What's up, guys. I mostly frequent /r/asktrp, but there's something I thought might be better suited to the wider audience here.
Lately, I've seen quite a few posts about how to maintain a LTR, and how to strike the "alpha/beta balance." Most recently, however, a poor guy posted about how his perfect relationship of 2 years has fallen apart, and he can't understand why. As you might imagine, he's done quite a few things wrong, but I wanted to address a specific part of his mindset:
[W]e're one of those couples who other people think are "perfect for each other, ideally paired", we almost never argue, we're both very rational and both of us discuss things instead of feeling aggravated or offended; we discuss jealousy or whatever may rise. We have been on a beautiful, learning and loving process, where we both scream and declare our love to each other constantly, having no bad experiences, ill feelings or degrading us. Also, we are sexually perfect for each other, both in libido and in practice, never have we used sex as a tool for anything.
Problem is...Tuesday she just told me she wants to break up.
Quite clearly, this guy believes that never arguing, being rational, and "discussing things instead of feeling aggravated" are all good things which speak to the strength of the relationship. The opposite is the case. The only powerful emotion mentioned here is love. And, in fact, the only emotion present in this guy's relationship was love. No lust. No jealousy. No passion. Indeed, when another emotion did surface (jealousy was given as an example) this guy and his girlfriend discussed it rationally, a sure way to kill the interest there.
Emotions, in and of themselves, are neither good nor bad -- but they are interesting. A relationship without a diversity of emotion is a boring relationship. Tell me, which sounds more intriguing to you: Love or Anger? Love is steady, stable, predictable. Anger is wild, unstable. Anger is unpredictable. Anger is passionate. Elsewhere, people have spoken about the importance of the emotional rollercoaster, about taking a woman through the full range of emotions, positive and negative. Well, that responsibility doesn't end with an LTR.
Women want to be swept along in your emotion. The "man on a mission" thing isn't attractive because women give a shit about your mission, it's attractive because women can see your passion for something. Above all, a woman wants to be intrigued by you, and that passion, stemming from strong emotion, is what will generate the interest she craves.
Anger is a strong emotion. Jealousy is a strong emotion. Both are vital for maintaining interest in a long, healthy relationship. Obviously you don't want to be getting in fights every day, or even every week. But if you're looking for a LTR, learn from the post I originally quoted, and don't be so quick to shut down "negative" emotions. After all, hate isn't the opposite of love; indifference is.
So, be unapologetic, especially if it means that you're being stubborn or unreasonable. You fucked up, and she's pissed? Too bad.
Let her be mad at you.
cocaine_face 10y ago
I've found that pissing off a woman is one of the surest ways to her heart.
Sleep-less 10y ago
My latest one night stand told me she hated me constantly throughout the night I pulled her, igoring several other guys that just wanted to give the world to her.
I could see she was trying to string me along like she was stringing them along, so I laughed at her and told her I had her all figured out and walked away.
She couldn't take her eyes off me for an hour. Eventually, as I went to the juke box she pulled me towards the pool table with the balls all set up for a game and begged for 10 minutes of my time to explain what I meant.
I did a quick cold read on her without even making eye contact while I sank the first 3 balls and by the time I looked up at her she had tears down her face.
"You haven't got me figured out at all" "yes I have" at which point I picked up the black and dropped it down a pocket.
"You can't do that!" "I just did". And walked off for a cig.
Came back, finished my drink and left heading back to my hotel. I turned two corners and I shit you not she followed me "to tell me how much of an arse hole I was".
She fucked me everyday for the remaining week I was there.
Never underestimate the power of upsetting a woman you are trying to pull. Women need to be taken on a rollercoaster of emotions, and they will always flock toward a guy who has them figured out because "I needed you to see I was deeper than you thought I was".
Cold reads tend to work best on recovering fatties (you can spot these by their loose tops and skinny jeans, the top half takes alot longer to firm up than the legs do so they hide the chub they have left on their stomach) and substance abusers (recovering drug users etc). Wear a rubber or preferably say no to the latter kind. Fuck knows what they have or of they have used needles.
Recovering fatties also don't tend to know what to do with their new found attention, so even though she has a few orbiters, she will be very socially clumsy and appear shy.
