When TRP was in its infancy, the number one goal I had put into place for the moderation team was to ensure that our message didn't slip and that we didn't allow our focus to be eroded by our politically correct culture.
Armed with the knowledge that the feminine imperative would see to it that we would be infiltrated and eventually tone-policed, we took a hard line stance against concern trolling. Comments like "maybe we should tone down the anger just a little bit," or "can't we say this without the anger?" were considered slippery slopes that would eventually lead to our demise. And I think we were 100% right about that.
Essentially, the way the feminine imperative controls the social narrative is that it aligns what can and should be politically correct with what best serves women. It seems like a simple effect, but it's rather overwhelming when you consider its implications.
There should be no doubt in your mind how the feminine imperative has defined this narrow volume of political correct speech (which we will refer to as the overton window). When there's discussion of TRP outside of our borders, it always criticizes and dismisses us due to our language and our premises, rather than discuss rationally any merits to our conclusions. They are able to do this because speech that is critical of the female gender falls outside the overton window. No logical debate necessary when you can easily dismiss an entire group of people with a hand waive and a thought-terminating cliche.
Women changing male spaces has always been known to us. Examples in real life are plentiful- men's clubs, men's gyms, the armed forces - anything primarily for men have been infiltrated by women and then systematically destroyed from the inside.
But this effect isn't limited to women. Men, employed by the feminine imperative, are just as able to help enforce the status quo by self-limiting and tone policing their friends to ensure we also obey the rules of the politically correct. Every day, our mod team removes at least two or three such fellows who arrive with well meaning but misdirected attempts to tone down the misogyny here so that we can still discuss the good parts of TRP without all that hatred! "TRP is really just about self improvement, afterall," they would say.
And it certainly sounds nice to think that. Yeah, we are here to get better, aren't we?
But serving the feminine imperative is exactly what that does. What is the word "improvement" without a goal to work towards? If we are making ourselves better, then to whose standard of better are we striving? If we accept the notion of dropping misogyny (or the apparent misogyny as it were) and focusing only on politically correct advice such as working out and eating right, then we have done a great service to the feminine imperative. We have curtailed our own goals to serve the feminine. We have changed ourselves to benefit others. That sort of self-improvement is acceptable to our politically correct overlords. It seems so easy to adopt it and move on, that almost every single male organization did so without realizing the consequences, and are now shells of their former selves.
Our self-improvement is one to benefit us. Since the connotation of the phrase "self-improvement" is so commonly accepted as the feminine-primary version, I hesitate to use the term at all, lest it be mistaken for "self-improvement-for-women." We are here to learn the truth. How we act on this information is up to the individual, and how it improves them is not for the benefit of society, women, or others. Rather, it is for the benefit of themselves in the most selfish and greedy of ways.
I think a better way to put it, is that we're here for "improvement for self." Though a key element here is improving one's options in life through exercise and learning skills (which seem merely like self improvement), our end goal is not to serve somebody else's imperative, but to increase our position in life to satisfy our own imperatives. That others' imperatives may be served along the way is incidental.
This infiltration and tone-modification strategy is, unfortunately, not the only strategy, and I have become increasingly aware of another way the feminine imperative manages to do its dirty deed.
Pressure to change, not from the inside, not from the outside, but from the borders.
When we started TRP, almost immediately a backlash subreddit was made to mock us. It was mostly unnecessary, because it appeared the mocking and distaste sprang up around reddit any time our name was mentioned.
Our strategy to these was mostly to ignore it. Nobody's mind was being changed by trolls who mock. Their efforts to shut down or modify our discussion were entirely failures. Anybody dismissing us in these manners made us stronger as a group. It enticed new users to check us out, and it strengthened group cohesion among those already here.
But the borders were a different front line altogether. The borders were a soft spot, and I'm not sure I realized just how soft they would turn out to be.
Just on the borders of TRP were "friendly" complimentary subreddits. They appear on the surface to be just like our main subreddit, but with a slightly different focus. Just a small microcosm of the bigger parent sub. One might consider this a strength, that ideas can spread out and continue to evolve.
The problem is that they co-opted the red pill moniker, but make no mistake- they were doling out blue pills just as sure as if they had been the trolls mocking us to begin with. Whether through malice or ignorance, these groups managed to cave to the feminine imperative and pick and choose red pill tenets to believe, while still clinging to the falsehoods of blue pill fairy tales that made them feel good back in the old days.
Heck, like Cypher in the Matrix, I can see the allure to wanting to forget all this red pill stuff and go back to life before. It was comfortable believing in fairy-tale love and equality. But once you swallow the red pill, this is no longer an option.
But the groups on our borders still sit there with the tasty bait that things can be moderate, and that red pill isn't really so bitter afterall, you can hold on to your heart-warming delusions. That maybe the bitterness of the red pill is inherent with the sub and its unsavory members.
What's worse, is that these ideas can wheedle into our collective thoughts and are reflected by many users here. Perhaps our subscribers haven't even really thought about these memes before repeating them, they were collected from a red-pill source and regurgitated here. And the effects of the propaganda shine through, regardless of the intent of its originator or propagator, regardless of the veracity of the statements themselves.
We've heard a lot of these phrases here. "Too many people in the anger phase" or "too many spergs here" or "when you look past the misogyny" or "I don't agree with most things here, but..."
These are the beginnings of apologetics. They are pervasive and they are what destroys the long-term viability of this community.
I'm going to address a few subreddits on our borders, because I think it's time that the mod team take a public stance on them.
First, and foremost is PurplePillDebate, which I have been guilty of dabbling in on occasion. The primary takeaway from this subreddit is that in order to take part in a debate, you must first offer the obligatory apologies for the rough edges of TRP. Many well reasoned contributors who consider themselves red pill will introduce their argument with a leading apology such as "when you look past the misogyny," "hatred aside," or "it would be better without all the anger..."
If PPD is a battle for minds, then the apologists have decidedly lost. Accepting the frame that TRP is fundamentally flawed and working backwards from there ensures that the debate will only land at conclusions that benefit the feminine imperative. And the takeaway for any onlookers reading is that surely there is a moderate position somewhere in the middle- a "purple pill" of sorts. We can accept reality, except the parts that offend us. Those in the fringes of TRP may easily bite at such a delicious nugget rather than face the reality that the fairy tales are all false.
Other subs worthy of mention unfortunately include the Married Red Pill sub, which despite its efforts to give a safe haven to men who married while plugged in, has devolved into an exercise in rationalizing why it was a good idea to begin with. Despite my repeated attempts to help them steer into the right direction, I have been confronted by many members there simply defending marriage as a good decision for a man in western culture, one of whom was a moderator whose post read "knowing what I know now, I would get married all over again."
The argument uses a common theme that you might recognize. Those who don't get married simply "aren't alpha enough to survive a marriage." Marriage, to them, is red pill on hard mode, and only the best of the best survive. Interesting that shame should be the primary enforcer of this behavior. It reminds me of something... perhaps it's written about somewhere in our sidebar.
I imagine myself making a similar face reading about somebody bragging about surviving a game of russian roulette, trying to convince others it's a game of skill and that the bullets in the chamber are reserved only for those not strong enough to win.
There is much rationalization of marriage on our borders, and unfortunately much of it has been coming from who used to be our moderators for the /r/redpillwomen sub. It's disappointing that they ended up how they did (no longer moderating for us), but I suppose if I were to draw a life lesson from my experience on RPW, it would be that.. all women are like that.
For those who hadn't heard about the mods who left RPW, it essentially boiled down to a disagreement between them and me- where I intended to enforce these very principles I state here today, and they allowed petty interpersonal drama stand in the way of our mission. Ironic that they would act so typically like women, it's actually somewhat funny. I'm sure I'll write up a post in more detail about this soon.
Anyhow, the resounding argument from these ex-RPW women was that marriage was a necessary part of life for those in upper echelons of society. That upwards mobility was limited and determined by marriage status and that anybody with aspirations of high society or positions of power much consider marriage to be a staple part of their strategy.
On the surface, this would seem to ring true. Many, if not most, politicians are married. The rich tend to be married (often more than once). It would seem as though marriage was an important part of moving up the status ladder.
The problems with this reasoning are multi-fold. It frames the discussion of marriage as though the "status ladder" itself is one we should care to climb. In fact, thinking about this for a second reminds me that it is women who care about the social status of males. Climbing this ladder directly serves the imperative of women. Of course the threat of shame or social ostracization would make an appearance. We are essentially reading women's endorsement of a pro-women strategy... also known as the feminine imperative.
That we would need marriage to find personal success has been thoroughly debunked by discussion on TRP. Much like the higher-education industry has tricked generations of students that going $500,000 in debt is the only way to succeed in life, the feminine imperative has successfully tricked men everywhere that marriage is a prerequisite of success and status, and that status is an ultimate goal that would serve themselves. They have framed this quite well as self improvement. But is it "improvement for self?" I think not.
The statistics may show a number of rich or powerful men being married. But every man is the maker of his own fortune. These statistics may show correlation, but they do not imply causality. Further, it should be noted that older generations rich and poor are more likely to be married or stay married. There's no reason to follow in their footsteps rich or poor.
But these blue pill swallowing border-groups eat this up, because it helps rationalize their addiction to their fairy tale reality. That marriage is a necessary component to success is just the evidence they need to keep clinging on to the blue pill lies that they were comfortable believing to begin with.
And while we can't control these border-groups who sit on the outskirts and dangle blue candy at us, we can and will address the erosion of our focus being caused by them, who bring their BP views into our sub via subconscious propaganda.
We will be extra vigilant against those who care to regurgitate the nonsense originating from these places. Anger is not a phase, we won't tolerate tone policing, and we're not changing who we are.
Interestingly - as a side note- the minute the ex-RPW mods were scorned, their behaviors and attitudes switched off like a lightswitch, all the work and effort put into the sub in the past between myself and them was suddenly null and void. And they began their propaganda campaign against the RPW and TRP subs (in places like PPD and MRP as well as TBP), assuming the roles of blue pillers almost immediately. Suddenly, their view on TRP had always been negative, we had always been chumps, TRP has always been wrong.
Sure, ladies. We have countless texts dedicated to describing just how typical your behavior is.
We've got new mods for RPW now, and seasoned mods here on TRP ready to pull the trigger when somebody crosses over the line.
So here's to another 150,000 subscribers. We're ready for it.
We have a couple big announcements coming up in the next few weeks, so look forward to that. New content coming your way, new ideas, and some new stuff that should be really friggin cool. Stay tuned.
[deleted]
Horus_Krishna_2 7y ago
nice post. I see I'm guilty of downplaying anger myself. I see my young self getting mad over women but it's easier said than done to just forget it and focus on "improvement for self." Definitely don't want to censor anyone and make them afraid to state their anger.
[deleted]
[deleted]
I_Need_More_Space_ 7y ago
That's great to hear. I'm glad I found TRP a couple of weeks ago. So, it would be a shame to see it watered down.
On another note, why can't we post upon joining? I read the New Here Readings. And I've pretty much been RP for the past 7 years as experience and seeing other guys get screwed in life taught me much about the other sex.
I understand that some folks may join without knowing exactly what TRP is and start posting irrelevant topics. But, I'm 31. I haven't been screwed by women, because I've learned from the mistakes of others (preferential, right?). And I may actually drop some choice nuggets on y'all from what I've been able to learn throughout the years.
Come to think of it... This "earning your ability to start a thread" is so blue pill. Just as women demand that we prove ourselves worthy of the vagina, we have to prove ourselves worthy of starting a thread. I don't get that.
Does anyone else see my point?
antariusz 7y ago
I have been guilty of assuming that marriage is a necessity for status, and I myself have always been interested in earning status.
But yes, you made me rethink why the top status men are married. I am currently leaning towards the belief that women latch on to high status men, and the higher status you are, the more compliant and willing a woman will be in any attempt to lock you down.
A woman doesn't love you, she loves how you make her feel. And being around a higher status man makes her want to serve him and be on her best behavior to secure commitment. As I have improved my own life, the women around me have acted more and more like "traditional" wives. But I'm willing to bet it's the women that haven't been changing. I've been the one changing.
RetroGroovin 7y ago
This is the greatest thing I've read as a new member. The indoctrination runs deep. Some of this shit I'm realizing I'm guilty of.
If it doesn't benefit me then its unnecessary. Many people get it twisted and think this kind of mantra is extremely self-serving and selfish.
I hate this useless urge to serve other peoples interests especially when it jeopardizes me being able to realize my own. It crippled me in highschool, I'm certain it has caused me to not capitalize on many opportunities that were there for me. This misguided belief that we should be worrying about the other woman or man before ourselves is why so many people are miserable in life.
I'll help when its convenient. I'm angry because I've been lied to. I'm harsh because you've abused whatever softness I've shown. I don't need you to police my thoughts and opinions they are mine and they aren't changing.
[deleted]
vicious_armbar 7y ago
Employers can't legally ask you about your marital status. Doing so is asking for a lawsuit. If you really believe that marriage is the key to climbing the corporate ladder then buy a fake wedding ring and wear it to work. If you ever slip up and imply that you're single you can quickly shut the conversation down by saying: "I was married but my wife died of cancer last year. I still wear my wedding ring out of respect for her." You don't have to actually be married in order to appear married.
Rambo1stBlood 7y ago
Im glad someone else said something like this.
I had a cousin get married recently - actually two in the last year - and I had the realization of like "Oh yeah, society sees this as a thing and judges you on it."
Pretty much made it clear to me that like...in a couple years when im out of my 20's and into my 30's and working still, it would be smart to pick up a fake ring.
[deleted]
sp1ff713582 7y ago
I see TRP as two parts: a set of facts/philosophy about women, and conclusions about how men should react to those facts.
On the facts/philosophy I completely agree with the sidebar (women pursue AF/BB; they are "the most responsible teenagers in the house;" Briffault's Law; they purge their memories as soon as they decide they're unhappy; AWALT; and so on).
But I draw different conclusions. Becoming Chad isn't easy for anyone, and isn't possible for every man. But a man who knows the facts/philosophy can get what he needs in other ways: using game as the PUAs do, or even simply paying for it where legal. And I don't especially care what a partner's n-count is, since I don't intend to have children with her.
I would never denigrate anybody for trying to "become Chad." I wish I were up to it myself. But I would like it to be OK to say on TRP that these other ideas are OK, too.
[deleted] 7y ago
Endless Applause!
I have gotten sick of all the "Anger is just a phase" phrase being misused by chaining it with a "Don't give up!Just lift and they'll notice you!"(Being used as a sneaky way to re-encourage the PUA mindset of pussy pedestalizing instead of using it to channel as a way to put YOURSELF as a priority)+ clogging up the posts at times that i just had to brb from TRP for awhile.
