.
One day I hope to take this to the next level and find a Charm Nuke that can progressively get a woman to reveal more about herself and feel good.
Good post, you should do more.
laere 7y ago
Time to start reading these books again. I have already incorporated a lot of the advice in these books, but every time I've re-read them I've always learned something I may have missed from the first read.
[deleted] 7y ago
Carnegie himself said that you would get the most out of his books by reading them over and over again
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thetimeenigma 7y ago
Charisma myth really helped change my life. I would totally recommend it. Not only helps you become more charismatic, but also how to not be uncharismatic. Teaches you great tools for dealing with stress.
whuttupfoo 7y ago
How to Win Friends and Influence people is a game changer. But don't make the mistake of using it in dating. Something as simple as complimenting a woman too much, for no reason, will backfire on you.
legedu 7y ago
Carnegie even says you shouldn't compliment too much, but a well timed sincere compliment is crucial. No one is above flattery. You just need to compliment what they care most about sincerely.
[deleted] 7y ago
Anyone reading my above post must keep this in mind.
It's easily overdone with women.
Many men use compliment as a way to get sex, which always fails.
Complimenting people in a platonic way is different to using it on women.
Women are like cats, if you give them too much attention they ignore you. If you ignore them they come to you. They call it pussy for a reason.
Thanks
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nsquared5 7y ago
Is it because you have high standards or you don't believe in the institution of complimenting?
waking-life 7y ago
I like to give stupid random compliments they have never heard before. An example is "damn girl, them are the hottest elbows I've ever seen" or "oooh turn around and show me the back of your knee again, you're turning me on". Their eyes will light up, they will laugh or they will playfully hit you. You gotta deliver it properly, though. Think Will Smith with the smirk and wink.
CanuckinFL 7y ago
compliment in bed. Simple. Learned the hard way to never ever really compliment much otherwise. Only validation gets given when I see behaviors I like. It conditions. This is important.
Aghayden 7y ago
Start with something small and innocuous like, "I like your style, very cool." Then build up to better compliments.
Anyway, you're not fucked, you don't have to be charming to get laid, it's just one effective route. If complimenting isn't your thing showing a lot of intent and being challenging can work as well, but you'll have to lead harder than if you're charming.
whuttupfoo 7y ago
That's a good, non-investing compliment. But as soon as you focus on making compliments too much that's when you mess up. Make it seem nonchalant and use it sparingly.
Mckallidon 7y ago
Lift. Jerknoff a lot less. Have female friends. Give zero fucks.
Aghayden 7y ago
How's that working out for you buddy?
Mckallidon 7y ago
Idk. In b4 the retards lol.
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Aghayden 7y ago
Charm isn't about impressing them, it's about making them feel good about themselves. And I know lots of people who have trouble with being funny or charming lol.
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Terdmuffin 7y ago
Charm isn't just about them liking you, it's about them wanting you to like them. If you're charming they don't just think "I like gay4pancakes" I think "I like gay4oancakes and I wish he liked me too". It's not that they want to join your club because they can't, it's because you make your club seem awesome so they want to join.
Aghayden 7y ago
Learn to have both, it's not black and white.
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Aghayden 7y ago
Yes, so can black-and-white overly simplistic thinking. Charm doesn't exist in a vacuum, you can be charming while still having mystique or being challenging, etc. Just like you can post poorly thought out comments without really thinking, but still be an intelligent human being in other areas of your life.
Purecorrupt 7y ago
The charming + mystique thing can work.
Whether right or wrong I learned to be charming not to make the other person feel good, but moreso from noticing people's "I don't care anymore" body language. They nod off, look away or disinterested, forget what you just said, interrupt you, etc. After a while you learn to speak sparingly and not ramble unless you're telling a story.
I've had friends tell me I was "a hype man" since I could get people to do things. I apply the same "hype" you can do it mentality to new people, but I don't talk about myself. Or if I do I sarcastically lie and they don't ever actually know anything about me. It's not worth my time to be serious with someone I have no investment in. If they truly want to know they will ask until they pull it out of me.
Just like a presentation you tell them the summary and then move on. If they want to know more information they will ask. People will fall asleep if you drag on.
ronaIdreagan 7y ago
Love how you even uses the backhand but genuine compliment towards him and it works ahahahaha
[deleted] 7y ago
Just putting together a tool box, what might work on one woman may not work on another.
I'd like to keep charm in my kit in case I need to use it, rather than hammer away at everything.