This is a true story about a gentle, funny man who I know personally, and not some third-party sob story I heard or read about. None of the facts are exaggerated for effect. We’ll call him Ray. Ray is 10 years past retirement age (in a public job with an unusually generous pension package). He has elected to instead work all these extra years so that his family can live more comfortably. He is an adaptable fella at his age (and I jest he is better with a smart phone than me). This old man has figured out how to apply a different ring tone for his wife, kids, and boss! Ray has been married for over thirty years and has two children. Both children graduated college with familial support and married. Both couples are homeowners with their spouses. Last month, Ray’s wife told him she wanted a divorce. She had a lawyer before she told him she wanted out. She waited at the bank during his last payday to cash out all funds from their joint checking the moment they were direct deposited, while he was at work. Now, he has no liquid assets whatsoever, as all their accounts were joint. He opened his very first personal checking account in over three decades this month. With tears in his eyes, he told me, “All she might have had to do was wait until September, because that’s how long my dad made it.” Regular church-going people.
There is no cure, sadly. Today I was thinking of that story and of my own. I thought to myself:
What have I really lost by losing all faith that someone would love me unconditionally until my end? Since it was a confidence trick from the start, I’ve lost nothing but gained my freedom. Losing faith is like overcoming a drug addiction. The trick that keeps you a slave is the illusion that there was something to be gained to begin with. That the drug (unconditional love) made you happy. In reality, it only tricked you into being miserable without it.
The_Ralph 8y ago
There is a cure. Two that come to my mind, actually.
Get a foreign woman. Foreign born or of mixed nationality (and by that I mean raised in a household in the States in which she was raised to act like a woman)
Thethrowawayoption 8y ago
Something from another place that this sub might appreciate:
Litany of Gendlin
—Eugene Gendlin
Whisper 8y ago
♂
You get it. All women are like that. They can only love you if they need you. If they ever have power over you, it's all over.
fluviant 8y ago
I cannot fathom how a "Redpill Vanguard" would have a response like this.
Are you kidding me? You expect me to sing kumbahyah and play paddycake over the tragic ending to the story of an aged beta?
This is not exceptional, this is not skillful, this is not any type of commendable.
This is whining about how a woman jilted a man she perceived as lower value than her. Same shit, different day.
Grab your fucking nutsack and become a better man. I'm directing this at you, /u/Whisper, for promoting such garbage. Enough whining.
[deleted] 8y ago
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Saiserit 8y ago
Ray had planned on finally retiring this year. Before all this happened I overheard him second-guessing with concern whether she'd get enough of his pension to pay for any further needs she might have when he died.
malariasucks 8y ago
in California the woman could wait 25 years and as long as she is not divorced, she could go back and get part of the retirement. you couldn't even make this shit up
makethemsayayy 8y ago
I don't understand how they allow that. Like fuck you're already old, your life's mostly over. Fuck it let her fall on some knives.
malariasucks 8y ago
yep basically my step dad got divorced in the 80s, and they moved back in together, thinking there was common law marriage, which there isn't in California. in the mid 2000s she hired a lawyer and now his union will be deducting part of his salary when he retires....
He left the marriage with nothing. Gave her the house which she sold for $120,000 plus a little bit of alimony. This was in 2000 and 5 years later she came back... oh they weren't married in 2000 either, their divorce was final in... 1989.
now my mom and him have to sacrifice for this evil bitch
makethemsayayy 8y ago
Why doesn't this ever work for the man? Is it because literally no women will marry down?
malariasucks 8y ago
who knows. money and power I guess
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NeoreactionSafe 8y ago
Marriage 1.0 was never like this.
In the old marriage if a woman wanted to leave she packed her bags and walked away. The man got the house, the kids and the assets.
Why men trust Marriage 2.0 is beyond my understanding.
Hopefully Red Pill can at least teach the difference between 1.0 and 2.0.
No man should marry with this Marriage 2.0 contract... ever.
ComradeCynic 8y ago
Ray might well be old enough, that he WAS married in the Marriage v1.0 days.
And the government forcibly rewrote his contract via the legal system - if you look at it in a strictly legal sense, those changes represented both an "ex post facto law" that retroactively modified the contract he signed; and, it was a "bill of attainder" as well.
Both are un-Constitutional in the US (I am making the assumption, that the post author and Ray are both in the USA).
pinakion 8y ago
You touched on an important point that just can't be reiterated enough.
When you sign a marriage contract, you have no idea what its terms really are. They can be altered and modified at any future date by the legislators and the courts. You literally have no idea what you are signing yourself into. No sane person should ever enter into such an agreement.
Incidentally, this also applies to women. It so happens that nowadays the terms of the marriage contract have been shifted dramatically in favor of women and to the detriment of men; but nothing stops future legislators from switching it around and making marriage a raw deal for women instead.
Sir_Shitlord_focker 8y ago
Well... females are more numerous than men, also white knights vote with them... it might take a total social collapse to go back now.
Movonnow 8y ago
You seems to be very knowledgeable about that topic, care to write a post about it? A lot of people will not see what you wrote here.
mercuryg 8y ago
This is the main reason i'll never marry, because some legislators can change the contract with my signature still on it, which is fucking ludicrous.
I live in a hyper feminized european country with reasonable child support laws and hardly existing alimony, it's still stupid to marry and have children but it's not flat out retarded like it is in the US. But this is for the time being, they have changed marriage laws in this country before and i won't be surprised if they do it again and we end up just like 'muricah.
A friend of mine just got engaged, he's 22, is the biggest Nice Guy i ever met and the girl is slightly out of his league so i can't say i'm surprised. At social gatherings there are congratulations and well wishes all around, but even though i feel fucking sad for him, i smile and say "happy for you" like everyone else.
InaV8 8y ago
What country? Indeed, in the U.S. even prenuptial agreements can be thrown away like they are nothing if the court feels like it.
NeoreactionSafe 8y ago
Marriage 1.0 really ended in the 1960's, but it had already been in decline since 1910 or so when women entered the popular democracy.
Women and low status (poor) men should never have been allowed the vote and those mistakes mean democracy cannot function properly.
DarthRoach 8y ago
Ancient Greeks predicted this shit. Voting is fine so long as it's just the best and brightest doing it. As soon as the masses get in on it, it becomes a farcical system where the whims of the mob dictate everything, while those most corrupt and selfish dictate said whims.
Movonnow 8y ago
When you think about it, democracy is a joke. I mean, with television and brain washing, all the idiots out there can be persuaded to do whatever some one else wants them to do so that they will vote for them. It's like they have no free will, it's the battle of the one who will be able to manipulate them most effectively.
Thank God there are men who thinks a little about everything they see and hear. But most men falls into the easily influenced category which makes me doubt the utility of democracy. I'm all for democracy but under those conditions is ours a real one?
cariboo_j 8y ago
So if TRP believes that All Women Are Like THIS...
What self respecting man in his right mind would marry or even fall in love with a woman?
I know we make a big deal about marriage 1.0 and 2.0. Supposedly this type of thing didn't happen in marriage 1.0.
But I think intentionality is important. Say you are in a room with a snarling pitbull. It growls and lunges at you but it can't bite you because it is muzzled. Would you consider it your friend? Would you pretend it cares about you? That it wouldn't eat your face off the second that muzzle comes off? How pathetic and lonely do you have to be to pretend this pitbull is your friend?
In marriage 1.0 a woman couldn't stab you in the back and rob you blind after 30 years of being a faithful husband. So what? Marriage 2.0 has shown us women have no qualms about doing just that. Why would you spend 30 years pair bonding with a snarling pitbull?
Coming to Terms with Reality
NeoreactionSafe 8y ago
Do not accept the Marriage 2.0 contract ever.
Just don't marry... have kids, but no State contract.
Keep the government out of yor sex life as much as possible. (many things are beyond your control now)
bourbonhipster 8y ago
removing incentives and easy access to encourage women to be snarling pitbulls should be the goal. De-facto No-fault divorces allow whoever, whenever, to call off a relationship and create a 50/50 asset split of all post-marital asset gains. No incentive to keep a bored stagnant house-wife of 20 years with no income prospects or potential bound to their sworn mate when the law protects her 'right' to stake claim to half of everything.
tompanz 8y ago
You don't choose to fall in love. The chemicals in your brain make it happen. A lot of the time, that same love that you didn't ask for can cause you to believe your partner is perfect and that's what causes men to risk marriage in this day and age. Believing that love isn't real or that you can't be effected by it makes it even worse when you get blind sided by it. If you know what it is, and what it's symptoms are, it allows you to stop the problem at its source befire it makes you make stupid decisions.
