Throughout the month of September, we are taking out old posts, dusting them off and bringing them to you as an RPW refresher course. This week we are covering the broad strokes of RPW and this post in particular covers the difference between what men and women are attracted to in the opposite sex.
A question about "The 16 Commandments of Poon":
http://heartiste.wordpress.com/the-sixteen-commandments-of-poon/ cropped up on /r/PurplePillDebate and one of our regular denizens seemed a little appalled at them (understandable), so i started trying to think about how we reconcile an understanding that "men" are "like that" with the fact that men and women still seek to form relationships and at least try to be faithful to each other.
TRP makes claims to be based on evolutionary psychology, and it is--but it is also based on what is referred to in political philosophy as a "state of nature". A state of nature isn't a scientific description of human behavior, but a fundamental first premise regarding human nature from which the rest of the philosophy flows. an example many people have heard is Hobbes' dictum regarding humans living without government "the life of man, solitary, poore, nasty, brutish, and short."
So, what is the nature of humans in the state of nature according to TRP.
Male ephebephiliac polygyny--A mouthful. Let's unpack it. If Men existed in a universe where fully formed, hot 16-18 year old girls with long, silky hair and .7 hip-waist ratios grew out of the ground without agency, wants, needs and desires of their own and without families to care for and protect them, men would kill each other to collect as many of them as possible--replacing them with new ones as the older ones cycled out.
Female hypergamy--If 6'2" 34 year old I-Banker millionaires grew out of the ground fully formed with no agency, wants, needs and desires of their own and no families to look after their interests--25 women would each chase and even consent to share the one that managed to make $1000001, while keeping a weather eye on any one who manages to make $1000002 as an option for jumping ship.
Why do these two statements sound both ludicrous and true at the same time?
Because humans recognize that we don't live in this world where the other people have no agency, wants, needs and desires of their own
That these two statements tell us something about human nature tells us nothing about the totality of human experience. In reality, we all have these kernels in the core of our sexuality, but on top of it we have a multitude of other factors. Our agency/ego, looks, temperament, personality type, class, culture, social status, age, education--all of these things accrete onto that raw kernel like layers of a pearl. This individuation on top of a base common nature by sex is what causes the "Sexual Marketplace". We do not in fact fall from trees as the Platonic form of what the opposite sex wishes it could attain, and we do not live in a world in which others have no agency, wants needs and desires.
We live in a world in which we have a dynamic place within a shifting, everchanging sexual marketplace. At any given time a man or woman might be on the rise, at the peak, or in the decline of their sexual market value with regard to the opposite sex. Our market value is based on how closely we conform to the other sex’s state of nature as possible within our bracket, and this is key. A 50 year old poor man may WANT a 17 year old hot girl (as per nature), but he generally realistically understands he isn’t going to get one and shoots for the most neotenous, slender, silky-haired youngest woman in his class, say, a 38 year old woman. A chubby, less than attractive 29 year old woman may WANT a 6’2” 34 year old millionaire I-banker, but if she’s realistic (another can of worms) she will likely shoot for what is in her class, a shorter man, a poorer man, a man with less options. This all accounts for why many people have a hostile reaction to many core TRP beliefs. They say “but look, fat, ugly people get together all the time and form couples”, as if to disprove the core sexual nature of Man. Of course they do, but solely because we are ALL as humans trapped in a world delimited by our OWN features and viable options, not because even the ugliest, least attractive person wouldn’t gladly take the MOST attractive possible person, the 10, if they could get it.
This discomforts people, it makes them feel bad about their place in the “Great Chain of Being” of the SMP. This is understandable. But feeling bad about the world doesn’t help you live in it. Recognizing the world for what it is and dealing graciously with your place in it, as well as putting significant effort into elevating your place to the best of your ability, does, and leads to greater overall happiness.

LateralThinker13 4y ago
My only disagreement with any of this is the polygyny part about men. Men go through phases. When they're not looking for an LTR, sure. I buy it. But when they ARE looking for an LTR, most men just want the one quality woman. More women at that point are just a lot of extra work for minimal return.
