Are you being manipulated? Maybe by your boss, your ex, your parents, your children?
​
In general, we tend to call “manipulation” that which has an overall net-negative value because some large unseen positive value is the aspect of control for one side (i.e. control for the sake of control).
​
Think of your time and energy like money – investors manipulate your money (and you, by extension), but often-times they return more of it than you initially gave them. It is a win-win, because they returned extra money for you, and they kept some extra money which your money made. Let’s say this is net-positive manipulation.
​
Net-negative manipulation is the opposite. When you are walking down an alley, and a homeless man shoves a gun into your chest and demands your wallet, you not only lose your time, you also lose your money. The manipulator would like you to feel that you got to keep your life, but you would have either way – it was an introduced threat by the manipulator. But the homeless man only gains $50, a high-risk low-reward situation. Not all homeless people resort to robbery. We could infer that for some, they really just like that feeling of total control they get in a robbery – others don’t seem to need it.
​
Nobody needs to convince you to participate in net-positive manipulation – it is net positive. It’s easier to pay a farmer some money than it is to farm yourself, so even though you need food to live, I don’t have to convince you to just pay the farmer. But if you are walking down the street and a homeless man asks for $50 (without a gun), only a great deal of guilt, fear or other convincing would cause you to consider this net-negative interaction.
​
I’ve gone through a list of manipulation tactics and pulled together what I believe are the 3 core principles of manipulation. I’ve also determined some defenses against the core principles, which aren’t exhaustive but probably helpful. The idea was to come up with a framework where manipulation can be identified without using a cue-card with 50+ tactics. This is not a how-to list. This list is for you to recognize where you are being manipulated, and to develop strategies to eliminate or otherwise neutralize the manipulators wherever possible.
------
1. KNOW THE VICTIM
The manipulator needs to know you – whether from up close or afar. Your boss knows you just bought that new car and really need your paycheck right now. But also, the homeless man knows that you probably do not want to be shot in the chest (just a guess). It doesn’t matter who he grabs.
​
If you are extremely wealthy, a boss hanging small amounts money over your head is not ever going to bother you. If you are a Grammy-award winning artist, it is probably a waste of time to try and invalidate your musical talents, though less-good manipulators will try.
​
The manipulator needs to know their victim well enough to see where the needs are in context of the control they want. They need to see the actual weak spots, so they can attack them. Basically, at this point, they are building a framework in their head to put other people to work for them. You are a tool to them, and they need to find out what kind of tool you are.
​
There is no real defense at this phase – that’s the idea. It would be completely innocuous even if you did find out. Hiding your own skills and talents only furthers the manipulator’s ability to control you – defending at this stage manifests as being extremely shy and afraid of being judged. With that said, never reveal dangerous info to a suspected or known manipulator. Use your judgement, but remember that you are submitting to them by hiding your needs.
​
2. CONTROL THE VICTIM’S NEEDS
​
The manipulator will keep the victim weak, isolated, uncomfortable, uncertain and/or fearful. They will also attack mental stability/durability/aptitude, and weaken the victims external support network.
​
The homeless man does this with a gun. But it could be done with something as innocuous as stapling a report together that you have asked not to be stapled, or standing in your way so you are forced to walk around them. Control can be anything from a major threat to a minor annoyance, to even something that can be disguised as being helpful. Any invasion of your boundaries is control.
​
Minor annoyances will add up over time, and there are some seemingly unseen factors which greatly influence your mental state. Good manipulators will try to modify your sleeping and eating patterns, and break any sort of pattern that you use. Humans are a species of patterns. Stuff as simple as hiding your keys or moving your shampoo can be done to unbalance your trust in yourself, and cause you to be submissive. Negotiating the needs to leave things where you leave them is being submissive – maybe you are not entitled to place them somewhere, but do not suppose this cannot be manipulative.
​
Without control, the manipulator cannot force you to do anything. If you have all of your own needs met, no one can control you. You feel the need to not die, the need to get 8 hours of sleep, the need to eat, the need to have a job, a car, a female and so on. The people who stand in the way of your needs have control over you.