DarthRoach 8y ago
I have had those symptoms a bunch of times, and realized that they're just my brain being horny and stupid even without being told that. Then again, I grew up reading about science passionately since I was 4 and never bought any of the "one true love" bullshit they keep selling us.
tompanz 8y ago
Oh yeah, separating the real emotion from the stupid cultural bullshit can be difficult. I swear , the number of women who believe in "soul mate" while being enslaved by their hypergamy is both hilarious and sad.
bluedrygrass 8y ago
Chemicals in our brains often also tells us to bash people's heads in. The ability to resist urges and feels is what made the society possible, and men different from animals. It is possible to remain rational and unfazed even while "in love".
tompanz 8y ago
This is true, but there is a large amount of people out there who believe love is real, and they just never look into it. These people are hit by it the worst when it happens. The first step to controlling your behavior is understanding it. Don't let the bullshit Hollywood version of love full you into thinking the real emotion doesn't exist. Lest you be unprepared when a random plate gets mentally elevated to god status in your mind by accident.
[deleted] 8y ago
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completelag 8y ago
That's what separates the Alpha and beta.
IVIaskerade 8y ago
You do not understand AWALT. Come back when you do.
cariboo_j 8y ago
If I understand correctly, AWALT is the idea that all women are capable of acting in the manner that OP described.
However things like marriage 1.0 and having a captain/first-mate dynamic will mitigate these tendencies.
To me, the fact these these tendencies are there at all makes me question the value having an LTR or any long term romantic involvement. Any feelings of love and mutual respect are an illusion; the product of you constantly jumping through hoops to keep her hypergamy and exploitative tendencies in check.
It's a Sisyphean battle with no end - constantly pushing a boulder up a hill that will come crashing down and squash you into a pancake the minute your foot slips.
IVIaskerade 8y ago
That these tendencies are there is a fantastic thing. They work against you if you're not good enough, but if you are they actually greatly increase the efficacy of your actions. AWALT applies to positive things as well.
AWALT is “all women are, to one degree or another, 'like that'." Think of a normal distribution curve and you're pretty close. Some women will be extreme, some will only display a bit, most fall somewhere in the middle. So whilst all women are capable of it, they are capable of different amounts.
You cannot ever eradicate these tendencies, so why would you try? Instead, surely it would be better to learn to harness them for useful ends?
To use your analogy, you enter the room with an unmuzzled pit bull, and stare it down. It might try to challenge your authority, but every time it does, you discipline it. Meanwhile, you care for it, and over time it becomes a faithful and loyal companion. There's a small chance it might revert to attacking you, and it will never stop contesting the leadership position because that's in its nature, but if you can handle it you will get a useful and loving companion.
Rather than try to make it not bite you, teach it to hunt and bring you game. Rather than teach it not to snarl, teach it to reserve snarling for situations that warrant it.
The captain/first mate dynamic is not a mitigating strategy, it's a natural heirarchy that occurs as a result of the aforementioned handling.
cariboo_j 8y ago
Thanks for the in depth response.
Aside from sex and reproduction, what use will a man gain?
I'm personally not terribly interested in reproduction, and sex can be gained from short term relationships. To further stretch the analogy, I don't think you're going to teach your LTR to do anything as useful for you as hunting game or attacking intruders. Cooking and laundry? I'm a bachelor and I do that shit myself, no problem.
Perhaps running a successful captain/first-mate dynamic will allow you to practice leadership skills that can be applied to other areas of life, but is it really necessary? It's possible to practice and cultivate these skills in other arenas.
This I think is the real problem. We measure our worth as human beings in terms of success in the mating game. If you are a good leader and hold frame, this benefits the woman. She gets an Alpha cock and feels all tingly. Why would you invest 20 or 30 years playing this role? Why not use that leadership and drive for say, intellectual pursuits or cultivating friendships? Or even spinning plates? Striving for greatness in the public sphere? Striving for greatness in your own eyes?
I really fail to see the benefit of being a good captain for the same woman for 30 years. If you say companionship... this is a dangerous road. It's coming dangerously close to gaining emotional validation from from someone who is volatile and self interested. In TRP's case we are not being betas and begging for validation from our women on bended knee... but we are getting validation from being good leaders which is a largely thankless role. TRP subscribes to Briffault's Law and maintains women don't feel debts or obligation for past service provided by their husbands.
Why not get validation from some other role?
Just because a hierarchy is natural, that does not mean we should follow it. There are plenty of mating hierarchies in the animal kingdom which are natural. For example female praying mantises and certain spiders will eat the male after sex. It serves to propagate the males genes but is detrimental to individual males. Obviously this is an extreme analogy, but you get my point. If we follow the human mating hierarchy simply because it is natural, are we not merely slaves to our instincts?
Women's hypergamy fuels male dominance hierarchy competition which advances the species. Some men achieve greatness while others fall into ruination. Women want to share in great men's success and will abandon men when they fail. If it weren't for sex and reproduction, we'd recognize that LTR's and marriage are a weight around our necks. I have no use for fair weather friends. I'd rather achieve greatness for myself. I don't want to share my success with someone who will "charm" (aka manipulate) me into sharing my success and but not help me get back up onto my feet when I fail. If that's the mating game, fine, it's nature there is no point in being angry. But as a rational man I can look at it and conclude I'm getting the short end of the stick; it may be fun to play on a superficial level but I don't see much point in investing 20 or 30 years of my life into it. Women as TRP describes them just don't seem to be a good investment for long term relationships, assuming I am past the anger phase.
sweetleef 8y ago
Your children, your siblings and parents, your friends, or your dog - maybe.
But don't expect it from a woman.
uglysweatercontest 8y ago
I spent seven years in the worst hell, convinced that that was what life and love was supposed be. The illusion of unconditional love is a hell of a drug.
IllimitableMan 8y ago
Fuck I've dealt with abandonment post-relationship, but I'm glad I've never visited that hell. Being intellectual, and having been hurt by a woman significantly before; I think the illusion/hope, it's loss, and then questioning the relationship between men and women in a depressed state of existential nihilistic cynical pessimism is worse than the pain of the loss itself.
If being dumped by "the love of your life" (at least up until that point) was Hiroshima, it wouldn't be the nuke that was the trouble, but the radiation that comes afterwards.
The harder you love, the harder you fall. Love is the drug with the worst comedown. And like all drugs, it rapes you financially. Bitch in OP has suspended empathy to secure her interests. Women are all too often insidious.
They say better to have loved and lost than never loved at all. I call bullshit. Sadly you need to get fucked up to truly realise any of this. And as fucked up as it sounds, the sooner you get fucked up, the better. Living half your life living a lie only makes it more painful, and robs you of even more potential to lead a happy, and cognisant life. It's very freeing to know everything a woman is capable of and sort of be outside it in the fact that you can simply drop her or outplay her. That no matter how you may allow yourself to fall for a woman's charms IT IS JUST CHARM YOU ARE INFATUATED WITH, there's nothing more to it than that.
Men are born blind, but women fuck us up until we question them, their nature, their motives, and then the larger world around us. Women are a stress test for men. Sink or swim my man, sink or swim.
WernerVonBRAAAAAWWWN 8y ago
Thank you for this, it really hits home for me. I'm going through the same painful process of cleansing myself from disillusions (and the hope that came with them) these past 10 months, after a terrible breakup.
Stythe 8y ago
I just had this happen to me last year at 28 years old. I had a mental breakdown due to cognitive dissonance about what love truly was. Having been raised by my single mother (divorced my dad, always complained about money, taught me suppress my needs because that's what she does) I grew up to believe family was everything even though mine set a terrible example. The reality is, as Mich as what I learned sucked, I can finally say I won't make the same mistakes my parents did. Its just that I never expected it to be for redpoll reasons, hahaha!
IllimitableMan 8y ago
Ouch. Happened to me when I was 19 and if I cast my memory back I can remember the pain. I think the older this happens to you, the more it hurts as you think you've lost more time you can never get back. Likewise the older you get, the more you expect from yourself.
Stythe 8y ago
Meh, better late than never. That relationship only lasted 9 months, so while I fell hard, I can't say it took up too much time. Besides, I've never felt the need to chase girls around so I have a very strong sense of pride about myself already, I just lacked information.