HappilyMrs 4y ago
The biggest bit I struggle with here is the idea that women would happily share a HVM because I dont know any women who would willingly share a man. Do I just have a particular circle with a particular mindset, or is this something other women feel?
I wouldn't want a man I had to share even if he was Chaddy McChadface
Inner_Honeydew_2878 4y ago
I would not say I’d be happy to share a HVM but I always feel like if it’s the only way for me to get him then I’ll just agree to that. HVM is rare and the one I want usually are not interested in me so yeah i think sharing is better than nothing i guess
DelicateDevelopment 4y ago
Many possible reasons are thinkable
1) possibility: A woman will not be able to submit to a man that she considers to be of lower value. So there is an incentive to share this one man she knows who is of higher value than herself, even if he is married. She can share, but she cannot go below her own value, because men that are perceived as lower value cause a deep feeling of dislike/repulsion
2) possibility: she is part of a social group that barely enables the men of that group to provide for themselves, so a married men from a wealthier group could be a safer bet
3) possibility: she doesn't value herself enough to think that she is deserving of being exclusive
4) possibility: is used to having to share her father with his new partner and therefore allocating family ressources/time/attention outside of direct family
5) possibility: grew up in a world were monogamy is promoted as unhealthy evil relict from patriarchy where people (men) wanted to own their women, while polygamy is promoted as more healthy and more representative of "generous and free (=true) love"
6)...?
It is always about the possible options, but from a purely biological, recreational, perspective, any option, is in terms of survival better than no option at all.
And this is why so many women then at the end of their "youth" settle for someone they actually perceive as low value and why then this leads to all kind of unhappy relationship dynamics, because the one thing we cannot compensate with even the biggest amount of patience and deferrence is having a man next to us whom we cannot respect or admire or be thankful to.
verdantsound 4y ago
the flaw to these “truths” is the assumption that people absolutely need another person. I argue that with the security of basic needs, shelter, food, a reliable income, and a little spending money on the side, the prospect of being single elevates at the expense of being in a relationship with a suboptimal partner. In modern society you don’t need to settle (as much) because being single isn’t so bad.
abacabbmk 4y ago
Are they with actual HVM?
Even if they are, some wont, but MANY would.
fishingismygame 4y ago
It honestly depends. If you had Lebron James who is literally a billionaire at this point and pays for anything you want? I don’t think you’d mind if he had a little action on the side. But obviously not every girl can get a Lebron James
HappilyMrs 4y ago
It would bother me massively. I have to be someone's one and only
softrevolution_ 4y ago
So, part of what made Mr. Second not work out is that I was sharing him. :( I tried polyamory fully believing that the three of us would make one massively happy family. Which was great until they trickle-truthed how much of a compromise polyamory was between what he wanted and what she wanted... and that he was never, ever going to make me an equal priority to her.
Since then I've clung to monogamy like a barnacle to the bottom of a boat.
HappilyMrs 4y ago
It's a big deal breaker for many
MuttonDressedAsGoose 4y ago
Sounds like you were the unicorn of a throuple? I have heard that the bi woman making the triad is often in an unequal position.
softrevolution_ 4y ago
Vee: two women agree to trade off one man, without themselves being involved. She was strictly monogamous. He was frankly greedy and couldn't keep it in his pants, so rather than divorce him, they agreed that he should have girlfriends with rules in place and full disclosure. I wanted it to be more like the vees I'd heard about, where the women are at least cordial.
Instead I drove her to drink.
Oops.
LateralThinker13 4y ago
In my experience, a V can rarely work because it's two people competing for the apex partner. Men can timeshare a woman sometimes, but women IMHO can't, not long-term. Only one I ever heard of working long-term was a V where the apex was a woman but the partners were a woman and a man; they weren't the same gender so what the apex got out of it from each wasn't fully overlapping and they didn't feel as much like competitors.