​
Keep in mind, just because they have control doesn’t mean they are net-negative manipulators. But in general, you’d better know who stands in the way of your needs. Do not try and convince yourself that your needs are not real – this is another tactic of a good manipulator. They would like the most for you to withhold things from yourself. If you truly want that slice of cake, or to bang that Brazilian, convincing yourself that you do not want it for any reason is submissive.
​
First line defense of this stage is to have an external support network, and potentially backup plans. A good manipulator will do whatever he can to poison that network – be it by convincing you it is not helpful, convincing the network that you are evil, and so on. He will try and destroy any path of escape you have, whether he does it himself, or he convinces you to do it. Remember, he is asking you to destroy your own defenses against him. Doing so is submissive.
​
Second line defense is to have strong self-esteem. Good manipulators will attack this relentlessly in forward, side-handed, and backward (support network) ways. Your self-esteem is the punching bag for a manipulator. They will do whatever they can to destroy it, and they will only ever add to it if you are compliant for them. Never ever give a manipulator the ability to access or affect your self-esteem. They would gladly chuck it down a well to make you totally submissive. Remember that your self-esteem is seen as an escape route to them, and they must destroy all of your escape routes.
​
3. DISABLE THE VICTIM’S DEFENSE
​
Manipulators convince the victim that they are unable to diagnose any manipulation tactic being used. They confuse the victim, divert them, appeal to status levels (real or made-up), minimize the attack, diagnose it as the victims own fault. They do not accept any form of responsibility for manipulation under any circumstance. They use whatever means necessary to divert or confuse, even making up a false reality.
​
They try to weaken the victim totally, maybe even convince the victim to prefer a submissive state.
​
Furthermore, they defend themselves relentlessly. They bend reality if they must, question the victim’s sanity, ability or authority to diagnose the issue.
​
This is the smoke-bomb stage, pay no attention to the man behind the curtain. They must obscure everything when it comes towards them. They can make you feel bad for them, they can suppose that they are the victim. In fact, a good manipulator will essentially act as if no rule applies to them. Any logic and reason used against them will be invalidated or minimized. When you do pin them down, they will appeal to your mercy only long enough to regain control.
​
Bottom line: Good manipulators will never be held responsible for their own actions. This is because they have assumed some sort of control over you and they don’t owe you anything.
​
First line of defense here is to ‘sharpen your sword.’ Nothing makes a good manipulator more excited than when you come with a pile of examples – they will gladly throw the entire pile in the trash, altogether or one-by-one. Have one example, one point, remove all of the fluff. In fact, when you are piercing armor, the key is to focus all of the power on a single point at once. Keep in mind, it will take time to sharpen this sword – this will be used by a good manipulator to control you, so don’t spend forever doing this. If you wait too long after an incident, the manipulator can call it an unwarranted outburst.
​
Second line of defense is to stay true to your values. A good manipulator will do whatever they can to shake you off your system of values, or at least to give themselves an infinite value in your system. Once you lose the system of values, they can regain control in many new ways and you will start the process over again. Trust your own values, and if you can’t do that, you must get to where you can on your own. Doing so through a network could leave you vulnerable when they attempt to attack your network. You must keep an internal value system.
​
A final note: Do not try to stay cordial with a known manipulator. They often operate and socially supplant you into situations where you would have to submit or break ‘social code.’ In fact, manipulators themselves are usually guilty of completely ignoring any 'social code.' Don’t feel bad about calling one an asshole, pointing out their lies, telling them you don’t care what they think. By hiding your feelings, you are being submissive – as they want you.
------
​
Finally, I believe there is one way to short-circuit a manipulator:
SEEK THE PATH OF LEAST RESISTANCE
​
Manipulators will try and convince you there is no escape, alternative or substitute – you must pay the toll. They will convince you that only their dollar is worth a dollar, only their widget is any good, fundamentally you must submit to your manipulator. “Thou shalt have no other gods before me.”