I spoke to my ex today too. We haven't really kept in touch since she went to rehab when we broke up. She apologized for everything, hinted at wanting to get back with me indirectly and said she would have sent me cheques in the mail to help with debt if she was working a full time job. Too bad she's not and she didn't. Actions speak louder than words. She did mention she was going skydiving, which means either she has an income or her mom and dad pay for her. Either way, helping me certainly isn't a priority. It was interesting to listen to her with a clear understanding of things though, I have to admit. In the past I would have been jealous when she told me about some friend she made who she watches anime and plays video games with. Now I pegged him as a beta, called it out and she laughed. I wouldn't be surprised if she slept with him mind you, especially since she felt the urge to mention "it's not romantic or anything" but I just don't care. The best part was being able to catch my outdated thoughts come up from time to time and laugh at them.
It's very refreshing to feel this free of uncertainty and so outcome independent. There's always another girl, but I only have one life and a lot to do in it, so, priorities.
blacwidonsfw 8y ago
I'm so glad I was broken in early. It's so easy to be blinded by pussy when you're ignorant and short sighted.
AlphaAccountant 8y ago
To expand on this, something I've been thinking of for a while is the idea that hotter women are typically "crazier" and shit test more because their male ancestors had better genetic material aka alpha traits to handle said craziness and shit tests. Sink or swim indeed.
Smitty6 8y ago
I wouldn't say love is the problem, it's the system that is the problem. Women know the system is to their advantage. So why wouldn't they have a alpha fucks / beta bucks strategy?
Think if the roles were reversed. What if men could fuck all the hot girls they wanted growing up and then could marry a rich hot girl and get her money if you weren't 100% satisfied? Many guys would not be opposed to this.
The problem is that men are blinded by the system and how it works. They are blind to women and their nature. Because they watched Disney movies when they were in their youth when their minds are sponges and are brainwashed.
I think if we were in a much more neutral field which feminism wanted to begin with then we would see a lot more unconditional love because there wouldn't be so much ego out there.
There wouldn't be much to gain by loving somebody other than just pure enjoyment of being around that person. No money grabs. Hypergamy would be an open field as far as everybody is concerned.
I think were headed in that direction because marriage 2.0 is going to fail and it already is in how many are refusing to get married these days. Men are starting to wake up to how lopsided the deal of marriage is. It will only be a matter of time.
johnnywahd 8y ago
"Women are a stress test for men."
To quote Ulysses Everett McGill "A woman is the most fiendish instrument of torture ever devised to bedevil the days of man."
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PipingHotSoup 8y ago
goddamn... I've been reading for a while but I think I just opened my eyes.
trowawayyada 8y ago
This shit happens all time, every where every day. Woman leave for what ever reason & men leave too for a younger upgrade. I went to a divorce support group during my split. Wow I thought it was going to be a small group, nope anywere from 15-20 people at each meeting.
The supporting members did it for free too. Pretty amazing folks voluntering their time. They did charge "workbook" fees if you wanted to join but it was very little.
It amazes me to do this day how many guys I've known or met that go back for round 2, 3 or 4.
busyalterego 8y ago
Step 0: Improve your career and make as good money as you can now while you're single. Save up as much $$$ as you can. Also, stay healthy with diet and exercise so you can live a long life.
Step 1: Spin plates until you're a bit older. 30's or 40's and well established financially.
Step 2: Marry a traditional young woman from outside of the West who is roughly half your age.
Step 3: Live in a traditional country, outside of the West. (This is why having good finances are so important.)
Step 4: Make her pregnant 3-6 times.
Step 5: She's so busy raising all these kids, divorce isn't even remotely an option. Meanwhile, as a formerly successful bachelor, you can afford to provide for your household.
Step 6: By the time all the kids are grown up, you're an old man. You will likely die before she can screw you. Hopefully you live to see a grandchild or two though!
Step 7: Keep separate fucking bank accounts anyway, the whole time, just in case!
Congratulations! You escaped the prison colony and managed to piss of feminists in every single way! No beta bucks for those whores, no marriage with them, minimal consumption in corrupt Western society, you're a global traveler, you bang a hot and much younger chick while both of you are at the top or your SMV, you have a stable family unit (feminists hate this the most), you avoid family court, you're surround with love, you get to behave exactly like a normal, traditional man, and you leave very little chance for your woman to ever fuck you over. Oh, and you will most likely live to see your children reach adulthood.
Saiserit 8y ago
But if it keeps on raining, levee's going to break. When the levee breaks I'll have no place to stay.
johnnywahd 8y ago
When you look at what women morph into as they age, the question becomes: Why would you want anything to do with a short-haired fat wrinkled troll, especially when it also comes with the usual negative (read: annoying) personality characteristics inherent in the female of the species? Why would you want to be legally bound to that? Not to mention there is no loyalty to be had. She will never be able to love you the way you want her too.
As you get older, the balance of power shifts and you will be able to sense it and use it to your advantage. If you take care of yourself, lift and stay in shape...and are single in your 30s and 40s? They'll be desperately seeking a man to take care of them once they've been introduced to their arch nemesis, The Wall. At that point you use them for the one thing they're good for and send them packing. Women in this age group aren't worth the hassle for more than one night of fun. One weekend at the most. They'll be single moms with kids from most likely two different guys. Knock out a piece and move on.
It sucks that the situation is the way it is. The only way to win is not to play the matrimonial game.
Movonnow 8y ago
You know about the myth of the lonely old man right?
Well, I would rather be a lonely old man than forced to live with a woman.
And that's when you take revenge on that bitch who were cruel to you during HER SMV peak.
"let's just be friends ;)" And then watch for her reaction. Man, I can not wait to reach that age.
johnnywahd 8y ago
"And that's when you take revenge on that bitch who were cruel to you during HER SMV peak. "let's just be friends ;)" And then watch for her reaction. Man, I can not wait to reach that age."
Sounds like you're possibly still in the anger stage. Back in my clueless nice guy beta days I would inevitably get the You're-a-really-nice-guy-but-let's-just-be-friends speech when I was lucky enough to stumble into a date. Think of it like this: Now you know women are attracted to certain personality traits and patterns of behavior, and if you were given the LJBF speech you were undoubtedly displaying personality traits and patterns of behavior opposed to what she needed to see to get the tingles going. It would be the same thing as if you went out on a date with a big girl. It would be forcing yourself to be physically attracted to her, wouldn't it? But being attracted to a hot body is just natural for us. Both scenarios just comprise the way things are.
Don't be cruel in the way you're describing. Channel that energy right now into more productive things. Lift and improve yourself to become the kind of man she wants. After you get to that point where your SMV is much higher than hers use her for sex and string her along. THAT is sweet revenge. But once you improve yourself and raise your SMV, her SMV will have no doubt fallen well below what it was when she LJBF'd you. Would you even want anything to do with her at that point?
Movonnow 8y ago
That is some great advice that I really need to follow. No point in staying in my room getting angry at the world and mental-masturbatung to revenge fantaisies.
Daisy_DukeNukem 8y ago
This is true, but at 70? What the fuck are you supposed to do? (except lawyer up)
At that age in Ray's situation, all I can think of is reporting wrongful seizure of joint assets (as they are not legally divorced yet) and using those funds to get their own divorce lawyer to duke it out. I wouldn't know what to do.
BrunoOh 8y ago
People in retirement homes have plenty of sex.
rp-disciple 8y ago
This is like the last frontier for spinning plates
suddenlytrp 8y ago
I'm delurking to reply to this. I'm new here. I'm 47 and feel like I just woke up to how beta I was after all this time. I've read a lot here and yet I'm still seeking answers and trying to learn. But your post spoke to me, and I appreciate that.
I struggle with the catch and release method to be honest. You are absolutely correct on women at this age, post-wall is the great equalizer. I just need to work on not getting caught up in their game.
johnnywahd 8y ago
Don't lurk so much...contribute after you've read enough sidebar and can relate a worthy story. And congrats on waking up. Better late than never of course. I was 40 when I discovered the Red Pill. It's a life changer for sure. Now I can play The Game instead of being played by The Game.
As far as Catch and Release goes I understand your point. I'd say most of us who discovered the RP have had to struggle with that very thing. It takes a while to undo a lifetime of conditioning. Back when you were still plugged in you saw examples of C&R going on and you just shrugged it off or didn't give it much thought or even let your inner BP White Knight get you thinking what a jerk guys like that are. Never mind you secretly envy them deep down and wish you could be that guy.
Knowledge is power. Now you know how the game works. Use it to your advantage. Don't have any moral qualms about it, after all, where has that gotten you so far? Nowhere but the friend zone at best. Nothing but frustration and probably even hatred and resentment in your mistaken BP understanding of the world. Make up for lost time my friend.
suddenlytrp 8y ago
Will do. So much reading to take in, not to mention a few books I now have as well.
I'm trying, but I still have a ways to go. I'm far along on changing the outer me, but not very far in changing the inner me if that makes sense.
