This is kinda like the opposite of when I get hormonal and say to my husband "I'm so sad that you'll never know what it's like to carry and give birth to a baby." Or i say "don't you ever get jealous that you can't dress up all pretty and have people tell you how cute you are?" And he's like wtf why would I want to do that??

Somewhere along the line it seems like women have wanted to become more like men. Where as men don't really seem to feel the reverse.

Trust me spinning plates is not the pinnacle of masculinity.

I don't believe that anything anyone can say to you here will improve the way you feel about yourself whilst you remain in this mindset. Your screen name 'ruinedgirl' seriously worries me.

Everything you post here is so negative and it's never constructive. You are just looking for any reason to tear yourself apart about something. If it wasn't this, it would be something else because you are intent on torturing yourself.

I get the sense that you are trapped in a very negative mindset. I think you should stay away from certain parts of the internet and have time off of relationships with men and work on reprogramming yourself and your mindset. I have been there. Therapy never really helped me, but I don't think I ever found a therapist that I truly clicked with. In the end I just came to some realizations all on my own but that took many years. Who knows, a really good therapist who you click with might really help you and it's worth a shot.

Whilst you are in this mindset and you are dating men like the last charmer you talked to us about, I don't think you will find a stable or happy relationship. You need to learn to value yourself more first so you pick men who exhibit positive masculine traits.

The red pill can only do so much. It's not a treatment program for those who are suffering from mental illness and emotional instability.

Please don't take my post as a personal attack.

I have an extreme jealousy of red pill men. It’s honestly getting me down.

Yeah, it’s exactly as weird as it sounds lol. I just can’t help but feel like they won the lottery in life. A man’s value is based on getting women in bed and they found a way to do that.

Nope. A man is valued (by himself AND by women) for his accomplishments - all the moreso because they don't get any help in doing them. A man who leans on others is less of a man. Sure, sexual conquests are AN accomplishment. But it's not held in as high esteem as you might think.

Yeah the process may not be easy but that makes it all the more valuable.

Well, yes. When one gender gets all kinds of assistance and coddling, and the other does not, you're going to respect the one that doesn't more.

They don’t have a care in the world- wake up, hold frame, spin plates. Oh, and be absolutely adored and looked up to as a result.

Again, most people don't CARE if a man has lots of girlfriends or not. Sure, some other men will see him as a stud. But it's not how most people define value in a man. Mental exercise time - which do you value/respect more:

A 30-something guy who works at Wal-Mart but dresses well and spins plates proficiently, or

A 30-something guy who looks good, lifts, has a high-pay career and Mercedes and house, but who doesn't date or has a low/no N-count?

The more women they get in bed, the higher their self esteem. They’re basically on top of the world.

Again, no. Sure, bedding women is a self-esteem boost, but it's not lasting. It's a temporary boost, not a permanent one. Marrying a high-status woman (think Ivanka Trump) is a permanent one. And a proper RP woman isn't just a boost, she's an uplifting, inspiring force.

I guess my jealousy primarily stems from the fact that there’s nothing we women can do that would be equal. As we all know, sleeping with men is nothing; something even the worst of us can easily do. The biggest proof of our value would be to gain the commitment of one of these men.

The biggest thing you can do is to make yourself valuable. Worthwhile. Desired. Pursue-able. Because so many women today aren't worth more than pump-and-dump, to find a truly worthwhile, classy woman is a minor miracle.

But what are the chances of that? He’s just going to give up the amazing life he has, the adoration and validation? The constant fun? Doubtful. I guess I just feel like they have it better.

Not hardly. Do you think men WANT to be banging many women with no one to come home to? To have no constancy there, no female life partner? No. They do it because it's easier. Because it's hella safer. And because the pickings are so slim.

You're looking at the positives of men and ignoring the negatives; you're looking at the negatives of women and ignoring the positives. Apex/Nadir fallacies at their worst. Honestly, you need to take a break, reappraise how you see the world, because it's skewed and negative in ways that aren't fair or healthy.

that's not really true. maybe in my 20's but now that i'm 30 i'm kind of done with the bullshit. All i want now is someone that will love me that doesn't want to have kids.

bottomline for me is i need good communication. i don't care so much if you say something i don't like, i wanna know where your head is ACTUALLY at cause if you tell me "you're fine" guess what i'm gonna treat you like you're fine.