Push-pull techniques shine on the occasion you find one that's new to the attention. (The way I took the time to cold read her but cut the conversation short by putting the black down a pocket)
She told me she hated me every chance she got up until the moment I left her.
They just eat that hanniblector cold read shit up. Happy black Knighting!
[deleted]
feelinglazy 10y ago
How does she know that you know that she used to be fat?
[deleted]
livingtribunal99 10y ago
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FI4BrXPMeZo
Scarface dance scene
Glenbert 10y ago
Better than just arbitrarily pissing her off is to set an idiosyncratic standard (that you don't really care about) and make her stick to it, no matter what. E.g. absolutely no dirty laundry on the floor, ever. Deep down I don't give a shit, but I make her believe I do and I give her shit when she doesn't comply. It makes for drama that's low-investment on my end but also productive. It's idiosyncratic, but not totally crazy... and it works.
Sleep-less 10y ago
A favourite rule of mine is no clothes or underwear in the bedroom. Not just the bed, the bedroom, so everynow and then when I catch her in there folding clothes or whatever Il playfully pin her down and strip her naked.
When she playfully protests I just say, you know the rules.
Makes for great foreplay and is fun all round. Never fails to fire her up ;).
Glenbert 10y ago
God, that's brilliant. Have to try it out myself!
Sleep-less 10y ago
It works wonders to be fair. And also make a point of making her get naked before she gets into bed, strip her if you have to. Constant skin to skin contact is great for developing a bind in a LTR, and will do you both a world of good.
Trellink 10y ago
Hell yes to this. Works best when you actually do not care about the matter in question, because then you can remind her of it in an absolute stone-cold fashion. Draw the line for the sake of drawing a line. As long as you don't get huffy and puffy about it, it's a little dash of emotional Tabasco.
the10thrider 10y ago
Most valuable lesson I learned in art school:
Perfection is perfectly boring.
Life is just better on the edge. It gives the soul something to look forward to, something to adjust to, adventure. Without imperfection we'd just be left with boring art.
[deleted] 10y ago
Be yourself.
You don't want to see that movie she wants to see? Say no
Very good post; that quote isn't seen around here nearly enough as it should be
Trellink 10y ago
Thanks for bringing that to the fore. Yeah, poor sucker's demonstrating the folly of attempting to provide "passion security". Doesn't exist.
As Heartiste puts it: "Woe be the man who plays it straight — his fate is the suffering of the beta. Evade, tease, obfuscate. She thrives when she has to imagine what you’re thinking about her, and withers when she knows exactly how you feel. A woman may want financial and family security, but she does not want passion security."
Guy blanded out whatever she was feeling for him in the first place. This is why LTR is TRP hard-mode.
asdfghjkltyu 10y ago
I'm convinced its difficult if not impossible to practice proper TRP principles in a LTR. They conflict with everything we teach, such as distancing yourself from caring, punishment with withdrawal of attention, a lack of reliance on others and treating yourself as a prize.
Relationships confer dependance, almost require emotional discussions and force you to live with someone long enough that even the strongest men will show weakness in response to the almost constant barrage of shit tests.
I actually almost prefer to cut relationships off when their still in their first few month 'dating' stage before any real commitment is required. Atleast both parties leave the situation with lust and respect.
Trellink 10y ago
LTRs are difficult, yes. But not impossible. Now, two LTRs--wife and mistress--that's master-class hard mode, and incredibly difficult for all the reasons you enumerate. Takes a daily deep soaking in TRP truth.
Swagzor 10y ago
This remembers me about that pickup guide from 4chan. "girls want to be in an emotional roller coaster". I see the same thing with my LTR. If its all too happy, my gf thinks everything we do is boring and sex will slowly dry down with less passion. A fight or disagreement now and then is healthy for the relationship.
RBuddDwyer 10y ago
Here it is, although if you Google around a bit you'll see it has been around on various men's forums before 4chan. TRP talked about it here.
Mister_JR 10y ago
Couple of things:
When dealing with women, remember their default setting is 'Max Drama' - they thrive on it.
and
If you are in a relationship with one, be prepared for a constant battle within yourself to maintain frame and to not let your guard down ever.
When faced with the prospect of having to always be on your toes and gauge your responses, you'll probably see that they aren't worth the effort - especially if you are older and the lower T levels move your brain back above your waist and up to the head on your shoulders.
newlifeasredpill 10y ago
Ephesians 4: 26
"In your anger do not sin. Do not let the sun go down while you are still angry."