Thanks for the advice, man.
johnnywahd 8y ago
"I'm trying, but I still have a ways to go. I'm far along on changing the outer me, but not very far in changing the inner me if that makes sense."
The inner part is the hardest to change. The more you repeat something to yourself the more it becomes your reality. It takes a while to undo a lifetime of negative thinking.
I'm still working on it and making good progress in both areas. Not where I want to be just yet but I am getting there. Getting the inner game sorted out feels like 80-90% of the battle.
The inner game has changed for the better and I do carry myself differently now. I do seem to get more female attention now. Problem is I generally want nothing to do with them. Too much self-created drama to deal with at their age. Life's too short to put up with their big bag of emotional needs. That and they've hit the wall.
suddenlytrp 8y ago
That's me right now in a nutshell. I've lost weight, hit the gym in a big way and changed my look and my confidence has soared back with it. Post-wall women are on the hunt BIG TIME, and I've had some failures because I didn't change the inner me. I've wobbled a bit on my recent escapades and made some mistakes and fallen for some shit tests. So my game just sucks at this point. Nowhere to go but up. And I'm so thankful I found this place and the advice here and recommended stuff as well.
trp_hamlet 8y ago
The most hard-hitting TRP maxim for me has always been "a woman will never love you in the way that you want to be loved."
boxofcookies101 8y ago
Lmao love is completely based off necessity. Just had a girl tell me how she's in love with a guy before she went back to my place to fuck. What she really meant was she found a guy she can use/need.
2comment 8y ago
Men love women. Women love children. Children love cats. Cats love nobody.
That's the way of the world. We grew up, hopefully with our mother's love. It's natural to want a little bit of that feeling back when we're older. But it's not to be; childish things need to be left behind. A women can provide motherly attention to her man, maybe for a few days even, before fatigue sets in. Just like a cat can sit in your lap and purr for half-an-hour max before it gets cranky and wants to bite your fucking hand off.
Unrealistic expectations is a stew to brew disappointment.
enteralterego 8y ago
actually - I like to believe it's like this :
Men love women, children and cats (or dogs. I love dogs).
Women love children and cats.
Children love cats.
Cats love nobody.
Dogs love everybody.
SleepNowMyThrowaway 8y ago
... and nobody loves weak men.
Now the circle is complete.
moiez326 8y ago
Dat mother's love mannn. No woman can compare.
I-Am-Dickish 8y ago
Honestly, want to practice how to act around women? Get a cat. They are just as fickle and are attracted to the same personality. Disclaimer, some cats are dogs in a cat's body.
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reigorius 8y ago
How about kids instead of cats?
I-Am-Dickish 8y ago
Kids are a bit harder to obtain, but I know a guy.
reigorius 8y ago
Truth to be told, I teach kids from 7 to whatever to climb safely. And being the consistent, stern and masculine teacher that I had to learn to be to make the teaching work, makes me, AFC for sure, realize a lot of the RP has merit.
bluedrygrass 8y ago
Except that most women don't really love their childrens. I dunno where that poetic myth comes from, probably has the same origin of romantic love and all the rest, but all you have to do is to think at your mother's actions toward you, without pink filters.
All the times she used psychological tricks on you. All the times she lied to you and clearly didn't even care about it. All the times she slapped you or pulled your hairs when really there was no reason to act that way.
All the times she said "no" just because she could. All the times she reflected her failures on you, and made you feel bad just for her to feel better.
And if you have been lucky, think about your friends' mothers.
Problem is, too many people simply don't want to admit to themself that their mothers and sisters are exactly the same egocentrical sluts as the ones everywhere else in the world.
Awalt, but not in your family? That's a big hamster, spinning full throttle.
phungus420 8y ago
Not understanding that women love their children is basically discounting evolutionary biology... We are mammals, a female mammal's love for it's offspring is intense, and human females are not exempt from this biological reality.
Modern feminism may ruin women by teaching them to be self centered narcisits, and I'll grant you that probably does harm alot of women's ability to be good mothers. But a woman's love for her offspring is instinctual, it's a trait she's shared with her mother, and great grandmothers going back to at least when mammals evolved (and probably much earlier).
Movonnow 8y ago
My mother broke me. She broke my younger brother too. The third one made it out and became as red pill and tough as you could possibly imagine.
They want to toughen up their kid so they try to break them (it's women's "logic" don't try to understand). The ones who are naturally worth something (natural alphas if you will) will survive the shit tests and the emotional and physical abuse and become stronger (and more fucked up in the head). That's what they think. But that's not true. You can't expect a young boy who is 100% to pass shit tests, that's fucked up. The only reason why my youngest brother hadn't been broken is because my mother was busy trying to break every three of us. I was lucky enough to have her undivided "attentions" for years before my first brother were born.
Sir_Shitlord_focker 8y ago
My mom treated me very well when I was a kid, it changed when i became a man for sure (insanely so as she's a man hating feminist) but I swear as a kid she treated so well I had a perfect childhood.
There was this one kid in my class, when I was maybe 10 years old. He was clearly mistreated or not even cared for at all, he would show up without socks, with just a t-shirt and no jacket and no lunch during winter. My mother's maternal instinct is so strong she started to take care of him too, buy clothing, make food, invite him over, etc...
Some women have it in them it's hardwired, my mom did.
Also and that is a KEY POINT to understand, none of this is random.
Did you know the precise distribution of leaves on a plant follows a complex fractal pattern to maximize sunlight capture?
And that's a plant!
Imagine what nature came up with in OUR brains in order to maximize child survival. Pre-breeding age individuals are the most precious to nature. Once you bred or had the chance to breed, nature doesn't give two shits about you, that's why your body breaks down as soon as you hit a certain age.
But before every trick in the book is used to keep you alive long enough to reproduce, if that means enslaving an entire gender to your survival then enslaving an other gender to the first, so be it.
Now I know some women kill their kids, etc... treat them badly, I think these are genetic defects, in a harsher environment they'd get weeded out soon enough, but we live in a notoriously easy environment for now and have done so for a while.
mahlzeit 8y ago
I don't want to argue against that, because it very well might be true, but this sentence is often a red flag that there was something wrong in childhood and a person is still rationalizing that away.
It might be worth it for you to actually investigate this claim. If you indeed had a perfect childhood then your investigation will turn out fine, but if there were problems you can't see at the moment then it's good to bring them to the surface. I can tell you from my own experience that since I've started reading a lot about psychology and especially child psychology I've found a lot of issues in my family of origin that I simply didn't see before. It's one thing to be physically cared for, and on the surface a childhood might look perfect in this way. Mine sure did. But that was an illusion, created by my mind when I was a child. I did this because the realization that I wasn't cared for in the way I needed would have crushed my little child's mind. All children in those situations do that, it's necessary for the child to be able to survive psychologically. And we carry that illusion into adulthood, where we still see our childhood with big blinders on. Our map of reality gets distorted by that and unless we fix it in adulthood we will run into problems.
Again, I'm not saying that this is correct in your case. You might have actually had a really perfect childhood. But, as I've said, usually it's a big red flag. And that little anecdote you mentioned about your mother taking care of that other child sounds like another red flag in this context, to be honest. You also did say that she changed when you became a man, and that's another red flag.
Of course I'm not an actual psychologist and you can't diagnose something over the internet, but I'd bet a six pack that you will find issues under the surface if you let go of the idea that your childhood was perfect. It might be eye-opening and another big red pill to swallow, but finding out that there were actual issues in your family might help you a ton to understand yourself as an adult and grow as a result of that.
Sir_Shitlord_focker 8y ago
Meh could be I guess ... I don't know what's in my subconscious...
But I grew up with a boatload of sisters, I was the only first boy, my dad's side of the family was all over me. Growing up I got a ton of pussy from my sisters friend's.
I got tons of gifts for Christmas and birthdays and as I kid I had great birthdays with cartoon characters like Ninja Turtles (I was a huge fan). My mom would tell me about anything and I was a super curious kid, science and stuff, dinosaurs where a huge thing and she was very supportive of it all.
As for discipline she used only one method, slap in the face or promise of slap in the face latter (if we were with other people). I don't resent her for that one bit.
My dad was absent a lot I guess, but he was working on the company he created in eastern europe after the fall of the wall. He made us quite rich (vacations around the world and stuff) and yes he was tough on discipline (belt on my ass, slaps to rip your head off) but that happened maybe 5 times my entire childhood and I did do some funny stuff :)
He also didn't teach me much, being never there, but we caught up on it when I turned 13 and spend a lot of time together working on companies that he created and later that I created.
All in all I would feel safe having one of my kids raised by my parents, I think that says it all.