There was also 1 very upvoted poster here who called some TRPs+ MGTOWs "cowards that can't tame women" for not wanting to get married.I literally lost some faith at TRP sub since that went on for quite awhile.
With how that(+ the "look part the misgony" +paraphrases of it) is on the same page as concern trolling,hopefully i can report them now right?
Really pisses me off with that "look past the misgony" part.Its the fucking damn truth.What it essentially means is to "look past the truth" aka HAMSTERING. Glad its finally addressed.
bluecantuesday 7y ago
does this mean the sub is going to start cracking down on "lulz he's just in the ~anger phase~" cunty passive aggression?
because I really hate that shit
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
We've always made it a point to remove it, but don't always catch it. Please report when you see it.
bluecantuesday 7y ago
Thanks for the reply, never knew it was considered reportable, will do.
[deleted] 7y ago
It is good that you have taken this stand. It is good that you have warned people about false prophets. I have also been on PPD debate, as have a lot of senior RP guys and mods. I see PPD as a place to engage and debate against blue pill corrosion and chat with some friendly people. It is a lot less serious over there and light hearted chat can be refreshing.
As for those who defend marriage. Well I was married, 2 kids. I do not regret having kids but to defend marriage in this day and age is crazy. Marriage will go the way of the dinosaur in the west. Thank feminism and online dating for that. The old world is dying quickly and the traditional family unit will become a vastly increasing minority unit in the future. Marriage is a bad deal for men in the west. I will be telling my boy that he should never consider marriage, it is a tradition from the past which is not relevant for the future.
Blue pill is really a tragic place. I have not even visited there but there are bloopers on PPD. They are more to be pitied than scorned. These poor hapless victims even reinforce red pill truths whenever they try to prove a point. There arguments are emotional, misguided and laughable. As for the misogyny on TRP, well I reject the term misogynist completely. We all know that the term has been expanded as a catch all perjorative to be thrown at any opinion or person who disagrees with feminism. We make sweeping generalisations about women like feminists do about men. If we are misogynists then feminists are misandrists, so the pot cannot call the kettle black.
I do have one ongoing issue with TRP but I cannot see any easy solution. It is not the hate for women but the hate for each other. Shit can get really nasty in here, over almost nothing. It is the reason I spend more time in PPD now. I can have red pill views over there and even the bloopers are not as rude and aggressive as some guys on TRP. I guess it is just the nature of the beast here, we have lots of angry opinionated guys (myself included), lots of alphas in training arguing that their opinion is right. It is typical male behaviour. If I was 22 I would love the arguing and fighting, now that I am older it does get boring being called out and insulted over minor points of disagreement.
So in summary, I agree with more than 90% of this post. Good that you are maintaining high walls and a clear line. Marriage is a bad deal if you are a man in the west, do not let anyone try to convince you otherwise.
[deleted]
lestratege 7y ago
TRP is indeed improvement of the self. However, the self does not exist in a vacuum. The self exists in a given group, in a given society, within a given culture. Improving one's position is by definition improving one's position relatively to others, so what others think and do cannot be completely discounted.
I think there is often a misunderstanding of, not the content, but of the nature of some TRP concepts, like for example AWALT. AWALT, and TRP concepts are like a compass: a compass tells you where North is, which direction you'll go if you go North. However, it doesn't tell you how North you are.
Going North means going towards colder climates ONLY if you are in the Northern Hemisphere. If in Tasmania, it's the opposite. If you are in Costa Rica, you don't need to worry about packing gloves and fleece before a while, etc.
So I think the main issue is with people trying to fit TRP within a given environment. And those people often draw the wrong conclusions from the fact that practice means adaptation of theory to local context. They conclude that the principles must be adjusted to fit their own environment. That is wrong! Taking into account context for application of principles does not mean that the principles are flawed. It's a very good point to remind people.
However, some folks here should remember that their environment is not valid for all. The US is not the World. So guys there are in such a northern place that they are fighting with polar bears and warning about polar bears, obsessing about polar bears. They are manning the North wall against the dead while other people worry about other stuff down south :-) To be more precise, I am talking about things that allow the female imperative to be imposed as a norm and be such a cancer in the US society, like "restraining orders" (don't exist in many countries), "being arrested for failing to pay child support" (a WTF realization for many around the world. I never realized that until that poor black dude ran away from a police officer cause he didn't want to end up in jail because of that and ended up dead with bullets in his back instead), "being kicked out of your place on complaint of domestic violence" (triple WTF: in most places around the world, the complainer would be shelter unless there is actual evidence of violence and then it's assault), etc.
There is a debate with Milo in which he unfortunately didn't answer a question by a Spanish dude who notices that the whole feminist BS is mostly prevalent in English speaking countries. It is indeed. The CC simply does not exist in some countries (compare the experience of the GIs with local women during the Vietnam war and the Iraqi war...). Not that women wouldn't want to, AWALT, but it's just not something feasible (just like buying a Bugatti is something many of us would want to but would never seriously envisage because we know it's simply impossible).
If we are going to talk about the NATURE of men and women, we have to make an effort to stop pretending that the cultural part is a natural part. On the other hand, I completely agree that those who pretend that there is no North because they are in a tropical lagoon should get properly schooled.
Horus_Krishna_2 7y ago
wanting to improve ones self is one thing, common sense to want to do that. One of the problems with making this red pill stuff public is that then everyone knows the secret, including chads and betas who then become alphas, and then you have more competition. This is why Plato wanted his unwritten doctrine unwritten, it was meant only for a few philosopher kings. Charlemagne wrote a book for his sons to read but it wasn't intended to be public knowledge. But a true alpha wouldn't be afraid of competition I suppose. I think the red pill females are hence why they were acting blue pillish, really women are in competition with each other for alpha males so the few cool women don't want other women waking up.
[deleted] 7y ago
I knew RPW was bullshit when I posed a simple question:
If a woman has her dream man, who is everything she wants in a man, but he refuses to marry, what should the woman do?
What do you think they said? What does that tell you about women's view of marriage?
stawek 7y ago
If she is sure he won't marry she should dump him. Otherwise he will dump her once she hits the wall and she will be screwed.
Better to have second best man that stays than the best that will leave. Same for us - better an honest 8 than a slutty 9 (for ltr)
Marriage is a tool for society to remove the prisoner's dilemma in gender relations. The dilemma being "if i marry her she has power over my finances" and "if i not marry him he will swap me for younger woman at first opportunity". Both parties must play suboptimally to achieve optimal results. However current marriage laws make the game unacceptable for men, which means both women and men are screwed. Remove alimony, child support, social security and marriage will be viable again.
jdgalt 7y ago
I would expect them to say she should dump him. Because that's her best strategy. That doesn't mean RPW is BS. It means men's and women's rational goals conflict with each other. There's no reason they ought to be less honest about that than we are.
All women are never going to get that message and heed it, because if they did, it would mean we're all wrong about their nature.
Wel108 7y ago
That logic, is perfect man.
Rollo-Tomassi 7y ago
Well said. I only have this to add:
Among the "border" RP groups it should be acknowledged that in the future you will see many, many more, groups who were formerly counted among TRP's adamant opposition who will adopt the 'Red Pill' monicker for whatever their pet issues are.
You will see A Voice for Men and the MRAs readily embrace branding themselves as 'Red Pill' and particularly once their feminist produced men's rights documentary film is released this fall.
This should be a lesson for TRP; the 'Red Pill' name has brand value. This is why you'll see it leveraged by groups with a political, racial or social agendas who have no association with, or were actively hostile to, the Red Pill as we've collectivized and developed it.
You will see, Purple Pill life coaches, dating coaches, amateur marriage counselors, Red Pill women's blogs all adopt the aspects of TRP that flatter their ego-investments and their revenue models. The will happily lay claim to the Red Pill tenets that compliment their audiences, but heap scorn on the uglier, but no less true aspects that contradict their self-serving bullshit.
You will see, others who've disdained TRP as being a group of "whiners" and made efforts to do exactly this same pick & pull from Red Pill awareness as they attempt to create niche' groups (Neomasculinity) come right back to TRP when "The Red Pill" name serves their PR efforts better than being separated from it. And they'll tell everyone that they were always the "real" TRP when they do.
You will see efforts from even the most unlikely opponents of TRP praxeology (Religion, Trad-Cons, anti-feminists, the Blue Pill sub) make attempts to sanitize TRP to fit their uses.
Way back when I started The Rational Male I wrote 2 posts warning of exactly what we're seeing today:
Could a Man Have Written This? and Sanitizing the Imperative
These are some things to remember when you see "The Red Pill" attached to entirely unrelated or bastardized attempts to adopt the label.
Archwinger Endorsed Contributor 7y ago
This goes hand in hand with people who insist that "Red Pill" and the Red Pill subreddit are radically different things.
"We're real Red Pill, not like those whining losers on Reddit!"
"Red Pill is a general manosphere/relationship thing. Completely different from TRP, which is a bunch of neckbeard woman-haters!"
This subreddit catapulted "Red Pill" from a Matrix cliche into a viewpoint on inter-sex relationships parroted across the internet, and once the brand was successful, everyone else jumped on to piggy-back on the coattails of the ideology...while fervently distancing themselves from the "internet losers" who made the brand what it is.
Now, any idiot with even slightly conservative advice regarding relationships who owns a blog calls him/herself Red Pill.
[deleted] 7y ago
TRP Goals:
- Build the WallCOMPLETE- Build the Wall 10 Feet higherCOMPLETEredpillschool Admin 7y ago
It's funny, I hadn't realized it until after this post, but a few people PM'd me accusing me of stealing Trump's strategy.
You gotta hand it to him, it's not a bad idea... lol
[deleted] 7y ago
Dafuq? Were they threatening to tell on you? What were they hoping would happen?
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
They thought they were trolling. But I mean, I like Trump!
nevva_Again 7y ago
The drama the old mods created is what destroyed my last blue-pill fantasy of NAWALT. Their behaviour was the clearest manifestation of AWALT and the light-switch effect I've ever seen.
It shocked me to see how these ''seemingly self-aware women'' turned on redpillschool and TRP, planned their mutiny, deleted a lot of quality posts, created a new RPW, and started to troll the old RPW sub.
It was funny to see RPW mods try to divorce rape redpillschool.
Please do.
I've been waiting to hear the full story.
james-watson 7y ago
I have been in these circles for a long time, long before the RP sub (or reddit itself) existed.
This place is an excellent forum for conversation, but also a perfect lab experiment which demonstrates exactly what happens when you allow infiltration by the enemy to slowly turn your ranks against you.
Make no mistake, this is full out war. The SJW crowd are currently reigning supreme, and we are a tiny, rebellious faction spouting heresy.
Don't think so? Try punching a woman. Try going through family court. Try committing the same crime as a woman, and see who gets harsher sentencing. Try accusing a woman of sexual assault, and then let her do the same to you. There differences will speak volumes.
The Feminist Imperative reigns supreme. We are dissidents, and we will be hunted.
In my opinion, the entire concept of PPD and RPW subs are incompatible with RP philosophy. Women will NEVER be redpill. It is against their interests. RP is male strategy, which benefits men and women materially, psychologically and socially. Yet the female's inherent, biological desire for dualistic mating (AF/BB) and cuckoldry will forever be at odds with men, who will never tolerate it. As such, it is vain to attempt to convince females that RP is good for them, for they will be losing their ability to cuckold men. Of course they will be happier in the long run, but the child rarely understands what is good for her until it is too late.
That being said, it is good to corral females into a separate sub so they don't dilute the conversation here. All things considered, the mods are doing an excellent job. Keep up the fight my brothers, for the war has just begun, and the Imperative is more formidable than most can ever imagine.
IVIaskerade 7y ago
I like going on PPD to bounce ideas off the bloopers. If it really riles them up, I've usually hit on something.
FrameWalker 7y ago
Im glad you called out the border attack. It got to me. I accepted their views om the importance of marriage for social mobility. But fuck its 2016. The new rich are gonna be as weird twisted and rebellious as ever.
Here's my concern trolling. Using the above phrase is the same as slamming your fists on the table. It says to the reader agree with me or else. Its bullying and adds little to the discussion.
I propose a new trp women sub. Trpwomengonewild. They post a link to a fresh pic of their tits at the beginning of every post.
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
If the phrase "make no mistake" wasn't followed by ten more paragraphs with solid reasoning for my hypothesis, I'd agree.
99_Problem 7y ago
Fuck yeah. Score one for Team Man. Thank you for all your hard work.
UrsusG 7y ago
We've always been at war with Eastasia
+1
bvcxxcvb 7y ago
Fantastic post, I can't thank the mods enough for staying true to their original mission. While the red pill can be bitter medicine, it needs to exist. These "purple pill" messages are so insidious because they create cognitive dissonance, which is often just a slippery slope back to "women are wonderful". They are not wonderful. They are ruled by emotions. I truly believe that everything in Western society went (perhaps irreversibly) downhill when we gave them the vote. But this is a Pandora's box that won't be closed in our lifetimes.
Since I see so many experienced posters in the comments, I have to ask a question that's been on my mind lately: what about kids? I want kids. Traditionally the path to do so is through marriage. That's incredibly ill-advised as we all know. But in what circumstances can one have kids and raise them in a healthy manner (I believe having both parents present is important) without marriage?
I've been thinking about the options and scratching my head. Find an "enlightened woman"? Even if they understand their nature, they're powerless to control it. They are so susceptible to peer pressure and societal shaming, they will have so much trouble having a kid and not getting married, especially viewing their friends' facebook wedding photos. Even if they agree, it seems resentment could set in and they'd essentially take your family unit for hostage.
Another option I see is just being so successful and having so much leverage that she'll have to make the trade-off of satisfying your demands. I'm talking multi-millionaire status or something, with incredible frame. Even then leave it to them to get upset and resentful a while later and take the family hostage, even though by sheer virtue of being with you they're doing so much better than any other woman could. Another problem with this is common law, if you live together (or together enough), you're basically back at marriage, for all intents and purposes under the law.
Of course there's another option I've been thinking about lately. Find a girl richer than you. This is interesting, because it seems more difficult to get as divorce / common-law raped. Of course if she starts weathier then you catch up, well, back to square one.
Fuck man, I just want to pass on my genetics and give the little fuckers as good an upbringing as possible. I don't know if that's considered a "blue pill" desire, but frankly I don't care if it gets labeled as such because I'm passing on my genes in my lifetime one way or another. What advice would TRP give on doing this right?
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
We've just added a new flair to discuss exactly this.. what if we want kids?
