TL;DR: An American spent three years as an expatriate in Thailand where he enjoyed the comfortable SE Asia lifestyle. Parts of it annoyed him but overall it was a positive experience. He moves back to the US for his career and lays out how miserable everyone is.
Stickman is a famous (to expats in Thailand) New Zealander who lived in Thailand for 16 or 17 years, recording the comings and goings of Bangkok and Pattaya's world famous sexpat bar scene. He writes a weekly column that covers various topics from culture, language, sex, legal trouble, corruption, food, history, and everything in between. Expats regularly write in and share their stories, this is just one of those stories.
Read the entire submission here. God only knows why he included his full name and email address. Hopefully it's a pseudonym. He uses RP terminology so it's possible he will see this thread....
After the glow of happy returns wore off, I have to be honest with the fact that I just don't like the US lifestyle. I came back to give the west a full on fair shake. I even saw it with new eyes. And there's much I really love about US that I had to be away from before I could appreciate it. It truly is a tremendous land of amazing professional opportunity, as well as a place where self development is encouraged and valued. Every system is crooked, but the corruption here is way toned down compared to SE Asia. The work place has some clowns, but is largely a meritocracy, where good workers are advanced, and losers get let go. People try hard. They want to make things better. The innovate. But what's really turning me off is how processed it all is. How boring. It feels like this grey machine. A conveyor belt. Relationships feel flimsy. Everybody works. Watches TV. Works more. The amount of hostility towards men is repulsive, as it plays out in the workplace and in media. But the underground of MGTOW and Red Pill is filled with a tremendous amount of hostility as well. I just really can't believe how unhappy and depressed most people in the west are. It's like there is this War on Love, destroying relationships between lovers, friends, and communities. There's not much neighborhood or local cohesion. I feel everybody keeps busy busy busy all the time, working buying and watching, working buying and watching, to avoid admitting how bleak and punishing the average life is here. I don't want to support it. I don't want to fit in and be part of it.
The West is a grey machine. A conveyor belt. Fuck I got goosebumps when I read that. I know we are brainwashed in the US but it's hard to fathom just how deep into our psychology the washing seeps in.
I have no regrets I left Thailand, and in terms of timing, when I was pulled back here was really a blessing. But I can't deny the fact that I feel a huge void in my life out here. I believe what I miss most is the excitement and adventure and just fantastic thrill - with all the tribulations that went with it - which living abroad in SE Asia provides. I just had more fun there. I felt more alive there. And what's also really difficult is that all of the experiences I had in Thailand aren't really welcome out here. Beyond the natural bias that women have of "men who go to Thailand", I'm just shocked that nobody really wants to know what life in another land is like. Maybe I'm a bad story teller. But maybe Americans are just living in their bubble. My countrymen have little frame of reference outside of their work and TV shows. It's heartbreaking, really. So much of the world, so much to see and hear about, and nobody wants to hear about it. I read a lot of columns on Stick that talk about how Thais don't really know much about the outside world. But in a way, the Americans don't either. So I'm left with this huge piece of living, and no place to process it. It's disheartening.
I have to agree. I have been in Thailand for a few years and basically no one back home even cares to listen to my stories. They could care less about learning how other people live. When the Snowden revelations were made I thought that would be the moment when Americans would finally wake up. The reaction was more like an obese person who briefly chokes on their tongue, grunts, rolls over, and slips back to REM sleep.
Expat Americans hate the US. And in general I have found expat English to hate England as well. We escaped the grey machine but are unable to feel happy for ourselves. Similar to survivors' guilt, we feel bitter as fuck that the machine continues to chew up friends and family back in the West.
The place runs well. The trains are on time, as they say, but psychologically, I feel the West is a very hostile and weird place these days. Especially when it comes to men / women relationships. I am shocked at the deterioration in relationships that I have seen, in just the past ten years. It's just so aggressively mercenary. The romance has been drained from the punch. There's very little charm in the process. I found dating pretty pointless, but still fun and sweet enough in Thailand. Even it if leads nowhere beyond walking around a mall and having some sex, it was lighter and more pleasant. In America, dating is this grim operation to perform: shit tests, hoops, Social Market Value, and the flat-out rude bossiness that has become the modern American woman. Joyless. Probably that's what this entire post comes down to... that one word: Joyless. America is not a life. It's a job. The job is work. And work sucks.
I have started noticing that good male friends I had have started disappearing. They just drift off and check out, delete their facebook, stop responding to emails. When I was in college there were guys that killed themselves with drugs or risky behavior, now even the guys that survived into their late 20s and 30s are dropping out socially.
Thais value fun. They like life light. Sanuk isn't just something in tour books. They have an art to daily living that has a pleasant ambience based on a healthy injection of “I don't give a damn”. All of us who have lived there have been on the maddening side of it. But from where I'm writing now, I see it now as a great way to resist the corporate take-over of every part of life. Why the fxxk should we all have to work so hard? Who's getting rich off our sweat? Just this morning I read that a new crisis on American college campuses is that many American university students are killing themselves or crowding counselor's crisis centers. Shouldn't higher learning be a better experience? They are probably feeling total dread at what the American system has laid out for them: joyless toil. It's like we're all fighting as hard as we can to jam our way into jobs that shred us. Why? Life shouldn't be so damn serious. Thais know that. I miss that. I miss them. I miss their land.
Joyless toil. Even betas have a breaking point when the juice ain't worth the squeeze. When there are nothing but obese shit-testing sluts men will just stop trying. Hence why American men are cutting back on going to university.
With luck I'll be back and honestly, probably bitching about lots of the things I just heralded in the previous paragraph. lol. Should fate decide otherwise, and slugging it out in the US is my path, I have my memories. They will remain a precious jewel for life. Either way, I am richer, wiser, and more the man I dreamed of being for having spent my time in LOS.
Enjoy it out there, gentlemen. Play smart and it's a brilliant part of the world to live life. Play dumb and it's still one hell of an adventure. My time there was a blend of both and I wouldn't trade it for anything.
It's a curious thing when men dream of living in a third world country. All the wealth and power in the world and America is still a shithole, little better than a grey prison.
Swallowing the red pill in The Matrix was to literally wake up from the prison that machines had built for men. Get flushed down the drain like a turd and baptized into the awful shitty reality of post-apocalyptic life. Swallowing the metaphorical red pill is to wake up from the "grey machine" of modern Western culture: a joyless existence of toil where human relationships are torn apart leaving depressed, hallow atomic brainwashed individuals.
Leaving the United States opened my eyes in ways I never anticipated, leading me onto a search for answers that led me to this forum, as well as other free-thinking havens where thought crimes can be explored free from consequence.
Nick Land popularized the term Exit over voice. In a system corrupt to the core, where you are hated and maligned, where the deck is stacked against you, where your words are twisted and weaponized against you, your only option is to find the nearest exit. Some guys exit where they stand. They don't physically leave the machine they just stop trying. Don't get an education, don't commit to women--or any institution. Personally, I am glad I made it to Thailand. It has its faults, but I do feel free here.
Lessons learned -- Some guys dream their whole lives of living in a foreign country. If you can: DO IT. The West has metastasized ideological mental illness. Swallow the pill. Accept reality. Exit over voice.
kreativsniks 8y ago
Hi. I would like to hear about some of the downsides, one does encounter while living in Thailand (or SE Asia in general). Apart from feeling like an 'outsider', what other, major downsides are there?
FLFTW16 8y ago
You can never truly own property or a business in Thailand. There are various "loopholes" and schemes to get around this, but if the people at the top ever choose to close those loopholes they can. We always say never invest into this country what you aren't willing to walk away from. At any time you can get shaken down by the local police and the corruption goes very very high up the chain of command.
The_Turbinator 8y ago
having eight past full developer
[deleted] 8y ago
A lot of the misery he describes can be avoided if you go MGTOW.
Since doing away with women, I have only really thought about how to achieve greatness. I'm not sure how I will feel about it in 20 years, but as of now, it seems to be the most important positive change I have ever made to my life.
trpSenator 8y ago
I think this is true about anywhere but the US. We are such a puritan culture, that misery seems to be deeply engranded in the middle class. The whole reason I love to travel is the attitude of just having fun. When you go out abroad, the WHOLE city is out and about. No one is worrying about breaking laws, looking a fool, and "trying to be seen". It's just going out to have fun.
[deleted] 8y ago
I always suggest people travel outside of the US & turn off the fkn tv, radio & newspapers/mags. (Travel doesn't mean a corporate ran beach resort or cruise).
It's like breaking out of the unhappy matrix if you pay attention.
donaldcicc 8y ago
I have been in Asia three years now. One in Taiwan and now two in Shanghai. One more maybe two and I will return home. Mainly to finish my PhD in something I absolutely love. I may or may not find a gig in the USA after, but I can always return to Asia or try someplace new. SH is a big city, lots to do. It is a great place for jumping off to SE Asia and Pacific Islands. Depending on what you are looking for China, Thailand, Malaysia, Vietnam all are great options.
steelerfaninperu 8y ago
I moved to Peru when I was 19. I see a lot of people asking about how to go about something like this, so let me throw out a few pointers from my admittedly limited experience (one country =/ all countries)
Research. I spent about 3 months deciding which Spanish speaking country I'd go to. I knew a bit of Spanish already, so I figured that would help (it did). You should consider climate, cost of living, economy, visa policies (this matters less if you have more money), tourism, and food.
Don't worry about language. Force yourself to live in a part of town that doesn't cater to English speakers. You will learn by necessity. I'm mistaken for a Peruvian now when I speak Spanish.
Mingle with the expats early on. They will help you make valuable contacts and can get your foot in the door for jobs. Also, it'll ease the transition since they'll speak English and can orient you on some of the nuances of the country. But don't rely on them forever.
Get an Apostille seal for all of your documents from the USA. This can be a pain. HS diploma, Degrees, Birth certificates. Get it done, you'll thank me later if you choose to stay long term.