Venicedreaming 8y ago
Women are crappy mates, but they are nice mothers. I have seen it through my mother, her mother, and everyone's mothers that I know. It's a strong biological imprint, I guarantee you these mothers will gladly sacrifice anything for their kids.
M0RKET 8y ago
Bullshit. You've been seeing some selective things not representative of the statistically average cases. My mother is terrible. Others I've seen are better but not by much.
Hatorader 8y ago
I agree, men make better mothers than women do. And I had an incredible Mother and Father.
Venicedreaming 8y ago
You have seen the exception and concluded that as statistic. Most mothers are good mothers
Krelious 8y ago
Not true women living through feminism can be fucking cruel and selfish. My mother's mother was a hardworking imimigrant. My mother is a hedonistic shopoholic and former alcoholic for most of her life. Essentially she works to pay for her lifestyle and gives no damns about reality while expecting other people to cater to her wants. She believes working a decent paying job affords her status except that status determined by her is being able to throw money at frivelous shit like clothes and expensive meals. Shes going to die alone unloved in a dingy apartment or retirement home with a pile of clothes. To top it off shes functionally retarded in that she used to work for heinz as a high up PR director or something like that. She was offered a promotion to be a high end Manager but she would have to move to London. She refused the offer and got laid off. In corporate world you either move up or get out. Now she's 65 working a dead end job making maybe 70k a year instead of several hundred thousand and shes managed to maintain a massive debt due to the fact she has no concept of savings. My guess is that shes waiting until either my dad dies or for her health to fail get a divorce liquidate the house so she can pay off her debts and live comfortably until she dies and fuck everyone else over. We were the the first and only owners of this house that my dad and his father built and subsequently maintained over 30 years while this cunt has done nothing but drink herself half to death while flooding the house with worthless crap and generally being a vapid cunt.
My mother thinks shes hot shit because she got a masters in english and is fluent in a couple languages. Fast forward to present day im editing her press releases that come off like a c grade 10th grader wrote them.
YouBigDingus 8y ago
I work with a lot of different PR firms through my job, and I have to say that female, middle-aged PR execs are some of the most miserable and bitchy cunts you will ever encounter. I'd say 90% of the men are chill and easy to work with, but holy shit the women are terrible. They all have permanent sneers on their faces.
Venicedreaming 8y ago
Look mate, it's too bad your mother was so screwed up as a human being. But your exception doesn't change the accepted historical fact tested for centuries that mothers have strong biological imprints on their children. Most of them can and will sacrifice anything for their children. Being RP doesn't mean we could discredit any and every thing that females can do. Mothers are generally pleasant to their kids, credit is due where it's due.
circlhat 8y ago
My mom love me in a sense, she had no concept of tough love, in other words she would run of her credit card to buy me toys I wanted.
This isn't love, spoiling your kids isn't love. Add that to abusive whenever she didn't get her way, she almost crashed me in my brother into a tree, and we didn't do shit.
Now she did work and provide what she could but after child support ran out($800) a month for each, she sent us on to our dads to become men as she put it.
She only ever ask me in my brother for money , and never offers a kind word, her advice is useless as shit, her ideal of a real man is buying women cloths, and not having sex with them, those were he very words.
And yet I still believe you, but women aren't as bound to their nature, as my father worked ,saved , and guided me all though out life, he was the better parent, however my mother provided a safe haven at times, while my dad never gave me a break if you couldn't support yourself he said you are useless and useless people have nothing.
boredgod 8y ago
Coming late to this conversation, but I wanted to add the fact that my mother was every bit of a inept failure that yours and /u/Movonnow's were, but in a very different manner. She was distant to the point of neglectful, basically crippling me mentally and emotionally until I figured out how to get psychological help on my own as an adult. The point is that she fucked up in a way that is entirely different, and that means that there may be hope in diversity. /u/Sir_shitlord_focker's situation is obviously much different but in a good way. He may not have been able to stay in his mother's good graces into adulthood, but at least he had a childhood that we can hope for our children, if we have them. There may be a million ways for mothers to be worthless human beings, but there might still be a couple of ways for them to not completely fuck it up. Just trying to keep my mind open, despite hating my own mother.
Movonnow 8y ago
Having children? You mean, giving huge power over yourself to a woman?
Sir_Shitlord_focker 8y ago
Much admiration to you brother for pulling through something like this and becoming the man that you are today.
Movonnow 8y ago
When I refused to give my mum her ridiculous daily dose of attention ("I want you to tell me EVERYTHING YOU DO"), she stopped giving me the money to survive. I was in another country and I wasn't allowed by the government of this country to work in order to earn some money.
I had to sacrifice my dignity and my pride and to litterally beg her so that I could eat. She made it last for hours on the phone, torturing me and putting me down a little bit more as each minute passed. When it had become clear that she had destroyed every bit of resistance ine me and made sure I sacrificed any piece of honor and self respect I still had, she finally agreed to send me enough money to eat. She would have let me die.
Women ALL prioritizes themselves before ANYONE ELSE.
Venicedreaming 8y ago
Look mate, it's too bad your mother was so screwed up as a human being. But your exception doesn't change the accepted historical fact tested for centuries that mothers have strong biological imprints on their children. Most of them can and will sacrifice anything for their children. Being RP doesn't mean we could discredit any and every thing that females can do. Mothers are generally pleasant to their kids, credit is due where it's due.
Movonnow 8y ago
Yeah. Just wanted to outline that to make sure people here don't pedastalize mothers. They are still women.
BeautyQuark 8y ago
I told my wife that men love women, like women love their children. Complete and absolute shock and non-understanding. Seriously she looked at me like I spoke a different language. Killed all blue-pill left in me and any thoughts of the rare Unicorn. It also killed any desire to remarry if we divorce. A man's love is always unrequited.
Personal note: High school sweethearts, lost virginity to me, and married for over 15 years when I told her this. I am as sure as you can be that she has never cheated. Disclosing to hopefully wake up any guys considering marriage, just don't.
seattleron 8y ago
Wow. The fact that she was that astonished is just more proof.
The dream of marriage should die the first week a person subscribes here. There is no logical reason to do it. Get your balls clipped and date.
111111189 8y ago
I'm fairly young so I don't really get people saying "Don't get married". Not all of us are going to live this rockstar life and get pussy till our dicks will stop working.
CopperFox3c 8y ago
The goal of life is not women ... women are a by-product of a life well-lived. Priorities, brother.
The problem is that marriage and LTRs can get in the way of other priorities. They can take you away from yourself. For instance, Sandman describes this in a recent video: http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GgotVnwkXZg
No one is saying you can't get married or be in an LTR. We're just saying you must be very very careful, and have realistic expectations. Find the right woman, realize she's probably still not a fucking unicorn, vet her ruthlessly. And remember she doesn't love you the same way you love her.
BeautyQuark 8y ago
So the best possible outcome is securing the best wife possible for those men. Therefore, raising your SMV until it is at its peak, and improving inter-sexual skills is the best path. TRP believes that the peak for men is somewhere around 35-45.
Also, getting married because of low SMV is starting on the path to being used, cuckolded, and in a sexless marriage. Again gain an IDGAF attitude increase your SMV and forget marriage. Marriage is not a cheat code in the sexual marketplace.
eof 8y ago
Do you have children? Do you have any advice to someone who (eventually) wants children?
BeautyQuark 8y ago
Yes, I have multiple children. Personally, I would recommend waiting until your late 30's to early 40's to have any children. Multiple reasons, but primarily it is generally a time of stable wisdom, and means in a man's life. Women actually have the age right, but for the wrong sex. Men don't have an expiration date thankfully. My great grandfather married an 18 year old in his late 60's and had 4 children before death in the late 1800's.
As to the best method of having children? First, until male birth control a women may intentionally bless you with a child against your will. Next, I would think when you reach that age, you will have made your own decision on marriage or not. I am not in actuality 100% against marriage. I just believe it is a mistake for almost any man to marry prior to 38-42 years old. At which point I feel must men will have the agency to ignore the never marry rule if they so desire, and understand the real consequences for this arrogance.
phungus420 8y ago
Don't think you're impervious to the ravages of time. Our sperm do get effected, and children become significantly more likely to get genetic disorders from older fathers.
A woman's biological clock starts ticking down after 30 (her egg quality starts to decline) and it becomes serious in her late 30s, early 40s, then she hit's menopause and she simply can't reproduce. We never hit menopause but our sperm do start declining in our 40s, and it becomes a serious issue in our 60s and later.
ToBecomeSuperHuman 8y ago
I'm still hoping!
vasalgel!