/r/TheRedPill/comments/4hx88m/introducing_married_red_pill_flair/
[deleted]
balalasaurus 7y ago
I'll admit to being guilty of tone policing myself. As I spend most of my time on asktrp, a lot of the times I find myself having to convince people of TRP.
No longer.
TRP speaks for itself. It needs no convincing. You either swallow it or you don't. Those who truly want to make the change will have to work for it the same way the rest of us did. Steel is forged in fire.
THE_StrongBoy 7y ago
This comment has been overwritten by an open source script to protect this user's privacy. It was created to help protect users from doxing, stalking, and harassment.
If you would also like to protect yourself, add the Chrome extension TamperMonkey, or the Firefox extension GreaseMonkey and add this open source script.
Then simply click on your username on Reddit, go to the comments tab, scroll down as far as possibe (hint:use RES), and hit the new OVERWRITE button at the top.
sir_wankalot_here 7y ago
They have their own RP sub, itts called XX
idgaf- 7y ago
Even after TRP I held onto the idea of marriage being good for a while, for all the reasons you described.
But looking closely at the contract itself, it quickly started to unravel. It is all downside risk and no upside. I'm still of the opinion that an LTR with kids is fine if that's what the man decides with his life. But I will never involve the government between us.
It adds cash incentive for the woman to leave, which reduces her incentive to work through tough times.
It only adds a minor tax advantage in certain income situations (where she doesn't work).
It's very expensive to get a divorce.
The rare exception is marrying a rich woman. Even then no amount of money is really worth your freedom.
RedBigMan 7y ago
Yeah and it's funny because you only get a tax advantage when she doesn't work... and when she doesn't work odds are much higher she'll be given alimony when she does leave so damned if she does, damned if she doesn't.
Gunnilingus 7y ago
The catch-22 is that the best remaining women out there are not in America...and if you are in America, the only real way to maintain an LTR with one of them is to marry her. A real conundrum I've been struggling with since I swore off LTRs with American or Western-European women. Spinning plates is great, but I'm bored and want a change-up. I think I may have to emigrate.
redpillbanana 7y ago
Thank you for keeping the concern trolls and tone police at bay.
It is well-known that censorship of any form stifles creativity, innovation, and education. The people who oppose us the most happen to be the people who rely on censorship, both by law and via social shaming (Overton window), to advance their agenda. They rely on authority to promote their policies because free debate would expose their ideas as flawed and self-serving. If you have any doubt about the fact that they want our discussions made illegal, take a look at what happened to Gregory Alan Elliot.
Censorship leads to stupidity. If you ever debate our opponents, you'll see responses that follow this pattern: "Wow...just wow, it is inconceivable that you believe something so obviously wrong. I can't even imagine it. You're so far gone that it's not even worth talking to you." They can't wrap their minds around the simplest ideas because they buy into the censorship and they are thought-policing themselves. This is censorship in action, making people unable to comprehend ideas that are not allowed. If you want to see a severe case of censorship leading to stupidity, look at what is happening in Sweden or the UK.
RPS is right in that tone-policing is the first step in curbing freedom of speech and gaining control of the narrative. The hypocrisy in all this is that our opponents would be the first ones to cry about tone-policing and yet they are happy to police our tone. To that, I say: fuck the fucking fuckers.
[deleted] 7y ago
And that censorship is likely to increase. http://www.europarl.europa.eu/meetdocs/2009_2014/documents/libe/dv/11_revframework_statute_/11_revframework_statute_en.pdf see section 2(e)
RedMoonAscendant 7y ago
You're close to right, but just off a little.
Censorship is actually good and fine. In a group of like-minded thinkers who are trying to debate the logical conclusions of their fundamental principles, those who question the fundamental principles must be censored and ejected from the community.
We call these tight-knit communities "echo chambers," and there's nothing wrong with them. I'll paste what I wrote in another comment thread:
If everyone is allowed to question the basic tenets of the echo chamber, then it cannot build on its foundation - the entire discussion is always chaos and confusion. It's fine to let XX and PPD and TRP build their respective castles on their respective foundations.
When the storm comes, we will see which castle is left standing, and the refugees will come to the strong castle(s).
IVIaskerade 7y ago
There is nothing wrong with an echo chamber as long as you frequently expose yourself to ideas from outside it and think critically about the ideas found within. Otherwise an echo chamber is tantamount to sinking into escapist fantasy.
RedMoonAscendant 7y ago
Not if the echo chamber is correct.
You are correct that we should assume the echo chamber has some problems and fallacies that need to be addressed, but attempting to address them within the echo chamber is a waste of everyone's time.
[deleted] 7y ago
[deleted]
[deleted] 7y ago
I never followed the RPW sub but what you say is interesting.
I always pictured "red pill theory" as the "reality of human sexual dynamics" so I naturally imagined RPW would be helping women to fulfill their imperative: how to get your AF and your BB.
I never imagined RPW would be a sub on how to change the very nature of women (reduce hypergamy?) just in order to help men fulfill their sexual strategy.
IVIaskerade 7y ago
PPD isn't there to debate bloopers, it's there for you to develop your ideas and gauge blooper response.
sir_wankalot_here 7y ago
Because you are stupid.
These are the ideal RP strategies for women. Think about it.
angry-neckbeard 7y ago
Thought about it, decided I would do what I always do when those things come up. Soft next.
Either she is into me or she isn't worth my time.
Archwinger Endorsed Contributor 7y ago
So essentially, censoring the censorship?
Part of what I like about TRP is that you have a bunch of guys talking and figuring shit out. Also, shitting on women is pretty fun.
There's not a lot of direct censorship. If a guy legitimately (e.g., not troll) shits out some half-blue-half-purple sanitized viewpoint, people point out the 500 ways he's wrong and tell him to go find his balls. His shit gets downvoted so it's barely even visible. Life goes on.
Nobody rushes to delete shit because it's not official Red Pill doctrine. People see shit, it's wrong, they downvote, they respond, life goes on.
If you head over to Menslib, their rule is that everything comes from a feminist lens. They start with the proviso that feminism is right and awesome about everything, and every post and every comment comes from a feminist viewpoint.
Is that us now? Just replace feminist with Red Pill?
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
No, nothing has changed about our moderating policy. This has been our policy since day one.
RedMoonAscendant 7y ago
There is nothing wrong with an echo chamber. I don't know why people get so up in arms about it.
Censorship of viewpoints that question the basic tenets of your echo chamber is completely fine. Here, on XX, and on PPD.
If everyone is allowed to question the basic tenets of the echo chamber, then it cannot build on its foundation - the entire discussion is always chaos and confusion. It's fine to let XX and PPD and TRP build their respective castles on their respective foundations.
When the storm comes, we will see which castle is left standing, and the refugees will come to the strong castle.
FieldLine 7y ago
The Red Pill is bitter. Finding this place was the best and worst thing to ever happen to me.
The attraction to PPD is obvious - as you said, the moderate position "somewhere in the middle" is certainly more attractive than the picture painted by TRP even if it has no basis in reality. Which is why, I think, for a person to truly understand what TRP is all about they have to get burned.
There has to be some sort of middle ground, even if we don't subscribe to it. Someone new here would run for the hills if there was only TRP. I certainly would have. Let people read PPD, implement what they read there and arrive at their own conclusions. Hopefully they'll realize the truth before they make a major decision that's difficult to reverse like getting married, but if they don't, even if you try to convince them of the truth they won't listen to you. Just look at MRP.
[deleted] 7y ago
[deleted]
savoryprunes 7y ago
I believe purity of message is of utmost importance here. Our exclusivity keeps that possible. You wouldn't have learned what you have learned had it not been for the purity of message that the exclusivity has afforded.
BlackJ1 7y ago
I've said it before, but I feel like some people just fail to understand it fully.
TRP is being politically incorrect. TBP is being politically correct.
I firmly believe that most people who are so called "blue pill" know they are lying to themselves and other people. I don't remember the link, but there was a post in TBP where a RP user asked if people genuinely believed that nice guys have more success with women than jerks. You could tell in their responses they were full of shit.
I don't believe the PPD makes it any better because it seems to imply that there is something to debate about when it comes to human nature. There isn't. We can only observe and accept it(which TRP excellently does), which people on the PPD fail to do. Most posts are about users denying and trying to prove something wrong or right.
[deleted] 7y ago
I agree, I tthink PPD is a fucking retarded useless sub too. Redpill men shouldn't waste their time arguing with bluepill faggots.
jdgalt 7y ago
You don't think some people who come there are curious and might be persuadable?
[deleted] 7y ago
I do but it's not worth the effort. Men will find TRP if they choose to. If you go looking for it, you'll find it.
TheVictor333 7y ago
The funny part is that these "ex-red pill women" will always and inevitably be attracted to men with red pill alpha traits no matter how much they denounce it. It's like an extreme form of cognitive dissonance.
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
They are so clueless about how TRP works, that they actually believe their men in real life to be significantly different than the type of man that leaves here into the world.
IVIaskerade 7y ago
I love their hamstering about how their men are different because they "don't know about TRP, but are masculine."
causeandcorrelation 7y ago
They just get it bro. Why don't you understand?
TRPShill 7y ago
I was just about to mention something similar to this. They always "just know" that he doesn't know about TRP. I've seen that shit said so many times.
[deleted] 7y ago
I never really understood the whole concept behind red pill women.
One of the tenets of TRP is that men and women have a somewhat adversarial sexual dynamic.
In short a woman's goals aren't the same as a mans.
savoryprunes 7y ago
"...unsavory members."
Dammit. Now I need to change my username to unsavoryprunes.
But seriously, I'd come to the conclusion that RPW is just a place for women to learn how to snooker men with more alpha traits into marrying them. I'm surprised that any woman would be willing to openly admit that marriage is a bad deal for men - even supposedly RP women.
It just seems to me that the divide on the marriage issue is going to be insurmountable and ever-present (like the damn abortion debate). Why, then, does TRP include RPW in the red pill network?
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
We no longer have the offending mods- I think the discussion still holds merit- how can women best subvert their instincts to achieve a long-term happiness. I'm glad to have women who want to entertain the discussion itself, even if it's only for short periods of time.
bluecantuesday 7y ago
It or something like it would come to exist regardless, might as well have control over it so you can clear it out when it goes bad.
MentORPHEUS Endorsed Contributor 7y ago
Marriage may be broken, but humans still want to form pair-bonds.
Something that's going to come up for ongoing discussion is alternatives to marriage that are satisfactory to both men and women. RPS mentioned "LTRs that behave like a marriage but are not a marriage." THIS is the type of discussion that will be opening up, despite the critics who think its a binary choice of "Marry or you're just a plate."
Wel108 7y ago
This, along with children, is what i truly want to discuss.
savoryprunes 7y ago
Kudos to you guys for taking on the task of opening up that discussion. It's one thing to try to break up the binary thinking of marriage vs. plates amongst fellow men. I wouldn't shy from that task. It's another thing altogether to open up this discussion amongst women who are undoubtedly entrenched in the idea of marriage.
Is the thinking that a reasonable effort should be put forward to come to a diplomatic agreement with our sexually strategic adversaries? Does it look promising that some women can be swayed to concede the legal contract, thereby placing more trust in their chosen partner?
I'll be interested to see what the dynamics of these alternatives will look like. I remain skeptical that any significant number of women would ever be willing to eschew the marriage contract for something that men will find more agreeable. But what do I know. I'm not a pair-bond type of guy. I'm not even a plate type of guy.
[deleted] 7y ago
Given enough successful men running for the forever-bachelor hills, this will drive women to make concessions with alphas or even redpill aware beta bux who want to settle down but can't bring themselves to marry. As with most things, it's simply a matter of time and incentives.
MattyAnon Admin 7y ago
I just checked out MRP for the first time. Total fucking cringefest. Apparently a bitchy bossy demanding woman is a "red pill woman".
That term always fucking grated on me... "red pill woman". Women are ALL red pill, that's the point of TRP. Being prepared to admit her hypergamous, selfish, submissive, responsibility-denying passive manipulative nature doesn't make her a better person any more than a serial murderer confessing their guilt when presented with incontrovertible evidence.
[deleted] 7y ago
I respect RPS, but I really never understood the point of RPW or sharing redpill knowledge with women. It won't change anything about them. It just makes them more cunning, even tho they understand TRP at an instinctual biological level. Why give them an advantage?
IVIaskerade 7y ago
I always saw MRP as a sub for "you're an idiot for getting married, but since you went ahead and behaved idiotically, here's how you don't fuck up any further..."
It's a shame they couldn't hack that.
Meat-on-the-table 7y ago
Such an overlooked point, but one of immense importance. I liken it to the slave foremen of old: slaves "elevated" to be in charge of other slaves. They were often recorded as being the most brutal and uncompromising, eager to serve the master and prove how much better they were than the others.
The BP suckers are indoctrinated to serve the system early on and to continue to propagate self-censorship and the censorship of others. This only brings more men into the fold, as they take their cue from badgered fathers and husbands who are the tools of the feminine system.
Freedom comes at the cost of ostracization. But that is a price I am glad to pay for my liberty.
Whisper 7y ago
Well put, although the word you are looking for is "ostracism".
redpillbanana 7y ago
White knights come in many forms, unfortunately.
DexterousRichard 7y ago
Epic epic epic post.
This is a manual in countering Marxist infiltration of organizations. They dilute the boundaries, and attempt to chip away little by little at the attitude and positions of a culture, until like a frog boiling in slowly heating water, the core of the culture is coopted.
Just say no.
Thotwrecker 7y ago
I agree that RPW's issues are unavoidable. It's inevitable.
TRP seemed to really want to have this attitude of "TRP and RPW use the SAME knowledge and SAME ideological underpinnings, but TRP is a discussion on male sexual strategy and RPW on female strategy."
But while TRP focused on building a great product capable of attracting women (aka improving and building male SMV), it seems that RPW focuses on "how to get a great product" - aka how to get a high SMV guy.
But this is literally what we say women do. They do not want to build a great product (a high SMV woman capable of earning the man), they want to GET the great product. Women want to be taken up by a great guy, not be great themselves.
They are never going to discuss things like a 6 month monk mode plan to cut bodyfat, put on muscle in choice areas, improve skincare, and so on like we do.
Can we really be surprised that a bunch of women cooked up a strawman conception of this "alpha male who wants to marry an average woman" and they now discuss how to game this fantasy creature into commitment? This is what women do, this is their heroin, their Christian Grey. They want to believe in this mythical guy who is simultaneously high value and has options, has testosterone in abundance, yet simultaneously wants to emotionally and monogamously bond with their basic ass.
What did we expect? That because these women were mentally independent enough to not be scared away immediately by the bogeyname "Red Pill" that they were exceptions? As RPS says, AWALT.