Jobs outside of ESL can be hard to get. This depends on country. Some countries have policies stating that foreigners can only occupy jobs that have a legitimate need for a foreigner due to a shortage of available local population. In Peru, the exemptions are mainly for ESL and mining company work for engineers.
Try to have about 6 months to a year's worth of cash to live there, and go with the intention of staying. I bought a 1-way flight, packed a big suitcase, and moved, but you could get a round trip several months apart.
Ignore the people around you. Americans are ridiculously xenophobic. They will all tell you that what you're doing is a huge mistake. They'll say you'll come back crying like a baby in a few weeks, missing the good ole' USA. Ignore this shit. Family will try to guilt you. Don't listen to the naysayers, go be your own man abroad.
If anybody is ever curious, PM me for more info. But I cannot agree with the content of this post more. The US is a corporation, and you are just one shareholder with the illusion of voice. Go start your own business somewhere else.
redpillmason 8y ago
I live in Peru, the first couple of years here it seemed great, great food, change of scenery, a welcome change from life in the US. As the years trailed on you start seeing the cracks. The crime, you can't have a house here without a massive iron gate around it, you can't have windows without iron bars. There are very bad people here who kill without remorese. You think the US ghettos were bad, well this country is 90% ghetto with harder more desperate people who will cut you open and steal your liver without a second thought. Men getting roofied and robbed while out drinking (happened to me). Just watch some Peruvian news to see the acts of desperation that go on here. You cannot have nice things without becoming a target.
The poverty, everywhere you go you see it, and it is saddening, people begging for food, scavenging your trash bags, there are small pockets of the city like San Isidro where you almost think you're in the US, but you need to have the money to live anywhere near there, millionaire level money for a US suburb comparable standard. The ignorance, even professionals have shit for brains, religious nuts are not marginalized, they are the populace. Nightlife is shitty, I'm tired of going to the same three shitty clubs (the best in the city), or drinking at the same places. Lima is tiny so tiny you feel claustrophobic. Geographically its large, but walking anywhere outside of the epicenter of it, you better not be wearing nice shoes.
8 years in and I have grown disillusioned with this place. I had a romantic idea of what living South America would be like, I was chasing that, and truth be told, it doesn't exist, it is a construct of popular culture. I laminated everything here with this romanticism for a long long time. You see them coming, the ones with this romanticized idea. They come here with Indiana Jones hats, oblivious to how ridiculous they look to everyone around them. Or with huge backpacks walking around the city dressed like hippies and bums. With the idea fresh in their minds of what this place ought to be. This place ain't no fairy tale, people here work hard really hard to get the fuck out for a reason. All in all I miss the life I had in the US, I am making preparations to move back soon.
drallcom3 8y ago
I also moved to another country (Germany to Spain). People forget how great their own western country is. All the freedom, security, comfort and luxury is so normal to them that they don't notice it. In my case I'm technically still in a western country, but it's already a noticable step down.
I have friends in Brazil and they have to legitimately fear for their life if they leave the house. I had an applicant in my company from Venezuela who told me about the country. You can't own nice things there outside, because you will get robbed in minutes(!). Asia has a lot less crime, but there people will simply rip you off with a smile on their face and the nicer places are ridiculously expensive.
The USA is a great country to live in and all you have to do is to stay away from debt, marriage and not having healthcare.
Oh, and women in poorer country want your money even more than women in your western country.
[deleted] 8y ago
All of what you said is definitely not hard to believe. I spent a couple weeks in San Pedro Sula, Honduras. Fucking hell. Only a guy like Hitler can fix that place up.
steelerfaninperu 8y ago
I agree with most of what you've said, but I also think that some of that is relative and subjective.
I think it's supremely important not to get "burned out" on Peru. You need to travel, you need to return home once in a while for some Murican goodness. You need a fucking real hamburger on occasion. If you don't do that, you'll go nuts. I've seen plenty of foreigners sound just like you. I've been here 6 years, and have loved it, but even I need a month or two away from the place every year or two.
nicethingyoucanthave 8y ago
Wow, this is the first bad news I've ever heard about Peru. It sounds more like you're describing Brazil. Why do you think your impression is so different from what seems to be the majority?
redpillmason 8y ago
I was like the majority for a long time. The change in lifestyle gives you perspective, you feel more alive and free from previous social constructs which you took for granted. But that doesn't last many years, you get used to your life, then you start letting yourself see why a third world country is not a first world country.
The final nail in the coffin for me has been the women. The ratio of hot to ugly young women is 1:50. Compared to 1:5 in the US. They are all looking for the Alpha Bucks and Beta Bucks. The poverty here makes it so the HB8-10s don't even look at you unless you are middle-to-upper class, they all think they have the goods to climb up the ladder (outside of tourist and expat circles). There is no middle class here, just the poor and the rich. Professionals make shit for money unless they are the top 1% in their fields. So all working people are basically poor or live in debt. I was making 100k+ as a software engineer in the US. Here this affords me a 20k salary. Try living off of that when rent is comparable to a US city (in respectable areas) and all imported goods are taxed.
To top it off feminism here is rampant. Just earlier this year they outlawed catcalling. Whistling at women in Peru could land you behind bars for 12 years. Women are being given massive powers against men, and the feminists are growing in power and strength. Its like a mutated form of feminism, one that was allowed to grow in a place without antibodies like the US Constitution and the Bill of Rights. Its a backlash against the machismo culture of the old world.
Peru is great for a vacation, it is great to live a couple of years here. But this is no place to make a permanent home.
MustNotFfff 8y ago
Why did you choose Peru? For example, I think that Colombia and Brazil are the most attractive countries for living longer term, but even for visiting, too. Also, if you were making 100k+, did you not have any savings which allowed you to live more comfortably (and appear to be more affluent to the HBs)?
truchisoft 8y ago
Come to Argentina then, they say our women are the hottest in the world.
Channel_oreo 8y ago
I got to agree with the hot/ugly ratio compared in the US. The HB8-10's in the philippines are just hb7-8 her in the US. The hypergamy in a third world country is so fuck up, at least in the US you have a chance with 6,7,8's if you have game. In third world women screen you if you have the capability to provide. I remember the moment I've got my green card, 6-8's women in the Philippines started to noticing me.
steelerfaninperu 8y ago
I have to disagree with the feminism aspect. I can't imagine whistling at a woman will get you arrested. The cops here are notoriously corrupt, and the judicial system is completely run by men. There's no divorce rape here if you aren't in the top 5% of income.
Yes, the movement is starting up, but it is nowhere NEAR the level of bullshit you see in the US.
Bwhitty23 8y ago
So not specific to Peru but travel living in general. Would you say that living in one country for like 1-2 then moving out would be favorable then trying for long term like 5+ years? I would love to do something like this but it seems the charm wears off after about 1-2 years based on what you guys describe.
[deleted] 8y ago
As someone who picked up and moved to Paraguay, I can't agree more with your astute advice. More people should go to a Spanish culture to try something new.
[deleted] 8y ago
How is living in Peru? How are the women? And where in Peru are you? I have always liked Cusco but I haven't been in quite some time. Would you recommend the country to other westerners?
steelerfaninperu 8y ago
I totally would recommend it. I like it a lot, cost of living is good and I earn more here than I would back home. I'm in Lima, though, and that's where the real opportunities are.
Women are bitchy and make US women look like pieces of cake. They hamster harder than US women because they have a layer of Catholic guilt all over everything. Having said that, if you're white, your SMV goes THROUGH THE ROOF simply because you're foreign.
There are tons of girls looking to bag their US betabux and you can take advantage of this wholesale.
cbnyc0 8y ago
Can you explain more about the Apostille seal?
Dasmahkitteh 8y ago
It sounds like a legal thing that makes your certificates legal worldwide but I'm not sure
soniq 8y ago
It's like a notary seal, but recognized worldwide. I had to travel to the statehouse to get mine apostilled.
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steelerfaninperu 8y ago
If it hasn't been explained already:
It's an official seal your State OR the US government provides, depending on who issued it. It basically certifies that the document is legit. You need to send any documents to the state where they were created. Usually the state capital does it. The US Embassies DO NOT do apostilles.
Without this, other countries WONT accept these documents for official purposes, like getting a visa or going to university. You will probably have to have the document translated into the local language as well, and for that to be official, they need to translate the Apostille as well.
So DEFINITELY get these. I didn't, and found out the hard way. Fedexing from Peru costs about $70, and I had to send shit to three different states. Ended up costing me roughly $300 when it could have cost less than $50. The seal itself is usually very cheap (Michigan for instance is $1).
EDIT: Clarified the point about where you get your Apostille. Whoever issued it does it.
LuvBeer 8y ago
Not true. From the State Dept website:
"In the United States, there are multiple designated Competent Authorities to issue Apostilles, the authority to issue an Apostille for a particular document depends on the origin of the document in question. Federal executive branch documents, such as FBI background checks, are authenticated by the federal Competent Authority, the U.S. Department of State Authentications Office. State documents such as notarizations or vital records are authenticated by designated state competent authorities, usually the state Secretary of State."
steelerfaninperu 8y ago
What I wrote is still true for the documents I mentioned.
The way it works is that the US government can only Apostille their own documents, such as the ones you mentioned. But since most people don't have/need federal branch documents, almost all your Apostille needs will have to be done by the state where the document came from.
And anyway, you can get an Apostille for any federal documents at the US embassy of the country where you currently find yourself. But the US embassy CANNOT give you an Apostille for state-issued documents.
So this is my point: Get your Apostilles from your states before you leave. If you absolutely need one for a federal document, it's probably easier to get it at the Embassy than mailing it to the feds which will take weeks.
LuvBeer 8y ago
Sorry, you're wrong. US embassy doesn't do apostilles, you have to mail the document to the state dept.
steelerfaninperu 8y ago
You just contradicted yourself. You just said that my point about state certification wasn't true, but now you're saying that I'm right. So which is it?