Or the cliche...dont go to bed angry.
This is total bullshit and OP nails it. Let her be angry. NOT caring about her emotional rollercoaster is exactly how to display higher value.
All my beta friends are scared to death to get in an argument with their wife. I say bullshit. Embrace her anger. Its foreplay for the makeup sex
[deleted] 10y ago
"foreplay for the makeup sex"
+1
[deleted]
CDBaller 10y ago
You're misinterpreting the verse. It says nothing about "Do not be angry, for anger is a sin" or "Apologize when it's not your fault, just for the sake of peace". The verse is meant to be taken as something more akin to "Don't let your anger drive you to do something idiotic" or "Make decisions with a clear head" and "Don't let anger brood and get in the way of a relationship". The Bible does recognize that there is such a thing as righteous anger and that there are legitimate things to be angry about. If Christianity did not permit anger or even emotion, I would not be one.
newlifeasredpill 10y ago
No interest in debating the bible. Ever. At all.
Point was to agree with OP. Many men are afraid to be angry with their women and they think its helpful to the LTR
It isn't
CDBaller 10y ago
then don't post shit from the Bible that you don't know anything about.
[deleted]
[deleted]
[deleted] 10y ago
[deleted]
CDBaller 10y ago
I misunderstood nothing. He posted a verse from the Bible to prove a point when the verse didn't mean what he thought it meant. If he doesn't want to debate the Bible, he should refrain from posting Bible verses and calling them bullshit.
newlifeasredpill 10y ago
You are misinterpreting more than a verse from the bible. This entire post is about allowing yourself to be angry at a woman. Take her off pedestal. Treat her like anyone else.
This gives her emotions.
You saw a bible quote and wanted to "study" it.
CDBaller 10y ago
I was correcting you, as you misquoted the Bible in support of your post. Again, don't post things you are ignorant about and then say you "don't want to debate it" when you're called out on your bullshit.
newlifeasredpill 10y ago
Whose to say this verse is incorrect support of the post ? You? I also never called the bible or the verse itself bullshit. I said that its good for a man to show his anger and maintain dominance over a woman.
Since you reallllllly want to make this about the bible...and I sure want to talk about TRP....will you forgive me?
CDBaller 10y ago
Sure looks like it's about the Bible to me.
CyricYourGod 10y ago
You cannot quote something and claim interpretation that is absolutely wrong. We can break down the meaning of the verse using what is known as literary analysis. I understand for some people words are big and diff-i-cult but you can use a dictionary if you're unable to understand the meaning of the words written.
Let me give you a clue about TRP: being an ignoramus is not conducive to being respected with your peers which in turn makes you low value among women.
[deleted]
[deleted]
[deleted]
rebuildingMyself 10y ago
Nothing turns on a woman more than her man when he stands up to her shit (bitching and moaning back to her isn't what I mean).
Padre55 10y ago
Exactly, she probably won;t fondly recall the flowers and chocolates BS, what she will remember is the times you pissed her off. This is where the saying "women never forget" comes into play. She will never forget because she LIKES to feel angry at times.
Pity the poor fool who follows the Disney butterflies and unicorns meme
eccentricrealist 10y ago
I think a woman will hamster "real passion" in a relationship if she sees it like between Bardem and Penelope Cruz in Vicky Christina Barcelona. Lots of sex, lots of fighting, lots of "passion".
[deleted] 10y ago
I get it but I'd rather be single than ever get into an argument in an LTR again. The absolute worst thing? Anyone hears you arguing will side with her and taken to the extreme you can get a DV charge. Where I'm at there's a zero tolerance policy. Meaning if the neighbours hear yelling and call the cops, not uncommon btw, there is a mandatory charge policy in effect. Shit can get real, real quick. Men arent allowed to have balls around women.
[deleted]
Trellink 10y ago
Those sort of laws are unsettling; a fucking chilling effect. But I'm in the habit of expressing my anger without raising my voice at all. Nothing wakes her up more than the ring of cold steel in your voice.