​
Firstly, you must assess the need they actually control. Sometimes they will be controlling you in ways which they are not entitled to do – you must aggressively regain control of the needs they are not entitled to control. Honestly, in 99% of cases, this is going to shake most manipulators. The most irritating manipulators are usually overreaching their entitlements. You can either inform them that you are aware of this, or ignore them entirely. Keep in mind that you will probably never convince them of reality – they are well aware it exists and are avoiding it. Don’t waste energy for "the greater good". If you must do something in retaliation, find what you have power over them in and use that – but be aware of any unseen powers they may have.
​
Second, supposing they do have the right to control this need, can you trick them into giving it to you anyways? Think about Indiana Jones and the bag of rocks. If someone forces you to agree with them, do it and then later act as if you didn’t. Flake on them. The manipulator is going to tell you that you are a chair and try and come back and sit on you – you must absolutely let him fall on his ass. Keep in mind, this is for one-time ordeals; Salesmen are great for this - you can say yes to anything to get them to shut the fuck up, but it is meaningless unless you sign on the dotted line - so just don't. But it can be used for chronic manipulators who you have to interface with, if they are not in control of something major such as pay. Use your judgement.
​
Next, seek alternatives. if your wife says she does not owe you sex, she is right. But you also do not owe her a marriage. If your boss says he does not have to give you a raise, he is right. But you can work for somebody who will pay market rate. Keep in mind, in this case, you will have to assess the consequence of going around them vs. the value. Is it worth divorcing your wife if she refuses sex once? No. Is it worth it if she refuses sex for a year straight? You tell me. But you must remember that your need CAN be met – if not by her, by somebody – but it can be met. Again, they will try and shake you and claim no alternative exists - don't ever take their word for this, why would they ever tell you an alternative exists?
​
Lastly, if you have no other option, just submit. For example, you may want to take over the United States so you can be the true Alpha. But you will sooner be killed than do any such thing. You can go pretty far, but at some point you will be stopped and be powerless. The point here is that, there is a point when you have to just deal with reality as it is. The idea is to avoid submission when it is not necessary.
Conclusion
We are all manipulated, all the time. Most of the time, it is net-positive and there is really nothing to worry about. Should you ever be attacked by somebody trying to manipulate you for net-negative power-seeking purposes, I hope you can use this guide to analyze and defeat the attacker, or otherwise to reduce their threat potential, and basically reduce your anxiety about the situation.
FanaticMind 5y ago
In the control part, how do minor annoyances help you control an individual?
for example, if a roomate decides to "organize my room" without asking how would it help him control me later?
(after a manipulation proccess) how would he use that control to get me to give him 20 bucks? or tell him something about my friend?
SUCK_MY_DICTIONARY 5y ago
Think of it this way: if you were about to go in for a job interview and I took the sunglasses out of your car, threw away the milk for your coffee, and hid your deodorant - are you gonna be A1 when you go in?
Similarly, when they want to manipulate you, pushing you off your center just enough can make you more likely to screw up and fall for it.
It’s kind of like in a lot of fighting styles, you try to trick your opponent to go in for a move and then hang back. When they go for it, you push their momentum down.
FanaticMind 5y ago
Okay, got it.
But once you are off center how do they go for the kill?
Can you give an example to the situations I gave at the end?
(I can see myself getting into a suggestive state but I can't see myself doing that, how could they frame it so I'd agree)?
SUCK_MY_DICTIONARY 5y ago
I can’t link that example you provided easily but I mentioned in another post the way it happens to me sometimes (which I’ve since learned to snuff out).
I’ll be sitting at my desk fully concentrated on something. Coworker comes up, out of nowhere, quickly asks me something while standing over me. Brain just squeaks out “sure” without really thinking because they caught me off balance.
Another example is that I go on work trips, and sometimes people schedule crazy flights and shitty hotels. When your sleep schedule is all fucked up, you will say and do just about anything in certain cases just to get more sleep.
It’s not like they automatically know moving your shampoo will get to know. It’s that they are just trying to get you to be a little frazzled or irritated. Once they have you in that state, they know you’re much more likely to comply.
