So HuffPost Women (I know, but bear with me) posted a video about a new ad campaign in China to 'fight' pressure about marrying young (which is the norm, seeing as about 4 out of 5 Chinese women ages 25-29 are married). The women who don't marry before around 27 are viewed as 'leftover' and are seen as an embarrassment to parents and families.
Now this ad campaign seems to be pushing BP ideals (claiming the Wall can be reversed or destroyed) over in the non-Western world, which is largely seen as a possible alternative for Western RP men who refuse to touch Western women but haven't gone MGTOW quite yet.
What are your thoughts on this?
Edit: formatting for clarity
Jujubes06 7y ago
If you've ever met and interacted with a man from China, you'd know why there are so many 剩女。They aren't good captains and are really lacking in the ability to provide and guide the family. Sons are the little emperors and they are selfish and spoiled. Hence the rise of the unmarried women. I'm not defending Chinese women but I'd say that before you judge all Asian women, take a look at their potential partners. How do I know this? I'm Asian and I just returned from a 2.5year stint in the Chinese Capitol
bromance946 7y ago
Can you elaborate on the "not good captains" point? What specific actions do Chinese men not take that Western men would take?
randomoaf 7y ago
Actually this is not true. Chinese women in the bigger cities tend to demand insane things from men. Men put their effort to get it but most of the time they hit a ceiling. Since men have a lot of options due to the sheer #'s, they can be more selective and wait for the woman that has more realistic expectations.
Jujubes06 7y ago
They don't take the lead in a relationship, they depend on their wives to make decisions for the family and to "socialize"
randomoaf 7y ago
It depends on the area. Chinese families can be matriarchal when it comes to family matters. Men take the lead in financial matters. This is not wrong by any means. It's just different. You being Asian has nothing to do with anything given that you're not a local and let's not forget that the 1 child policy has led to raising daughters selfish/spoiled as well.
Aerobus 7y ago
This video is complete BP propaganda. What those feminists are NOT telling you is that these women have unrealistic and incredibly high standards.
I bookmarked a video of chinese women openly admitting their ridiculous standards.
I will search for it and hopefully edit my comment soon.FOUND IT: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zf2--TJYuxc
The youtube comment sums up what's wrong:
[deleted] 7y ago
[deleted]
boredcentsless 7y ago
The three things you just listed are orders of magnitude harder to get in China than the US. 12K USD is more than the average person makes in a year. That's almost 2 whole years worth of wages.
[deleted] 7y ago
[deleted]
boredcentsless 7y ago
Jesus that's not even close to accurate. A crappy English has a super inflated salary. You're talking about foreign wages in China. Let's look at what the actual Chinese people make. The second highest paid city for office workers is Shanghai, where the average monthly salary for an office worker is 7,500 RMB a month. souce. So that's 90k RMB annually, which comes out to a little over 14,000 USD per year. So it's more like wanting a guy to have 50k in the bank. Still not that bad, right?
Well, he's in Shanghai, which has out of control ral estate prices. So every square of foot of the house he wants to buy is going to set him back over 1,000 USD. So he can save for a whole year and buy a closet. That might be out the window. He can always go outside the city center, where prices will be about half, so 500 per foot^2 .
Young Chinese are way less affluent than you seem to think. I would know. I worked there.
[deleted] 7y ago
[deleted]
boredcentsless 7y ago
Average guy makes 7k. Average guy in Shanghai makes more. Average guy in a smaller, poorer city will make less. Duh.
And you're still talking about foreigner wages which are inflated. If you don't think they are, you have no clue what you're talking about. And that internship for a few months was a 2 year marketing job, so yeah, I've been there for a while. And I got paid way more than most Chinese people I knew.
Inflated in the sense that it's a retarded baseline to use. A twit ESL teacher at a high school will make double what the actual Chinese teacher makes. A white face has a premium of a couple thousand RMB.
So yea, saying that because an English teacher makes 10k, a foreigner working in China will make 60k, your average Chinese office worker will make X is an ignorant thing to say. You have no clue what you're talking about and it really shows.
Aerobus 7y ago
In China, where there is a culture of staying with the family, and added competition due to a much larger population, getting those three things are exponentially harder than in the U.S., Britain, or any other major western nation. The Yuan is also worth less than the USD, so accumulating such large sums of money as savings are going to even more harder. Buying a house where prefectures and high rise apartment complexes (due to limited space) is like trying to buy property in NYC. That should give you some idea of the differences.
I agree that having money saved up for children is important, but the number of Chinese men that can realistically save up 300,000 GMB (around 45,000 USD) is so small, that those men would be able to get their own mistresses and pay for hookers. In short, the women are not living in reality.
The answer is in your question. Average standards. Luckily in the west women are able to have the standards that a guy must not live with his parents, must have money saved up, and must have a car, because there is still a significant portion that meet these. But in China, the proportion of men that meet those standards is much less, and I guarantee you they aren't going to want Mrs. Average.
[deleted] 7y ago
[deleted]
Aerobus 7y ago
First, I'm not claiming to know enough about Chinese culture and the Chinese dating market. I'm not Chinese myself. I am basing my views based on facts that I have learned (e.g. the average income in China, the cost of a house).