I think you simply have a hard time genuinely empathizing with men. It’s obvious to your typical male reader that TRP discusses some rather depressing realities about the SMP, and the behavior of women in it, as well as the low likelihood of being able to find a stable, reliable spouse. So the default mantra is to “enjoy the decline” and simply engage in short term sexual relationships with women, which have their enjoyable elements. Even achieving this requires facing far more rejections than your typical woman is used to, or likely would be able to handle, and many men don’t succeed.

I think you are also additionally committing the apex fallacy of viewing these men as if they are all these confident alpha types that supposedly can easily get women. That’s simply not true. Lastly since sex is easier to obtain for you, because men are far more willing to sleep with even minimally attractive women for limited periods of time, you don’t sufficiently appreciate how difficult it is for many men—including men who are working on themselves—to get into any sort of relationship with a woman. I think if you were to become a man, you would despise the dynamics in the sexual marketplace.

He’s just going to give up the amazing life he has, the adoration and validation? The constant fun? Doubtful. I guess I just feel like they have it better.

Understand this, a lot of the things that get said on TRP are meant to comfort and encourage guys who are struggling. It's not always the reality of the situation. Being a TRP man isn't like winning the lottery, it's more like being forced to start a business. Most businesses won't turn a profit for years. Even when it looks like the business is succeeding or starting to succeed, it could still fall apart at any point in time.

Something else I think you should consider is that men have different priorities at different points in their life. If you're talking about men in their 20's, then yes a lot of these guys might not be interested in a relationship. At a certain point though, what value does adding another notch to your count really do for you as a man? What is more exciting/engaging at that point, meeting a girl who you truly, genuinely like and makes you feel amazing, or hooking up with another girl who you don't even like all that much?

Despite what they may say, most of these men probably want to have a family at some point. Even if they don't want to have kids, most men simply don't want to have to go out and constantly be meeting, approaching, and getting rejected by women all the time into their 30's, 40's and beyond. A very small percent will do it, most won't want to. The vast majority of the older guys on TRP sub are there because their relationships/marriage fell apart. They didn't want to be a player for the rest of their life.

At the end of the day, women have things they struggle with, men have their own struggles. There's no reason you need to be so down on yourself and pessimistic. I know it might be difficult to be positive sometimes, but getting down on yourself by comparing yourself to men just isn't going to help you. Focus on improving the things that you can a little bit at a time and achieving your goals. They're not as impossible as you might think.

Hope this helps.

You're only jealous of the outcome, not the grind it takes to get there.

Focus on your grind

I feel that. Sometimes I’m envious of the “wild oats sowing” period men are allotted in their lives, and can even make them more attractive (to an extent.) I think women can dip their toes into that but its a fine line, between experimenting and exploring sexuality to overindulging and sharing sexual energy wastefully, and distancing herself from intimacy.

That being said, I’m sure men could flip this and say the same about women. If we accept that men are the gatekeepers to commitment and women are to sex (in general) then once a woman can get a guy to commit, barring any health issues, she can have sex whenever she wants. In effect she can have the best of both worlds. She’s also allowed total abandon during sex, her pleasure put on a pedestal, and if he’s considerate, he’s concentrating on not finishing for as long as possible.... if we’re being uber traditional she’s also staying at home, which men may envy. Not that its leisure, but her world can be filled with comfort so that she can bring joy to their family. Involuntary celibate men who can’t get girlfriends OR sex have neither, they’re the gatekeepers to nothing, and they feel pitiful, so desperation can turn into seething rage, which is occasionally seen with women too.... (though a woman who cant have sex with anyone is rare. It may be more common in the fat acceptance side of things though)

A man’s value is not based on how many sluts he can fuck.

A genuine 10 woman is arguably going to have an easier, more fun life than even a top alpha guy. All men have to actually work and compete for a living. Top tier women? Not so much.