MindEnabler 5y ago
Nice summary! For all of you that want to learn more, I recommend the following books:
TRPLazarus 5y ago
What book do you recommend starting on?
MindEnabler 5y ago
You can start with Influence: The Psychology of Persuasion before switching to more specialized books depending on what you're interested in.
SUCK_MY_DICTIONARY 5y ago
Also 48 laws of power, which I think this is very similar to, and almost felt like I was either rewriting a chapter from it or something.
The key here was just that I wanted to make a short (as I believe it can be) guide to ‘sense’ manipulation - that’s the hardest part most of the time I think. Many of us just run straight for the guilt, shame, anger and submission - especially those types who try to have a positive and trusting outlook. The kind of guy who ends up in TRP because he was a nice guy, which is a huge section of the community. Because the belief is “there’s no way they’d be that much of an asshole. I better just comply.” It took me to get asked literally an inhuman amount of stuff (quite literally too much work for 1 man in the time it needed done) and realize it before I said “oh fuck, he’s been manipulating me for months and I just took it.”
audit123 5y ago
Are you an accountant by the way?
audit123 5y ago
This happened to me as well at work fun that guy. Let me ask you this, I noticed after a while that he would copy me while talking to me, for example my mannerisms or the way I am standing or nodding. Is that also a form of manipulation or some other tactic?
SUCK_MY_DICTIONARY 5y ago
I’m an engineer.
And that’s called body mirroring, it’s instinctive. Probably not manipulative.
Some manipulative tactics I’ve noticed at work were:
Manipulation is subtle, it’s supposed to be covert and deniable. But there also is usually some goal. Body mirroring could be used to instill a feeling of comfort (it does that instinctively) while he is trying to coerce you. A good idea is to slow the interaction down and imagine he is emailing you what he is saying. It’s a lot easier to catch the bullshit - good manipulators never write bullshit in an email because there is a paper trail.
MajesticPresentation 5y ago
I think body mirroring is one of the more well known tactics. If it is as blatant as it seemed from the guys comment, i think the guy might be doing it knowingly. Admittedly, it's difficult to tell whether they are being blatant, or if you are just better at recognising. Also very dependant on the person themselves and using past experiences as a reference to make the determination.
I love what you said about not using emails and leaving a paper trail. I never considered that to be a thing.
SUCK_MY_DICTIONARY 5y ago
True. Email trail is part of that smoke screen tactic. A good manipulator is kind of like a ninja. They try to strike so that nobody sees them, and if you should happen to, they want to make it look like you are insane for complaining.
MindEnabler 5y ago
The 48 laws of power is a very good books, but very long and too hard to implement when you are a beginner.
Beginners should always start with a framework that is light and easy to implement - this will yield better results than going directly with the full blueprint. Always keep in mind Pareto's law.
SUCK_MY_DICTIONARY 5y ago
Agree. I have a hard time getting through 48 Laws. It’s high quality but it’s almost like reading a DSM.
Rakgnar 5y ago
http://www.wikisummaries.org/wiki/48_Laws_of_Power
MajesticPresentation 5y ago
This is great. You could use it as a reference along with the full book. See if there are any situations where you might need the info from it, reference that list to see which laws are relevant, and use the book to piece them together.
Sumsar01 5y ago
Get the audiobook it's great.
MindEnabler 5y ago
Not sure you'll be able to memorize anything from the audiobok, given how extensive the book is, and requires you to go back often to fully understand everything.
Sumsar01 5y ago
Just listen to a bunch of times. It can be done while doing other stuff. You might not retain much, but you wont from reading it either and since you want to intetnalize this stuff you would probably have to read it more than once either way.
Pooptrition 5y ago
A lot of what you’re describing crops up in people with what psychiatrists call Anti Social Personality Disorder, or the Psychopathy spectrum. I’ve encountered a couple and had to gain some wisdom the hard way. These folks can be charming as hell while they learn your every vulnerability, then exploit them ruthlessly. Gaslighting is a textbook tactic. Like you said, it’s all about destroying your self worth and getting a hold over you. Set your boundaries and set them firm, and don’t let anyone rewrite reality. Knowing the kind of people who use these tactics exist is the first step to thwarting them.