Planner_Hammish 8y ago
There was a pretty mind blowing post on here the other day about finding an egg donor and using a surrogate. I never even thought that was an option, but at the current rate things are going, it is becoming the prime option.
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Planner_Hammish 8y ago
It was on this sub last week, or maybe last two weeks.
Meoang 8y ago
You don't recommend marriage even though you've been married for 15 years? Could you elaborate, or did I miss something?
Edit: I think I got banned from a certain subreddit for posting this.
BeautyQuark 8y ago
Overall, as a Husband and father any sacrifices that need to be made for the family are your's. In the best of times you are often an accessory to your wife and children.
Read that several times and think about the toll it will take on you as a man over decades. Women are pack animals and the vast majority are being at best infected by feminism, and at worst embrace it. Studies indicate that a single friend of your wife that is going through a divorce significantly raises the risk of your own divorce. I have experienced this phenomenon no less than three times, and it ends in my wife reducing contact with those friends.
Overall, that recommendation comes from my/our observations on the decline of society. Marriage was always life on expert mode for any man. Now it is on insanity mode for the vast majority of high quality men.
As to my personal opinion on whether I would do it all over again? I will have that answer on my death bed or right after divorce papers are filed. Until, that time I am always evaluating.
IVIaskerade 8y ago
Smokers often don't recommend smoking. Besides, I trust the opinions of people with experience over those who don't have it but want to talk about it anyway.
wavescrashing 8y ago
There is nothing unique that marriage provides other than increasing the probability of assuring paternity.
Spouses mutually set expectations of each other which will doom them to failure. Your spouse has to be your best friend, lover, muse, entertainer, provider and Care taker. How can a person not fail.
iAMtheBelvedere 8y ago
You'd be surprised, it may be that he has a child from her or is in a situation that would make leaving difficult. I know that up until my last relationship ended, I was trying my hardest to not end it...
martypete 8y ago
Over 50% of marriages end in divorce. Are you saying you would also go skydiving even if statistically over 50% of the parachutes did not open? If so you are either A) Insane or B) Bad at math
ILoveSunflowers 8y ago
50% in divorce, then you've got the couples that won't because of religion, the kids, or money and how many happily married couples do you think we're talking?
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you_dont_even_no 8y ago
Did you honestly get banned from other subs?
Edit: for - from
Meoang 8y ago
Yeah, I don't know if I should mention which one, but I was suddenly banned from another decently sized subreddit that I've never used.
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AlphaAccountant 8y ago
Who better to recommend not doing something than someone who's been doing it over a decade.
99centHeartattck 8y ago
Here is the more important question. If I could offer you to go back to the day before you met your wife, would you take it? And if you went back would you still meet your future wife?
BeautyQuark 8y ago
I honestly cannot answer whether or not I would change my life. I am who I am as a result of everything in my life including my marriage. I am pretty happy with my life, even though I am not happy with my marriage. I have experienced great personal growth due to my wife and her behavior.
No I would not have met my wife. Edit: Meaning any change in my life would have prevented me from meeting my wife. We met on a last minute, blind double date.
martypete 8y ago
Unfortunately the sad beta schlubs around here refuse to give up the naive notion that marriage can still work if you just find the right unicorn
hrm0894 8y ago
I agree with this sub's take on marriage but, as someone who practices his religion, I need to get married to have sex. Lol it's fucking awful cause I know that's the only benefit of getting married.
BeautyQuark 8y ago
I went to a Christian high school by choice back in the 1990's. I also went to a Public high school by choice. Trust me you do not need to be married to have sex.
The christian school was much more morally bankrupt as far as sex is concerned. There were at least three girls that I knew, who pulled trains with strangers. At least 60% of the females were fucking by 10th grade. Hell some of the teachers flirted with me.
I held the moral ground such as yourself. I was a virgin when I married my wife. None of the girls would date me, as I was too moral. I was shot down multiple times as all the girls knew, I was looking for a serious relationship. Almost all of the girls wanted to corrupt me, and be the one to take my virginity. I had turned down close to 20 direct offers from girls in 2 years prior to meeting my wife. Seriously, I was too good to date but perfect to fuck.
I regret this decision. First, after almost a year of dating I finally cracked and had sex with my wife. Yup, you read that right I was holding up sex with my virgin girlfriend, even though we would get 90% there. My wife has told me she did not care about my N number even though she was a virgin. Without experience, it will be impossible to understand the level of crazy in women.
Next, in my life, this ONE decision altered my entire existence. Personally, I advise my sons to forget about serious relationships until after college. I will also advise them that mistakes are required to learn what you want in life. I truly believe that my inter-sexual development over the first 10 years of marriage would have been achieved in those 2 years and 20 women. I would have been a better man and known what I wanted. I also know I would not have married my wife. I cannot change reality and do not wish to change my lot in life. However, you better damn well believe I will try to help my sons avoid the same mistakes I made.
All sins are forgivable. All sins are equal. I am almost positive you commit sins purposefully at times. Sex is a forgivable sin. Sex is in human nature. Only a malicious God would not forgive pre-material sex. YOU will 100% hurt yourself with most women by not having pre-material sex. YOU are pre-selecting yourself for failure by not having sex. Almost all virginal women will except that you are not a virgin. Any high quality male will have women down to fuck.
All I am saying is set aside the unrealistic no pre-marital sex rule, and accept it might be broken. Lower YOUR expectations on women. You honestly have too high of a standard for modern women. You are damaging yourself and excluding the majority of women from your marital pool.
TL:DR
Remember this was a sin in the times of arraigned marriages. Tattoos, piercings, cutting hair, facial shaving, and numerous other things have been sins as well. So why is premarital sex a sin when the social construct around marriage does not resemble biblical marriage? Adulterers would be stoned to death as it was a sin as well, but through no-fault divorce adultery no longer matters. Technically we are only married by word in modern times, and not by a religion. Therefore, even sex in a modern marriage should be construed as a sin as the only binding factor is no-fault divorce, and not biblical standards.
isthatyoujonwayne 8y ago
Oof. Neither pussy nor money matters when you have tons and marriage carries a good chance of leaving you with neither. Some followers on this sub might recommend celibacy over marriage.
Movonnow 8y ago
Can you expand on that? I don't understand her reaction.
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Movonnow 8y ago
I know. I still don't understand though. That's the one piece of RP I haven't been able to understand yet.
Do you mean that she loves her children and couldn't understand that a man can love her as she loves her children (which is the real love) and so it reveals that women don't love men ?
redditarcm89 8y ago
Have you ever felt love? Towards a younger sibling, or a girl, or a child? That's not how women feel love towards men, it's how they feel it towards children. They feel it the way you charm your boss, mixed with how you loved your Dad as a child (he gives you something, or does something for you, the automatic reaction is "Thank you! I Love you!").
Movonnow 8y ago
But...that's not love. It's being thankful, that's all.
edit : fuck, that's why they love conditionnaly. They feel nothing if you don't give them anything. So all theer is in a woman is attraction and thankfullness. Okay, great, I'm gonna love myself now, since mo one will ever love me (I mean, with this definition, only my mother will ever be able to love me so no other woman will)
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apply_truth 8y ago
Haha so love is a weakness, the Sith have it right then.
redditarcm89 8y ago
What? You don't have to show weakness to love someone.
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rebuildingMyself 8y ago
Yet it's perfectly fine for a woman to want a father figure
Simon_Inaki 8y ago
that is really shitty. proud of my dad for keeping his fat stacks in a completely unrelated, personal account. the joint account is used to put "on a show" and pay for petty expenses. thats his advice to me too
SergieAdamas 8y ago
Thanks for sharing. Sadly that can be an illusion that keeps many people miserable.
Regards, Sergie
clam61 8y ago
she drained all joint checking accounts?
WingsnLV 8y ago
What we seem to be forgetting here is that since we know that all women have the capability to divorce their husbands, or to wander to another man, it is the man's responsibility to always strive to be the best version of himself. A woman is biologically predestined to explore her options if a man is lacking leadership, or displaying the blue pill characteristics that we all know about. Eventually you have got to leave behind the anger phase and become the best man you can be. If you decide to get married, you have to be prepared for the possibility that your wife may lose interest, but you can't just roll over and become a shell of a man who follows all if his wife's directions without giving any of his own and expect your wife to remain interested. Marriage is a huge gamble and isn't for everybody. If you can't see yourself making that gamble that is your choice to make, but if you do decide to marry, you have to keep your identity, lead your family, and retain interest from your spouse by being the best version of yourself.
greatmikeshark 8y ago
How would it look if he went to their bank account and cashed out all the funds to prevent her from getting the money?
makethemsayayy 8y ago
Let's see he is a man...soo if HE did it, he would lose almost all of HIS money because that was an unfair move. But when SHE does it, well it's technically legal so no big deal, let her keep it!
crestind 8y ago
"All she might have had to do was wait until September, because that’s how long my dad made it."