I would even go so far as to say the fact if we ever get to the point where a sizable population of women can stomach and mentally entertain TRP without freaking out, then means we've become a bunch of soft, tone-policed pussies. TRP has to be inherently unpalatable to women and bloopies, because if it's not, then we've compromised our message and we're more watered down than Drake's new album.
Eager to see what's in store for TRP over the next few years. Can TRP with its mod leadership beat the "as subreddits grow, they turn to shit" syndrome? As long as the banhammers stay bloody and we report moralfags, trolls, and tone-policers, I hope so.
angry-neckbeard 7y ago
Of course I want a LTR.
Fuck that noise, I learned the hard way that society is full of shit. If a woman wants to stay with me, then stay with me, don't ask for the bullshit which we call marriage. Get rekt divorce rape, I moved to a state where common law marriage is a figment of the imagination.
[deleted] 7y ago
Thottie, I agree 100%. TRP is not and will never be , for women. Don't even understand the reason RPW exists. TRP should also never soften itself to comfort women. Women are pretty shit, and exist for reproduction. An unfortunate truth. Why give redpill knowledge to s creature like that?
Also, god you're right. Views was fuckin terrible. I liked like maaaybe 5 songs.
adam-l Endorsed Contributor 7y ago
RPS writes
This, a million times.
For an individual man, being self-centered and even selfish is the way out of the victimizing mainstream social expectations.
For a collective of men, "man-centrism", not "objectivity" neither "the interest of society" (or, the upholding of "western culture", as it is sometimes put in here) is the way forward, is the antidote to gynocentrism. Any focusing on keeping women happy is in vain. Focus on having the men happy, and voila, women are happy as well - even though their control-freak component is on constant alert.
[deleted] 7y ago
The thing is though, male and female sexual strategies cannot cooperate. In order for one to work properly, the other must fail. The war of the sexes is forever.
alvlear 7y ago
This is it. This is what really pisses me off. How can anyone want to marry such a disgusting creature. I spend all day hustling, scheming, trying to carve out what's mine on the planet. And this creature wants to come and just latch itself onto me. That is very disgusting.
Honestly, I do not know how you guys do it. Especially you, Thotwrecker. How do you have so much sex? Do you really find so many women attractive?
Periodically, hormones attack me, and I find a woman's physique attractive. However, when I call her over I am viscerally repulsed by her mediocre and pathetic consciousness. At this point, I am completely turned off, and there is no way I can have sex with the woman. And she is typically physically stunning. At times, I will play her along and get her somewhat invested so that certain chemicals in her brain create the illusion that she is intensely attracted to me. I then summarily get rid of her, because I am still not attracted to her. This is usually as far as I go though. I am practically a volcel.
I am an outlier, and my interests are rarely discussed on this sub. I am attracted to highly intelligent, strong, and powerful women. This is heresy to most men. My predilection is of course a bizarre case of projection, which is probably why for the life of me I can't find such a woman. Truthfully, I do not care for this that much. But then the hormones attack me, and I call over another disgusting specimen.
[deleted]
Thotwrecker 7y ago
All I can say is if you're looking for intellectual stimulation or a kindred spirit from a woman, you're fucking up big time. See, I provide enough intellectual stimulation for the both of us; I don't need her to be smart, I got that base covered. Just like I don't need her to have the same interests as me; I already HAVE those interests and qualities - the fuck do I need her to provide them for?
Why are you attracted to highly intelligent strong and powerful women? Do you not provide enough power? Enough strength? That needs to come from your nutsack, you need to rewire yourself to stop wanting that in a woman.
You sound like a "smart guy" and I think you have a little bit of that syndrome where you're thinking "ugh I'm so disappointed by how morally and intellectually vacuous everyone is around me!"
Just snap out of it, some people are people. Most men will screw you over for money or pussy, most women will screw you over a superior guy, and latch onto you parasitically until that moment comes. That's why you don't marry them. You use 90% of hot girls for casual ONS. Maybe 9% make the "FWB" cut. And that 1% is where you can think of LTR as a possibility.
So with those stats, you have to fuck your way through 99 to get to the 1. That ain't so bad dude, just soldier on and keep plowing through until you find gold. Or don't - that is a fair option too, but you cannot hamster about it.
alvlear 7y ago
I appreciate the response.
Cyralea 7y ago
The dangling of blue-pill candy is a known persuasion technique in manipulation circles. You start off by presenting safe, agreeable statements and building trust, then slowly walk the individual to the place you want to take them. You play to people's instinctive biases. Play on people's inherent desires for fairness and equality, and to be seen as socially upstanding.
The presentation of a "Purple pill" works because it plays on these biases. It's truly insidious how easily it can take root. People think they're being reasonable, and think no less of themselves for taking the "softer" approach, even though they are acting against their own best interests.
Recognizing your own interests as being über alles, and being cognizant of what they truly are, not what others decide for you, is probably the most important starting point for any RP'er.
mojo_juju 7y ago
As a proponent of Machiavellian communication/persuasion/manipulation tactics, I'd really like to see a post on this with some examples.
I'm struggling to come up with some examples off the top of my head of say, a 3 to 5 step thought process to walk someone through a situation or idea to consider, starting at blue pill frame, arriving at red pill frame.
I've been in interactions with people where I helped them see an issue with a red pill lense (i.e. paraphrasing a conversation at a bar: A woman tells me and my gf: "My mom complains about Dad. He is always out late, or drinking. Typical of a man, isn't it, to just ignore the problem and isolate himself? He is always out, and never home to [entertain] my mom". Me: "Well, you've got to ask what he wants to isolate himself from. He doesn't exist in a vacuum. Surely he is avoiding something that he also finds problematic, perhaps it's a lack of respect or a consistently displeasing attitude directed towards him at home? Because it would be myopic to only consider one perspective when there is at least two involved." )
... but to start at point A (BP) and lead it to point D or E (RP) sounds like quite a nifty tool to have in the toolbelt.
NightwingTRP 7y ago
This is exactly how political correctness went from "you shouldn't call black people niggers" to the modern nonsense of "you can't be racist against whites," and "don't call them coloured people, that's racist!" This shit doesn't happen overnight, it's happened over many years. Little by little, with seemingly good intentions, the overton window is shifted. Little by little.
Bloopers have a different set of base assumptions to me. Theirs is mostly based on the idea that words hurt. Mine are based on the idea that words only hurt if they reveal some kind of inner truth about the person... otherwise those words are irrelevant.
IVIaskerade 7y ago
"you should say 'people of colour' instead! That's not racist!"
[deleted]
NeoreactionSafe 7y ago
About marriage:
The Child Support Laws are the true hardcore evil in our world not so much the marriage which only tacks on additional penalties.
Child Support was illegal up until 1950 because it was correctly seen as a type of male slavery by English Law. The fact that they passed such laws shows how badly the men of that time misjudged the long term outcome.
Counter Argument
There is a counter argument that since the legal situation is so bad if you have children then you ought to take seriously the role of being the masculine polarity father figure from the very beginning. The role of Plate spinner is essentially abdicating the power over a woman and keeping yourself uninvolved and distant. That's great until you get that brain dead slut pregnant even if you aren't married because all of a sudden the full weight of the Child Support Laws comes crashing down on you.
If you are Plate spinning and not wrapping it up every time you are playing russian roulette with Child Support Laws even if you don't marry.
Child Support Laws are worse than the marriage additions for most men.
In most cases a marriage will not make things much worse.
mr_nate_ 7y ago
Nice to see us getting back on track.
[deleted]
Red_Faust 7y ago
IMO releasing the anger is helpful.
Releasing the anger is "improvement for self".
The fact that your antagonists recommend something doesn't need to mean it's not a good thing. But the use for releasing the anger is not to become more politically acceptable to the outside world. No need for that shit. No, the real use is for oneself: accepting reality and enjoying it as it is.
The anger that stems from having being deceived about the nature of women and relationships fades when you learn to use your new knowledge for your benefit.
The anger that comes out from women not being what you think they should be fades when you accept that women are how they are and it's useless to try and change them, so you might as well enjoy them.
I revelled and savored my anger for a good couple of years when I started opening up to the nature of women and relationships.
Then, as I started getting better and better results, the anger gradually faded as I became aware of my newfound powers.
Nowadays I love women for what they are. Of course I'll never go back to the blue pill worldview, nor would I enter any agreemen based on that worldview (like marriage).
I accept women as they are. I have no anger (that I'm consciously aware of) agains them as a group. As long as I don't forget how they really are, and I behave accordingly, that makes me happy. I'd rather be happy than bitter.
IVIaskerade 7y ago
Without anger, I'd never have hit the 1RM that I hold. Anger, controlled and released, is the most powerful driving force in the world.
[deleted] 7y ago
Fully with you. I'm fine with guys here expressing anger at women and society (and often their past selves). God knows, I have written enough angry words myself. To me though, I draw the line at exchanging one fantasy for another. The Red Pill analogy is waking up to see the world as it really is, not diving into something equally divorced from reality.
Case in point is guys saying that women are 'evil' or 'incapable of feeling love'. I don't hold women in high regard anymore, I have much higher regard for men, but much of what we see as 'evil' is women following their own subconscious and evolutionarily advantageous sexual strategy. It is at odds with ours, and it makes them manipulative so we have to be on our guard, but following a sexual strategy is not evil, otherwise TRP is evil too.
Similarly, 'women are incapable of love' I heard recently. I guess people skip over reading the sidebar, because it is right there, and what Rollo actually said was,
That is something rather different. If women were actually incapable of loving at all, first I wouldn't see the point of having a sexual strategy. If women are evil and cannot love, go full MGTOW. But in fact women will do anything for what they perceive as an Alpha. I don't really count myself as one, yet even I have been astonished in the past at what a woman was prepared to do for me. The whole 'alpha widow' idea is predicated on women falling deeply in love with someone they see as much above them, to the extent that they never get past it emotionally. Hypergamy itself is based on this. The neurochemical basis of 'being in love' is a proximate causation that makes women attempt pair bonding and thus pass on their genes.
So, to me, saying things like 'women are evil and incapable of love' is just another fantasy, the opposite of the blue pill one, but still a fantasy, and fantasies don't help you being affective in the world. However, as a stage at least it is useful in disinfecting the mind from all the BP garbage that filled it for so long!
angry-neckbeard 7y ago
I wonder if robots will be good enough to emulate humans in my lifetime. I would dump all my plates so hard for a loyal toy which I perceived to love me XD
[deleted] 7y ago
You know that feminists always love to talk about 'Stepford wives' if a woman is demure, attentive and submissive to her man? I always wonder if it ever strikes them that the robots in that film made better companions, better women, than modern women do? You would think that would give them pause, that women couldn't outcompete a robot at being a woman, but I guess not.
angry-neckbeard 7y ago
What really weirds me out about the whole concept is that when I bring up the topic of male robots as companions for women, that they don't seem to be as keen on them. I get that they can't produce children but is it really only that their robots couldn't provide them with resources? I guess I'm still having trouble with the female mindset.
savoryprunes 7y ago
Thank you for this perspective. I hadn't quite come to the realization about some of our members that they have overcorrected by adopting an anti-bluepill fantasy. This will help in a post I'm working on.
I'm MGTOW but I'm 39yo and I have the experience to know that this is the right choice for me. I've been in ltrs. I've spun plates. I've had ons. I'm genuinely an introvert who just doesn't have the patience for people - especially women.
Too many of these youngsters overreact and declare themselves MGTOW without the experience to make an informed choice.
[deleted] 7y ago
Look forward to reading it. The great insight from Rollo's rule was not that women are worthless, or that they cannot love at all, but finally realizing what it is that women fall in love with. That whole men>women>children>pets thing. A man may think that a woman is a hopeless dork, not understanding much, not in any sense his equal, yet love her anyway, just as parents love young children even though they are far less in abilities both mental and physical. That doesn't work for women at all, her love is grounded in respect and admiration, her need to 'look up' to you. That was one of the cornerstones of TRP for me. And from it we get the whole 'improve yourself' mantra, because you have to be superior to her.
So I am fine with men thinking they are superior to women and 'looking down' on them to some degree. They are not equal, and a partnership of equals doesn't work because the woman loses respect and gets turned off. The feminist/BP-endorsed 'marriage of equals' doesn't work because of women, not because of men. But seeing them as not equal is not the same as seeing them as uttterly worthless or evil. If they were that, no point in engaging with them at all. Instead of a 'sexual strategy' TRP would be a 'avoid women' strategy. But I'm fairly tolerant of when it goes beyond just 'inferior to us in many respects' because it acts as an antidote to the feminist conditioning we are constantly bombarded with. It isn't a useful end state, however.
Chrience 7y ago
Thank you for this post. I've been seeing a lot of this 'purple pill' propaganda recently. One particular example is that there are some guys here telling you you should marry, or else you're a 'genetic dead end'. That 'society will crumble' if guys like us don't reproduce, and that 'getting married ensures the best environment for kids' (i'd say it doesn't, because getting married actually incentivises the wife to leave through the femcentric divorce laws, take the kids and poison their minds against the father). Watch out for these lies particularly, they're trying to drive men to get married through shame.
With a life long decision like getting married, men should think about it with a clear mind, without any societal pressure or emotional manipulation from the media, friends and LTRs nearing their 30s. When you do, you'll realise, with enough uncensored information about sexual dynamics and the state of women today, that it's a bad choice for men. It's why even guys who know nothing about the red pill have gone MGTOW in increasing numbers.
Another example of all this manipulation is from the 'rape fugee' crisis. After women were being beaten, raped and threatened in places like Colonge, there was a feminist Rollo wrote an article about who was saying men needed to reclaim their masculinity and fight for their country against the Muslim 'invaders'. Seems fine enough, except that with a closer look, what she said was essentially 'man up', another Feminine shaming attempt to get men to serve women's own selfish, solipsistic interests.
The key to keeping frame is to focus on your own goals, and look at everything through this lens, from conversations to events, to others body language. Make sure your decisions are not being emotionally driven by someone else.
WeedDaddy 7y ago
On the other hand, "Focus on yourself", "you are the only person you can control" etc is solipsistic or myopic at best. If you let the world around you burn, you have to live in ruins.
In this situation male and female interest can unite. Men offer protection and women reward it with sex. A more manly proposition than dolling yourself up with tattoos and trendy threads in order to get sex.
It's not manly to watch from the sidelines while outsiders feast on your women. If you don't own your nation's women, they will. Women will submit to the strongest group of males in the environment.
There's a small amount of attractive women in the world and men from all over the world are after them.