And before someone thinks these sorts of manipulations are good mating or social techniques, in my experience, doing these things will yield only bad karma and pain, resentment, and ultimately drive every worthwhile person away. The few successful psychopath types have been honing their craft from childhood and while it may yield some short term material gains, they ultimately don’t get to possess the kind of fulfilling relationships that make life worth living.
SUCK_MY_DICTIONARY 5y ago
So much yes on your last bit. I didn’t want to add all the disclaimers in the original text because I felt it would’ve made it too cloudy. I had hoped the examples and the suggested defenses showed the futility of trying to force someone to do something.
In the end, you’ll be like a zookeeper should you be a “good manipulator”. Everyone around you would gladly kill you given the opportunity, and maybe not even know why. When you die, people would rather spit on your grave. I know TRP is all about not appealing to morality, at the same time, guys like George Washington will go down in human history not because he was a manipulator but because he knew how to use power properly. In a way, he still emasculates every man born today - people have been born, died and forgotten who learned about this guy in history class. Manipulators do not live an abundance lifestyle. Fundamentally, they couldn’t. Their actions scream one-itis.
Warped_Mindless 5y ago
Lol. Plenty of psychopaths have amazing lives but you just dint realize they are a psychopath. Truely talented psychopaths and machiavellians can usually hide it damn near forever. You will just see them as someone who is highly charming and very lucky.
Isbjornsolo 5y ago
You will also find that a lot of them don't have any close friends though & people they can rely on long term. They will move around a lot due to need not necessarily wanting to do so.
Humans are social animals and we "need" to be part of a tribe.
[deleted]
[deleted]
Clutchafied 5y ago
Story or my life. Complied with probably every single Tom dick and Harry in my life, only to realize that all of them were manipulating me, and that the people who seemed liked assholes were actually the genuine ones, because they did not want to continue feeding me this diluted idea of being submissive to everything everyone says.
It’s a sad and ironic reality honestly
I do think that people who fall into this trap of “people cannot be this manipulative so let me comply” come out the other side 10 times stronger than the before and than any other mind-twisted manipulative individual, after taking TRP, because of their past traumatic experiences
SUCK_MY_DICTIONARY 5y ago
Yep. I wish I never had to ‘become an expert’ at this shit, but I’ve seen in my little bit of life so far (25) that situations change dramatically from year to year. I’m very glad to have a framework that I trust to hold up to years more of situations.
I think a lot of these skills maybe were not taught in our childhoods. I had a memory the other day of a kid who bullied me relentlessly and everybody knew it - then one day I decked him. And all of the parents acted like I was a monster, and nobody stood up for me. When I’m a parent, if that happens, I am going to reward my kid. I wasn’t violent, I wasn’t ever going to be violent - and should I have been, there are other ways to train that out. The only lesson I learned is “when someone is making you feel like shit, you better submit or society will hate you.” They raised a generation of pussies like that. I won’t continue that idiotic trend. Defend yourself against attackers (which is what they are), and don’t feel bad about it.
Clutchafied 5y ago
True man. This shit runs deep
Anyway really appreciate your post, thank you
[deleted] 5y ago
[deleted]
SUCK_MY_DICTIONARY 5y ago
It took me until eh, now, to realize this. Here’s the thing they don’t understand: let a kid punch a bully in school, or else that kid will be spending hours and hours in therapy or never realizing his full potential.
I understand they “can’t condone violence” but to me, if they gave me detention but the principal said “hey listen, we have to do this to get the state funding but you did the right thing.” I would’ve walked away empowered.
Again, it’s 5 minutes when you’re a kid, or months of training/re-education later. You just gotta show your kids not to ever take shit from the bullies.
[deleted]
Ixrxxni 5y ago
Sounds like you have cared too much what a person said. A person can't make you feel like shit. Your perception of what they've said makes you feel like shit. The only way a person can attack you is physically and that is illegal. If you somehow feel attacked by words then that's your problem. Be wittier with comebacks, agree and amplify, do not give a fuck, verbal judo, walk away. They are plenty of ways to counteract "verbal abuse." A person's words can't hurt you unless you let them.