I'm kinda-sorta poly, but for long-term I would want a triangle only, not a V or any other shape. Wife and I are Bi, but not looking, and especially not after having a kid now. So it's more a fantasy at this point (yeah yeah, unicorn hunting, yadda yadda, I won't hunt them but if one stops to graze in our garden, well...)
MuttonDressedAsGoose 4y ago
Ah!
I'm not entirely monogamous but I can only deal with that sort of thing if it's casual and I don't want to know much about the other people they're inv with.
SunshineSundress 4y ago
Polygamy is a difficult and culturally taboo type of relationship. While I think it’s certainly possible for some couples (er... maybe throuples is a better word) to enjoy them, for many others it just isn’t feasible given their culture, personality type, or temperament. That doesn’t change the fact that polygyny has been a pretty normal and prevalent type of union throughout human history. Until around the 19th/20th centuries, men had multiple wives and concubines. The Mormons did it. The European elite did it. The Asians did it. Hell, Muslim culture STILL does it, and so do some African cultures. It’s been an option many women across cultures have chosen to take throughout human history. That tendency of ours is still evolutionarily coded into us - most people just don’t exercise it anymore in the West because of culture and social norms and how they tie into our modern motivations.
HappilyMrs 4y ago
That makes sense, thank you
PinkNinjaKitty 4y ago
I've been reading "Wife No. 19" by one of Brigham Young's wives. The full title is "Wife No. 19, or The Story of a Life in Bondage ; Being a Complete Exposé of Mormonism, and Revealing the Sorrows, Sacrifices and Sufferings of Women in Polygamy." She tells her life story and recounts how suicidally miserable the multiple wives of the Mormons were. Polygamy may have been a prevalent type of union throughout human history, but I'd argue that it's not an evolutionary desire for women. It could possibly be an evolutionary desire for men (as the more women they impregnate, the more their genes are passed on).
SunshineSundress 4y ago
I definitely agree that there are a lot of downsides to polygyny, even for those who choose to engage with it, if it’s not executed fairly. And to be fair, there’s a LOT of room for it to be executed unfairly.
Still, I think there is some evolutionary desire in it for women. Women often want the men with the most resources and the best ability to provide. Unfortunately, every other woman wants that man too. While some logically decide they’d rather be with a man with less resources and less of an ability to provide so that they wouldn’t have to share, some other women logically decide that sharing a very successful, very wealthy man would still provide MORE for her than a not so successful man could even if she had a full monopoly over his provisions.
It’s why women from MENA countries sometimes share wealthy husbands. Poorer men can’t afford the dowry, and are implied to be unable to provide for her in the future. It’s also why rockstars have tourbuses full of eager groupies and why millionaire wives turn a blind eye to their husbands’ side piece(s).
I looked up that book though. That guy had 55 wives! That’s bonkers!
free_breakfast_ 4y ago
Small snippet of a personal random sample experience.
Back when I was younger and dating casually in college, I had met/dated girls who were open to polyamorous relationships (unprompted on my half). I wasn't interested in 'spinning plates' as per rp terminology and was fairly upfront about my intentions when dating.
I noticed that this situation normally occurred with girls who didn't have the highest self-esteem and or had blended family situations (parents having a divorce and new marriage) growing up and came from family backgrounds/socioeconomics that weren't the most stable and reliable with some sort of instilled guiding principles such as religion, politics, or wealth.
Other girls who did come from wealthier families or families that were principled centered were likely in their 'experimental/exploration' phase and were wanting to experience life outside of their traditional upbringing. I noticed that these girls normally settled down fairly soon after college and it was only a 'one' off thing (if they were ever interested in polyamory) with a few hookups between their serial monogamy.
Whisper 4y ago
One of the greatest obstacles that "FunSize", "FanGirl" and I have faced in this respect is lack of cultural acceptance.
It's a little like being gay, but without the support network and pride parades. People feel totally comfortable being bigoted against us where they would feel ashamed of doing the same to gay couples. I've even faced a fair amount of that same attitude here.
