hi guys, straight to the point.
I've improved a lot compared to my past self 4 years ago when i first discovered the RP got a decent bod , but no matter how much i try, just can't seduce women tried multiple different(and a combination of them) approach being an asshole, always agreed and amplified shit tests, Machiavellian, kino-ed her according to body language but always got signals to go back one step.
I've even tried to seduce whales(it seems even they have better options than me) to practice but it seems even they are not interested in me. I've developed great hobbies where i'm great at and like doing but its all nerdy stuff philosophy, math, coding, technical stuff. ik these all stuff is not what a woman should give a fuck about but its part of who i am. i also don't drink or smoke or do drugs so parties/bars/clubs are out of the question for me to meet women which reduces my options to cold approaching in my college and online dating apps.
Tried Hinge(paid)/tinder/bumble trio with the best pictures i could find and got 4 matches in a month of swiping, 2 didn't even responded to the first text, other 2 were attention farming men on the app
30+ cold approaches of which I've got around 5 numbers and 1 date 0 lays (yes IK its a low number but cold approaching is not generally acceptable in the conservative culture i live in, but no excuses and will try more)
money game is bad as im still in college but its not an excuse to not develop this area of my life
also im not on Instagram or any other social media as consumes too much of my time to build and keep the profile updated and becomes about seeking external validation so i don't indulge
20yo,kv, 5'8, 12%body fat(not ripped but visible 6 packs), autistic,72kg bw, 21.77FFMI, little more than 2 years of lifting experience, also considering 500mg test after a few more years
I humbly beg the advice of yours intelligence and experience on how to tackle this area of my life and maximize it to its potential.
mattyanon Admin 1mo ago
Ok.....
Online dating sucks.
Ok, here is your problem.
You're doing pretty good if you're getting any dates. Here's some very rough numbers:
100 cold approaches 50 numbers 5 dates 2 lays.
And that's when you get good. Not beginner.
Do some research online about day game and you'll find that you can quibble the numbers all you like, but even guys good at this stuff convert around 2-3% of approaches to lays.
Here's some more info.....
100 cold approaches 50% are in some sort of relationship and won't cheat 25% might cheat 25% single.
So that's half lost before you start (some of whom will happily waste all your time). You need to work out which of the rest you're dealing with and pass the appropriate shit test. As a beginner you won't.
Let's say you pass that....... how many women are going to find you "their type", have some free time, are in the right phase of life to want to fuck a stranger?
Maybe 1 in 10 will really like you.... and maybe you'll fuck half of those up..... so that's 1 in 20 on a date...... which is about your numbers.
In other words: THIS IS NORMAL.
Right, it's fine.
Good
You're young...... which is good, but it's limiting your options a bit because women generally prefer slightly older. This improves all by itself with time ;)
what is KV?
tall enough
good... get down to 10% so you look ripped
Yeah... see..... this is an issue, but also an advantage. It will take you more time to get socially calibrated.
Do you have a social circle? (if not, get one)
Do you have female friends? If not, get some....... not to fuck them, but to get the hang of being normal with.
Ok, you need to work out more.
Right, the autism thing means that you'll be coming across as odd.
Do you remember to smile?
Do you maintain eye contact?
Manofcave 1mo ago
all male rat pack social circle, currently 0 female friends will try to make some
kiss less virgin
I am currently working upon that
Yes, i especially pay attention to these two things
mattyanon Admin 1mo ago
Stop defining yourself in this way. You're a man on your sexual journey. That's all you need to do to define yourself. Free yourself of labels.
Good.
You're slim, gaining muscles, tall enough ..... you'll do fine.... you definitely need a bit more practice and some muscles will help and some female friends will really help.
Be a bit careful with female friends.... never solicit advice from them! [they'll only ever give advice that benefits women, not you]
But you need the social calibration/exprience
Vermillion-Rx Admin 1mo ago
Because you requested off platform.
What are your social skills like? The over the top kino suggests you can't read the room or progress.
What's your vibe. Do you vibe with them. Are you a chill fun guy?
The above two things are all you need to tell who's interested
Manofcave 1mo ago
I'm autistic so it's kinda hard to read the room and i make approximate guesses from how the girl reacts. With dudes I'm a normal dude ig i can hold the conversion and ask deeper questions about what they like or are talking about(learned this from Joe Rogan but I'm not even half as good as him, I ask a open ended question and then go deeper into it about how they felt about it and what significance they think this holds for them etc.) but with girls most of the times they don't give me enough material to ask them more deeply about and the conversion is cut short about how she likes food(most of the times it's mix of carbs and fat without any protein, which explains why most of them are overweight) but has no idea about what type of food she likes(eg. A girl told me she has eaten all cuisines and i can ask her anything so i asked about what lebanese food she had tried , she frozen like a lobotomized zombie in front of me for a minute) so I'm like ok next topic. I have no idea about my vibe or anybody's vibe, it's a thing that's never even crossed my mind, how can I judge a person's vibe without talking to him/her if they don't look over the top (blue short hair with choker or a dude in a crop top).