[deleted] 7y ago
This is why I've been focusing on the military mindset. Master self discipline and look after your buddies first (they'll be looking out for you too). Lots of good red pill knowledge if you look at what the military does.
redpillbanana 7y ago
As I've mentioned before, Richard Dawkins had the last word on this in his book The Selfish Gene:
(Note this was written before the DNA testing on Richard III's skeleton revealed infidelity in the royal lineage.)
There are 32 generations between William the Conqueror and Elizabeth II so you can do the math.
ToSeeAndToHear 7y ago
This is a fallacy - there is no reason to count how much someone has maintained their genes after 32 generations by how much of their genetics exists in one of their descendants, you ought to count it by measuring how much exists in all their descendants.
That said, the point is well made that your descendants may not be anything like you, and seeking immortality in them is a silly thing.
angry-neckbeard 7y ago
This is actually really great food for thought. I wasn't really seeking immortality when thinking about children but I did think it was important to pass on my genes. Now I wonder if it really matters in the scheme of things.
UrsusG 7y ago
And if you look at it broadly enough, we share many genes with everything that lives. Not just other people, not just other hominids, not even all other mammals, but with literally everything, including (redpill) bananas.
So if you're concerned with immortality on behalf of your genes, then worry not, their survival is assured through presence in literally every life form on this planet.
fasthandssam 7y ago
This is an interesting point that I hadn't considered until you guys pointed it out. Another way one can think of it is this: genes are information, and in a significant way the protection and replication of genes is a protection and replication of information.
So perhaps a better way to pursue "immortality" would be to generate new information, new ideas. Create art or music or come up with an invention or write a book. This may even be a better way of pursuing the higher calling of a man's life (as opposed to having offspring) because 1. The information passed on would have higher fidelity 2. You have a much larger amount of choice and control regarding what ideas you'd like to express.
This is an interesting topic, because I think the innate desire to "pass on" something in a meaningful way is a big motivator for men. But maybe it is time for us to stop prioritizing genetic information and instead focus on higher creative forces. I think this deserves further consideration...
redpillbanana 7y ago
That's a great point. And if humans die out then some other species might eventually take our place.
My bet is on the red pill bananas.
[deleted]
IVIaskerade 7y ago
It's going to be cats, the only species to universally possess Dark Triad traits.
redpillbanana 7y ago
Not a bad prediction.
There's a book called The World Without Us which talks about the development of the earth after humans are extinct. The author predicts that cats will do very well because they are such good predators.
CopperFox3c 7y ago
The efforts of the RPwives mods (aka ex-RPW mods) going on PurplePillDebate and the Blue Pill sub to directly attack TRP was probably the most ironic part of all this. All the sudden, we no longer provide any benefit for association (Briffault's Law), and they go full-on crazy assault. Fraternize with our opposition, publicly denounce us. Like some scorned ex-girlfriend. Like some war bride. I doubt they even realize their behavior is TRP 101.
If you want a pure example of AWALT, you need look no further. Even amongst the exemplars of so-called "red pill women" ...
As to all the attempted tone-policing and watering down of the TRP message, I'd simply add this: A sword must be forged in fire. There is no other way ...
mensafloyd 7y ago
Excellent, CopperFox3c! Excellent! The funny thing is, The Red Pill means you're unplugged, you see reality for the ugly and not so ugly truths that it is. One refers to logic and empirical facts as part of The Red Pill! Yet RPW uses allegorical comparisons from fiction as a means to justify their brand of hamstering! When in reality their way of thinking is mental Cosplay at best. The Red Pill (men) need to take re-ownership of the brand so it can stop getting molested by these so called red pill women. AWALT absolutely! Again, Excellent!
[deleted] 7y ago
I honestly don't understand the point of the RPwives/Rpwomen subs. Its essentially just whores convincing themselves they're not whores from what I can tell. Being traditional doesn't change anything.
[deleted] 7y ago
Except they brought it to mrp. Was a great example for guys on the nature of women.
Felt like the kid whose divorced parents would bitch about the other one, and pass messages through us.
BluepillProfessor 7y ago
More like ignored you while they scratched and fought over you.
[deleted] 7y ago
Lol, neither wanted us.
Meat-on-the-table 7y ago
I stroked my goatee as I watched this all unfold. From being a part of building the RP community and contributing to it, to bucking against the hand that guided them and turning away when they decided that they didn't want anyone to regulate them.
They confirmed my worst suspicions about women and AWALT. Even when presented with facts that directly state that they will behave a certain way, they are powerless to stop themselves.
[deleted]
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
They are nothing more than creatures of emotion, forever victim to the whims of their irrationality.
RedBigMan 7y ago
I have no hope for the MRP sub. Any man who would encourage other men to get married in the current legal environment are doing those men a huge disservice. Even if they are top tier alpha men they end up getting divorce raped and it's more likely because they have the money to lose.
As for the RPW sub. I can understand why they would promote marriage because it's about women who possess red pill knowledge. Knowing what they do about male and female interaction and dynamics it still makes sense that a woman would want to secure that ultimate level of commitment from her man because it ensures that she and any offspring they have will be taken care of in the event the relationship does not work. For a woman marriage is all benefit and no cost so it would be foolish for women not to promote the idea that they should get married. However, they should realize that a larger and larger portion of men... men they would like to sink their claws in to are opting out of marriage entirely which decreases their potential husband pool which means they need to make themselves more attractive both physically as well as mentally/socially to potential husband material men.
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
Agreed- and this is actually still very much the view of RPW. It was the point geared towards men that they were making that I was addressing. For women, they'd be insane not to want marriage.
[deleted]
[deleted] 7y ago
Than you haven't been There. There are men pulling each other out of the mud, taking back their lives. Faggots being forged by fire and rebuilt. Alpha married guys running a solid, action oriented ship. Lawyers, doctors, phds, military men of all levels.
There's theory that easily compares in breadth and depth to a single man's rp theory.
Even tfa, with his marriage 1.0 outlook, still drives men to be on the top of their game, and does it well. I'm sure lots of people here find neoreactionaries views on the collapse unpalatable, but he's still a solid value here.
It's an Ironic statement, considering how much trp is vilified with one poster and a one off opinion in other subs.
[deleted]
Meat-on-the-table 7y ago
And the safe-space-echo-chamber that the forum provided them only amplified the situation. Any lingering doubts solitary members may have had were quashed out by the screams of the hamster in unison.
Proda 7y ago
Basically women are like the Orks from 40k. Only difference is the kind of emotion that drives them.
Ork= Bloodlust
Woman= Self-interest.
I wonder why weren't men selected by evolution to accept such a behaviour from women and we instead find it odd and strange when we come to realize it piercing the veil of Maya...
TheInevitableHulk 7y ago
That's basically what eldar are, they do the whole sterile ritual stuff because if they don't they will turn out like the dark eldar which are living the same way they always have which caused another chaos god to appear which screwed everything up
Proda 7y ago
Hey, this actually makes sense!
reigorius 7y ago
Interesting question. Why didn't we? Why does the blue pill mindset seems to be default by nature, even without the unrelenting avalanche of blue pill speak, thinking and propaganda.
Proda 7y ago
My take on this is that we may have internalized during our evolution the concept that women are valuable, inherently more so than men, that is why we frown upon those who kill "women and children" and the blue pill mindset grew up feeding on this, but still I know my interpretation is just partial, and It has been a long while since I studied evolutionary biology so I may be wrong, but I still wanted to discuss this topic as I find it very important to better understand ourselves as men.
Axel_Black 7y ago
You fucking nerd lmao. I love it hahaha. Dow 3 announced btw.
Proda 7y ago
Well I AM a nerd :P but seriously, that doesn't mean that the Red Pill isn't any less true or useful for someone who is less interested in women than average. And, dear god DoW 3, I need it like I need air! I'm so Hyped...
Axel_Black 7y ago
I absolutely agree.
lurkingtacopiller 7y ago
I've recently starting seeing a girl who has a deep understanding of male-female relationships and basically the majority of what we talk about here. Despite that, while she can literally point out when she's being what she calls "crazy", she then immediately says that she can't help it.
It doesn't matter how self-aware they are or like to think they are, there's nothing they can do to stop their emotional thoughts from seeping out.
veggie_girl 7y ago
Women are slaves to their imperative. Slaves that cannot be freed. Unfortunately no matter how enlightened or educated the woman is, she can't contain it.
Heck even looking at extreme examples, there are FtM trannies that look like men and sound like men, but are unable to hold a relationship because they still are under full control of hypergamey.
reigorius 7y ago
I've seen girls struggle real hard to overcome their inner disturbance when their ever changing needs are not met. I applaud the ones who can vocalise that their mind is utter chaos.
NightwingTRP 7y ago
I have had multiple women admit to me that their vagina has more control over them than they have over it. They really can't help themselves and I think many of them know it. The thing is, once you realise that... if you admit it, then you basically confess that your opinions are worthless and anything you say could be driven by a fleeting emotion. So they try to deny it - because otherwise they'd never be taken seriously. (Which they shouldn't be.)
Wel108 7y ago
As I'm sure we all already know, but it just makes me chuckle every time i get reminded of this. The fact that there's a message going around every where in society that MEN are the ones who cannot control their penis, or rather their desire.
At the very least say, "we're all human and everyone is different." But no, it's men, not women. Never women who have these uncontrollable urges and irrational thoughts.
SkorchZang 7y ago
I was told there's a surprisingly resilient lewd russian proverb: "The Wife Is Not Her Pussy's Master."
It's the ABCs of women, and yet the delusional blue world will refuse to learn them, considering knowing the ABC or being literate in the subject, very immoral.
KyfhoMyoba 7y ago
See my previous comment on this thread.
I believe her. I think that when women get "caught up in the moment" and when "it just happened," they really and truly can't control themselves, i.e., they lack agency.
I read a series of posts/comments on some marriage board by a woman that was trying to repair her young marriage after cheating on her husband one time (ONS, no alcohol involved). She first wanted advice on whether or not to tell her husband. She felt bad but didn't know if telling him would just add him to the 'feeling bad' category. Advice seemed to be overwhelming to confess, which she did. It was catastrophic. Over the next year attempting to fix things. She had no idea how much she had hurt her husband and the marriage. Throughout the entire year's posts and comments she seemed very, very sincere, open and as honest as she could be (many statements against interest). And here's the kicker: she could not figure out how she (consciously) came to the decision to cheat.
I've seen this same scenario in other accounts of wives cheating. They. Just. Don't. Know.
Wel108 7y ago
You have no idea how much this resounded in me. Thinking back at my last relationship and the conversations we had after she fucked up, it was literally the same message.
Then, after all was said and done and we broke up, she hamstered by saying "she didn't cheat, and it wasn't actually cheating." But that's not what's important here. It's the correlation between her, literally crying and not knowing how this happened, how it got here, how did she become so weak, (which i believe) and then not being able to accept it after the fact as well. It's all relative, they're literally just victims to their emotion. No matter how much we may care, we can never give in and think that she is different, and she wouldn't "do that." Because given the right circumstances, any woman would.
Let's even go out on a limb here and say given the right circumstances, a man would too. But we logically and consciously make our mistakes, that's the fucking difference. It's the fleeting emotion of what she feels for you that's dangerous.
[deleted] 7y ago
[deleted]
[deleted] 7y ago
And this right here is why you never trust a woman and women's words were regarded as worthless since pretty much forever. Why in Islam, a woman's words are worth half that of a man, if any. Why? Because their words have no meaning to them. They have no agency/responsibility.
[deleted]
TheReformist94 7y ago
Women openly cheat,brag,practice open hypergamy,yet the sub has issues with men cheating on their wives. I just don't get it.
educatethis 7y ago
I've frequently refused wives who wanted to cheat. I tell them that I respect their spouses, and I wouldn't want to be cheated on myself. Women need leadership, they need to be around strength.
Wel108 7y ago
I do the same, and for this exact same reason. But RP isn't about morality. It's about understanding the nature of women. There is no right or wrong in nature, it just is.
educatethis 7y ago
I agree. But my code is to respect the poor bastard who stupidly got married by respecting his vows, not hers.
KyfhoMyoba 7y ago
I ran across a study from the '80s showing that connectivity between the neocortex and the limbic system/brain stem is 8 to 12 times higher in men than in women. Wish I could find it again.
QuantumFuantum 7y ago
Does that mean men have more control over their emotions than woman do
KyfhoMyoba 7y ago
Of course. Men have their emotions mediated and modulated by the neocortex at a rate 10x more than women do.
LarParWar 7y ago
As you probably know, the brain is basically just millions of years of evolutionary clusterfuck one neuronal layer at a time. You yourself have a brain stem (worm layer), cerebellum and basal ganglia (movement; lizard layer), limbic system (complex emotions; mammal layer), and the neocortex (language, consciousness, and impulse control; human layer). The reason I detailed all these is to make the following point: that each subsequent level of evolution refines the levels previous. That is, each higher level is wired into most of the functions of the the levels below it, and can assume executive responsibility if necessary. One might even say: Assume Direct Control.
Anyway, the most obvious example is probably breathing--your subconsciousness does it if you're not thinking about it--or blinking, or swallowing. You can do it manually, but most of the time it's on autopilot.
The Greek concept was the Tripartite Soul: http://i.imgur.com/xzONpBg.jpg
QuantumFuantum 7y ago
You don't have mental control over your digestive muscles or heart. But maybe that's because humans just don't know how even though the capability is there. Like trying to move your middle finger but having to through trying every finger first
KyfhoMyoba 7y ago
It has been shown that with proper feedback anyone can exhibit control down to the firing of a single neuron. Experienced Buddhist monks do this shit in their sleep - they can raise and lower their body temp at will.
karmalizing 7y ago
Don't believe this sort of hype. Raising or lowering body temperature is mostly just flexing / unflexing major muscle groups.
The hardcore Buddishts I've known over the years have been the most disconnected from reality. It's a religion of disassociation.
[deleted] 7y ago
[deleted]
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^0.3016740716296229
bogeyd6 7y ago
Assigning MRP a reputation based off a handful of people is probably not the best way to handle it. Following that line of logic I could say TRP is filled with angsty teens looking to get laid... Generalizations are not our friends.
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
Based on the behaviors of a moderator who is tasked with steering the discussion.
[deleted] 7y ago
Flavour posters are driving the discussion. It's 7k members, you know how this works, you've been through it.
bogeyd6 7y ago
Let's hope that one person doesn't define MRP.
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
No hope needed. LTR and Marriage are on topic for TRP. We're going to be revamping our flairs specifically for this.
bornredd 7y ago
Excellent. I believe that the current degradation of masculinity can't be halted unless men who understand what is happening start having families and raising their kids. It makes me sad to look at all these young men who come to TRP to be told to never marry. Raising my own children is one of the more satisfying experiences of my life.