Usually it comes through an overfocus on the sexual aspects of our relationship. Somehow, because our lifestyle is seen as a hedonic ideal for men, it must therefore be about, and solely about, hedonism. We can't possibly be having any sort of meaningful interaction with our clothes on, and everything I have done to arrange my life this way must simply be in service to my desire to have regular threesomes.
It's nonsense. There is absolutely no basis for the assumption that monogamy is somehow so "natural" and "stable" that nothing else works at all, and that no human society, culture, or tribe has ever had a high male mortality rate it needed to adapt to.
My opinion, which does not constitute proof, but is formed over all my years of studying this stuff and testing it... is that men are programmed to be jealous, and women can be taught to be jealous. Which most cultures do.
Advanced_Bar_673 4y ago
Just wanted to say thank you for sharing your family dynamic! Very interesting and beneficial.. thank you u/Whisper
DelicateDevelopment 4y ago
I think in that generality this is only true for the situation where the man has enough ressources for both women. But it has never been the majority of men that have been in such a position? So that means food for the second woman's kids always means less food for one's own kids. Jealously is programmed into us as well, but due to circumstances women can feel forced to enter such a compromise if they don't see better options for themselves.
They might be able to accept such an arrangement and it can be enforced on them, but given free choice they would in most cases be happier about not needing to share.
So we are just able to subject jealousy to the greater good, because, given certain circumstances, we needed to learn to do so.
It is the same logic with respect to men that needed to learn better impulse and emotional control, because of the circumstances. It does not mean that man need to be taught to feel. They feel, they just deal differently with feelings, once matured.
free_breakfast_ 4y ago
What are your thoughts on alternative relationships becoming something that's widely accepted as a social norm in the us as a political and social norm?
It's a covert secret that we have a "don't ask, don't tell" policy that people with wealth, power, and competency can 'break the rules' and live life on their terms regardless of societal programming and common consensus. Even if people are not at the peak in those areas, they can still begin dictating life on their terms as they began building power.
I was browsing Reddit the other day and found a user in her early 40s who was a married executive (open marriage) that had 2 long term adultery partners within the last 12 years (1 of her 'AP' had passed away in a plane accident).
From her account, I felt that she came from a place of good will (she had a fairly good perspective on the situation, was realistic, lots principle and integrity) and was likely keeping her marriage on account of her children similar to Bill and Melinda Gate's marriage and recent divorce.
She only screened and qualified across and up based on socioeconomics and had an extremely selective process for her AP and found that the men who carried the least risk and maximized best compatibilities ("education and intellectual capacity, financial resource, time/schedule flexibility, travel capacity, lifestyle, etc.") were likewise business executives who were married and no longer romantic with their spouses.
Her user account was fairly enlightening from the perspective of insider knowledge of adultery in the executive circles.
I personally view these alternative relationships (throuples, polyamory, consentual adultery) being covert secrets in stable societies for at least another 30 to 50 years in the united states until decentralization and corporatocracy began shifting power from the federal level to businesses and they began shifting public opinion in this direction. This is discounting major population disruptions or some sort of mass societal decline that destabilizes society accelerating this process from a different angle and position.
[deleted]
SunshineSundress 4y ago
I’ve always wondered what your dynamic is like with friends, family, and the general public. What do you guys usually do when meeting new people - selectively tell those who are more open and understanding, or just let everyone know and anyone who has a stick up their butt can eff off? What was it like when the newer partner joined and you let the people in your lives know? I can totally see the discrimination from everyone and how aggravating that can be. I can also see a LOT of hostility towards it here at RPW, but a LOT of admiration for it at TRP
Whisper 4y ago
We're completely forthright about it. I have zero patience for people who can't mind their own business. The pattern is that no one gives us crap in red-state areas, and tolerant liberals... aren't.
That would be "FanGirl", a nickname I use because we met when she wrote fan mail to the Whisper account. A very determined young lady.
Her family, of course, loathes me, for the exact reason you would assume. But they are tradcons who probably wouldn't accept a child being gay or bisexual, either.