I don't suppress a woman's anger, because she wants the FEELS (for them, getting angry and being passionate are often the same thing). But it's good to make clear that a woman's anger and a man's anger are on entirely different levels. Cold steel.
newlifeasredpill 10y ago
Cold steel is a great analogy. Sometimes I have to withdraw affection and cold steel will be in my mind when I am speaking
AFPJ 10y ago
A life of FWBs / Flings is better than LTR unless you live in a place that fosters quality women along with a cultural climate conducive towards men who can do so keeping them in check. Sleep around, move away or accept it.
Kill_Your_Ego 10y ago
Plate spinning is really the only answer. I can't even imagine meeting a woman of high enough quality in America to be worth elevating to even girlfriend status. They are all plates. Hell half of them know that they are plates and actively participate in it. They aren't as happy as they could be and neither am I but there just isn't any other option. Spin up them plates.
AFPJ 10y ago
Ehh this is a bit extreme, marriage isn't an option but having "LTRs" without assuming exclusivity is my go-to.
Kill_Your_Ego 10y ago
An LTR without assuming exclusivity is just spinning a plate.
AFPJ 10y ago
There's no such thing as spinning "a" plate - 2 or none is spinning plates. Fucking whoever I want but mostly seeing one girl is an open relationship. This distinction is important to recognize because everyone already knows a woman's word and "commitment" are without ground or value and the facade thereof exists merely to secure (her) provision.
Explicitly recognizing this is key for a satisfying LTR in the U.S. because provision is a low value commodity here.
Kill_Your_Ego 10y ago
Spinning plates is just the terminology I learned. Your open relationship is my spinning plates. Your "dating" is me spinning plates. Fucking whoever you want is me spinning plates.
I do enjoy my time with these women. My lovers. I just can't imagine letting one of them rise to "girlfriend" status anymore. They are all such low value...
Now I can see through women's lies. Watch their actions. Don't watch their words. And fuck them and have fun with them anyway. They are all that is left for us. Spin some plates. I'm spinning one up to go on a four day camping trip with me in a few months. Spinning four up so I can make sure one will go with me. If I game them right I can pick from a few.
Edit- I agree with you. I just call it plate spinning. We are doing the same thing and I fully agree with you.
AFPJ 10y ago
We're indeed furiously agreeing , only thing I have to add is you can feel free to let them think they're GF.
Title makes no difference in the operational innards of a relationship
Antibuddy 10y ago
I like the main idea but not the explanation. I arrived at the same conclusion long ago, but here are my thoughts on it.
For any given issue, a woman is ready to get off it and move onto the next thing that's interesting. After all, a woman is a hedonist. So when you fuck up and she gets mad at you, your dwelling on it only makes you spend more time on the issue and will magnify her negative feelings about it. Fucking up in the workplace has a proven formula for remediation: apologize, take responsibility, show what steps you'll take to prevent it from happening again. Done. Don't do this with women! It only makes you look worse in her eyes and, again, keeps the focus on you and how you fucked up.
I just saw this happen today at the airport. Rental car agency. A couple was there and she was giving him some "I-told-you-so's" and saying how he has Alzheimer's or something (insulting; he was young) because of some issue that was clearly the car agency's fault. Apparently, she had some concerns about it early, so she was letting him have it and he was within her frame the entire time. "Yes, you were right, should have done that," etc. And when she went to insult him, he was trying to save face by laughing it off, but wasn't doing a good job. Cringey.
Unless it's a huge mistake with really big repercussions, just shrug it off. She'll forget about it once you give her some shiny thing to play with. Dwelling on it only makes it more of a memory.
brotherjustincrowe 10y ago
I think this "alpha/beta balance" thing is a crock. You're either one or the other. An alpha can provide in a LTR scenario just as a beta can get laid every once in a while, but just because you can get a dog to go "quack" doesn't make it a duck.
waylandertheslayer 10y ago
Alpha and beta are traits, not names for types of people. Most people have a mixture of traits - pure betas would probably not last a day in the real world, while pure alphas would go to jail.
Even Dark Triad types are not pure alpha, although they're closer than even the average Red Pill guy.
BlackHeart89 10y ago
Another reason I rather avoid LTRs. Too much energy required on bullshit.
You either better be exciting or having some relationship problems to keep an LTR working.
rolfraikou 10y ago
When she's mad, the sex is usually moderate. Hashtag bitches.