Rakgnar 5y ago
Well, most of the people aren't stone cold psychopaths so there might be some emotional pathways to influence other people, lol... One could, of course, pretend otherwise, but looking around shows that people are easily affected by emotional manipulation. It is not like we have been conditioned by millions of years evolution to be social animals... It is almost like saying that it is your fault that a bullet can hurt your head since your skull is so weak, lol. And it isn't just about winning some verbal quarrels. Those kind of people usually tries to poison whole group against you and they succeed in it often enough. Being just strong doesn't really help too much since people dislike people who they think are better than them. If you really want to win against those people, one almost have to tailor their personality to be strong and socially likable so it is almost impossible to attack against, but one likely loses oneself in that operation.
Yes, you might even "win" if your community have some decent people and superiors, but if community has those kind of people in it, then it is somewhat likely that superiors don't mind them too much or even encourage them.
But really if you have even really need to defend against that kind of people, then you have partially already lost since either community is full of those people or just ignorant people since intelligent people would see through those kind of actions. Stupid people are easily swayed and manipulative people don't like people with moral integrity for obvious reasons so it would an uphill battle.
It will be just never ending fight if you cannot assert real dominance over them or just treat those manipulative people like shit as they are deserved to be treated.
SUCK_MY_DICTIONARY 5y ago
You might not have been in a situation like I’m referring to here. Sometimes in a job people will stick you between the rock and the hard place, and you will constantly be fighting your way out. And you can’t just ignore the work they ask you to do.
Again, people acting like this do not want you to realize you’re in the situation. They want you to think they aren’t doing it - it’s all in your head. Gaslighting is a technique they use all the time.
Ixrxxni 5y ago
Well that's different, in a job you are automatically signing your free will away trading your time and work for money. You are giving up power when you become a worker under someone. This is more of a problem of the system rather than someone manipulating you. The system is unavoidably manipulative. Even people at the top have to appeal to stockholders. Everyone is basically a manipulated slave when it comes to work. However, in social and sexual situations which is what this sub is about, you never have to feel manipulated or attacked if you are smart and witty enough.
exoduslife 5y ago
when you realise this, and make it part of the equation when people want to manipulate you, you will come out on top most of the time. By understanding your time is finite, you realise that you have to be selfish with it in order to be successful and not be manipulated.
RightHandWolf 5y ago
There is a most specialized version of female manipulation. My friend Chris summed it up best when he described his ex, in that she would bully him from a position of weakness. Almost all women do this when they're arguing with you. They always paint themselves as being the long-suffering, overly patient partner who gets nothing but aggravation for their trouble. Every little good thing she ever did for you becomes part of the case for her eventual canonization. Every little bad thing you did is going to condemn you to an eternity of fire and brimstone. A martyrdom complex, in other words. Some of them are Jedi Masters at this.
[deleted]
SUCK_MY_DICTIONARY 5y ago
Yes. I had a girlfriend who would constantly send me affectionate gifts for no reason. It was cute. And she would tell her girlfriends and even my friends about them. But what happened was that there was a covert contract that I had to always let her pick the most expensive restaurants, always go where she wanted to go, lay around when she wanted to lay around.
Basically, she came up with her own reward system for me which I never agreed to. When I didnt comply, I looked like an asshole. Like “dude seriously, she made you a handmade photo album and she wants to go to a restaurant you hate and order up a $150 check (in college) what’s the big deal?” The big deal was that I never agreed to any terms.
RightHandWolf 5y ago
The covert contract is part and parcel of the dating game, unfortunately. I know this isn't a new observation, but women give up the sex, hoping to receive commitment in return. Men offer the commitment and the comfort in hopes of getting sex. The time-worn trade-off. It's hard not to become jaded and cynical about it all.
Managicall 5y ago
A common thing most negotiators do not understand is that you relate to the perpetrator only so they may not know you and perhaps they disclose knowledge about themselves.