Take it from somebody who knows from firsthand experience.
Federally issued documents can only be apostilled by the US government, which is represented by the US embassy.
State issued documents must be apostilled by their respective state.
At the end of the day, whoever issued the document is who authorizes it.
LuvBeer 8y ago
No, the federal part you wrote isn't true, specifically about embassies. US embassies don't do Apostilles. Take it from firsthand experience, for a federal document, for example an FBI criminal background check necessary for certain immigration documents, you need to contact the state department.
steelerfaninperu 8y ago
Alright, I looked that up, that's new. My bad.
Anyway, I think we both agree on this: Get them done before you go.
RS73 8y ago
The "grey machine." This post reminds me of a B. Kliban cartoon: Wasted & Useful Lives
Osama_bin_Lefty 8y ago
TREMENDOUS POST
I agree with this and resonate heavily. I think it's possible to still live and enjoy life even if you are in the machine. I was in a high paying sales job and fucking despised it. One day last week at 11pm before I headed on my 90 minute bus ride back home I stopped at a pizza place to get a slice because I was starving.
There were 3 eastern men one of which worked there chilling serving food, watching TV and joking arround with each other. they were HAPPY AS FUCK - the place was quiet and I can't imagine they make that much money. There I was in a fancy suit having made 5K this month, a stress knot in my stomach and borderline suicidal. I quit the next day. Now I'm unemployed (comp sci degree ) Still figuring out how i'm going to balance living in the machine.
HellbillyDeluxe 8y ago
Reading posts like this make me appreciate the pace of life and sense of community where I live in rural Appalacihia. "The Machine" has certainly embedded itself here as well in a variety of ways, but it hasn't to the extent it has in other areas of the nation. When compared to NYC, LA, or other large metro areas it often times seems like a foreign country.
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[deleted] 8y ago
Life in the West (North America, Developed East Asia, and Western Europe) is a very peculiar thing. There is a cult of work that exists that everyone has to buy into lest they be deemed a "fucking loser." It's a point of pride when people say how they're working 60 hours a week. And as the guy who wrote the OP said, who are they working for? Ninety-five per cent of the time, their working for their rich boss who puts in maybe 25 hours of real work a week (making calls, sending e-mails, reviewing things). People are so caught up in day to day shit (working, studying, etc) that they've lost sight of what is actually important in life.
On top of that, everyone who drudges through the grim and soulless world of the modern economy thinks that one day "I'll be able to finally live for the present, after I've made that promotion and or found a new job, I'll finally be able to enjoy life.
It's shit like this that makes me sometimes resent the insane work ethic of places like Germany who look down upon the "lazy Mediterranean countries" like Italy where people actually take time to enjoy life, be with their family, and enjoy what their beautiful cities have to offer.
I do respect cultures that emphasize working your ass off, and persevering, but there's a limit to that type of thinking too.
Work to live my friends, and don't live to work.
rpscrote 8y ago
In Italy all the 30 something men still live with their mothers and dont have jobs because there are none to be had. Cult of momma's boys, at least in south italy. Ask a neapolitan or sicilian.
Much the same happens in Spain, especially south spain. I have no experience with greece but I'd imagine its similar.
[deleted] 8y ago
German here. I agree completely. I'm gonna do what I can to retire early and fuck off. I was talking yesterday to two young yet plugged German guys and they're your typical efficient yet repressed intellectual German. They talked as if..."in the end everything would come first circle". Meaning work-wise, respect, money, and....women! (Dat Beta)
We were talking about the German coldness vs the Southern flair. And you see, Germans can look down on Southern Europeans all they want, but they know that there's more to life than breathing.
soAsian 8y ago
Mmmm..you guys romanticized too much about being a expat. From what I know, if you work at Asia. You're working long hours with little time for your family and your salary is less compare to the USA.
One thing that is great about being expat in Asia. You are practically rolling in pussies if you are white. Even if you are a fat bastard. You can still score free pussies.
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soAsian 8y ago
First hand knowledge. I'm from Taiwan and still got a lot of friends and family there. They do work a lot longer than US. Even when you are off the clock. They (co-workers/boss) will want to go hang out and drink. In Asia, the work/life seem to be blended into one.
Another thing, lets say you are done with your tasks for the day way ahead of quitting time. You can't leave early or right on time because your co-workers or boss will look at you funny. I've a confirmation from some Taiwanese friends, a Chinese co-worker here in the US whom used to work for a Japanese company and couple Chinese companies and a Indian contractor.
I've traveled back to Taiwan a few times and see how my cousins work.
For all the developing or economy prosper Asian countries. They do work long hours.
[deleted] 8y ago
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soAsian 8y ago
why so angry?
The work hours is long. According to this source.
https://www.accacareers.com/career_centre/average-working-hours-across-the-world/
FaustoRMD 8y ago
The love on war. Fucking exactly this. And is deeper and darker than you think.
[deleted] 8y ago
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rpscrote 8y ago
do it dude. You're the only one stopping you. When I was a freshman in college I said "I want to start a heavy metal band." As soon as I got into a house, I did. After a while of shifting line ups and start up instability, now at 5 years running with a stable line up, we play shows, we released an album that I self taught the engineering for. Next summer we;re looking at doing a 14 day mini tour. Sure it was and is work but it's enjoyable. Practice = jam out with a bunch of cool folks and drink some beers. Crossed at least two things of my bucket list from it: release an album, and have someone I dont know and have no relation to buy it and think its sweet.
Just dont treat it as your job, that takes a lot of doing. a LOT. and luck. Treat it as a hobby and keep your 9 to 5.
[deleted] 8y ago
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rpscrote 8y ago
Yeah, I'm a drummer in a metal band and I'm very much more in demand than any other position except maybe bass (if you actually want a skilled bassist, not just somebody who plays bass). Dudes that can absolutely shred are surprisingly more common than I would have thought even where I am.
If you're playing straight up death metal the drummers are going to be pretty interchangeable so long as they're technically ridiculously good. Probably a good bet to get the line up first. IMO the line up strategy is going to depend to some degree on subgenre. Prog Metal = find kids from music school, doom = find kids that like metal but also smoke tons of weed
Dont get caught in the constantly preparing for it trap. I was a shit terrible drummer and I put the thing together and practiced my ass off to rise to the challenge when needed. Just do it. Get your Shia Lebouf on
[deleted] 8y ago
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rpscrote 8y ago
hell yeah man, we did the same thing. Just "metal." We have some songs that sound folk metal, some that are straight up acoustic to heavy power ballads, and a couple where over half my parts are just hammer blasts and double bass. Gotta do what feels good.
BallisticTherapy 8y ago
Have a plan B.
Even better, make the economically viable option your first priority, and transition into being a musician if it's actually going places.
2comment 8y ago
I have a friend whose wife is a teacher for a German class, and she does a 2 week tour for the kids in that country. The first thing the kids want when they land is a McDonalds. And it seems like every other meal is "a taste from home" --- like if they were there for weeks on end. I doubt they'll ever have an authentic meal there.
It's fine with the parents because their biggest, overriding fear is that the kids might accidentally get a beer and piss themselves at night with visions of some reefer madness shit ensuing from that. Idk if the little brats ever meet a normal, everyday German who isn't a tour guide -- let alone talk to them in their native tongue -- or see anything that isn't some monument or museum.
This isn't limited to kids btw. A lot of people, when vacationing out of this country, just stick to the hotel, those amenities, and the safe tourist crap nearby. Might as well go to Disneyland in a lot of cases just to make the corporate packaging complete.
We Americans are in a country with Freedom of Speech, but hardly anyone has anything interesting to say irl, they're all so scared of losing their jobs for having anything not resembling your run of the mill milquetoast opinion -- FoS but the government loves enforcing a lot of ridiculous discrimination lawsuits and the like via the judicial system.
Similiarly, a lot of interesting stuff can't be done because of how normal lawsuits have become and everyone freaking out about liability and all the rules are designed to cage in the lcd retards out there.
As a society, we're living an increasingly sheltered existence. Those who are curious about the world get a swat team called on them for shit that would have been seen as innocuous and inventive 50-60 years ago. This isn't even that out of the ordinary, I inquired about some common chemicals at a freaking hardware shop for some work I was doing, and the saleswoman was interrogating me like I was the next unabomber -- and then pretended she had to by some bogus law when I told her to cut that crap out.
No one wants to stick out, the tallest blade of grass gets cut. It's only going to get worse with the tumblrina generation who do nothing, produce nothing but criticism and vitriol, and yet somehow will have a career of busy work and be provided for by the system in one way or another.
rpscrote 8y ago
This is completely legit though you're missing the real issue. The real issue are agencies that both make and enforce law simultaneously.Like the EEOC, government agencies whose only purpose is to find bogeymen -- but they also get to define who the bogeymen are. When there are no bogeymen, do you think the EEOC will stop and say "Well we did a good job boys, lets go home!" No. What they do is instead "interpret" laws in ways that are waaaaaaay outside the scope of the real law and find new bogeymen. Ways that are obviously wrong and sometimes unconstitutional.
But it will cost you literally millions to prove that the EEOC has its head shoved up its ass. They'll come audit you on these completely bogus "interpretations" they came up with and you either dance their dance or you get fines out the ass then have to spend even more money to prove them wrong in court. Or take the fines and enter a "settlement" where they get to invasively interfere with your business, forever.
This simultaneous "I Make Law and I Prosecute Law" agency madness is exactly why we have the separation of powers between legislative and executive. But that's long gone.
When you give agencies the ability to make law, and their budget is dependent on them finding law breakers, well gee, I wonder what will happen...
wanderer779 8y ago
interesting quote, "you have to trust the authorities in they're doing what they think is best." I'd bet the dude probably thinks he believes in liberty.