Yes, women on RPW have thrown full-on meltdown tantrums before about me being non-monogamous... including former mods. Hence the "former". Men on TRP take my ability to have a harmonious household with two "sister-wives" as evidence that I might just know a little something about how women think and feel.
I would say so. One of the few ways that women actually are disadvantaged in western civilization is that we are so protective of them that we prioritize this above listening to them, or respecting their choices and individualized needs. Which results in a lot of self-appointed white knight heroes swooping in to "save" women from the exact thing they wanted, and refusing to back the fuck off when gently told that their interference is unwelcome.
This mirrors my thinking. The girls are 15 and 16 years younger than me, and many people have pointed out that there is a "power imbalance", an idea which they wave about as if it were the football they just carried across the line to win the superbowl.
Well, one, duh. And two, so what?
All this reveals about these people is that they see relationships as adversarial... so much so that they are unable to even realize they are making this assumption, since they can't imagine any other way to be.
I'm not really interested in the perspective of people like that on relationships, or mine in particular.
Moreover, polygyny in traditional societies can also serve the function of protecting women from having a poor, low status, or otherwise undesirable husband.
Where this doesn't come with high male mortality rate, however, it tends to destabilize societies because it creates a collection of young, broke, angry losers who can't get laid. This is why the House of Saud sponsors terrorism. It has to. It needs to keep these young dudes focused on hating America, because otherwise they would hate the rich men hogging all the chicks... which includes the House of Saud itself.
I think it's very easy to be glib about this.
Many women will roundly deny being "gold-diggers" or caring about wealth or resources at all, and angrily reject any insinuation that they might be hardwired to care. Then, the moment you bring up polygyny, they suddenly become evolutionary psychologists, and assert that they would be desperately unhappy if they had to share a man, because "resources" led to a hardwiring they just can't overcome.
They are of course, wrong.
Marriage is not a part of human evolution. It hasn't been around long enough. It wasn't until the Neolithic era and the agricultural revolution that there were any resources to have. That's 10K BC. And the first evidence we have of marriage being a thing dates from around 2350 BC.
So, not so much with the "evolved to seek resources".
No, women are biologically programmed to seek high-quality genetic material, and resources can be a rubric for this. Women are only culturally programmed to seek wealth directly.
Additionally, women now act as direct salary earners, so not only do they need less wealth from men, more adults in the household leads to more income.
Our household has three six-figure salaries and no kids. It's not hard to imagine why we are in the 1%.
SunshineSundress 4y ago
Interesting! While I had a sense about the liberals (it’s “sex positivity” this and “sexual liberation” that until it’s a man who’s in the position of power. Then it’s just blabbering about the PaTrIaRcHy and oppression.), I’m surprised to hear about the red-state areas. I always assumed that the TradCons would be pretty against it too, but I’m glad that there’s more libertarians around you and that you guys can be completely forthright and not have to worry about it.
Oh wow! Very determined indeed! That’s at the top of the meet-cute list for sure.
Ah, makes total sense. I think her willingness to step away from that and the fact that she was the one to reach out to YOU is even more of a testament to how much this was a fully autonomous choice on her end, and that she wasn’t forced or manipulated or exploited into this position like how people often assume.
I can totally see that. We see that here almost everyday, just for different situations, and we’re one of the places that even BEGINS to hold women accountable for their own choices and desires. So even the women that very consciously and purposefully choose their lifestyle are babied against their will and to their own detriment, all because some self-righteous white knight decided that he/she knows best. I don’t think there’s any way to handle busybodies except refusing to entertain them.
It often surprises me how many people are completely oblivious to the fact that a good chunk of women WANT to be submissive to a benevolent patriarch. I mean hell, RPW is basically a community of women seeking benevolent patriarchs to be submissive to. Implicit to that is a power imbalance. Can power imbalances be exploited? Of course, but that doesn’t mean they will be, or that can’t be incredibly successful and fulfilling for a relationship either. If anything, a bit of an imbalance allows for a relationship to be complementary instead of adversary.