Mofreer 1mo ago
Cold approaching is harsh. If you're doing it solely for the purpose of getting laid, you're in for a harsh reality. Think of cold approaching as a way to break down your approach anxiety and build confidence to maintain a conversation without a proper context.
What you should be be looking to do now is finding a pick up buddy, or a group of friends that you go out clubbing/to bars with. That way, you'd be more likely to pull because of the social proof.
Other than that, you're doing great. Just don't overanalyze every single detail.
Manofcave 1mo ago
the problem is i don't drink so going to clubs and wasting money when im a broke college student seems imprudent. I do have a buddy who i used to do cold approaches with but he's now too comfortable to do that nowadays so ill have to find a new one. as for the approach anxiety i think i figured it out after a couple of attempts tho,still shit confidence tho .thanks for ur input tho
Jackmoter 1mo ago
You don't have to drink to go to a bar, just have friends. Although drinking might make you less socially awkward...
Jackmoter 1mo ago
4 matches in a month of swiping is crazy. That suggests you have absolute dog shit photos or you have inanely high standards. You don't match with 10's on dating apps, it doesn't happen.
"being an asshole, always agreed and amplified shit tests, Machiavellian, kino-ed her according to body language" Sounds like autism to me alright.
Have you tried becoming friends with women and learning how to speak to them like human beings rather than omnipotent beings?
coolsocks00 1 1mo ago
Heresy!
Manofcave 1mo ago
i agree im not a photogenic dude but ive consulted with multiple men and women about these photos and they were the best i had, and my standards are very low like woman should be >=4 in looks and just that, just not a whale and multiple times i've even swiped on the whales too. as for friendship i've tried but i found out im not cut out for that shit, i don't like drama, i love technicalities and i wanna fuck a woman if im spending 10+ hrs with her weekly not be her attention farm or smthn
Jackmoter 1mo ago
You and your friends are deluded. Dating apps are photos. If your not getting matches, your photos are shit.
Man you can even get ai generated shit these days.
You do not have to spend 10 hours a week with a woman to be her friend. That's called being an orbiter. I find my female friends add value to my life and I maybe go on one 2 hour walk with them every other week.
You're thinking way too autistically about this man. Chill out.
Women are not the mission, they are an addition.
Manofcave 1mo ago
can u please explain bro, im having a hard time understanding this? how?
Jackmoter 1mo ago
They are always down to do my favourite hobby (Hiking). The one I spend the most time with runs hills with me - something which none of my male friends are even capable of doing, despite all being gym lads.
Furthermore, conversation is very fun with them. None of them are lefties, we can joke about extreme shit while always borderline flirting. It's very fun.
Manofcave 1mo ago
Damn I've never met a girl my age expressing right wing views ever
Jackmoter 1mo ago
Girls will reveal a lot about their real beliefs once they're comfortable in your presence.
First-light 1mo ago
I think that the most important thing men with autism need is lots of calibration -by that I mean learning to read women and people in general within the circumstances that you find them.
If you are on the autistic spectrum, odds are that when you are into something you do the research and learn a lot about it. However putting it into practise is hard for you because it means stepping a long way out of your comfort zone and trying to step into the shoes of he woman you would like to impress. You need to understand how she sees you and how she feels and that takes calibrating yourself. This is more important than all the lifting and red pill theory.
You are going to need an unusual woman to find you attractive being the guy you are. You either need someone who gets who you are -a brainy girl who may be a bit autistic herself but if you and she make a deal about your roles in the relationship and give each other space to do your own stuff and be who you are it will work or you need a girl who is a long way beneath you and looks up to you -possibly an immigrant or a poor girl or an ugly girl. I think that is the deal unless you can really step outside yourself and develop a whole interpersonal skill set and actually get on OK with wasting days of your life going shopping, having lunch with her friends, going to see her family and having friends over for coffee....
The first rule of hunting is "Go where the game is". You are looking for deer in a shopping centre. You need to get into the woods. Where will you find girls like the ones I describe? -probably not on OLD -the low SMV ones will get overlooked or used by lots of men and then ghosted. The brainy quiet, border line autistic, bit eccentric girls will not fancy having a stranger attempt to go through their knickers an hour after meeting him. They won't even want to make a lot of conversation with strangers. You need to get into places these girls are.