So if you really want to be depressed, don't compare yourself to alphas, compare yourself to the hottest girls next door.

It's easier to be adored as a woman. You just have to be pleasant.

A woman's value is based on building a family. And lot of men want to commit to have that, because spinning plates is good for the self esteem but in the long term it's also a lonely and sad road.

"a man's value is based on getting women in bed" No, it isn't.

Take a couple of deep breaths.

Now tell us how you came to have such a bad day.

A man’s value is based on getting women in bed

A man's value (most men, unless you're very hot or set to inherit money) in this life is accrued. It's created. It's what he does and what he has. It's what he makes and contributes. Getting women in bed is the result of that. It's not the cause of increased value. It's the result. And (barring the above exceptions) it's a lot of work. The only reason it's not more work is because so few seem to have the motivation or the discipline to do what's necessary. Envy that if you like. Learn from that envy and put in the same effort. Be excellent at something. Anything. Honestly this grass seems greener because you don't see the effort it took to get it that way.

A man’s value is based on getting women in bed and they found a way to do that

Sex is so unimportant to the value of a man that history books do not even bother listing the sex life of the great men. Sleeping around is fun for men, not valuable. Society does not consider Ron Jeremy and blonde twinks on Grindr to be valuable despite them having more sex partners than anyone on TRP ever will.

The more women they get in bed, the higher their self esteem.

Most self-described red-pilled men appear to me have massive insecurities issues and hate their lives. One of the most common type of threads in TRP is ranting, ranting is something miserable people do.

To me personally, a wife's greatest value is her maternity towards children. The results of maternity, both good and bad, have results that can last for a life-time.

Well, see it this way. As a man, not too long ago, I was too angry/jealous of the opposite sex after finding TRP. But after let's say 2-3 weeks. You have to say screw it. If this is how it works, I'm going to be the best I can be. No more excuses. You see, I've been on TRP and have read a lot about it in the past 2-3 months. I agree with some stuff but not with everything. Take some, leave some. I don't want to spin plates. It's just not for me. Take what you think is worth FOR YOU and apply it to your life. I am 23, virgin, working out, in the process of starting a business, gave up video games, etc. I also got my flaws and insecurities like balding since I've hit 18, not the tallest of man, etc. But you know what? I don't care, I'm trying to be the best version of myself in every sphere of my life, financially, mentally, physically. With that being said, I hang more on THIS sub than on TRP, because I am looking for an high quality LTR. I don't post on this sub(except now) because it's a space for women. Sadly, I havn't found the equivalent subreddit for men yet.

Enough rambling, what I'm trying to say is this: stop looking at the other side of the fence, focus on YOU, stop looking at men and women who don't share your mindset, your values, your goals. Be the best and CRUSH IT. Be the best you can be and you will attract the best.

You are assuming that happiness is the same for men and women. It's not.

If I'm going to be totally honest, my personal opinion is that - even for (most) men - sleeping around is not the key to true happiness. It's fun, it makes them feel good, it meets some needs. But so does being a husband, father, having a family to care for, etc.

This is more true for women. Living this way will not make them truly, deeply content and satisfied.

To say that nothing women can do would be equal to men is just not true. Women are equal to men - equal, but different. Men and women have the ability to be valuable, admirable, enviable, and role models. Just in different ways, and to different people.

I also disagree that male value = being a male slut. Male value = being a good man. They are not the same thing.

Also, RPW are not trying to gain the commitment of RP men. We are trying to gain the commitment of a good man, and build a good relationship & family.

There's a difference in true contentment, being an admirable person... and being a successful PUA, who may or may not also be a general douchebag. The only way you can convince yourself men have it better is if you are confusing what women really crave & what men crave - which are not the same things. We aren't trying to compete with RP (or any) men or comparing ourselves to them.

Bottom line: meaningless sex does not necessarily (and in my personal opinion, though probably controversial, pretty much never) equals true, deep, lifelong contentment. Especially for women, but for men too.

I think it's more subtle for women, but I honestly think the sexes are quite equal albeit quite different, even if it's not apparent until slightly later in life.