Second, I don't believe I am misunderstanding your question. I believe that when everything is boiled down, under-average people will realistically only be able to get under-average partners, average people will realistically only be able to get average partners, and above-average people will be able to get above-average partners. In essence, that is what TRP and RPW are trying to do: help people become above average (in differing respects) so that they can get what they want (which typically are above-average partners).
Third, to answer your question directly, it is not my place to say what standards the average marriage-minded Chinese woman should have. It is for women to decide. If they want to have the standards as seen in the video good for them. I am not mad at them. My feelings are not hurt. I will laugh at them however because the reality is the men that meet the standards they have will not want to pair with them.
With that being said, I believe that average marriage-minded Chinese women (who still live in mainland China) will benefit from better understanding the mindset of men. If they are exposed to what men actually think and believe, such as some of what was said in the above video, they will be forced to accept that the men they will be looking for won't be looking for them.
[deleted] 7y ago
[deleted]
Aerobus 7y ago
Yes, precisely.
I honestly do not have a good answer, and I never claimed to. I just know that if they keep clinging to those expectations, they won't have much success.
IsleView 7y ago
I find this confusing:
China has a larger gender disparity than average - about 118 boys are born for every 100 girls, against a global average of 103 to 107. Some are even calling it a demographic crisis. And yet, these women don't seem to be making use of their distinct advantage. From your HuffPo article:
This appears symptomatic of BP teachings. The writing is on the wall. I assume they must be actively avoiding attention from viable males or are failing to meet baseline acceptability. At this point, these women have no one but themselves to blame.
Citizen_Bongo 7y ago
Women in China are intent on marrying up, or at least into wealth.
I went out with a Chinese girl that was very much the opposite of the stereotype, outgoing confident and not at all shy. She'd been told that she was too funny by Chinese ex's, had it implied she should tone that down. I'm no expert on their culture but they are clearly easily emasculated when they see things in women beyond what they see in themselves.
My ex was from a rich family, they gave her hundreds of dollars a month to spend on hand bags, make up and whatever. As well as buying her an apartment with a sea view back home, these girls expect luxury. She was livid when I said men that buy their wives that material bullshit are idiots.
It makes sense that the system leaves a social underclass of men that are below the standards of the lowest women. With women at the top looking for men that don't exist and seen as far less favourable than those in the middle, I guess they could maybe lower their standards they could find some Chinese peasant?
Also they constantly put their men down, whether it's on their looks, sexual prowess, though apparently they don't even try to pleasure women there. My ex was telling me about a friend who married Arab in his 50's, she asked what he was like in bed, she said better than a Chinese guy in his 20's.
MentORPHEUS 7y ago
I'm surprised there would be leftover women at all in China. You'd think at this point, almost any woman would be worth like a billion Yuan on the sexual marketplace there.
Sociologists have long pondered the effects of the one-child-per-family rule causing selection for males, and the resulting surplus. Some even predicted the emergence of new family forms, such as one wife with multiple husbands. Though I do believe the expected disparity necessary for this phenomenon was far greater than the current 100:118.
[deleted] 7y ago
The perceived abundance of male prospects probably plays into the "paradox of choice". Women are especially susceptible to these forces.
-TheOutsid3r- 7y ago
These women have effectively nobody to blame but themselves, it's in a way a similar phenomen we see in the West except far more pronounced. I.e they didn't want the men they could get and the men they wanted didn't want them for various reasons.
Now they're rapidly entering the age where they value as wife is about to drop through the floor and is only going to pick up speed on the way down, while they themselves refuse to budge on their expectations.
One of the main reasons for marriage has always been to have children, we diluted that in recent decades but it still very much remains. So marrying a woman 30+ is a risky bargain, 35+ and you're basically shooting yourself in the foot as man.
alisonstone 7y ago
With the one child policy, fertility is far more valuable. If someone fails to reproduce, the family line is dead. It is not like you have a brother or sister that can reproduce. You don't even have cousins if your parents can't have siblings. The Chinese don't want to take any risk on fertility.
People don't think about lineage that much in the West, because we don't have a one child policy. A lot of people say they don't care if they don't pass their genes down. But their genes are already all over the place already with all their siblings, uncles/aunts, cousins, etc. If extended family doesn't exist, people would think differently.
-TheOutsid3r- 7y ago
Hey I take offense to that, not having children to continue on when I can't anymore is one of the few things which really bother me. If I were living in another place and time I'd most likely have a bunch running around already.
And no adoption isn't a choice for me, what I want are actual children of mine.
[deleted] 7y ago
At what age do you think women become infertile?
-TheOutsid3r- 7y ago
Oh, quite a bit later. Doesn't change that at 30 you're already considered "old" for giving birth especially as a first time mother and that 35 and beyond various risks involving pregnancy and the infant are going through the roof.
Why, is this some "women can have children just as well at 40!" thing?
cxj 7y ago
A certain department store parable comes to mind.... one I first read posted by u/wingnut
[deleted] 7y ago
Most of them are left from being way too picky. I'm not saying they shouldn't have standards but they set impossible standards( makes double what they do, university degree, owns a house and luxury car,tall, handsome, etc.) that most men in China are never going to meet. And the men who do meet them are looking for younger girls. They've done this to themselves there are 30 million single men and not one of them met your standards.
[deleted] 7y ago
Rome was founded by a much smaller tribe of men looking for women for wives... just imagine an army of 30 Million.