And so they encourage those young men to do things that effectively eradicate the young, broke, angry losers once and for all: they turn them into ISIS pawns who give away their lives (and thus take away threat to the rich men hogging the women). Turkey is one of the few Muslim countries that ban polygynous marriages, and it’s curious how as a result of that, the only ISIS/ISIL threats they have are spillovers from the Syrian border, and those threats are usually directed AT Turkey’s (sadly decreasing) secularity and not as a recruitment tactic for more pawns.
Okay, guilty as charged
LateralThinker13 4y ago
While you'll still get judged by the hyper-religious, in general red states just want to do their thing. They're much more libertarian in that regard than blue states. Houston (my area) for instance is a melting pot of all kinds of folks. I never get judged on any non-hetero/cis/whatever behaviors so long as I'm not acting the fool.
That said, go outside of the big cities into the country and you can and will find the usual bigots. My ex-wife's family was one - from a nearby town of 5000 or so, and turns out they were liberals, bigots, and feminists (but I repeat myself) in ways that would surprise you.
SunshineSundress 4y ago
Ah, that makes sense! I think Houston and other big cities in Texas are cool places: they have a lot of the metropolitan qualities of other big cities, but aren’t so rampaged with woke social justice warriors that everyone is afraid of wrongthink.
Liberal feminist bigots! Now that’s a special kind of delusional
softrevolution_ 4y ago
My man, you are living the dream: three people who get along well enough to make this work? [doffs hat] I cling to monogamy because you ARE the top 1%, and very few households I'm aware of can honestly make this work. I've even had nightmares about jealous wives (Jesus, I wonder why...)
Once burned twice shy and all that, but I won't harsh your squee.
-- Genuinely Tolerant Liberal
Whisper 4y ago
I appreciate the sentiment... but you are still harbouring a fundamental misconception that will cause you more pain until you learn to set the millstone down.
You said "people who get along".
That is the symptom of a misconception so fundamental that most people can't disbelieve it... because they can't imagine any other possibility.
This shibboleth is called "compatibility". You're thinking of us as three people who "fit" together in some special way, like puzzle pieces. When you think of it like that, it sounds rare. But people aren't puzzle pieces. We're very simple oblong shapes, all similar... all driven by the same basic mating instincts from the same evolutionary process.
That's what all this "red pill" stuff is about. When we admit that we are just chimps that have figured out tool use really well, then we can understand our behaviour in terms of chimp mating instincts, and act in a way that leverages those instincts.
What's "special" about the three of us isn't that we are exceptional human beings, or even exceptionally well-matched. We just have information that others do not.
It's as simple as "here's how to act". A relatively simple set of actions are the key that every lock, with little variation, because the locks were crafted by our evolution as a species, and thus relatively the same.
The first context we discovered this in was the seduction of women. It was like having cheat codes. The "worse" we treated women, the more they not only desired us, but actually loved us.
Then later we discovered there was an equivalent set of actions that worked on us. And they didn't stop working on us even when we understood what the actions were. We were having our own buttons pushed in the same way we had done to women.
And we discovered we didn't care. Girl game worked on us even when we understood girl game. And we realized the same was true of women. Weren't fooling their frontal lobes at all. We were fooling their temporal lobes. And this was why redpill tricks worked so well. They work even when the frontal lobe sees right through them... because the frontal lobe likes it when you fool the temporal lobe that way.
It's behavioural makeup. Men know perfectly well that you are smearing pigment on your faces to trick our temporal lobes into thinking you are young, stuffed with estrogen, super healthy, and perpetually sexually aroused. We just don't care that it's a trick, because "we" is our frontal lobes, and the temporal lobes, which are being defrauded, we do not experience as "us", but as part of the environment.
So, while my girls feel pretty special to me, I know intellectually that they're not. They just push the right buttons. If you, or SunshineSundress, or pretty much any woman who knew those tricks, had come along instead, then that's who I'd be a relationship with now.