What does that even mean?
Dravous 8y ago
I wonder how their children are perceiving this.
HakaseJ 8y ago
You know, I had an elderly neighbor. She grew up during the great depression without a father and was constantly ridiculed and mocked and suffered during the most difficult times and with a one income household. When she became an adult, she was resolved to never allow that to happen to her children and she found a stable and reliable man whom she provided with unquestioned support even while he was underway in the merchant marine for four years of war. She told me personally if he ever cheated that she didn't want to know because she had so much respect for marriage that she didn't want anything to ruin it. She made 3 hot meals a day for the family, kept the place clean, and still worked as a waitress. Her Husband wisely invested in property and left her financially comfortable without fear of debt or obligation and an ample surplus to leave to their daughters.
Now, I would have married a woman like that. A woman who respected her husband, revered the sanctity of marriage, and thought of her family before herself. Now all we have to choose from are narcissistic whores who play musical chairs with dicks until their vagina is so worn out and used up that they will take any chair that doesn't collapse under the weight of their fat ass.
I think today's women are a consequence of the environment that they have grown up in. With role models like Madonna and Kesha, there are no viable partners that are suitable for supportive LTRs. They are shitty mothers and shittier wives. Marriage is a show of status, not commitment. If such a woman existed like my neighbor today, I would snatch her up without a second thought. But with today's selection, I will keep my expectations low and my bank account unjoined.
ZackCross 8y ago
Lately, I've developed some rather alarming oneitis for the sister of my longtime childhood friend who has become extremely attractive in the years I had not seen her.
Despite how infatuated I am with her and my prospective plans to date her and perhaps stay with her for the rest of my life, I have given ZERO THOUGHT to the idea of marriage despite how ridiculously perfect we are for eachother.
Marriage is rigged heavily in favor of women, don't ever put yourself in unnecessary risk for a very unprofitable return.
The risks of marriage (for men) are quite high, whereas the benefits of men are almost non-existent (for men).
Tom_The_Human 8y ago
Cut contact with her. The oxytocin is meddlin' with your mind.
ZackCross 8y ago
Actually something pretty strange has happened.
My oneitis for this unicorn is making me want to become a better person for her ( I know, I hate myself for this too).
I've quit smoking, cut all video games, become even more diligent with gym sessions, and have completely stopped masturbating all for her. This is a very weird thing for me, ill write a story/update once more time passes.
makethemsayayy 8y ago
You should do that for you, not for someone who feels entitled to it. Whatever you sound like you'll be screwed anyways, and you're hamstering right now.
ZackCross 8y ago
She has never asked for any of this lol.
In fact, she has never asked anything of me that I had to go out of my way to do for her.
I am doing this for myself, of course, but it is her who serves as my motivation.
Just being around her makes me want to better myself, I really don't see any harm in this and will continue to spend time with her until there is a good reason not to.
Again, I will write a report on this once enough time has passed with this new lifestyle.
makethemsayayy 8y ago
Yeah get married to her too! For you though, you know?
ZackCross 8y ago
Please learn to read before you waste your limited energy on typing a semi-literate response.
I have NEVER considered marriage with this girl, as perfect as an Angel she is, which I had stated on my initial post on this topic.
Just because our motivations differ does not mean I am any less of a man than you, especially if you lack basic reading skills.
Falc0n7 8y ago
She was playing the long con.
Nazrath2112 8y ago
AWALT, even my own mother.
My mom is 63, husband about the same age. He was full on Alpha, job as a civy contractor for the army, Biker, etc. Now days, hes had a couple replacement surgeries. Aint as alpha as he used to be. I remember her telling me she was unhappy and told him that he should leave. He of course told he no he wasn't going anywhere and they dropped it, but I remember having that conversation a couple times with my mom.
ozn 8y ago
same thing happened with my own parents. but my father back down and leave the house when she threatened to call police and tell a bullshit story.
DrQuaid 8y ago
I am so happy that I came to TRP so early. I won't ever have to deal with that.
Movonnow 8y ago
Don't be so sure. I mean, stay on guard.
CowardlyPetrov 8y ago
Inspiring post if the read can get past his own delusion as well.
Delusion is ALWAYS cruel.
BurgundyCarpet 8y ago
Fantastic summary. Summarizes my entire TRP experience.
nechoha 8y ago
I'm sorry for Ray, it sounds like he never saw it coming. 30 years, that's just cruel. Please keep him hopeful to life if you can. Suicide is a nasty thing, and its cry can be so much louder in the spiral of distress.
Saiserit 8y ago
I told him to "take the money and run" if he could. That's when I learned about the direct deposit shenanigans. I consider myself chill as fuck but I found no way to respond.
Fulp_Piction 8y ago
ELI5 Direct deposit shenanigans?
nechoha 8y ago
Woodworking could be fun? I'm not sure either.
Hatorader 8y ago
Yeah I hope he doesn't commit suicide. Murder suicide though....sounds pretty reasonable at this point.
nechoha 8y ago
Not if he has some sort of Christian religion because murder and suicide are both big bad no no's in their book. Maybe get him lifting or just enjoying this weekend?
scummcdirt 8y ago
Anyone who is more knowledgeable on this then i am, feel free to correct me if i am wrong. From what i understand:
Bankruptcy, halts divorce proceedings. If ray gets a lawyer worth his shit, he would do that.
The beautiful part of it, is that if the bankruptcy happens before the divorce, then the creditors can go after both the husband and the ex wife. So if he says "my wife got all my money", then the collections people will go after her.
[deleted] 8y ago
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Saiserit 8y ago
The species is better served by doing everything possible to live and learn long enough to conquer the stars or transcend traditional reality before bad chance and/or entropy drive us extinct. My only loyalty is to the spirit of my species. Robbing productive laborers for the illusory and temporary comforts of leeches (women or men) stifles progress towards that goal severely.
fight-the-beard 8y ago
Simple give no one anything ever. The biggest lie perpetrated to man is the nature of women
MattyAnon Admin 8y ago
That's the thing.... you've lost the dream... but the dream was a lie and you'd find out how much of a lie it is sooner or later. You've lost a comfortable delusion, nothing more. Saved yourself a lot of future pain in all probability, unless you are one of the very very few lucky ones.
ghaenrynquau 8y ago
If you're a 10, you will be loved unconditionally. This is the only exception.
martypete 8y ago
You hit the nail right on the head with this explanation. A1 post.
johnchapel 8y ago
Uh, next time you want to tell a story, try including the part where you explain what the fuck you're talking about.
bonerfleximus 8y ago
Why is she leaving him when she's probably 70 years old? Honestly something has to be missing from this story...did she find some geriatric Chad with balls as smooth as a 30yo or something? Most likely I'm guessing she held a grudge for many years for something fucked up your friend isn't mentioning in his story.
The replies to this post kinda turn me off to this place, it's starting to look like a cult when nobody uses critical thought anymore.
Edit: Some sensible responses here, so I'll address them in this edit. Recently my sister's husband was caught raping my niece/nephews. I've heard of many instances of this happening and the mother turns a blind eye. There are also many other atrocities people commit and the spouse (man or woman) will ignore it and continue to live as if nothing is going on. I'm not saying that the woman in the story was justified, just that when you're 70+ years old and you leave a relationship of 30 years its not usually something you do on a whim. There's more to this story than just what OP is presenting. Yes - AWALT - but that doesn't mean all men are innocent slaves of matriarchy - I'm willing to bet my sister's ex-husband has many stories he tells people about why he's in his current situation and they'll all involve the evil ex-wife. With the way people are buying into this story, I can imagine HIS story showing up here with a few facts missing and everyone sympathizing, which disgusts me.
Aerobus 8y ago
Don't try to understand women logic.
Nazrath2112 8y ago
The replies of people giving examples turns you off because were not using critical thinking?