Example: My husband expects to provide for our family, he cherishes us so much that he's willing to give up some of his own personal pursuits to work harder for our stability. And all that's required of me is to greet him with a smile, shower him with respect, and quietly care for him in return, plus I get to enjoy extra time with our family because of the sacrifices he willingly makes.

If a woman goes out tonight and gets wasted and has sex with a man, who is equally wasted, she can cry rape in the morning and he can't. She'll have a far more compelling case if he's an alpha.

If my husband and I lost our house tomorrow, everyone would blame him and console me, because he's still supposed to provide... despite our silly Women in Power societal expectations.

When we have little boys, their little girl playmates will be allowed to wear shirts that say "Boys are stupid. Throw rocks at them." They'll be told that these girls are perfect and flawless.

Those same boys will be yelled at for play fighting or shooting finger guns, because natural male characteristics are obnoxious and distracting, while little girls with their calm and imagination are beautiful.

My library system fired our director last summer. My tattooed, lesbian coworker actually said "He's an old white guy. He'll be fine." She had no idea about his career dreams, his financial standing, his health, the health of his family, how excited he was to have a position where he could be near his kids. She didn't care, because he has a penis. She rejoiced in his fall, despite having any personal issues with him, beyond his gender.

My husband is a natural alpha, the kind of guy with no interest in the Red Pill, because he's doing fine without it. When I had surgery three weeks ago, the entire left side of my face was bruised and he was genuinely concerned that my very feminist coworkers would think he hit me. He would never hit me. Ever. He doted on me while I cried in pain. Because he's naturally muscled and charismatic and confident, though, he was worried people would think he had hurt his wife.

Men didn't win the lottery. Life has challenges for everyone and alpha men struggle a good deal against our rising feminist regime.

You need to step back and look at what you're saying...

there’s nothing we women can do that would be equal

There's two things you should think about here 1.) Depending on your perspective, women can do exactly the same thing, the result isn't equal because men and women don't have equal goals. Men desire those things, so through dedication they achieve those goals.

2.) It's never been about equality, it's about learning truths and using truths to gain an advantage to achieve your goals. Being above or better than others is the opposite of being equal. Don't aim for equality, aim to for the things you want in life and take advantage of opportunities to move yourself to the place you want to be, whether it's a better career, a better health, better activities, better relationships, etc. The only person that can improve you, is you.

As we all know, sleeping with men is nothing; something even the worst of us can easily do

If sleeping with men you desire isn't one of your goals then why be fixated on this? Do you want to have sex, or do you just want to be worshiped and adored? You can achieve adoration without opening your legs to men.

The biggest proof of our value would be to gain the commitment of one of these men.

The biggest proof of your value is to be an alpha woman. Someone who is adored and desired by alpha men. Healthy, independent, logical, successful, etc. Don't validate yourself by needing someone else to prove it for you, that's the point.

I guess I just feel like they have it better

You are right, they have it better... in fact, anyone living a better life than you has it better, because they aren't hung up on the constant need to feel validated or equal with other men (or women). They are busy constantly working on self improvement. If the only thing you're doing is looking at the other side, and not improving your side, then you'll always feel jealous. You need to think about yourself, get rid of jealousy and improve your own life to make you feel 100%, that's the validation.

I believe what you have is "envy", not "jealousy".

Sorry to sound rude but OP has drunk the feminazi kook aid.

Men and women are different, same species but different. We are not equal biologically which leads to different needs and wants from the environment.

The only place we should be equal is in the eyes of the law.

As a guy, an average guy, (although I'm mgtow)I don't have it easy.

I work hard, pleasant to everyone I meet, there's no harem of women clamoring to suck my dick, I do the grind everyday.

What you have is the apex syndrome. Women's ability to only see the 20%, the top achievers and equate them to all men, all the while completely ignoring the good guy right in front of them doing the best he can.

Stop with the oppression olympics. Both men and women face there different challenges in life.

True alpha females as defined by TRP are probably just as rare as alpha males. Some reading to explain:

https://therationalmale.com/tag/alpha-female/