This is why I think that arranged marriages probably worked much better than most modern western societies think. If every man knew the correct actions for a husband, and every woman the correct actions for a wife, then a high percentage (not all, but lots) of random pairings would probably result in a loving couple (or, in some cases, triple, or whatever). With just a little matchmaking on the front end, the success rate would be very high indeed.
LateralThinker13 4y ago
What made poly work for me when I was younger was one simple thing: I'd had two "successful" relationships before, and I simply reasoned, if I can love one person, then another person, why can't I love two people at the same time? Love, respect, and affection aren't finite resources. Only time is, and that can be managed.
As someone who has a lot of family in India, I can attest that arranged marriages can and do work if you have the right framework to support them. Modern western leftist values don't.
free_breakfast_ 4y ago
Thank you for sharing your experience, Whisper.
Also, thank you for sharing your energy, knowledge, wisdom and time investment over the years on TRP and RPW. I learned a lot from both communities and the legacy that you and the other men created.
Whisper 4y ago
You are welcome.
_-_FanGirl_-_ 4y ago
I'm gonna tag in with a bit of a more detailed breakdown of this question :D :D
To get more example-based, we don't do some sort of Big Pronouncement On The Exactitude Of Our Relationship. If Whisper is doing introductions, he will say, "these are my girlfriends, Fangirl and Funsize," if one of us is doing introductions we typically say, "this is Whisper and Fangirl/Funsize" and let the way we interact tell its own story. Sometimes we'll bring it up explicitly in conversation (ex: today someone made a comment about him having a bit of gray in his beard, and I rejoined with a joke about, "well, what can you expect to happen when a man has two girlfriends!"), but it's in the same way anyone would talk about their family.
We spend a good amount of time in Red-Coded areas (in case you haven't noticed, Whisper is pretty into firearms, and this has inspired us to get into it to!), and have yet to experience any face to face unpleasantness, and pretty much unanimous acceptance. We're very much a stable happy family uninterested in converting others to our Deviant Lifestyle or demanding parades in our honor (... though unlike Whisper, I wouldn't be opposed, I like parades...), and so people just... accept us.
We actually just back from hanging out with some neighbors who we hadn't got around to meeting until today, and they all conservatives, who don't want to tell people what to do, and who don't want to tell other people what to do, and we felt perfectly welcomed and accepted. In fact, because of the media narrative of them being small minded bigots, they were clearly trying to make it very clear that they are totally cool with how we choose to live our lives. We would have been judged much more harshly for being democrats!
I tend to be the Social Coordinator of the family, and I rarely do any sort of explicit "coming out" before some sort of group socializing. So when the yoga studio gals have a group bbq I don't say, "is it ok if I bring my boyfriend's other girlfriend?" I just go, great! and the three of us roll up, and it's never been an issue. Sometimes it makes logistical sense; we went over to dinner at an online-friend-through-redacted-hobby's house for dinner, and knowing he has a wife and a few offspring, I was like, hey, there's three of us, are you going to have enough chairs?
In very-liberal areas, we feel celebrated in the abstract; the shape of our family is Great, but we, are individuals, are Unacceptable, primarily on account of our libertarian values. But even as my conservative family rejects my relationship, you would, for example, expect my liberal uncle who has assisted with assorted democratic campaigns to embrace black sheep me... but no, he has actually been more intolerant than my extremely-uncomfortable-with-this-less-than-godly-arrangement father, in ways that I will not document here, for reasons of privacy.
So I'll switch to an amusing tangent. I have a Thing where if Funsize and I happen to be wearing the same colors, I go change my shirt before we go out somewhere! Wearing matching clothes just feels too much like we are making too big of a deal out of the shape of our family. Like those parents who put their twins in matching clothes; look! tada! there's two of them! Cute when it's babies, but just makes me feel weird.
So in short, we're just.... us. We don't hide in real life. But we also don't up in people's faces about it. And apart from my family, it's been perfectly fine. Maybe one day the world will allow our little family to share a museum family membership!