Onein1024th 5y ago
I recently had an employee try to do this by withholding information, taking over decisions that weren't hers to make, sowing confusion and gaslighting. I've only learned all this in hindsight, of course.
She just seemed like an often illogical and quirky but passionate person.
You just described her playbook perfectly. I only ousted her when I caught her in one specific instance either being manipulative or completely inept.
SUCK_MY_DICTIONARY 5y ago
If I had power over a person like this at work, I would fire them. There are too many good people who will not act like this. The thing about these people is that they will destroy you over time if you don’t set hard boundaries with them.
Onein1024th 5y ago
yeah I did, it took me awhile to figure out what was happening. This guide you wrote has really helped me understand the situation better.
Any other early warning signs you've noticed? She proved to be an immense time-waster for me and the organization as a whole. It was like having a competitor trying to sabotage your every effort at setting up good procedures, transparency, or productivity; all to satisfy her own ego
SUCK_MY_DICTIONARY 5y ago
The last line there explains it the best. I realized this with a coworker lately. He is literally like having a competitor working within the company.
All I can say is that it’s hard. They are doing everything they can to make it look seamless, but you can feel that it is not really seamless. It’s usually very broken and frustrated feeling to work with them.
Something I started doing is just saying “why?” A negative manipulator will never have the answer to that question, or it will be never hold water. That’s the last thing they think of. Be careful also if they have the answer too quickly. For example, why should I do that? “Well if you don’t the customer will never talk to us again.” Really? Over a single thing? A normal answer would be “I guess you don’t have to but Jim can’t finish his report until you do it, and the deal is waiting on that report. So please finish it.”
Again, the tactic is opaque fear, they know more than you, you could never possibly understand. But they don’t all work that way so it is just important to start with how it feels and work backwards.
Quo210 5y ago
This was an amazing ready my man. I'll be saving it for re-reading it again. The kind of things that need to be internalized through a lot of repetition.
This stuff is what hooked me the most to TRP teachings. The manipulation part and identifying the reality of people. I fucking love it.
somebullshitrp 5y ago
This is well-written, and eye opening- thank you.
Most victims of manipulation wouldn't even think twice about the behavior of their manipulator, let alone be able to recognize the signs that they are being manipulated. Which is fascinating, considering how fundamental manipulation is in every facet of our lives; especially when it comes to any interactions with women.
Learn to spot the signs that you are being manipulated, and learn the strategies to escape or avoid it.
Great post.
AutoModerator 5y ago
Why are we quarantined? The admin don't want you to know.
Register on our backup site: https://www.trp.red and reserve your reddit name today.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.
JackOfAllTalent 5y ago
This feels like defense against the dark arts where the sidebar is learning the dark arts. It gave me better internal references than the sidebar material though. I still fail to imagine manipulations that happen in short spans of time. Perhaps more salesmanship tactics would help. I've read people saying salesmanship and game have a lot in common. I'm curious to see the tangents there.
SUCK_MY_DICTIONARY 5y ago
True. This is a slightly different situation, it’s basically: what to do when someone is trying to make you submit.
The key difference between manipulating (in the context here) and salesmanship is that a manipulator is trying to force others to comply who do not have an interest in complying. As I said about the farmer, you don’t really need convincing. Of course, there is some play there (brand competition etc.) but that’s a different subject. This is more if you have determined that someone is trying to coerce you, how to recognize it, and what to do - all the while trying to not let it affect you at all. In general, this is more like when you have many options, and you have fallen trap to thinking there’s a monopoly. Wife not wanting sex or boss not wanting to give a raise is that example. In the moment, it’s so easy to feel there is no escape. A salesman who does that will have a horrific reputation, potentially legal issues as well. Not good.
While writing this, it occurred to me that many in TRP submit their own wants for the sake of “winning” or avoiding a situation. I know I have done that many times. It’s another hard thing to swallow that you already lost when you tell yourself you don’t want something that you do. For me, I want my work to be relatively peaceful - so I have to recognize that someone disrupting the peace could be trying to manipulate me. Recognition is the real power here.
[deleted]
[deleted]