Be smart about it. Choose wisely. Don't end up like the guy at the end of Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade. It's work - hard work - but the rewards can be worth it.
MentORPHEUS Endorsed Contributor 7y ago
This is a good development. For its faults, MRP has a good shipping product for men who unplug while married. TRP has some good writers on the subject too, but admit it, when a married guy wanders in here, the majority of responses heap scorn and insults upon him, and actionable advice is buried or not mentioned.
[deleted] 7y ago
It's a great one. Remember, the OMG are pretty much the average guy in here, or former alpha, who has lost his way, he's not starting from 0, he's starting from -10.
It's been said from the start. MRP isn't pro marriage, it's anti divorce rape. And since the only control you have is over self, than that's where we shall focus.
IVIaskerade 7y ago
I've always seen MRP as saying "well, you done fucked up. With that in mind, here's how you proceed so you aren't fucking up even further:"
[deleted] 7y ago
You still have options, but that's pretty accurate.
NightwingTRP 7y ago
That rests with the other moderators. Where do they stand as a group? Does the actions of that individual reflect the group or not?
bogeyd6 7y ago
I cannot speak for the other mods, but I think you are going to find there is a definite split on those who recommend and do not recommend marriage.
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
Whomever is responsible for a split mod team needs to get his house in order.
[deleted] 7y ago
How large a split though? I mostly know the minds of the flaired users, and it's a split between "Absolutely not" and "too early to make that reccomendation", with one 5000 word essay as an absain.
With one exception, but I argue he's the exception that proves the rule, as opposed to the model.
[deleted]
NightwingTRP 7y ago
I would echo RPS's comments. You can't effectively work as a team if you're split on something absolutely fundamental.
Personally, I think whoever that is who is saying he'd marry all over again is just in denial about the fact he made a dumb gamble when he was blue pill. It's probably come from a need for control... can no longer admit when he didn't have real control so he rationalises away the weakness. Essentially saying "I didn't make a bad decision by marrying... I just wasn't Red Pill enough to make it work back then. Now I can make it work, the decision was clearly fine."
For me, MRP is not Red Pill on hard mode. (I believe that glorifies things too much. An equivalent for us would be to go out and game with a mediocre SMV. It's on hard mode, the chicks won't be naturally interested. However, it's doable. Despite the fact it can be done... who the fuck is going to pretend that's something to be proud of or something you actually want to do? It's called fucking retarded to handicap yourself like that when you could spit game on easy by a few wardrobe changes, lift a bit and get a haircut.) MRP is trying to play the game after having surrendered your best trump card (the ability to walk away.) It's doable, it's difficult... but getting in that position was never a sensible move in the first place any more than trying to go out and game without raising your base SMV first. So yeah, you won't be able to convince me that any guy from there saying he'd get married all over again is anything but mentally handicapped to complement his relationship handicap.
That's just my take on it though. Ultimately it's you guys who need to take a very hard, (and possibly painful), look at what's going on.
bogeyd6 7y ago
You miss the fundamental point. Unplugging men are already married and for many there is no way out. A general goes to war with the army he has. The tools are provided for after you are handicapped. The trump card is not given up. You can still walk away but with that comes penalties. Usually for most men it's because there are children involved. I digress. The point is moot because we are discussing the minority.
Also you assume I am pro marriage and I am clearly not so the points brought up really don't apply to me. The split amongst the users is there and it is very clear. You also have your split. Does MRP subtract from trp? No, not as a whole.
[deleted] 7y ago
[deleted]
[deleted] 7y ago
Military men all get cheated on.
[deleted] 7y ago
And you get a prime example on how bad it gets. That mod was the exception that proves the rule, not the model.
Also, stokers don't count as sailors lol
KyfhoMyoba 7y ago
I've long said that the US Military is/makes one Blue Pill.
[deleted] 7y ago
[deleted]
IVIaskerade 7y ago
Not exactly.
MRP is for men that have gotten married. They are correct when they say that marriage is TRP on hard mode. The problem comes when some of them start seeing this as a good thing. Once you start seeing marriage as a good thing, it's a very short leap to seeing it as having inherent benefits, and from there advocating for marriage not needing to be changed, because the state of being married is inherently good.
Believing marriage to be good makes you soft, and when you're playing on hard mode you can't afford that.
NightwingTRP 7y ago
True. But it's not going to make working with TRP much fun... and there's a fair bit of crossover from some prominent members. I also miss theultimatecad. Does anybody know what happened to him?
[deleted] 7y ago
Im curious as well. He was one of my favorite posters. Asked around, didn't get a solid answer.
[deleted]
[deleted] 7y ago
Trump card my ass. There's plenty of guys in there who build themselves back up, and then drop the papers anyways, or start getting plates regardless.
This is an argument of 1% vs the rest. You have more in here calling current year the fall of Rome
NightwingTRP 7y ago
This is called a disengagement. You would do well to read my base guide on argumentation.
I'm not sure whether you realise how the willingness to walk away works as a strong part of dread or whether you seem to have some kind of incorrect perception of using it as an ultimatum or something stupid like that. What you've just cited is literally irrelevant to what I said.
I have no idea what you're dribbling about. My best guess is that you're implying we're not united over here maybe? All mods and endorsed guys are on point here. We're not divided on this topic. EVEN IF we assume you're right that people are calling this the fall of rome... it's irrelevant. Whether current year is the fall of rome is not a key issue for TRP that requires us to agree. Whether or not endorsed guys and mods recommend marriage or not... that is relevant to the direction we take.
[deleted] 7y ago
fuck it. when you get a container ship with a few bad lemons, you get busy making lemonade with the rest, or you return the merchandise.
rps tells guys who complain about the state of trp should start providing more content and stop complaining. It's the same standard here, and 99% of us are doing just that. Iron sharpening iron.
If the rp message gets muddled, people will move on. Until then, feel free to contribute to the direction you want to see it go.
I'm not about to start calling for a reformation on account of a few people who think their marriage is the standard, and you can sprinkle a little alpha on it to win.
This post may be edgy, but I'm not going to get lumped in with that circle jerk called ppd, or the blue cuck fest.
redpillbanana 7y ago
Regarding marriage and the "status ladder", I wrote this a while back:
I don't think that it is necessary to be married in order to be a leader. I'd say that marriage is necessary if you're being chosen vs doing your own thing.
Most Fortune 500 CEOs are chosen, but there are plenty of CEOs who have started their own company and have remained single. Felix Dennis comes to mind. Bill Gates also didn't marry until well after he had become a billionaire.
Politicians, military officers, managers, etc - all these people are chosen by other people, so appearance is important. In fields that are meritocracies, such as starting a business, sports/competition, instruction, engineering, etc, where social appearances are not as important, you can be a bachelor and do fine.
[deleted] 7y ago
The only discussion on marriage was a single younger mod who still married his high school sweetheart, telling people to "sprinkle more alpha on it"
The overwhelming majority are on task.
[deleted] 7y ago
The thing is though, "sprinkling more alpha on it", is exactly right. While the wording is a bit flowery, whether you are married or just spinning a plate, using more alpha is pretty much what everyone who swallowed the red pill and ended up here, needs to do. A lot of married guys are so beta, and don't even realize it, that using more alpha behaviors actually works really good. And another way of using more alpha could also be said as running game. Parts of it anyway.
RedBigMan 7y ago
Except that over time in any LTR a woman is going to continue to shit test you periodically. This is when you apply typical shit test dealing with techniques.
They are also going to comfort test you, this one is harder to deal with because a comfort test is something they throw at you when they think you're too alpha and risk losing you. You need to respond to these tests with some beta qualities.
Comfort tests will over time decrease your alpha to beta ratio which is why it's always better to start out with higher levels of alpha qualities.
Most red pill men will start out 75-80% Alpha qualities and over time in a LTR will drop to maybe 55-60%. It's only when you drop below 50% will your relationship suffer. In which case dread game is what fixes things. You pump your Alpha qualities back up to their original levels and it signals to her that you're preparing to exit the relationship so she tries harder to keep you because she's already invested in you. Sunk cost fallacy can help you in a LTR when you realize that your woman is highly invested in you.
[deleted] 7y ago
I think any woman will shit test you, LTR or not, from time to time. Again I know and agree with all this. My point was that a mod was giving out advice to be more alpha, which is clearly red pill knowledge. I had assumed that there was more to his discussion like you mentioned above. Now, if he only said be more alpha and that was it, your reply to me makes sense.
btw my rule of thumb is that a shit test is about you, and a comfort test is about her. When in doubt use tone to help you figure it out.
[deleted] 7y ago
Mosquito's always to bite you... You don't change your plans because of it
[deleted] 7y ago
Yes, though thats only first steps
[deleted] 7y ago
Yes, though thats only first steps. There's congruence testing, comfort testing and shit testing. Each involves a different approach. You're going to need a balance of alpha, not just more of it, otherwise you're just giving her a no win relationship, and you will nuke it
[deleted] 7y ago
Agree with this. The plugged in married guy can fix a lot by just being more alpha. However, to clarify, I did not mean that to be the only, end all be all fix.
[deleted]
[deleted] 7y ago
MRP is doing just fine. If two posters are enough to get your panties in a bunch, than I don't know what to tell you.
verify_account 7y ago
The fact that you came her to reply tells us that your panties are actually a little tight ;) Other than the "MARRIAGE IS GOOD" stuff, I like MRP for LTR advice.
[deleted] 7y ago
They have to be, otherwise my Johns can see the bulge, and know something is up.
Besdies, I've checked the official mod thread on this issue. There looks to be 3 people... 3, out of 7k. I wonder what opinion would be of any of us with that kind of criteria?
I wouldn't want to damn us all
Squeezymypenisy 7y ago
Its useful for LTR examples from what I have found. For single examples I use this place. I never much cared for the theories or why anything was the way it was. It is what is, now where is the profit. A few more field reports would be cool, maybe some more of those BP examples to laugh at.
[deleted] 7y ago
You'll find my submission history reflects that as well, as do many.
The fact a guys willing to put his nuts on the chopping block for guys to beat them into dropping again take a lot of guts. The own you shit weekly thread is something I think every rp sub should have.
It's easy to bullshit yourself. Not so easy to bullshit everyone else.
Squeezymypenisy 7y ago
Your posts are often pretty humorous, if not for the fact that you stick to your guns. Which mod is he talking about? The only ones I see a lot of, at least in my limited interaction is you, BPprof, and I think one other.
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
Thefamilyalpha- who has a comment chain in this thread somewhere trying to defend marriage.. again.
[deleted] 7y ago
The family alpha, and to a lesser extent some of the new guys, because they still haven't clicked.
It was a good discussion to have, but I agree rps, the advocating was a bridge too far.
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
It was more than two users.
It was quite a large number of users whose goal it was to take a collective shit on TRP users. The moderator who was pro marriage was the straw that broke the camel's back.
You know I have respect for you stone.
[deleted] 7y ago
Damn it! Well, so much for that rant lol.
Either way, it's a fair point, but I'm not getting lumped with the purple circle jerk, or the blues. Those two don't do shit.
bogeyd6 7y ago
I seriously doubt that there so many people shitting over trp users that it caused you to become enraged. You spoke to no one through the mod mail. You endorsed /u/bluepillprofessor banned /u/uemcgill. This sounds more like you took a few snapshots and formed a bad opinion off bad evidence. You gave us mods at mrp no information to rectify the situation and you hamstered that you can accuse MRP of border erosion.
In another note you banned me on the irc channel just because I was from mrp. Blind assumptions are ridiculous.
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
I did contact BPP regarding the state of things, and mentioned I'd be reviewing the content to see if we could consider putting it in our sidebar.
I was offered a moderator position - I think BPP did- and I didn't think I'd be a good fit with the moderating policy there so I declined.
I think there's enormous value on your sub that is being made rancid by the moderator decision to entertain trolling, and witch hunts, rather than enforcing that the threads stay on topic.
Some of the guys there don't like me, I get it. But they haven't given me one ounce of rational argument, they're just trolling. In my house, we remove the riff raff.
bogeyd6 7y ago
The point is moot and the actions are done. MRP Flair on TRP is a good idea as stated previously. Instead of trashing the sub on TRP, I would have preferred that we made a go at this together. You are convinced that only your TRP endorsed users are capable of helping marriages and somehow /u/Adderallabuse with a 10 day account factored into being help to someone make a go out of the life they already fucked up. Time will tell if your people can make the transition and pivot on the synergies of family life and single life.
Good luck, and I sincerely hope that your MRP flair actually helps family men get their shit together, unplugged, and their lives back on track.
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
I'm sure by now people must have understood we have a policy whereby ECs who contact mods before they delete their old accounts can get their flair back on their new account. We don't speak about who they are for anonymity's sake, obviously if they deleted an account, there's a reason for it.
I really wish there had been more working together too. I did try to reach out, but the general attitude over there really, really wasn't conducive to my goals: helping men. I know there are some members there who are for helping men. And they're here right now having a calm, rational conversation with me. And I appreciate that.
There are some quality posters on MRP who I do not mean to trash. But the trolling that's happening even now tells me that the sub itself was never up to par for our side bar.
Thank you. For the good of men, I do hope you contribute.
[deleted] 7y ago
MRPs mission is critical.
IMO, the execution can be handled in TRP-like ways at TRP without muddled messages and invitations to women and men who regularly post at TBP.
You are welcome and encouraged to participate here.
-Anteros- Endorsed Contributor 7y ago
You were banned for this:
[2016-04-29 19:55:47] <bogeyd6> lots of faggots here
Not because you are from MRP. We do not automatically ban MRP users unless they try trolling like you did. For more info on how to act, check out this page which was sent to you repeatedly instead of making things up on reddit.
bogeyd6 7y ago
Taken out of context and you know that. Men always call each other faggots and then I was messaged and told that as MRP I am not welcome there. That wasn't trolling. It was an attempt to enter the sandbox. That page was never sent to me. When I get home Ill post the logs of the user who told me it was because of MRP.
-Anteros- Endorsed Contributor 7y ago
Here is more context, hopefully you're referring to the list from the .kickfags command being large instead of being a new guy calling everyone fags.
[2016-04-29 19:52:36] <Anteros> but we have something that is a bit more encompassing
[2016-04-29 19:52:40] <Anteros> .kickfags
[2016-04-29 19:52:41] <Enmity> neet
[2016-04-29 19:52:41] <TRPBot> 14 targets acquired: RootA, nnngh, jjj, lodbrok, crimtab, GetMoneyGetPaid, strike_, Zenta, semicolon, asgeirtj__, PrivilegedApe, rudi, Les, uber` - ^C09.kickfags go^C to initiate
[2016-04-29 19:52:58] <DocObvious> I smelled the faggotry from my phone in my pocket.