CornyHoosier 8y ago
I've gone on a couple month-long backpacking trips outside of the U.S. and it's the best. You really learn about yourself when each day you don't know where you'll sleep, what you'll see or have an easy ability to communicate with the locals (which always made ordering local cuisine a surprise - since I refused to eat at any American places).
I loved every minute of it.
VodkaTankerSpill 8y ago
The only time I heard someone eating exclusively in McDonald's while abroad is my buddy during his visit to Switzerland cause regular food is expensive as shit.
[deleted] 8y ago
Yeah it's like when tourists go to Jamaica it Mexico and stay at an all inclusive and never leave the grounds. They come home and are like, "wow Jamaica/Maxico was great!" It's like "no dude, you went to a fucking Disney style resort with a bogus ass Caribbean theme to it."
[deleted] 8y ago
To be fair, I don't think I would want to leave the resort in Jamaica. Some other countries, maybe...
[deleted] 8y ago
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redpillspeeddate 8y ago
This is actually why AirBNB, VBRO and couch surfing is a good thing. I go to Hawaii 1-2 times a year and do my best to live like a local. I stay usually in a studio apartment attached to a family house on the north shore and it's a totally different world compared to Waikiki.
Few things better than getting up in the morning and running a mile on the beach with no one around, exploring reefs and waves that don't have huge crowds (I don't go when the north shore contests are on) I have fallen in love with L&L and the great Hawaiian invention of the plate lunch. The only thing that's not great on the north shore is the nightlife, but I'm going to connect with my self or if a girl has behaved herself connect with her, so it's no big deal.
Hawaii once you get out of Honolulu is a special place that is a great way to get an experience without leaving the USA. It's a great first step to get you out of your comfort zone.
djn808 8y ago
ho, stupid haole fakkas brah...
RedSugarPill 8y ago
Great post. Most people who have lived abroad experience reverse culture shock. I became depressed when I returned to University from South America. I couldn't articulate the losses (there are many), but this post have given me some more helpful insights.
ftfy
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Screenp2 8y ago
Ive got an old friend who went to tailand 3.5 yrs ago for business, took his family with him and immersed himself in the culture. We stayed in touch via FB and we'd share info about this and that. When his contract finished up, He moved back here. Less than 3 months being back he said fuck this place and moved back to SE asia permanantly.
[deleted] 8y ago
Currently in Thailand training Muay Thai. I like a lot of things about it, and some aspects I dislike. The pro's beat the cons hands down however.
[deleted] 8y ago
This is why I preach about living below your means.. I work in a high paying job. Most of my coworkers live in huge houses with two brand new cars in the driveway.. Guess what? They work overtime to pay for it.
I bought a modest place with cash and now work only 3-4 days per week.. The rest of the time I just goof around. American is a great country of you stay out of the debt trap
AEther_Flux 8y ago
I moved into an RV and I love it. I can easily afford it, and I can travel wherever/whenever I want. I have very little need for money other than paying off the last of my debts. Everyone around me acts like I'm a miserable vagabond, but I'm happier than a pig in shit! Do want you want, people will think you're stupid/crazy/foolish no matter what you do.
[deleted] 8y ago
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coffee_and_lumber 8y ago
So much of our economy seems to operate because everyone is so deep in debt.
teeelo 8y ago
Living in a constant debt spiral is not only the way we've been brainwashed into living but it has also made many people very rich, by essentially stealing from the poor.
To quote 'Handshakes' by Metric:
'Buy this car to drive to work, Drive to work to pay for this car.'
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Hammoch 8y ago
I believe most western countries doesn't understand the concept of this. Even in Norway people buy big houses, expensive cars and live a life of debt until they are too old to work. Then they lean back and "enjoy" life.
[deleted] 8y ago
And for what? Most people spend their time watching TV,or going somewhere else.. All that house only to watch TV and sleep
[deleted] 8y ago
When you don't have real community, you buy things to feel a sense of status, anesthetize yourself with fake TV friends to keep yourself from feeling alone, and work at a soul-crushing job just for a little real social contact.
Schrodingersdawg 8y ago
Give me a frat house of red pill men of all walks of life and ages and I would be happy.
[deleted] 8y ago
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rpscrote 8y ago
There are certainly folk around here like that. For those that truly appreciate the message, TRP is one of the only places that seriously advocates putting in the work to actually increase your esteem so that your self-esteem can follow
[deleted] 8y ago
You know, if I could back a hundred years, I would—and stay there.
In regards to your cough, how does TRP soothe the self-esteem? If you subscribe to mainstream thought, would it not be inflammatory?
william_law 8y ago
Enjoy the trenches of WWI then
[deleted] 8y ago
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[deleted] 8y ago
A hundred years ago there was no TV, very little advertising, no feminism, no consumerism, no Bernaysian "engineering of consent", no gay marriage, no rampant promiscuity, no surveillance state, no social atomization, no political correctness, no obesity, no absurd national debt, no diploma bubble, no bastardy, no welfare state, no trans-whatever-ism, no affirmative action, no ritual emasculation of men, no Adderall-crazed little schoolboys, no career womyn, no fecundophobia, no nuclear weapons, no cultural ghetto-ization, no NCLB, and no porous national borders through which Messicans pour through like an illegal, dusky tsunami of violence and poverty.
[deleted] 8y ago
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[deleted] 8y ago
That's an interesting perspective. I can't say I've ever come across it; I simply never imagined that such a person might exist. What prompted you to recognize this type? Were you once one?
tn18947 8y ago
I think most people on this sub are also serving the gray machine, and they anesthetize themselves by spinning plates.
somethingofvalue 8y ago
What is that term from? I like it.
[deleted] 8y ago
I wouldn't be surprised. Endless impotent sex, with as many barren women as you can manage, is as much a drug as any other.
sja832mamzh1n 8y ago
Literally anything can be rhetorically spun as a negative.
e.g.
Buying consumer items for social status is a replacement for lack of community
Hooking up with lots of random women is a soulless waste of time
Building a family is a waste of energy and resources that could've been allocated to those with better merit
Happiness is an ideological construct, and any sort of personal fulfillment in life is just a reflection of the delusional mind seeking to internalize itself
etc. pessimists gonna pess
[deleted] 8y ago
Everything is sex. The things which make us happy are the things which natural selection rewarded in generations gone by. Being good-looking, making lots of money, achieving high social status, and having lots of intercourse are just things which, once upon a time, intrinsically improved the odds of having lots of descendants.
One of the marvels of the modern age is that you can do whatever you want, but know that everything we all desire in life originates from our innate desire to maximize reproductive fitness. So go forth, be fruitful and multiply.
[deleted] 8y ago
Yup! It really requires you to be mindful of what make you happy instead of anyone else. If you go get that and your mind changes to want something else? Go after that instead.
Depression comes from spending your time working towards something that doesn't make you happy.
egoisenemy 8y ago
Wow, fucking spot on. Thanks for this.
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StrokeGameHusky 8y ago
It's bred into American Culture. Hell the "American Dream" is to own a (big) house with a white pocket fence. All we see on TV is rich people with big houses, fast cars, etc etc.
The US = Consumerism
Next time you watch a commercial pay close attention to how they make it seem as if buying their product will bring you "happiness"
[deleted] 8y ago
Oh, I know. America has always been the frontier for the hard-driving rags-to-riches types. The thing is, the hard-driving rags-to-riches types in days gone by ended up creating strong local communities, forming endless series of associations (as per Tocqueville) and then plunging their wealth into creating tremendous families. Today, America is the frontier for status-striving ladder-climbing, but not for any sort of creation. Americans no longer create anything, not communities nor social capital nor the next generations.
I don't know when the watershed moment occurred, but today's America is qualitatively and quantitatively different than it once was.
coffee_and_lumber 8y ago
The 80's seemed to be the most visible quickening of the slide, though things probably started to shift post-WWII.
[deleted] 8y ago
Commercialism sky rocketed in the 80s.. It was clearly the the start of the age of being over the top..
Also seemed to be the start of the outlandish divorce rate
mryddlin 8y ago
...and then the 90's came with tsunami of political correctness, which also goes right along side with feminism rise and peak.
we are dealing still with the baby boomer generations fights and now all they want to do is cash out.
There isn't going to be much change until they really start moving out of politics.
[deleted] 8y ago
I lived in Bergen and a friend of mine who was doing her PHD bought an apartment for 3 Million Noks on mortgage whereas she only had 600,000 Nok. Loans were very easily and readily available.
egoisenemy 8y ago
People forget that money is just a resource. Of course it is important to our survival like how water is to life, but we don't really see people working themselves to death for some excess water do we? Have enough to pay your basic life sustaining bills (utilities, healthy food, health insurance, rent), save a decent amount for rainy day funds/retirement/investments, and enjoy your life. As far as most people are concerned, we only get to be on this crazy earth once.
vacationlife- 8y ago
i work overtime and don't waste any money so soon I can just retire altogether if i want
its crazy to see all the stupid shit people waste money on these days, even the few dollars here and there really add up
Polaris382 8y ago
Im with you on that, I just dont understand the brainwashed consumerism in this country. Frugality can make life significantly less stressful.
nonconformist3 8y ago
Sounds like something I wrote in a story about a guy leaving Rome right before the Gauls took it over.
coffee_and_lumber 8y ago
My American experience took a sharp uptick when I got myself out of debt...and more importantly, the debt mentality.
There probably shouldn't be anyone on this sub who claims to have internalized TRP who is also in debt (excluding mortgage of course).
[deleted] 8y ago
I would say to not even have a mortgage.. I did at one time, saved up, bought a distressed property with cash, and sold my big house..
My whole outlook on life changed overnight, like having a huge weight off my shoulders.. And I'll tell what, work is far more enjoyable when you don't need the next check to keep from being homeless..
rpscrote 8y ago
not having a mortgage is my goal too, but its not feasible for a number of years after you've entered the professional world unless you're a trust fund baby or something like that.