Considering that she took all his money at a certain point in time gives the impression that she was waiting for a milestone before this happened. Was it 700k, 1M that she took? This seems much more plausible than this entire sub as lost critical thinking skills.
bonerfleximus 8y ago
edited my post with a response
ComradeCynic 8y ago
It could have been "The Whispers" - all those posts , stories, TV shows etc. about women growing old by themselves and having a grand old time. Or maybe she felt left out by not riding the CC when she was younger. https://dalrock.wordpress.com/2010/11/02/the-whispers/
It could also be that women after a certain age , are "done" with men except as social status symbols. After menopause they can become less emotional and possibly lose some of their pair bonding ability. Again, Dalrock: https://dalrock.wordpress.com/2011/03/11/are-women-done-with-men-after-age-55/
bonerfleximus 8y ago
edited my post with a response
Ninja-5 8y ago
You're assuming she's rational, honorable, cares more about her family than herself etc. Critical thought and naivety aren't compatible.
bonerfleximus 8y ago
edited my post with a response
bourbonhipster 8y ago
im going to go with the "Shes been so malcontent, bored, lonely, whatever, for so many years shes been planning this day meticulously for as long" - not that that makes the situation any less FUBAR. A married woman feels entitled to a mans time (that whole most precious resource thing) - when she doesnt get that its all over at any phase of a LTR. Still, Marriage law typically determines halfing assets so its not like she could have realistically left him penniless unless he kept something of equity (though possibly not currently in liquid form, like real-estate ) of an equal value.
bonerfleximus 8y ago
edited my post with a response
[deleted] 8y ago
There's really nothing that would excuse the actions, explain them maybe, but not make them right.
bonerfleximus 8y ago
edited my post with a response
RS73 8y ago
I really like your final paragraph. It gets to the heart of the male/female relationship lie that society bullshits men with.
Heizenbrg 8y ago
Is this legal? I can't fathom this to be even possible.
allcapsisyelling 8y ago
If anything, her bad actions could fuck her over during the dividing of assets.
InscrutablePUA 8y ago
Another way to look at it is he got to live in a BP fantasy world for most of his life. But that means he was never prepared for something like this to happen.
tompanz 8y ago
That's even worse. That's like finding out your entire life was a lie the moment before you die.
trowawayyada 8y ago
10yrs past retirement age. So he's what 72-75.....married her in his early 40's? I'm willing to bet it wasn't his first rodeo but shit after 30yrs. FUBAR
rebuildingMyself 8y ago
Joint checking means they both have full power to rob it at any time.
Best financial strategy to avoid this is don't get married
yaardi 8y ago
Isn't there an option to not allow sum over a certain amount to be taken by only one of them? It seems logical.
VasiliyZaitzev 8y ago
Don't get married.
If you do get married, keep your own account, and have a joint account for household expenses that you transfer money into as needed, but not more than you care about losing in a "Ray's Cunt Wife" scenario.
Have a stash of cash somewhere safe that nobody knows about. Leave a sealed letter with a lawyer that you only retain for that purpose, or someone you trust with high security info, so your kids will be informed of its whereabouts upon your death.
nillotampoco 8y ago
As far as having a cash stash, buy some silver bullion, hide it, bury it and don't ever mention it again.
I mean greenbacks are cool, but it doesn't feel nearly as cool as hiding silver coins and bars. Totally makes you feel like a pirate.
Hey do you know if there's an official name for having a secret way to inform people of things upon your death? A will seems like it wouldn't be discreet enough.
TwoThirteen 8y ago
TIL I should metal detect around retirement homes...
you can have your lawyer do list things for you, discreetly.
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Movonnow 8y ago
I don't think feels should be a factor in your decision about how to organiwe your economic future.
nillotampoco 8y ago
Silver is a tangible asset, that should be obvious, it's not simply paper. The motto goes, if you don't hold it you don't own it. Trusting the bank with every but of your money would be silly like trusting a woman with half of it.
Heizenbrg 8y ago
There has to be! Who would be this stupid?
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paleoman1992 8y ago
ok- Here's another one: These money grubbers also have long term plans with the house they share with their beta shlub husbands. Heard about two guys in my peer group who were hit with the "news" of their impending divorce AFTER the expensive kitchen remodel or turning the basement into a play room for the kids. Guys-they have a strategy.They have a plan. Just don't marry and keep your cash,paycheck,inheritances private and for your kids only.
SleepNowMyThrowaway 8y ago
Nobody, and I mean nobody male or female should ever put themselves in such a position.
I know men that brag how they let their wives handle all their money and bills "...'cause she's better'n me at it." Just begging to be gutted like Ray.
And I went to Uni with a woman that came home with takeout for her husband, only to find him gone and a note and copy of the divorce filing on the kitchen table, so it goes both ways.
Only an imbecile presents complete dependence and submission as a badge of honor, something to brag about.
No matter your sex, you should always maintain some independent funds, keep your skillset sharp, your friendships active, and your body in shape - it too is an asset.
Ray is now an object lesson in how one's perfect life can crash into a mountain when you let someone else act as your pilot. Had Ray a clue he'd be laughing at her antics on payday, hitting on her friends on Saturday, and nailing strange by Sunday.
Instead his life is a shambles and he'll likely be moving in with his kids or attempting suicide within weeks.
Movonnow 8y ago
Ray is an idiot.
Not his fault though. With all the feminine bullshit conditioning men suffer today, society produces almost only idiots (I'm an idiot myself, a big fucking one_.
bluedrygrass 8y ago
That's like bragging to not be able to read. Bragging about your own lacknesses. Nonsense. But that's the culture we are raised in.
"Hey, hey, i'm dumb and i'm drinking a beer watching television! So cool"
ColonelMitchell 8y ago
These people bother me so much
herewegoaga1n 8y ago
Holy fuck. I kept hearing that Sarah McLovin' song throughout the entire post. Fuck OP, right in the feels.
I'm in for $5 to help this poor sod.
morealphaeveryday 8y ago
I second. Would happily throw $5 at this brother (if he needs it. Not sure if that was clear in the post)
herewegoaga1n 8y ago
He had his life's work stolen from him by some bimbo in it for the long con. Mine would come with a message: "Here you go brother. To get you back on your feet. May I be remembered one day when I'm in need. P.S. Don't let this happen again."
Saiserit 8y ago
He doesn't. His kids are sympathetic and he will be fine even with a 50/50 split. It's the heart that suffers. As I said about my own situation, "It wasn't about the money, I can always make more. Betrayal can never be healed." Ask Caesar. Dante didn't put them all the way down there next to Satan for no good reason.
morealphaeveryday 8y ago
That's for sure. I'm in the 17th month of drama after finding out my SAHM wife of 18 years was fucking a "friend" of mine, so I know this reality more than I care to.
JamesRoscoe 8y ago
Great lesson here. Never, and I mean NEVER allow a woman access your finances. Give her a debit card with a predefined limit. Better yet, make sure she can make her own money. So when she loses her mind, (and she will, it's just a matter of when) you can get away from batshit without being hurt too badly.
schnappdragon 8y ago
What. The. Fuck. Ray should choke a bitch.
JeanValjean197o 8y ago
Choke his master? That would result in the most severe of punishments.
He's fucked no matter what.
schnappdragon 8y ago
10 years past retirement age? Dude's old as fuck, the greatest punishment for him was the divorce rape. Any crime he commits now would seem insignificant compared to that.
csehszlovakze 8y ago
At this age it wouldn't matter anymore. They'll probably lock him up and he'll have a place to live.
johnnywahd 8y ago
Ray should not do that. Only Wayne Brady should.
call_of_the_wild 8y ago
Just remember, for every story like this, there is a story about the couple who stayed happily married for 60 years until death did them part.
quasatical 8y ago
This hits me really hard man. I can't say I'm glad that other folks have gone through it, but the more of us the better. I hope Ray's got some friends to tell him as much.
breakingbadrule 8y ago
I know all of us are analyzing this situation here from every amble possible and that's good. But I just feel sad for Ray. I feel sad that a fellow man has to go through this after giving his life to something he believed in.
I'm just sad. I am not a highly emotional person but I can't help but let a tear trickle down my eye. :(
Daily_Dosage_3 8y ago
It's times like these, when I read such a post that makes me glad to be single, never married, and safe from the clutches of a hamstering thief.
fhghg 8y ago
You are merely unscathed, never safe.
JeanValjean197o 8y ago
Sucks to be Ray.
I just can't muster any sympathy for these guys anymore. There are far too many of them and I just don't have the time for it.
He'll probably off himself. At least he had kids and stuff. Hope he changes his will to leave out his cunt wife.
johnnywahd 8y ago
A guy at work has two daughters. One was married about two years ago, the other just got married a few weeks ago. One guy already has a kid with one of the daughters.
I feel sorry for the poor clueless saps for what their lives are going to turn into. Hopefully they'll discover some RP knowledge.
Tom_The_Human 8y ago
I would suggest administering the Red Pill via a drip, but there is still a massive risk attached to that. Sucks to be those guys.
I know a 20 year old girl who got engaged to her boyfriend (who's 18) after about 4 months of dating. He works at a fast food place and is beta as fuck. I'm just sat here with my popcorn.
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