[2016-04-29 19:53:00] <ethicsman> Where's snuupy
[2016-04-29 19:53:01] <Anteros> get your game up new guys
[2016-04-29 19:53:08] <ethicsman> On the Canadian fag list
[2016-04-29 19:53:26] <ethicsman> Virgin Canadian.
[2016-04-29 19:53:53] <Les> Hey guys
[2016-04-29 19:53:53] <OmegaRed> virgin canadian is superfluous
[2016-04-29 19:53:54] TRPBot set channel modes -b !~vltrltv@s010600266c9c5e71.cc.shawcable.net
[2016-04-29 19:53:57] <OmegaRed> it's like an atm machine
[2016-04-29 19:54:02] <semicolon> O.o
[2016-04-29 19:54:09] <Tizen> pin number
[2016-04-29 19:54:13] <OmegaRed> redunand
[2016-04-29 19:54:13] → vltr joined (~vltrltv@S010600266c9c5e71.cc.shawcable.net)
[2016-04-29 19:54:23] <OmegaRed> redunant*
[2016-04-29 19:54:49] <DocObvious> NIC card
[2016-04-29 19:55:17] <Enmity> that's because people don't know what shit stands for in acronyms
[2016-04-29 19:55:23] <Anteros> dumb blonde
[2016-04-29 19:55:26] <Enmity> beta faggot
[2016-04-29 19:55:32] <OmegaRed> retarded woman
[2016-04-29 19:55:47] <bogeyd6> lots of faggots here
[2016-04-29 19:55:57] <ethicsman> Yesterday I ended a date cause a bitch was super cunty. I could have fucked, and I'd fucked her before, but she was super bitchy all through dinner. Any shame in that?
[2016-04-29 19:56:00] <OmegaRed> bogeyd6 is triggered
[2016-04-29 19:56:11] <Enmity> triggered feminist
[2016-04-29 19:56:12] <DocObvious> .kick bogeyd6 One less
[2016-04-29 19:56:13] * bogeyd6 was kicked by TRPBot (One less)
[2016-04-29 19:56:13] <ethicsman> It's the first time it wasnt worth bithering
[2016-04-29 19:57:04] <vltr> ok maybe im an 80 iq moron but i dont know what to say. i was just hoping to be able to socialize with people who had the thoughts and ideas as i did. sorry
[2016-04-29 19:57:18] → bogeyd6 joined (~bogeyd6@bogeyd6.users.quakenet.org)
[2016-04-29 19:57:19] TRPBot set channel modes +b !~bogeyd6@bogeyd6.users.quakenet.org
[2016-04-29 19:57:19] * bogeyd6 was kicked by TRPBot (Ban evasion. htt ps:/ /tinyurl. com /TRPircrules)
I've put the important parts in bold and broken out the links, particularly the one at the end where you were sent the page that you claim to have not been sent. It is also sent when anyone join the channel (its in the topic at the top) and via PM (from the Q bot) for any user joining.
bogeyd6 7y ago
ill have the counter log tonight where in I got privmsged and was told exactly why I deserved that ban.
-Anteros- Endorsed Contributor 7y ago
I am a moderator telling you that there has never been an anti MRP ban policy in place and repeatedly providing a list of rules/recommendations for the channel (which does not include an anti-MRP condition).
If someone else told you differently it does not matter.
bogeyd6 7y ago
You mentioned i was banned for trolling by saying alot of faggots in here. Even though it was a direct reply to Enmity. That's not trolling, it's in context. Don't pretend to stand on a sand castle and mistaking it for a steel rebar reinforced concrete fortress. I was banned, for participating in a relevant discussion and privately messaged that I deserved to be banned for being from MRP. In total I spent about what, 2 minutes in the channel? The fact you even needed to defend yourself speaks volumes. Plus your log only serves to reinforce the previous point that it was taken out of context. Really, all you did was prove that I was banned, for dubious reasons, under a guise of legitimacy.
You can be the irc mod all you want and say there is no policy. You are probably correct. The actions speak otherwise.
-Anteros- Endorsed Contributor 7y ago
This is what a direct reply looks like with Zepile as the target:
[2015-11-10 08:09:08] <scottishredpill> Zepile: that is true, but they aren't as shit as that
This is what you wrote:
[2016-04-29 19:55:47] <bogeyd6> lots of faggots here
And why a half-operator kicked (not banned) you. I banned you.
2015-11-10 was the first day you joined our channel, granted you don't say much it would mean that you've ignored the channel climate in the 6 months since then. The rules page has been sent every time you've joined or been auto-banned for any reason.
I dug through the logs, formatted and posted them to help you. I pointed out the length of the .kickfags list to help you. I wrote the rules for the channel to help users like you.
If you would've said "ok, some one in the world was wrong when they PM'ed me. My mistake" your ban would have been immediately lifted. Instead you're getting snide with this "probably correct" nonsense after being provided evidence and authoritative clarifications against your baseless claim. We have other MRP users in our channel as well which also contradicts your claims, but I guess that is a fact that exists in nowhere land.
Keep your ban. Its clear that evidence, reality and instruction is lost on you.
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
I didn't ban you or anybody from IRC, we have a team of other mods that might have.
I have stopped in MRP a few times and found that the discussion was pretty evenly split between those with a good red pill head on their shoulders and those who are absolutely blue pill. Not once, mind you, I've been stopping in quite a bit lately.
Whisper 7y ago
What I find particularly interesting is how, time and again, whenever someone wishes to externally influence TRP, they will talk about evil, but when get angry, and cease trying to steer and instead try to discredit, they focus on accusations of weakness.
This demonstrates that everyone really knows the truth... that it is weakness, not evil, which is the unforgivable sin in men.
When someone calls you "evil", especially when what they have is a caricature of your behaviour, it can be tempting to engage with them and attempt to correct their impression. But this is simply bait... "make this concession and we will cease regarding you as evil... oh, and also this one. And this one. And this other little thing."
Sooner or later, you will deny them some concession they want, and the narrative switches from attempting to bait to attempting to discredit.
Never make any concession to anyone who attempts to characterize you, rather than persuade you.
bsutansalt 7y ago
Words to live by. This is also true politically and I think why Trump is doing so well. He's never caved to the left's antics and in fact doubled down. That's received as a strength, staying by what one says, rather than kowtowing to the left's denigrations.
The_DogeWhisperer 7y ago
He's one of the only real role models men have left. That's why I'm voting for him. So there will be a shred of hope for all the poor men who are and have been raised by single mothers. Boys who don't have a father figure to look up to. Boys who learn how to treat women from their single mothers. Single mothers are the most miserable role models for men.
bsutansalt 7y ago
Exactly. The author of this CNN article nails down why he resonates with the public in the face of SJW and leftist rhetoric. People are fed up with the noise of the PC police and when he refused to back down he showed he had a backbone. Imagine that, a man who demonstrated strength in the face of opposition is looked favorably upon.
The_DogeWhisperer 7y ago
Wow I never would have expected to read an article like that on CNN. Very well written, thanks for the share.
bluecantuesday 7y ago
Every woman's ultimate attack on TRP is "they're a bunch of losers who can't get laid," which they will and can never understand is the ultimate, undeniable proof that TRP is 100% correct about everything.
Whisper 7y ago
Correct.
But they think it's a slam-dunk case. Why? Because women invariably, universally believe that their vaginal moistness is a magic dowsing rod that inerrantly locates good genes and good character.
Therefore, once a loser, always a loser. Once couldn't get laid, always couldn't get laid.
This means that women who like TRP are forced to conclude that we were always pretty awesome dudes, but we just wanted even more control over our sex lives. And women who hate TRP are forced to conclude that we still aren't getting laid, it's all a con game, and all the field reports are fake.
Because anything else would force them to admit that their sexual urges are a simple rubric that can be beaten with a simple set of cheat codes. They can't handle that.
Men, on the other hand, have always known this about themselves. Symmetric facial bone structure, big eyes, the correct distribution of a little bit of body fat, and we're in love, or at least in something we can call love until our balls are empty.
Men confront their own shallowness every day. That's why the red pill is easier for us to swallow. Because "swallowing the red pill" is the admission that there are no great and noble souls, that everyone is made of the same selfish goo as everyone else. Very, very few women ever truly take the red pill, because very, very few women can look in the mirror and say "I am shallow. I am a basic bitch. I want the same simple, stupid stuff every other woman wants."
ColdEiric 7y ago
The villain is the hero in his own story.
The hero has to learn and grow in his story. There and back again. Frodo has to throw the Ring in the fires of Mount Doom, and come home scarred by maturity. Luke Skywalker has to stop being an angsty teenager, grow to be a Jedi, accept tutelage by the master, and beat his father.
It takes honesty, or intelligence, or wisdom, or adult maturity, or introspection, or a combination of all of that, to admit that "I did something which I shouldn't have. I should have done differently. I will try to never do that mistake again." It takes a lot to rewrite your own story when you get new, weird stuff in new chapters, new chapters which confuses the shit out of yourself. New chapters which makes you remember and think about your past, in order to understand your future and what may lay ahead.
The villain doesn't learn. The villain merely reacts. The villain might be big and powerful, but doesn't learn or grow.
And, safe spaces are for pathetic, weak losers.
RedMoonAscendant 7y ago
Why is this sitting all the way down here with only 4 up-votes??? Here. Have mine.
[deleted] 7y ago
[deleted]
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^0.28155090179751885
[deleted] 7y ago
[deleted]
questioningwoman 7y ago
LOL I'm exposing this post to the world. You think I don't know what you guys are up to? I take this as a hint to always be on guard and prepared to fight your system.
[deleted] 7y ago
Daddy, I'm telling on you. You won't let me play career girl anymore. Run along and pout sweetheart. You can't have it all and we no longer have to humor you while you try :) LOL on that.
ponkyol 7y ago
I don't feel this at all. If anything the majority attitude is to salvage what they can and many wouldn't have married now.
[deleted] 7y ago
[--removed--]
causeandcorrelation 7y ago
Thanks for that shoulder mobility link. Procrastinating work and still learning good things.
whatsazipper 7y ago
A person with a Y chromosome is a male. He may or may not become a man. It is a prerequisite.
[deleted] 7y ago
Clicked the link in the "get offended" text. Fuck that fat chick is hideous. Legit hurts my eyes to look at.
camenossaber 7y ago
Triggerlypuff is its name.
sir_wankalot_here 7y ago
Bro you should know better then most.
Cucking is another RP strategy, if you are a woman. I have been saying this for ages, what is good for women is not good for men.
[deleted] 7y ago
[deleted]
sir_wankalot_here 7y ago
Low reader comprehension abilities, unable to see other perspectives which means unable to understand game theory or come up with food strategies.
Unless you are darktraid and pretending to be stupid.
[deleted] 7y ago
[deleted]
sir_wankalot_here 7y ago
You knew me, trying to think how long ago I read the book. 10 years ago ?
[deleted] 7y ago
[deleted]
sir_wankalot_here 7y ago
What was my Nick 4 years ago ? ????
BluepillProfessor 7y ago
An exceptional post RPS. Thanks for clarifying a lot. As one of the louder mod voices on Married Red Pill let me respond. The governing model of TRP is in the hands of a single executive with essentially full power. ON MRP the governing model is an oligarchy or a council of Captains.
We have worked hard to assemble an all-star moderation panel on MRP that includes Archwinger, Ianironwood, and a group of really smart, Red Pill guys. I have often noted that we have 2 lawyer's a couple PhD's, a couple of guys with Master's degrees, and another guy working on his MBA on our moderation panel. We also have a manosphere icon, a senior endorsed contributor and an endorsed contributor on TRP in the mod panel. As an oligarchy, my vote is the same as all the other mods so changing direction and/or deciding on things like official policy is almost impossible. However, this has the advantage of moving more slowly without sudden lurches, and, sudden or arbitrary decisions that can be made when a single person is in charge.
The reason I pushed this model early on was because MRP is about self-improvement but it is also about "saving" the existing marriage if possible. Just HOW we go about doing that is not straightforward. Different people have different ideas and we (I) wanted a diversity of opinions to be expressed. Some guys need to hear the hard core red guy reading them the riot act. Some guys need to hear the more compassionate...you can make it work if you do this version of advice. Most guys just need a kick in the ass and a reminder that their wife is not a special snowflake.
So...MRP is deliberately set up as a debate sub. We are NOT debating "Red Pill praexology but we ARE debating how to fit that praexology into married life and into our individual marriages. Since we are not exactly sure how exactly to do that, and since men need different types of advice at different times in the unplugging process (or they will blow the fuck out of their marriages for sure) we (I) think we needed a broader diversity of responses- all the way from the purple pill Athol Kay pro marriage approach to the hard core red women aint nothing but tricks and hoes approach.
Thus:
I don't think you can say "many members" but there is no doubt a minority who argue that marriage is still a good thing, including a recent addition to the moderation team on MRP, our good friend /u/thefamilyalpha (TFA) who has his own related blog. I am pretty sure he would be the first to say he is not really "Red Pill" or at least that his philosophy transcends Red Pill and guess what? He is right!
Red Pill is a narrow sexual strategy and life improvement model and is not even a full fledged philosophy. "Red Pill guys" range from Level 4 MGTOW's (who will assure you that they and they alone are the one true Red Pillers) to (most) Married Red Pill guys, a few of which will claim that marriage CAN work and you know what? They are right!
Marriage CAN work and we can show you on Married Red Pill how to make it work, probably. Except like I always say, you CAN survive falling 110 stories down an elevator shaft in the World Trade Center- but that doesn't mean it would have been a good idea to be on the observation deck at 8:45 a.m. on 9-11.
Which is exactly why I and so many oppose this view. However, it is a balance between spurring men to self improvement as a conduit to improving the marriage and their lives, and truly blaming the victim. I get very angry when I see men blamed because their marriage blew up but there is also a lot of truth in it. Most marriages fail when men fail shit tests and buckle under the weight of social pressure and become "Beta." So challenging a man who is still married to Alpha up is not blaming the victim. It is giving the guy with the power to change things a kick in the ass.
ColdEiric 7y ago
I agree.
Marriage is the only way, or at least the least worst way, an entrepreneur is able a man is able to get a family.
Bill Burr has an excellent piece of comedy on the statistic of marriage, where he compares divorce with faulty parachutes in skydiving. And TRP preaches both 'Do not Marry' and 'Go out in the world and fail at getting laid, unlike the MGTOW'. But if an entrepreneur wants to have a business or family, should he try? Or should he listen to 'do not marry', act like a coward around good women, and thus go MGTOW, because of the low statistical chance of doing marriage successfully? Shouldn't men be bold and beat the odds, due to pure manliness and balls, or should they repeat the comfortable prayer of 'do not marry, because you might fail and hurt your feelings'? Can't would be captains and confirmed, non-homosexual bachelors somehow in any way get along, share knowledge and discuss in their males-only clubs? Or do they shit themselves and lose their composure, because they're not living the same lives?