I think having the mentality that you dont want debt and identifying debt as a chain that binds gets you the majority of the benefit.
[deleted] 8y ago
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rpscrote 8y ago
This.
People outside the US typically live in small locations, don't host often at their home. Given that most people actually just watch TV, eat and sleep at home, their apartments are sized so that you just watch TV, eat and sleep there. They conduct social affairs out of the house. Where you go depends on the culture and climate.
Just by downsizing living arrangements to something small and cheap and meeting socially outside your house you can save an ass ton of cash.
[deleted] 8y ago
Do the SE Asian countries really pay those Western fuckups $35,000 a year for teaching English??
Easih 8y ago
only in Japan pretty much; Thailand,Vietnam,philippine,china and the rest dont pay anywhere near this amount unless you work at international school with real requirement(teacher license,years of experience teaching in your home country). for their teacher.
rareburger 8y ago
actually more than that, with full benefits, airfare, holidays, vacation, etc. especially if you look white and speak proper english.
WoahScienceCool 8y ago
What exactly makes people fuck-ups for wanting to experience different cultures and get out of this dreary prison that is the west? Would you have the perserverance or even intelligence to learn Chinese or Japanese, or any foreign language for that matter? Would you ever even be ballsy enough to attempt to move abroad and truly immerse yourself in a different culture?
There are plenty, too many to count, stories of success found abroad, both from rich "successful" types and rrgular Joe Schmoes. My own dad was one of them after he made his fortune here in the US in his thirties and then went on to open up what is now a booming and successful business in Jamaica as a white man. The guy in OP's story is another one.
What the hell are you guys griping about exactly?
[deleted] 8y ago
I think that experiencing life outside the sanitarium is great. My impression is that most of the folks doing more than a very short stint as English teachers, are schmucks.
[deleted] 8y ago
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[deleted] 8y ago
Of course. But that's outside of the spirit of the advice. You know what he means.
[deleted] 8y ago
Luckily I have excellent insurance (for now). My gf however has a deductible that I'm not sure she ever pay if she became seriously ill.
Medical costs will end up being the final blow to the U.S. economy
[deleted] 8y ago
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[deleted] 8y ago
True, but you can't control everything. Plan for the worst and hope for the best
I_is_the_best 8y ago
It's different for the US (though still probably the same) but in countries where there's free health care or national health care it follows a simple rule. Men pay for it women use it. Them bitches go to their GP for every fucking imaginable BS - like IDK a cold, small tits, whatever you can think of, or some sort of medical leave to further bend the system to your advantage.
[deleted] 8y ago
I dunno, you would think that the massive wait in line would deter them. Canadian here.
coffee_and_lumber 8y ago
I've not met a woman yet who understood that the doctor is not a magical feels fairy who can solve all your problems every time you feel just a tiny bit "off". Got a cold or fever? Stay in bed bitch, drink water, and wait that shit out.
[deleted] 8y ago
I have.. They are the ones that pay for their own insurance and medical bills because they don't have a husband and they don't qualify for state insurance..
It's amazing how frugal some chicks are when they have to pay the bill themselves
[deleted] 8y ago
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[deleted] 8y ago
There is always the risk of accidents and random diseases..
Fade_0 8y ago
I didn't know that the foods you ate immunized from cancer, car accidents, etc. There's other reasons that people go see a doctor. I've personally never went for flu/etc but I've gone for other things.
coffee_and_lumber 8y ago
This really is the first line of defense. Exercise, proper nutrition and vices in moderation. Lots of greens and such really will give your immune system a huge bump. I think it was Joe Rogan saying that since drinking his "hulk shakes" (kale shakes basically) he doesn't get sick...at all.
[deleted] 8y ago
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vengefully_yours 8y ago
I'm building my home and a shop on a tiny budget, most cars cost more than my garagemahal. I do the work myself, rather than paying 10x the cost of materials in labor. In five years I will be debt free again, living mostly off grid, and I'll be able to travel again. I haven't been outside the US since 2004, my last deployment. I lost my last home/shop in a divorce, so I had to go back into debt briefly. It sucks. Never getting married again.
I've lived in Germany, UAE, Korea, and spent an inordinate amount of time in Kuwait and Iraq. The only thing anyone says is the platitude "thanks for your service" nobody cares about the years I spent in foreign lands learning the culture and experiencing life outside the US.
darkrood 8y ago
Wow...so you are a vet. Please share more. Do you think army want to have more beta yes men tool or they want calculating, country-loving agents that need no surveillance?
vengefully_yours 8y ago
They want anyone they can teach to do a job, that job can be pushing paper, pushing cargo, shooting people, running powerplants, turning off the power, LAN administrator, or cooking. The only job the military doesn't have is farming.
coffee_and_lumber 8y ago
Exposure to other cultures was the biggest takeaway I had from the military, beyond the lessons learned about work ethic and duty, etc that really didn't hit home until many years anyway.
vengefully_yours 8y ago
Almost everyone I grew up with has never left the country. They're as shortsighted and myopic as you'd expect.
rpscrote 8y ago
I've gone abroad for a time and in the group I was with a lot of them ended up just as myopic. Their idea of broadening their view was eating paella every now and again. Predictably it was the women who ended up the same. Many of the men too though. The majority of the women didn't make any foreign friends (unless you count banging random natives)
vengefully_yours 8y ago
Same in the military. Some people simply stay on base, drink Bush Light, and act superior to the host country. In the desert they would be openly racist and biased against the Arabs and especially the 3rd country nationals from poor countries like Sri Lanka, who worked for the Arabs. Come back to the states and never know anyone different from you. What a waste of time.
I go overseas I get into the culture, meet the locals, and see how they live. I have friends all over the world who have never been to the USA, and knowing them gives me a much larger perspective.
BlackFallout 8y ago
Exactly this. I work on and build motorcycles on my week ends. And I never come in for OT unless I have nothing better to do with my time, which is rare.
This can be a bleak boring grey country if you don't take time to relax.
My monthly bills are $545 a month and I make $2000 a month. I have 1000$ a month to do with what I wish. And I never let my bank account go below a few grand.
Also I'm single and will never get married. haha
Easih 8y ago
545 month bill? that's not even half my rent here in DownTown montreal..
rpscrote 8y ago
if you're a programmer, look for metro and big cities jobs that allow full time telecommuting, then live in Buttfuck, WI and pay $500 a month for total monthly expenses while earning NYC salary.
Username-_-2015 8y ago
Same here bro. Just bought a nice home gym and a huge tv and upgraded my car. All my friends and relatives that are married are like "where the fuck do you get the money?" I tell them I don't have a wife or kids. They tell me that i probably use these things to numb my lonely life. I tell them that they try to do that with their wife and kids, i tell them are you happy? They just look away and don't say shit. Yeah just because you have a family doesn't mean you're happy!
TellMeYourFears 8y ago
That's one good fucking retort
[deleted] 8y ago
So... the married guy doesn't own a car or TV?
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NakedAndBehindYou 8y ago
On this note, I read an ebook awhile back that someone had written after having an epiphany. His epiphany was that "financial freedom" is not an objective but a subjective emotional condition that people experience not when they reach $X income but when they reach the point that their income is high enough above their expenses that they don't feel like they struggle to pay the bills.
Specifically, he said that almost everyone will feel "financial freedom" when your take-home pay is 2x the size of your regular living expenses.
For example, a person who makes $100,000 a year but spends $90,000 a year will probably feel a lot more stress due to their finances than a person who makes $50,000 a year and only spends $25,000. As a percentage of his income, the lower earner has much more wiggle room, which also gives him more room for things to "go wrong" and he would still be okay.
Easih 8y ago
I dunno, I make 58,000 here in Canada and even with expense around 18-20k I dont feel that freedom; that damn income tax eating my salary.
crunchbones 8y ago
You should be interpreting these numbers as take-home pay.
coffee_and_lumber 8y ago
My wife and I figured that we put away about 2500 bucks a month. That's after the mortgage, utilities, a fistful each of walking around money, and other expenses. We live relatively modestly but quite well, like an Americanized version of a laid back European style, spending our money on food, drink and experiences rather than material excesses. We could take a big pay cut and still have our same lifestyle.
We pay straight up cash for our vehicles and don't use credit cards. Basically, instead of a car payment, we set aside an equivalent amount each month, so that when it's time to buy a car, we've got plenty to get whatever we want. The difference between that and just financing, even at zero percent, is that if we don't want to pay that amount for one or two months, no problem.
Similarly to Red Pill, financial smarts and good habits are one of those things that's hard to get others to adopt, even when they know they should. I look at some of my friends and just want to shake 'em sometimes.
CornyHoosier 8y ago
red pill, every man should know, personal finance, fit .... great sub-reddits
Easih 8y ago
saving 2500 per month? I wish, I'm just a junior programmer in Canada+canada taxes makes my net salary just abit over 3k per month before rent,food etc.
crunchbones 8y ago
Keep the career path, focus heavy on it, and live like you are poor. I paid for a house entirely with RRSPs by 28, and am investing around $5000/mo. My monthly expenses are just utilities, necessities, and entertainment.
I figure I'll retire at 40.
You don't have to be super wealthy to do this, my salary is in the low six figures.
[deleted] 8y ago
He has dual income tho.. If they live off one salary, they can afford to save the other salary
Harry_Teak 8y ago
It always amazes me how few people seem to understand that the easiest way to have money in their pocket is to simply not spend it like an idiot.
coffee_and_lumber 8y ago
Hey, it took me forever to really get it. Just like how it took me forever to get the truths that we discuss on this sub. Some obvious things just seem to evade people for some reason.
Harry_Teak 8y ago
There are so many people and organizations out there trying to redefine reality for their own purposes that it's easy to lose your way, or worse, never find it. Resisting the daily onslaught of cultural imperatives takes a certain kind of strength that just isn't terribly common, unfortunately.