Manofcave 1mo ago
brotha im a poor(currently) ugly low smv dude from a 3rd world country so not much chicks even below me ,and wtf that sounds so horrible (can really step outside yourself and develop a whole interpersonal skill set and actually get on OK with wasting days of your life going shopping, having lunch with her friends, going to see her family and having friends over for coffee..)
hmm and that's good food for thought (You need to get into places these girls are.)
First-light 1mo ago
Good luck with it. I am not trying to be too despondent, just trying to suggest avoiding struggling to play games you probably don't really want to play with people who may not appreciate your strengths.
I personally really struggle with the enjoying doing stuff women like thing. I like having sex and I like having my dinner served up and my house cleaned. In return I can provide the house to live in, buy the food and provide affection, conversation, comfort, good sex and emotional support but I struggle with the going out places to waste time and money impressing her friends, visiting relatives, going to worship together, messing up the house by re-decorating it when it works OK already, going on holiday to do nothing but travel about in towns or to beaches and so on when I could be doing my hobbies, working, exercising, relaxing at home with her or sleeping. I have come to see in the end that this is just me. Most normal guys actually like some of this stuff!
My brothers and other men I know who are a bit like me have done very well with academic women or women who share their interests and who give them space to think and in return want to be given space to think and do their stuff. I have blundered along outside my comfort zone for decades, had a number of children with a number of women, learned a fair bit about how to step outside myself and into the shoes of others but I still wonder if its worth it in the end. I am not playing my strong cards in this life.
I think the one advantage of trying to act normal -as opposed to avoiding normal women has been having children who do not have two parents with similar weaknesses. The only time I had a quiet woman, who gave me space, one of the children was autistic. It was in both our families.
I have a fair amount of autism in my family. I am not autistic myself (can't score enough on any of the tests, even though I keep trying when they bring out new ones) but I definitely find it easy to sympathise with guys who are autistic and have a bit in common with some of them.
A man can only bend so far and then the bending becomes pain and he ceases to be able to do what he does best.
Manofcave 1mo ago
you're the most relatable guy i've seen here
will look into that
maybe i should try that, i can only learn more from failure
i 100% agree with you brotha
First-light 1mo ago
You sound like you have the mental flexibility to learn to step into the shoes of others. When you say "I can only learn form failure", this is true and its a positive mindset but its good to remember that we all learn best when we are not pushed to failure but just challenged. If you are getting most of the questions wrong, the text book is too hard. If you can't crank out the desired number of sets, the weight is too ambitious. If take a learner driver, you don't teach him how to go through the gears on a busy roundabout and so on. You don't need to start trying this out on women you would like to bed. You can do this "empathy training" in small ways and you can do it using subjects you have no sexual interest in. Just work on giving the people you meet a great interaction, gently finding out what is driving them, trying to see the value in the things they value.
You don't have to throw yourself into the fire to build yourself better. In fact we all train best when we apply just enough stimulus to create a small adaptation, recover and then push a bit harder. Just go to the edge of your comfort zone and practise staying there a bit. The comfort zone will expand.
When it comes to academic and special interest women, the thing to remember is that they are all still normal women when it comes to their sexual desire. They all still really want rich, smooth, tall, handsome, successful Chad to fall for them. They just have a better grasp than most women of the need for thinking space and developing your interests and can value men who think deeply more. They tend to be more introverted and can be approached more slowly with less extroverted behaviour. But they still need courting in the usual way -show interest in them, demonstrate high value male traits, take them out, lead and guide them gently to what they want, listen to them, show affection, move in confidently but gradually as you read they are receptive to touching and kissing when appropriate and so on.
Also note: some academically successful women are very pushy women who want to achieve in their careers. These are to be absolutely avoided. They are academic to be successful not academic because they love a subject and love researching it. When I am thinking of more suitable academic women, I am thinking of one of my sisters in law who is a history academic, does not really like going out shopping, in the end preferred to be a house wife over her academic career, likes craft activities, was happy to follow my brother's hobbies.
AbusiveFather1 1mo ago
Good for you: these are real men’s hobbies
Again, good for you. No self respecting man uses social media, unless he makes money off it
This is the issue. Because of your height, you will need to compensate with something, like god-tier game or money
But you’re still 20 yo, keep up the work and you’ll be running through these whores in no time
Vermillion-Rx Admin 1mo ago
Try to answer your own question somewhere in the post
Manofcave 1mo ago
I have some answers but they are mostly cope/garbage answers I'm not satisfied with, like how I need to chisel my physique more or how I need to get hair transplant or get on roids then get a professional photoshoot to look slightly above mid. Would get the job of getting some bitches but at the cost of lying and deceiving myself.
Most honest answer I have is to work some years on physique and money whilst practicing game and training myself to be non autistic then try again.
This reminds me of a 4chan post lmao
While I'd not like to go the blackpill route it seems it's what's been chosen for me by the cruel gods