Having doubts about my LTR boyfriend (25M) and I (23F) long term.
We were friends for a year until he gave me an ultimatum about three years ago. (Date or not see each other.) I love him, so I said yes. We moved to go to school and started living together (I know, my bad.)
We recently moved back to our home town after graduating. Even though he’s 25, I feel like he wants to be an adolescent again and spend a lot of time with his guy friends without me. I’m starting my graduate program and am ready to seriously settle down and think about marriage, home ownership, and children within the next five years.
He’s my best friend and I love him, but if we met now, I don’t know if I would choose him. We come from different backgrounds, which I initially didn’t care about.
At risk of sounding snooty, my family and friends are highly educated and professional, and he is a first generation college grad without exposure to that atmosphere. It’s not a status issue for me. I’m just worried we have different visions of what adult life looks like.
He almost said as much: “I feel like I’m 25 and you’re trying to be 32; sometimes I feel like you’re my mom.” Ick.
Positive traits: he’s steady, honest, kind, loyal, and makes me feel safe. He makes me laugh all the time and is my best friend.
Negative traits: he’s not as ambitious as I am, doesn’t prioritize health in the same way, and is not a “life long learner.” He and his family really like to drink as a hobby and I’m trying to permanently quit.
Are there vetting questions I can ask this deep into the relationship? I’m sad :(
TLDR: are there questions to ask 3 years into a LTR?
SunshineSundress 4y ago
I love him but...
softrevolution_ 4y ago
Yuppppp. Sounds like there's a lot of love but not much respect going on.
[deleted] 4y ago
If I’m being honest, I think I’m more capable than he is. And he defers to me for advice and help on a lot.
I was in a very abusive relationship with a man who would lead me into a fire for kicks, so it’s hard to know where that healthy line is.
From what I’ve said do you think this is a deal breaker? I feel like my gut instinct has been warped from my past LTR.
[deleted] 4y ago
women often are more attracted to older men, for some good reasons. Yes, you are 23, he's 25, same age basically. Looks like you may be better off with a guy in his 30's.
why? he's done with the party day's, he's more established, more mature, more experience,etc.
Can your 25 guy get there? Absolutely. Are you willing to wait? Are you willing to (chance it), like if he doesn't? You think you 2 can not hate each other doing this for a few more years?
If you broke it off today, didn't see him at all for 7-8 years and then met him. You'd probably kick yourself for setting him free. but again, 7-8 years is a long time, there's no guarantee's he'll change, improve to your liking,etc.
Go find the guy that's already there, the complete package.
But, are you the girl that he's looking for? Serious. Why should he take on a younger girl like you? Because you are soo smart and ambitious? Yawn.
Figure out the guy you want, then figure out if you can actually get that guy. Do you need to improve in areas , submission,etc to land that guy?
Just thinking strategically, I obviously can't get your situation in a few paragraphs.
[deleted] 4y ago
I guess I have this question: how do I increase my sense of attraction to the right kind of males?
I don’t even know if I’m attracted to my BF apart from our connection and bond. We have a good sex life, but it didn’t come naturally. I was in an abusive relationship and this man let me trust again. I haven’t felt attraction to any other men. What to do… :/
[deleted] 4y ago
ok, you have some history that complicates things.
Normally I'd tell a woman if she's not hot (physically) for her guy, he's not for you. Men require respect from their girl and they also want (desire). They know if you desire them or not.
Your situation, I think you need to take a break and figure out what you are attracted to, etc. Are you getting therapy?
Your guy sounds like the standard (nice guy). But, he's not doing it for you, which is also standard for the (nice guy).
So, you don't find guys you see out in public (hot)? I mean some women need the (mental) attraction also, but they find him hot physically first. It makes things more difficult.
So, I think therapy if you don't already get, and focus is on attraction to men, what you need/want.
[deleted] 4y ago
My ultimate goal is to be a wife and SAHM. At least while the children are young. I view education as a gift to pass onto children, just like instilling moral values, or teaching homemaking.
I don’t necessarily count my ambition as a “plus” for me as a potential mate. But I do value intelligence and would like my husband to be smarter and at least equally responsible as I am.
Thank you!
[deleted] 4y ago
most men won't care about your ambition or your graduate degrees,etc.
I'd say best thing is ability to support yourself, with a job/career that would fit well with a SAHM.
HVM are looking for, will she prioritize me? Will she be a good first mate? Will she add value to my life, she desires the same lifestyle?