[deleted] 8y ago
that's because people have the mindset that a house payment is supposed to be x percent of paycheck, car is another x amount of paycheck.. No attention to the fact that larger house has higher utilities or new car is more to insure..
As far as $5 coffee and going to out eat every meal? They see merely what it costs them that day, they never add up the monthly total
rpscrote 8y ago
I make enough money that the best deterrent to eating out (more often than currently at least) is my other budget. The caloric one. I can afford to eat out, to continue dropping BF% I can't though.
The rise of decently healthy fast food options is a really bad thing for me because it tempts me... Having no option is easier than having to willpower yourself from not taking the option. So its back to preparing meals in advance so I make sure its so convenient that its a no brainer
vengefully_yours 8y ago
My jobs always subsidized my car building and drag racing fetish. Getting married cut into the funds I could spend on my cars, and my freedom to hop in one and drive across the country.
Never again. Shit, I won't even let a bitch live with me.
[deleted] 8y ago
I have one living with me. My house is paid off and she pays for the utilities. Free living
vengefully_yours 8y ago
I'm done with them living with me. I end up paying for everything and she gets rewarded when she decides to swing to a lower branch.
[deleted] 8y ago
I had to get rid of a few. Once they realize you will have them evicted if they don't pull their weight they turn around.
Although many days I still consider living by myself again
vengefully_yours 8y ago
Mine always thought I wouldn't punt them, that I'd be there paying her bills and providing a vehicle. She fucks up, she gets kicked out. I used to put up with more than I do now, age and experience has made me less generous.
[deleted] 8y ago
How the hell? Where do you live?
[deleted] 8y ago
Hey man, I don't know if you'll see this but a huge portion of the Midwest is like this if you don't mind the cold.
BlackFallout 8y ago
Rent is 400$ all utility's included. Then I pay 75 for high speed Internet and 70 for my cell phone. It's a mostly Spanish neighborhood, im the only white guy but my neighbors love me. And my neighbors always invite me for carne asada and cervasa! Some place in southern Nevada fyi.
BowlOfCandy 8y ago
I grew up in the south, you can get a modest apartment with roommates for ~$150/month range. Buy yourself a $50,000 house and mortgage payments can be $250.
vengefully_yours 8y ago
Once my land is paid off, my bills will be lower than that.
I make fuel for my cars with cattails and tree sap, I'm building greenhouses to grow food in winter, I'm going wind/solar for electricity, and my heat comes from a compost pile that heats water passively for 6-9 months at a time. My biggest bill will be cell phone/Internet because I like technology.
bhooooo 8y ago
Do you mind sharing how you started? I'd also like a lifestyle where I can sustain myself from natural projects.
vengefully_yours 8y ago
I'm a huge car nut. I love muscle cars, big engines, ludicrous power, and drag racing. Back when gas was $4 I started looking into ways to make fuel, because gasoline was always higher here than the rest of the US, save for the Bay Area in California. They gouge us here, and it's always 50 cents to a dollar higher than everywhere else.
I looked into methanol, too much hassle because it's very corrosive, highly toxic, and takes time and lots of energy to produce. Found ethanol, easy to make, it's the same stuff you drink in a bar or from beer bottles. I find it's actually easier on parts than gasoline as far as wear and corrosion, plus it makes more power, loves boost and high compression, and I've worked out how to get better mileage and lots more power on ethanol than on gasoline.
Then came finding ways to produce my fuel on a tight budget, not pay for propane because theres no natural gas in my area, and electricity is expensive too. Researching how to heat water and produce methane led me to the rest of it. I'm rebuilding right now, out in the woods 20 miles from town, so I can't drive my cars this year, the stills need set up, I need a larger boiler, the sap runs in March and April, and I need a new permit from the ATF for this location. The divorce set me back quite a ways.
You can get started with this at journeytoforver.org. I'm well beyond most of what they have when it comes to ethanol conversions and efficiency, but that makes sense due to my extensive background and knowledge about engines, carburetors, EFI, and fabrication. When I am set up again I plan to write some articles about it that show how to do this on a tiny budget.
You either work more hours at your job to pay others to do the manual labor, or you do tne manual labor yourself rather than watching TV and pocket the money. Done right you can earn money selling surplus produce, and never buy electricity or gasoline again. I'm rebuilding old cars anyway, so I build them specifically to run on ethanol, and that means they can't run on gasoline at all. If you want to run both, you're going to lose mileage on ethanol, because gasoline can't run like alcohol does, so you don't get as much mileage on ethanol. Mainly the static compression ratio is too low to utilize ethanol to its fullest.
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[deleted] 8y ago
Looking forward to your articles
bhooooo 8y ago
really interesting! nice integration of this project with your passion and your main activity. Thanks
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vengefully_yours 8y ago
If you like trees, lakes, and nobody around but your dogs, it's fucking awesome.
darkrood 8y ago
Venge, What about sex drive? Don't you have them? Your hands only feel so good for so long.
This is a genuine question. Because this is the only issue for a young 30 something guy who try to do this MGTOW.
vengefully_yours 8y ago
Yeah I have it, it's be crazy high most of my life. The need to get laid is why I developed game early and polished it to a fine edge. Right now I am too damn busy building my home and shop to spend much time going to meet new ones, so I fuck the ones I've known for a while. I still meet them, the University is getting a new crop of sluts in this month. It's about 25 miles from here. It's remote but not desolate here.
vengefully_yours 8y ago
Yeah I have it, it's be crazy high most of my life. The need to get laid is why I developed game early and polished it to a fine edge. Right now I am too damn busy building my home and shop to spend much time going to meet new ones, so I fuck the ones I've known for a while. I still meet them, the University is getting a new crop of sluts in this month. It's about 25 miles from here. It's remote but not desolate here.
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vengefully_yours 8y ago
Fuck yeah. It's awesome here
[deleted] 8y ago
Small town America. I live in a medium-sized small town and my monthly is ~$750 give or take $20. I live in a big apartment compared to the rest of town.
Also take home is over double the $2000. Yeah college
MustNotFfff 8y ago
I understand living within (or even under your means), but I personally could never live in a small town. I value entertainment and culture and I find that you need to be at least in a medium-sized city for that.
Saiserit 8y ago
Nothing lasts forever. One thing that strikes me is the crippling fear of pain and death which guides all behavior. In one token everyone demands that "every life is equal, precious, and valuable." The system will bring down the fucking hammer on your face and career if you so much as insinuate otherwise. All the while everyone goes on a delibriate war against their own bodies with medication, inaction, and fructose.
wanderer779 8y ago
that is why the internet is so huge. You can speak your mind anonymously.
I think it is probably not all that uncommon that a group of people discussing an issue in public say one thing out of fear that no one sides with them and then go on the internet and argue the other side, even though they are actually the majority.
alritealritealrite 8y ago
Why does Thailand come up so much in TRP? Fuck Thailand. Why do you guys like it so much?
YuriJackoffski 8y ago
because it's easy to get laid by hookers and lady-boys
[deleted] 8y ago
What do expats think of China or Japan, are they any good or are they too similar to the west?
RPJapan 8y ago
Both are amazing and I highly recommend taking a trip to one of them if you can. The languages aren't that hard either, just need a lot of time.
coffee_and_lumber 8y ago
This post presents a great argument for why you want to travel internationally, and actually live in another country if you can carve out the opportunity. It's the best way to understand your own country more completely. There were loads of things I didn't even know about Americans until I went and lived in England for a while (and used that as a jumping off point to travel elsewhere). You need contrast to see your own bullshit (and good points too).
[deleted] 8y ago
Two people come to mind upon reading this post, Joe Bageant, who was an expat and a socialist before dying a few years back and James Kunstler, my two main literary heroes. It's because they understand why this all is the case for the West and write in beautiful prose. Both are prolific, although Bageant's main website is currently down. You can still find many of his essays online though.
I really need'nt say more. Enjoy your journey!
krakosia 8y ago
Any specific starting points?
[deleted] 8y ago
Yeah, first I would read 'the geography of nowhere' and watch kunstlers ted talk, then listen to his podcasts that have more to do with either geography or new urbanism. As for Joe Bageant, I used to be able to point out some articles that were my favorite, but his website is down, so i would just start reading from the coldtype catalog and find what tickles your fancy, and perhaps buy his essay compilation through Amazon. I think thats where the bulk of his website went.
[deleted] 8y ago
Joe Bageant (RIP) saw the rot set in, and sought to escape it (he lived out his days somewhere in Mexico?).
[deleted] 8y ago
I believe so. I'm not sure, but joe was practically convinced at the end of his life that America was a sick experiment and a giant con game for the elite. Both him and kunstler decry the lack of public space which turns many destinations into yet another trip to the store or fast food joint, for instance. Really, dont let anyone tell you otherwise, one of America's worst problems is the lack of public space and some lefties have tried to reclaim the local intersection of their block to have get togethers with their friends to get back to having a social life, which America stole from everyone through privatizing all property. Just a for instance, but listen to kunstler for more elucidation
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icallmyselfmonster 8y ago
It's not the easiest. I went via internship, i.e. I planned it very early. In later life its a bit more difficult. Easiest: if you can do it, internal transfer with the company you are in. Then bolt when you get a higher local offer. Moderate: Get as many Certs in your field you can afford, apply for jobs, get sponsored. Hard: Start your own business, service companies that work out of both countries. Set-up local office and ship yourself out.
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scrantonic1ty 8y ago
I've been strongly considering doing something similar to this when I've finished my degree, and not even necessarily to stay in SE Asia. My picture of an ideal life is actually quite nomadic, never staying in the same place for more than 18 months or so.
I don't know how feasible it'd be, but ideally I'd only stick around long enough to earn enough money for the next destination, then squeeze all the enjoyment I can from the place, and leave at the next opportunity. I'd prefer a lifetime of this to packing everything into a gap year, seeing the great sights for fleeting moments then returning to the rat race.