SunshineSundress 4y ago
Ahh, thank you for stopping by to elaborate!
Okay I see, so y’all are very smooth about it
AngelFire_3_14156 4y ago
It's been a while since I looked at the basic Red Pill concepts, but isn't Briffault's Law considered to be one of the foundational principles? If so, why wasn't it included in the post?
Just curious...
pearlsandstilettos 4y ago
We are pulling old posts written by ECs and mods. I didn't write this one so I couldn't tell you why it wasn't included
AngelFire_3_14156 4y ago
Thanks!
One reason I asked is that there's something about Red Pill that while I agree with it, seems to me to be incomplete and sometimes oversimplified. I always see lots of stuff surrounding hypergamy, but not much concerning Briffault's Law. I think it is just as important.
LivelyLychee 4y ago
We can definitely try to find a post about Briffault’s Law and post it sometime this month! It’s hard for any one post to capture ALL RP tenets and still be cohesive and comprehensible. That’s why we’re dedicating an entire month to this: to focus on all the tenets individually and give them the attention they deserve.
Ethman2k9 4y ago
Y’all should make a sidebar archive with these
LivelyLychee 4y ago
There is! So far, most if not all of these posts came from our wiki/sidebar.
Edit: Here‘s a link for those who are looking for it.
[deleted] 4y ago
Reading the male ephebephiliac thing is making me want to be alone with my cats or marry solely for the sake of making and raising kids and then separate as soon as they’re grown. Christ.
pearlsandstilettos 4y ago
Well, no one is preventing you from staying single and raising cats.
But this is basic theory. It doesn't mean that men will cheat just as hypergamy does not mean that women will leave their marriage when a better offer comes along.
Marrying with the plan to use him for babymaking and his wallet (to raise the baby) would put you on par with the man who leaves his wife for a younger woman though.
[deleted] 4y ago
I think ephebophilia crosses a moral line for me that’s much worse than the whole using for money thing and especially because I don’t feel at my core that I agree with the female hypergamy thing…
LateralThinker13 4y ago
There's a difference between men being wired to be attracted to the most fertile women around and ACTING on it. Also, most men don't want a 16-18 year old as a partner because they'd be crap at it. It's just their body screaming "she's at her most fertile! Get her!"
You don't have to agree with it. That doesn't make it less true.
pearlsandstilettos 4y ago
Two things:
Morals generally dictate behaviors. If a man notices a young woman but doesn't act on it, it's not really a moral failing. You cannot control the minds of others. Doing so is a bit morally dubious itself.
Obviously the trait natural to your gender feels less icky to you. Men are going to be much more disgusted with the idea of women using men for money than they will be with men's attraction to young women.
[deleted] 4y ago
I think 16-18 is a teen and much different from what i consider to be a young woman. I must have phrased what i said wrong
pearlsandstilettos 4y ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/90u0kb/for_women_only_men_are_visual_chapter_7/
This may or may not help and give you additional insight.
HappilyMrs 4y ago
Ahhh! This makes a lot of sense.
So do women hate men looking at other women because we feel we are being weighed up against the other woman (and probably found lacking), because we do that when we see attractive men?
SunshineSundress 4y ago
Interesting. So women being “exploited” for their youth and beauty crosses a moral line, but men being “exploited” for their money, protection, and provisioning doesn’t. I think you’ve reconciled what you desire from men as morally acceptable, but can’t come to terms with the fact that men desire things in us too. It’s a little convenient.
And like u/pearlsandstilettos said, having desires and acting out on them are two completely different things.
If at your core you don’t think female hypergamy is a thing, then why waste your time here? That’s one of the biggest things RP/RPW theory is based on.
[deleted] 4y ago
Not what i meant at all and I also left after this but thanks anyway
SunshineSundress 4y ago
*is still commenting*
Make it make sense.
[deleted]
LivelyLychee 4y ago
Be polite or be quiet. Goodbye.
[deleted]