[deleted] 7y ago
Yup. The woman is not the. Mission. If a guy walks in knowing what he's doing? That's on him
james-watson 7y ago
That's funny, does he have his own cult and has he declared independence from his country of residence as well? Does he write his own laws, and does he have his own police force? How about a military to defend his sovereignty?
If not, "Transcendence" isn't the right word. "Delusion" is.
BluepillProfessor 7y ago
What?
[deleted]
AgisIII 7y ago
Perfect
[deleted]
[deleted] 7y ago
I'm the one you are referencing here.
I will make my point as succinct as possible.
Telling men they should or should not marry is as fucking gay as telling them they should or should not date or should or should not drop a plate or spin one.
You are just a dude, a fucking speck in their internet life. You can provide your advice, for sure - but you cannot tell them what to do.
If I say I like skydiving, who the fuck are you to harp about the dangers. If I like to fuck women on the side in my marriage, who are you to judge? If I say I enjoy my marriage and own my shit - why the fuck do you care?
We walk our own paths. If guys get off to Russian roulette, then let them do their thing. You don't have to, that's the beauty of being an 'alpha' man - you don't give a single fuck what the others guys are doing, their path isn't your's to worry about.
I don't tell guys what they should and should not do, I tell them when they are lying to themselves or their ego is in the way, but if a dude loves Smirnoff and says he brings it to every party, as long as he owns that shit then who am I to judge.
The Red Pill isn't yours to lay claim to, it isn't a single thing. It coincides perfectly with masculinity as a whole.
Masculine men own their shit - that's it. TRP is the sexual aspect of it, understanding the other guy (women) and using that knowledge to reach their objective.
Of course you won't mention this in your OP as that isn't popular. I posted solid shit about how I've maintained a sex filled marriage and been down voted and wrote a response about bitches being predicable and gotten hundreds of upvotes.
You've got your fanboys here who are eating anything you put out because you're RPS. But, when you look at real world application, these guys should be owning their shit and choosing to do what they want vice what TRP told them to do - because FUCK TRP - it isn't about making it on this sub, its about using this sub as a resource for tangible and intangible results in the real world
EDIT
You'd do well to put out truths to your thousands of subscribers. I'm in the minority when I say Marriage CAN work. A lot of the guys disagree and go about their business, you seem to be the one caught up on a dude saying marriage CAN work and that if someone wants that, then they should do it fully armed with the knowledge of what is at stake and the amount of work required.
I'm surprised at how sensitive you've become on this topic. You don't have any counter to the point that my marriage is sex filled, I'm improving personally and professionally, and I never went through Deadbedroom or had a Dadbod. I have my kids under my control and own my shit as every masculine man should, you couldn't/didn't choose to - doesn't mean we should all be like you.
EDIT
Disagree with RPS with a thought out response, still enter the negatives - do you see my point? It's not about what is useful, it's only about what is popular.
I'd rather a man disagree and say why - than become a yes man to me. Too many Yes men in TRP.
[deleted]
KyfhoMyoba 7y ago
But that's not the way to bet in todays social environment. You can lose resources, time, children. We here at TRP just want everyone to be aware of the colossal risks involved.
redpillbanana 7y ago
It's not wrong to tell someone to do anything as long as you back it up with facts and statistics.
So you're telling him that he can't tell people what to do? Of course he can tell people what to do, and those people are free to listen or not.
I can see you're a "don't judge me" kind of person. I should let you know that I'm judging you right now and so is everyone else. You are constantly being judged by everyone, and who are you to say that they shouldn't be judging you? Who are you to say that we shouldn't harp about the dangers of skydiving? (FYI it is less dangerous than riding a motorcycle an hour per day.)
They are welcome to do their own thing, just as we are welcome to call them stupid and use them as an example of what others shouldn't be doing.
[deleted] 7y ago
This response is a waste of both our time.
Everyone judges, bt no man has any right to think he can tell another man what he should be doing. You walk your path, I walk mine. You can look at my path, but you will never step foot on it.
redpillbanana 7y ago
Again, you're contradicting yourself. You're telling other men what they should be doing when you say, "no man has any right to think he can tell another man what he should be doing."
I tell people (mostly friends) what they should be doing all the time, and I have the right to think it as well.
[deleted] 7y ago
Yeah, I tell men to own their shit, choose the right path over the easy one, and to do what they believe is right over what is popular.
This is different then telling them specific decisions to make.
Would you tell me I was retarded for buying a pet snake? Or a motorcycle? Or a french press? It doesnt matter what you say, so long as I own it in the masculine sense, then you should be good with it.
The same goes for all things. You can say something is completely a waste, but as long as the individual owns their shit - you should be good with it - too include marriage.
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
Coincidentally, this is marriage.
I just put an entire essay about how the feminine imperative makes strategies that benefit them into socially "right."
[deleted] 7y ago
You know what is right? Having a six pack at 30, you know what is easy - the dad bod. I guess the female imperative would say a six pack is for the enjoyment of women so it's lame, we should all have dad bods? You make no sense.
redpillbanana 7y ago
All those examples are fine though I'm a bit iffy on the snake.
But if a friend of mine wanted to buy a magnetic bracelet to help him with his wrist pain, I'd call him an idiot.
If a friend of mine decided to marry his bitchy girlfriend because his astrologer told him to, I'd call him an idiot.
And if a friend of mine decided to join the Church of Scientology...well you see where I'm going with this. Some things are just stupid and people should feel stupid for doing them.
If a friend of mine went full beta orbiter oneitis on a sketchy woman, I'd call him on his shit, even if he owns it and even if he thinks it is right. Maybe he listens to me, maybe he doesn't, but at least I tried.
[deleted] 7y ago
I see your point.
savoryprunes 7y ago
I ride a motorcycle. It has worked out for me so far. However, when my brother-in-law suggested that he start riding too, I told him I don't condone it.
He is the father of and provider for my niece and two nephews. If I die, so what. If he dies, the damage is far greater. I will never tell him: "Do what you want, bro. Own that shit."
I know the risks and they've worked out for me so far. Knowing those same risks, my blanket advice to others is not to do it. I know that the ones who really want to will ignore me anyway.
redpillbanana 7y ago
Good advice.
If he were an experienced rider already, it would be a bit more understandable, as I know experienced riders develop a sixth sense for dangerous situations.
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
This would be a cogent point if we weren't literally on a self-help forum dedicated to advice. Of course I can't tell anybody what to do. But I can ensure that the advice being given on our subreddit is consistent with the red pill.
If any advice was on topic, we'd call this the "any advice" forum.
But it's not. It's advice from a red pill perspective.
So, yeah, it's within the purview of my job to ensure that the advice isn't balls-to-the-wall nonsense like what you've been preaching.
Likewise, it's not yours to bastardize.
My job, which I do very transparently here, is to ensure that the principles laid out on this subreddit upon its inception are kept true.
That's as good as saying "anybody can do anything..." Well sure, that's true. There's already an /r/relationships for "anything" advice.
And I've told you more than once, good for you, that doesn't make it a solid strategy.
And here you've turned to shame to re-enforce your terrible advice. As long as one owns their shit, they should make any decision they want, no matter how poor it may be? Implying that abstaining from marriage is just simply a man-boy problem of not owning one's own shit.
Of course if somebody wants to read TRP and get married, that's their choice, we're not stopping anybody from living their lives. But when they come crying that shit went south, it's not like we didn't warn them.
That's the sort of nonsense I'm talking about. Driving off a cliff and surviving can work. Playing Russian Roulette and surviving can work. Doesn't make either of those a solid strategy.
You're literally preaching that you've made a bad decision that hasn't gone south on you yet - but your marriage isn't even a decade old yet. Why would I let a special snowflake like you start making threads about how others should too?
Here's an idea, I started smoking a few years back, and haven't died of cancer yet, so here's how I'm going to drag an entire subreddit down with absolutely shit advice because my 3 years of smoking havn't had repercussions yet.
You've bought the feminine imperative, hook, line, and sinker. You serve at the mercy of your wife. What you have is nothing more than what she lets you have.
[deleted] 7y ago
It makes it another strategy, one that can be considered along with all others.
Yes, absolutely. I think the guy who quits his job to be an artist is a fucking retard, but it's his decision to make and as long as he owns it, then go for it.
Negative, I'm implying that anyone who skips an LTR or Marriage, or anything because of TRP vice what they truly desire is fucking weaksauce
Yet when they come saying shit went north they are chastised as some cuckold fuck.
Spinning plates can get you diseases, everything has risk some people view marriage to be worth that risk.
Why does everyone bring age into this? When you hit a 400lb deadlift does someone says, Well, you're not 45 yet when it gets harder to maintain your muscle mass? No, because thats fucking stupid, if I'm owning it now thats all I have to show, the same as anything.
The physiological response of smoking is almost universally proven, marriage is interpersonal, entirely different
You know nothing of me or how my relationship works, I guess you added this as a nice tag line for your own mental masturbation?
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
Not all strategies are equal. For instance, putting a fork in a toaster is a bad strategy. It's so bad, it doesn't belong on our subreddit.
So somebody who reads a well-reasoned rationale on why marriage is a raw deal for men and makes the informed decision not to marry is... weak? Is there an argument you can make that doesn't rely on shame?
No, they are not. There are a lot of men who come here for help, and it's cathartic to discuss where things went wrong.
You must be referring to a straw version of the red pill that you read about somewhere else-- perhaps your subreddit? I wouldn't expect objectivity there anyhow.
Yes, everything has risk. Some are more risky than others. You seem to think that because there are varying levels of risk, that they are equally risky. Which doesn't make much sense at all.
Except in weight lifting, a sign of success is how much weight you can lift. In marriage, your success is based on happiness and how long you can keep it going. That's literally the measurement. Anybody can stay happy for a few years in marriage. That's not special.
You can actually just read the marriage contract laws to see the flaws. It's not hidden or covert, and it's not special on a case-by-case basis.
I don't need to. I know the law, and I know women.
DexterousRichard 7y ago
Although I vehemently agree with everything OP said, TRP should not tell people not to get married. TRP should tell people about the law and the nature of women and they can make their own decisions.
IMHO, if a man is red pilled, it's a hell of a lot easier to achieve a good marriage. It's not a slam dunk, and sometimes it's impossible. But marriage is only definitively a shit deal for blue pill guys. RP can help drastically.
TRP shouldn't be supporting or promoting marriage for that reason, but it shouldn't be telling people it's always 100% BS either. TRP is about knowledge and wisdom. We make our own paths.
That said, all the shit about concern trolling is dead on.
[deleted] 7y ago
We did this in MRP - I'm going to prevent another 30,000 words from being spent.
This is your sub, do whatever the fuck you want and kick out or include whoever the fuck you want. But don't let your blinders prevent you from seeing ll perspectives to an issue.
Marriage can work, for the past 8 years, mine has provided nothing but joy, sex, and value. Apparently you have some measurement of time that determines whether this passes 'the test', frankly I don't give a fuck this is my life, not a reddit test.
[deleted] 7y ago
I agree with you that marriage can potentially work, but marriage itself is not necessary to derive the benefits you've described. Also, it objectively has downsides as well as game theory "traps" which you cannot fully immunize yourself from.
redpillschool Admin 7y ago
I'm always open to a logical argument, to prevent blind spots.
Today, you did not have one.
FUCK_YEA_GLITTER 7y ago
Rekt. I really wanted to see some solid points on the side for marriage... I truly did. But they never came...
Overkillengine 7y ago
I know I've had my head butts with you in the past but in this matter I am in perfect agreement- modern marriage contracts are objectively bad contracts for men. One is subjected to legally enforced obligations but the supposed benefits are not similarly enforced.
To be blunt, one gets nothing from it that one did not already have before it. No deal.
james-watson 7y ago
Homie, I can smell the sexual frustration on you from across the interwebz.
Quit spouting your bullshit here, start your own sub, and go brainwash poor hopeless cucks into sharing your pain.
Your entire posts summed up:
MISERY LOVES COMPANY, JOIN ME OR DIE
You're committed to your bullshit, which I respect. But out here we'll keep ridiculing you until you learn, or until you finally realize we're not falling for your shit, and leave.
Your choice homie.
[deleted] 7y ago
Sexual frustration? I think you mean sexual exhaustion, my day started with my wife riding my cock and I just finished fucking her in the shower - go lay down.
james-watson 7y ago
Yet you spend an inordinate amount of time spewing rage filled bullshit on here to defend your lifestyle choices.
Riddle me this, if your lifestyle makes Entourage look like a homeless shelter documentary, what the fuck are you doing here?
Oh that's right, in between banging your wife in your Malibu mansion, you hop on RP and rage like a maniac about how great your life is. Instead of, you know, going for a dip in the beach.
Yup, 100% certified unicorn marriage right here folks. Definitely a shining example of why marriage is great.
Keep it up though, the one thing you are excellent at providing is comedic value. A+ would read again for the lulz.
[deleted] 7y ago
It's all about giving back to the community.
I don't want to be the lone king, I want to find/create more Lions and run with them.
Wel108 7y ago
I have a lot of respect for both you and RPS. I will say that from a logical perspective, he makes more definitive points on why you shouldn't marry. I don't even think he's saying DO NOT MARRY or you will be banned. I don't even think he's saying guys, "If you want to marry, leave my sub, don't talk about it." What he's simply saying is, don't promote marriage. Don't make other men feel like it's a good idea, risks aside. I think he's made a pretty compelling argument as to why it's a bad idea.
My gripe with the way you're wording what you're saying is that you're basically saying "if you're man enough, it CAN work."
You're a role model around here, and you set examples for many people. Many men here unfortunately lack a lot of direction. If they've been conditioned their whole lives that marriage is some sort of achievement, reading your posts will only fuel that conditioning, even if your intentions weren't so. It will make them work hard for that goal. Instead of reading rational, logical, factual information on marriage itself. I understand when you say that every man walks his own path, and they should own their decisions, and he very well should. But you need to let them make that choice by arming them with truth, not stories(and fantasies they might have) from a man that has succeeded in marriage.
The message, to prevent confusion should be, "Marriage is something that isn't necessary for happiness, and extremely risky; however, if you still choose to marry for your own personal decisions, we're here to help you. Followed by: THIS IS HOW YOU SUCCEED."
/u/redpillschool just doesn't want it promoted, especially from men like you that have a following.
[deleted]