I don't think we evolved to be sedentary and settled, at least not until we're old and tired. I want to see and do as much as I can while I have the energy.
[deleted] 8y ago
The aspect of the west that I object to is that to is that a lot of markets are highly competitive and sown up by the big corporations and government.
Want to sell lemonade at the side of the road? You'll need a health and safety cert for that. You'll need a business licence. Oh, you'll need insurance in case your employee slips and falls over. You have to pay him minimum wage, despite the fact that you haven't sold a single cup yet.
In a developing country you make your lemonade and sit by the road and sell it. The buyer takes the risk and your business survives by its reputation.
In the west the game is rigged, and not in your favour. This is why these countries are referred to as "Emerging Markets" where the biggest gains are to be made.
[deleted] 8y ago
That's the irony of free markets in the West. The market is relatively open, but its so hyper-regulated and structured that it almost cancels out its freedom. Think of Uber right now: in a normal free market, it would easily overtake regular taxi companies, but now municipalities all over the world are going ham on Uber for violating existing regulations on taxis.
Another case in point: you have to wait weeks to get a fucking permit to build a shed IN YOUR OWN BACKYARD where I live (Ontario). What kind of "free society" is that? It seems like the only real freedom in the West is the freedom to complain about shit (free speech).
You can talk shit about whatever politician you want, but besides that: sorry, wait in line, get a permit, and your license will be mailed to you in 6-8 weeks.
[deleted] 8y ago
or 5 years for one I just got.
RedHeimdall 8y ago
But now even that is rapidly vanishing. Say something critical of anyone belonging to a Special Victim Group^TM and you are a backwards, vicious hatemonger.
purplecabbage 8y ago
The USSA needs a libertarian awakening. We all need to take personal responsibility and eschew the nanny state. Doesn't seem like voting changes much though.
rpscrote 8y ago
the presidential debates somehow never manage to include all the people you can actually vote for...
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1independentmale 8y ago
Trying to run a business in the U.S. sucks. I've run several and there are so many laws and regulations I'm pretty sure we're all constantly in violation of some law or another. Everybody wants their goddamn hands in the pie. City, county, state, federal and they've all got countless divisions with assholes claiming authority over you in one way or another.
90% of my business ideas have never gotten off the ground due to all of the regulation. Every time I start putting something together, I run into roadblocks that wind up being huge, expensive hassles. I've learned not to invest too much money into an idea until I've thoroughly vetted it out to find which government agency is going to fuck me over this time.
rpscrote 8y ago
the flip side is if you can figure out the maze, its a barrier to competition as well. The only place you can actually get away with an idea and not have the government shit on you is tech. Im not sure how much longer it will last until tech starts getting regulated into oblivion, but for now you can still have freedom in tech.
[deleted] 8y ago
A little off-topic here, but I highly recommend the book "Average Is Over." It goes into the gory details about how joblessness will get worse as it becomes harder and harder to actually employ people.
As I grow, I'm beginning to wrestle with:
It's not that hiring someone is expensive salary-wise, it's that the ancillary expenses/risks keep growing. As this grows (and it will) the lowest employees in terms of productivity (i.e.- the employees who are least-able to manipulate new technology) will keep getting chopped.
The book posits that pretty soon about 80% of the population will be people in service industries (Drive Lyft, wait tables, etc.) that cater to the 20% of high-performers as well as, in some cases, each other.
CornyHoosier 8y ago
Lets not forget that insane background checks.
... and the list grows all the time.
FLFTW16 8y ago
and my favorite... Must have the experience of a 50 year old, the drive of a 30 year old, and the salary expectations of a 20 year old.
[deleted] 8y ago
I remember helping my college hiring people right after the financial crisis, when everybody was looking for a job.
Have anything on your record? Next.
[deleted] 8y ago
The Japanese Koseki system is rather handy for this. They have a standard form with their information as provided to the government. When you want to give it to someone, you just submit a copy of the koseki, and it can be digitally read in without typing because it's a standard form.
Easih 8y ago
you can afford to be picky when there are so many willing people; the insane background are a result of abundance of worker.
drallcom3 8y ago
Well, you can't blame them. If they can require all of that and still get the people they want they do it. I'd do the same.
krakalot 8y ago
I think that book is missing (part of) the point. If you listen to forefront economists like Piketty the bigger problem comes from the fact that robots and software, aka capital, are doing more and more of the work and contributing to a higher value added to the final product than people. IBM's watson, if it succeeds, won't just increase the firms competitiveness but also replace a huge number of low-skill consulting and so on jobs which people otherwise think are safe from being robotized.
The more capital does in terms of the final product the less labour is needed and thus the less bargaining power labour has. We cannot employ as many people productively in a high tech economy as we did in a factory or agricultural economy. It simply isn't possible as there's no need for all these jobs they're being done better by capital. the only people who will benefit from this are the ones who own capital- aka the rich.
[deleted] 8y ago
Technology is a part of it, yes. Hopefully I caveated that in my comment in terms of how the book categorizes the least productive workers, which is through the paradigm of technology.
One of the main tenets of the book is that Cowen believes that new technology (for now) creates a slew of jobs as long as people have the mental capacity and the training. Those that do, and are able to manipulate that technology, will be rewarded. Those not (and there's a lot at each new development)... will be discarded.
Capital was/is a great book as well. Similar issues, and I'm not even sure that they're different conclusions.
Edit: to your point - you'd better learn how to be someone that builds, maintains, manages, designs, services, makes parts for, markets, fixes, or creates Watson. Or you're screwed.
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Zachar1a 8y ago
If you think we have bureaucracy in the West, just go back to Africa and try to start a business, and see how many licenses you will need to obtain. Each one will require a small "gift" to be made to the presiding bureaucrat.
If you guys don't recognize that most states in the U.S. are a fantastic place to do business, then that's fucked up. Places like California and New York are not as business-friendly from a regulatory standpoint, but they have other things going for them that are good from a business standpoint, enough to offset the regulation.
diggingme 8y ago
But even then if you can afford it, isn't really a problem - especially as some of the countries I've been to are cheap due to the strength of the £
[deleted] 8y ago
Freedom is being able to race your Ferrari down the coast of Chile with your dad, at top speed, and having no one say anything to you.
Try THAT in the USA!
Of course, there's a flip side, try getting a world class education in South America, or a world class professional position, or even having secure property rights for your cash and real estate.
I still prefer the West but there's also a lot of opportunity abroad nowadays if you are educated in some skill and can speak multiple languages.
diggingme 8y ago
Yeah I'm study agriculture which is more useful in developing countries, plus I'm trying to learn french
My favourite thing about some African countries is the status you recieved based on who you are, plus knowing people means there are more doors open to me there than in London
But I definately agree about the educational/infrastructural point, I've found that getting things done over there is a case of who you know/ what you're willing to paying whereas in the West the systems are more procedural, fairer and of course more generous
The only time other countries are great is when you can stand on you're own two feet and not need much/ any assisstance, so it definately isn't something for the faint hearted when starting from the bottom
Jokoran 8y ago
The US is a big place with many different cultures. The blogger was comparing Bangkok to New York. The North East is notorious for its productivity and "assholes." I'm sure if he went to San Francisco or New Orleans he'd find more of what he was looking for in terms of work/life balance or culture.
YuriJackoffski 8y ago
Reminds me of this couple
iluminatiNYC 8y ago
Personally I think the problem was that we chucked our American cultural structure overboard without stopping to think that replaced it. Unlike a lot of red pill time, I look at the pre 60s America with much more sanguine eyes. A lot of people got legitimately fucked with no Vaseline back then. That said, a lot of babies got thrown out with the bathwater. Everyone was so busy fighting beaten wives and chicks getting raped on the reg that they didn't bother to build a community one the foolishness was cut off.
Now if you have money, you can build a community to your liking. The rest of us have to cobble together something without any overarching structure. In a way, the Red Pill and SJWs are operating from the same impulses. Now you can use this work to build or destroy. Where are you working?
Kose2kose 8y ago
This is a great thread. I agree with OP as I've traveled to other poor nations and felt the same way.
However, the one thing that keeps me from living their permanently is "What if I get sick?" "What if I need special medical care or an emergency happens?" I'd rather be on the grey conveyor belt when that happens to me rather than in the "fun" place. I never want to be in a hospital in Thailand. You're better off dead if that happens to you.
Easih 8y ago
dont be silly; thailand has a big industry for medical tourism.Of course you dont want to go to the local rural hospital in a 3rd world country but Thailand also good hospital.
asianmasaccount 8y ago
Yea this rings very true for me. Most of my extended family is in China, and while they are the first to admit there are a ton of problems there that make life hard, their main critique of America is basically the one OP outlined.
I see it when I go there. Pace of life is just much slower and people enjoy themselves more.
Cyralea 8y ago
Some part of this is off-base. Strikes me as the musings of an individual that loathes work and can't discipline themselves to it.
I won't deny that the capitalist machine in the West induces all kinds of drudgery, drudgery that has yet to completely pervade the undeveloped world. It's a bit ignorant to assume that the system itself provides no value, however.
The reason America is front and center of the world financial stage is precisely because they have such a well-oiled capitalist machine. If you're skilled and intelligent you will amass wealth quickly. That opens up all kinds of doors to lifestyles you've never known. You don't have to be a 9-5 wage monkey forever, there are ways to escape that in the West.
Everyone should spend some time seeing the world. Broaden your horizons, learn how different people work. Get away from Netflix. But appreciate what you have back at home. There's a reason why the U.S. is the U.S., and Greece is Greece.
whatgold 8y ago
Because USA prints the currency. Greece does not. It's that simple. USA has much more debt per capita than Greece.
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Sdom1 8y ago
I don't think that's where he's coming from. The distinction to be made is this (I think): The US is great for its opportunities for the entrepreneurial, but increasingly employers are demanding an entrepreneurial work ethic from people who aren't entrepreneurs. In other words, you have to kill yourself just to make enough money to support a family in the middle class lifestyle.