Your RMV, taking care of house, cooking, clean, kids, submission/feminine and understanding what your guy needs/wants.
And yes, your guy needs to fill your boxes/needs also, it works both ways. Is he worthy of following? Does he take care of his things? Work/money/yard and other house things that are mainly his area,etc.
Intelligence is important to you. This can be wide range. What is most important type of intelligence for you? Emotionally, relationship, job/career, social/political, financial?
I know lots of smart people, who didn't go to college and conversely, lot's of people who (think) they are smart who have graduate degrees. What is important to you?
[deleted] 4y ago
I guess I come from a somewhat niche community. Most of the SAHMs I know have PhDs, MAs, or MDs and retired their career in a STEM field to raise children. I don’t think it’s the most important thing to men, but the men I’d imagined myself with tend to have women like these.
I also think getting my particular MA will put me in the best place to support myself for the interim before marriage or in case I want to go back to work when kids are old, husband gets struck by lightning, lol. Id say I have a solid foundation for RMV skills (always improving but I keep a beautiful home), so this educational path is more of my preference.
Having an intellectual passion is very attractive to me, though. I’m just not sure if it’s a deal breaker to not have one. I know this is just a preference, but in my world it’s pretty standard.
Thank you for asking me open ended questions this has helped me sort my thoughts haha
[deleted] 4y ago
You are welcome.
One thing to keep in mind is the following though. Getting your MA, will it limit your guy options while pursuing it? The type of men you will meet, the time you will have to focus on a relationship.
Yes, the type of men, are you going to be around men who turn you on, mentally and physically?
I think a lot of women today are wasting some good years pursuing advanced degrees and then, bang they are 30. Also, a lot of women complain that the men they are around in university graduate programs are (not Red Pill) for sure = not attractive. So, again, will you be wasting valuable time?
Dawkinswetdream 4y ago
https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-suzanne-venker-show/id1471433977
TheBunk_TB 4y ago
You need to be doing some deep work before you get married.
This is a big tell.
SunshineSundress 4y ago
It’s understandable to want to swing in the complete opposite direction if we’ve been burned by past mistakes. However, I think you’re starting to see that doing a complete 180 isn’t the best strategy either.
No one, not me or any of the other women here, can tell you if this is a deal breaker or not. Only you can make that call. From what I see, you know what goals you have and what you want out of a partner. He has told you he has different plans. Vetting doesn’t magically stop once you hit the 1- or 2-year mark. It continues until you’re 100% sure the man you’re with is who you want to be with and who you want to lead you and your family.
[deleted] 4y ago
I"m a guy, and vetting my girl never ends. It just evolves a bit.
[deleted]
pearlsandstilettos 4y ago
The respect is supposed to flow from her to him. If you disagree with that then you do not belong on RPW.
[deleted]
pinkcub 4y ago
Ick indeed at the mom comment. I just took a look at your post history and, while I don't think your boyfriend is a bad dude or anything, I think there are some serious incompatibilities with your lifestyle and goals. I also don't really like how he went out with friends who have made it clear they do not like you or approve of your relationship, but of course I am just a random internet person without the full context of the situation. It might be the beginning of the end of your time together, and that's okay, you've got an exciting newly sober life ahead of you and I'm sure you'll find a better match along the way.
[deleted] 4y ago
Thanks so much for the kind words!
Sufficient_Screen776 4y ago
Agree. I very rarely drink, and binge-drinking doesn’t interest me at all. It would never occur to me to buy beer or wine with my groceries.
Therefore, I wouldn’t date or marry a big drinker. It’s just too big of a divide to me.
Some things you can’t overlook. That’s one for me.
[deleted] 4y ago
Do you find it hard to date someone who is on the same page in that regard? It seems like binge drinking (technically speaking) is ubiquitous in my generation and location (California.)
Sufficient_Screen776 4y ago
Well you’re going to laugh when you hear this, because of the stereotypes, but I’m Irish
SDezzles 4y ago
Are you treating him like his mother?
[deleted] 4y ago
I think I’m treating him like his pretend wife. He went straight from living with his mother to living with me. I have a strong homemaking / maternal instinct so he may be merging me with his mom? I don’t know.
I definitely don’t nag him or scold him like a mom though. I stay friendly and respectful.
Anonymous_fiend 4y ago
You aren't his wife though. It's not good to treat bfs like husbands. Theres a huge reason cohabitation before marriage isn't good. Not judging you I lived with my fiance way too soon. And I acted the same trying to play house. It added a lot of unnecessary issues. It caused me resentment. It put a lot of pressure on the relationship before it was ready. Instead of just vetting him and enjoying the relationship I put way too much focus on settling down. He may be resisting your efforts to control him. Trying to get him to act like a husband by acting like a wife is actually manipulative. Honestly I didn't know that until recently. He needs room to grow. By being too nurturing you may be pushing him into doing the opposite. You may be acting like his mom by wanting him to grow up instead of just respecting him where he's at. Men don't like being pushed to do things. They can sense when you're trying to emotionally control the relationship.
[deleted] 4y ago
Going to read this over and over haha Thank you so much
Dawkinswetdream 4y ago
Yes - leave - and try and make it on as friendly terms as possible. It’s not just about your different cultural backgrounds here - it’s about gender difference. Women have to grow up much faster than men - that’s why he perceives you acting older like his mother. Women have to make choices about their time limited fertility. Men don’t. You would be better off dating a man a decade older than you are if you want a balance in “maturity”
I know it might be heartbreaking in the near time but you will save yourself much pain in the long run (and for him too!) if you withdraw from this relationship.
[deleted] 4y ago
Do you think that men a decade older who would date so much younger are good men, though? It seems like a red flag but I don’t know.
[deleted] 4y ago
will good men date younger women (30's to 20's). For sure, in fact most HVM want younger women.
Vetting is required as always and maybe even elevated, you are dealing with a more experienced guy, be prepared for it.
Dawkinswetdream 4y ago
And please have a sift through Suzanne Venker’s stuff - she has a new book out just for you - about getting hitched and what to look for in partners.
This is one of her podcasts that specifically you may like. There are others on the topic if you look through the index. Believe me they are the best 30-60 minute lessons in life a woman (and a man) could ever get:
https://podcasts.apple.com/gb/podcast/the-suzanne-venker-show/id1471433977?i=1000533860679
Dawkinswetdream 4y ago
Not at all! There are good men everywhere sweetheart! In fact men get better as they get older - they become much more understanding of the female situation from experience.
When you’re in your twenties you are filled with testosterone and will do almost anything to get sex! Your thinking is clouded by all the unwanted sexual thoughts - you make promises that you cannot possibly keep because they sound rational and go along with the cultural narrative
edjohn88 4y ago
So weird that it has to be considered a red flag... in my expwrience the only vocal promoters of this idea are post wall ladies or self rationalizing men. "Good" depends on your perspective, but even if I were a hardcore monogamous Christian zealot with the perfect character to father and lead a household, I would prefer 10-15 years younger simply because they are at the same place in life. Girls at 25 have plenty of sexual past nowadays, and I at nearly 40 have less than average but have invested so much in my career, fitness, responsible habits, etc. that my greatest challenge is stalling the "please marry me" crowd regardless of their age.
The only logical reason for this notion is that early 20 somethings are still fairly naive.. but if we are honest, men mature so slowly in this regard that on average a 25/35 is really a better match than same age couple... especially in a red lens where you value male chill/confidence/take-charge-and-take-responsibility etc.
[deleted] 4y ago
That’s heartening! Not sure where I got the notion that it’s a red flag. I think it is because some abusive men may view younger women as easier targets. But I’ve already danced that tango so hopefully I will know better!
unefilleperdue 4y ago
I dated a guy 8 years older than me and he made the mom comment too. I’m glad I left that one quickly lol. Some men never grow up.
It doesn’t sound like you two are very compatible on a logistical sense. Practicality is more important than just love sometimes.
[deleted]
pearlsandstilettos 4y ago
Remember that rpw is for women's benefit not to defend men
TheBunk_TB 4y ago
I don't think you would have the passion in another 3 years.
I would strongly suggest either getting into couples counseling or considering the tough decisions.
You have said a few things that you have said that suggests that you would friend zone your own husband if this guy ended up making it down the aisle. I also would be concerned that you wouldn't have the "fire" for this guy "in the horizontal way".
You cut him down because of difference in ambition and his family's views on education.
Is this guy your friend or your boyfriend?
WhatIsThisAccountFor 4y ago
This should be something you’re sure of, one way or the other.
This post sounds like you haven’t talked to him. You recognize he comes from a different background where he probably doesn’t have the same kind of family/friend influence that you do. Why not give him the option to have that (in you) if he wants to?
Talk to him and ask him what he thinks adult life should be like.