There's no pot of gold at the end of the rainbow for these people, they are just getting worked to death and are poorly paid, considering. On the other hand, we have record numbers of Americans not working, many of whom have given up hope of ever finding a decent job.
The whole "They're just lazy" argument resonates with us, but doesn't really hold up on examination.
rpscrote 8y ago
It seems that both these arguments can be true at once. Most people aren't truly black and white and most people can feel conflicting emotions simultaneously.
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B_uckets 8y ago
This is the perspective that's lacking from the OP. Life in America is the best in the world if you're wealthy, but it's nothing special if you're middle or lower class. And it's even worse if you're middle/lower class but try to live like you're wealthy.
I know a lot of wealthy foreigners because I vacation in a town that attracts them, and there's one thing most of them have in common: Their home country is too hostile towards wealth. People think our taxes are high, but it's nothing compared to the taxes a wealthy person will pay in a place like Germany (income tax alone is 42%). Those people know that they can live a lifestyle in America that's much more difficult to attain in their home countries.
TL;DR: America is for people with money. The person who wrote that blog post probably didn't have any.
Cyralea 8y ago
The majority of my wealthy family fled down south to the States for exactly that reason.
soAsian 8y ago
^ This. We just wrapped up a project (Web Portal). The third party vendor send a guy from India to my place of employment for 3 months. I got to know the guy and we hang out a lot.
The Indian guy hated the work-life balance in India. He is on call 24/7. Even when he is on vacation. He doesn't have time for his wife and daughter because his work and the salary that he made is a fraction of what the USA worker get.
Easih 8y ago
I guess that could explain why work from india is often very poor quality in my field (programming).
[deleted] 8y ago
Good perspective. It's all what you make it. I look at a lot of the rest of the third world countries and thank god I was born in the U.S. Imagine one of those shitholes in Africa. People need to appreciate just how good we got it here.
[deleted] 8y ago
I think a big part of it is that most first worlder have no experience with just how shitty the outside world is, and imo, it is almost impossible to get a true picture unless you go for yourself and spend quite some time in those cultures.
I don't blame any first worlder for his myopia.
Dis_mah_mobile_one 8y ago
I think part of the problem is that there are genuine problems in the U.S. i e, inequality is growing, debt is pervasive, there can easily be a lack of genuine community and of course the ruinous state of male/female relations. Still, that does not mean that life is not objectively better in the U.S. than most of the world.
It's fine to point out legitimate problems here, lord knows we need more leadership doing so, but quite a bit of this thread seems like bitching for the sake of bitching.
falcors-tick-remover 8y ago
Skill and intelligence have little to do with success in the USA. That is the kind of propaganda that middle class spew as they present themselves as future millionaires.
The system is absolutely a well oiled capitalist machine with little to no regulation on manipulation of the structure of economies big or small. The system is easily exploited and locked down in a legal morass by the highest bidder who now can amass unlimited wealth thus maintaining their position.
The illusion that you or anyone else will get far financially is so great that becoming truly wealthy is closer to a lottery for even the hardest working most intelligent individuals.
As you are clawing your way to an upper middle class lifestyle your youth passes you by and suddenly you are old with a diminishing ability to enjoy life to the fullest.
rpscrote 8y ago
This is laughably wrong. Skill and basic intelligence are the absolute minimum for financial success (barring lottery-like outliers like the actual lottery or Kim Kardashian). You can't succeed without them, but that does not mean once you have them you will succeed and that's where you're getting tripped up.
To succeed you generally need skill, intelligence, drive, the will and ability to consistently put yourself into places to discover opportunities, the will and resources to capitalize on the opportunities and the good fortune to have all this happen. You can control much more of the equation than you let on. Most BP men have no risk tolerance (either through weakness or dependence on a paycheck) and opt for the steady pay check over the uncertain but potentially lucrative opportunities they pass up.
Cyralea 8y ago
My father sold literally every possession he owned to come here from his home country. He now just recently sold his million dollar home.
I graduated with debt making just over minimum wage. I'm about to break 6-figures this year.
It's not an illusion. If you're hardworking and intelligent, there's always a way. There are more self-actualized rich people today than at any point in history.
PaulAJK 8y ago
If you want to work your absolute nuts off, the US is the best place to get rich in the world, (but don't discount the effect of luck).
If you just want to work as hard as the next guy and live full rounded life, chill, enjoy your holidays and have fun, America looks pretty tough to me. All that student debt and expensive health care, the long hours, long commutes, short holidays etc.
But if you're an entrepeneur who can succesfully navigate the mostly rigged makets then it's the place to be.
TimeHoTraveler 8y ago
And for every success story there's a thousand sob stories. Your anecdotes are just that. Anecdotal
rpscrote 8y ago
This whole sub is anecdote dude. If you don't like it, fuck off. Just because the 95% BP population sucks shit at accomplishing anything doesn't mean those in the 5% or those seeking to be in the 5% can't do better...
Cyralea 8y ago
No, I just have the benefit of experience. I felt hopeless when I graduated, and even more so a few years later when the recession hit. Turns out, engaging in a pity-party is self-defeating.
TRP isn't about being an average man. It's about becoming a self-actualized man that catapults himself into the top percentile.
falcors-tick-remover 8y ago
You graduated with debt unfortunately sums up a major part of the problem.
6-figures is in no way rich. After taxes you are only feeling rich living in a shithole like Arkansas.
I am glad you can still dream that the USA is great but it is a facade skillfully crafted by those who are the ones actually living in the artificial glow.
Cyralea 8y ago
You're right in that 6-figures isn't rich, especially in my neck of the woods. That's why I'm working on starting a business. If my father did it without English or the internet, most of us can aspire to something similar.
It's not a facade. Remove yourself from the pity party, it's self-defeating.
[deleted] 8y ago
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FLFTW16 8y ago
There is more than enough room for nuance. In the sentence you quoted me I was referring more to gender dynamics. The legal deck is certainly stacked against men in the US. If a woman accuses you of rape she can get you thrown out of university without trial. She can get pregnant by another man and claim you are the father and get money from you. Divorce rape you. etc etc.
The author was referring to a meritocracy in the workplace. Well that is a huge topic with many factors. I would take exception to that, though. I can name a few examples off the top of my head. In a true meritocracy your ability to perform and produce value should be considered above all other factors (race, age, sex, religion, sexual orientation, political leanings, etc).
Tim Hunt was hung out to dry because he made a joke about women effecting the gender dynamic of a laboratory. He is a Nobel Laureate but that counts for shit in a politically correct (read: hostile) landscape.
Matt Taylor advanced the human race by landing a spacecraft onto a comet, but he wore the wrong shirt for an interview, so fuck that guy, destroy his career and make him cry on TV! This ain't no meritocracy, this is a theocracy and the religion of the zeitgeist is feminism.
James Watson was made a non-person after his research led him to believe that, yes, DNA (the thing he discovered) determines IQ, and that different races have different mean IQs. Africans have a lower mean IQ compared to Europeans. Now it all makes sense, you know, how Africans never invented a written language, and the continent is mired in poverty and war, even post colonialism. Watson, despite being a Nobel prize winner, is persona non grata, because he dared speak out loud his thoughtcrime.
The US is a meritocracy until you say the wrong thing. Even the hard sciences, which should be pure meritocracies, are full of politicking and witch hunting. There was a good article I read not long ago about the Friends of Abe social club in Hollywood. Being a good actor won't land you parts in movies or tv shows. You have to be a liberal and believe in liberal ideology. Conservative actors formed a secret society where they would meet and socialize, almost like underground Christians hiding from the Imperial Romans, lest they be found and fed to the lions.
Because the author never elaborates on his line of work, we can only speculate and offer our own experiences and opinions.
asm129 8y ago
It's a shame about James Watson. He spoke his mind and got labeled as a racist and could not find work again. He even had to sell his Nobel prize because he was broke. But luckily, a Russian billionaire bought it and gave him back his medal.
All of Watson's comments on race and IQ are supported by research and facts. But in America, anything seen as racist gets shot down without being considered and the speakers lose their credibility. It's similar to how we speak out against feminism and things like how divorce laws unfairly favor women. You instantly get called a sexist for pointing out facts. The power that minorities and women have in this country to unfairly set the national agenda is what sucks about America.
YuriJackoffski 8y ago
Inquiry, do you think you have an impressive IQ? If so, does it make you feel special and superior to Africans, particularly those that are born into poverty?
lono12 8y ago
Africa had several written languages before the arrival of the europeans and the reason it's in perpetual poverty is because western interests keep it that way so they have an easier time mining its resources.
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TRPApprentice 8y ago
No offense, but the USA is 1000x better than Asia. If you're alpha in America there is no ceiling...unfortunately if you're a beta there is no floor, either. Plus IMO American sluts are so much hotter than those scrawny Asian cunts. Get yourself a good job, get a nice, but not too nice of a house, a decent car, modest everything else and watch your savings swell up like a fat cock
Spiral-knight 8y ago
It depends what you want from life. This guy wants adventure and will probably find more of it, he is in a way an exemplar of TRP, he is unplugged and living his life. Beholden to none of society's constraints or views on men, I feel sometimes we forget that women, sex and game are all by-products of what is ultimately a mindset of self improvement
FLFTW16 8y ago
I know, right!
TRPApprentice 8y ago
With all due respect, I disagree. When I think of sexy, I think of bodacious American/European women, not fucking land whales as per your link. For example my favorite actress is Christina Hendricks. Asians cunts are too...uh...girly, I guess, for me.
TankVet 8y ago
I respect this man's point of view and, having lived abroad for four years, understand his view of that crushing gray machine. He really nails the imagery.
I would probably take off myself, but I love my job. I love what I do. I enjoy it. I have fun. There is joy in my life and a significant portion of it comes from my work. I like making money this way.
I buy things, I watch TV, I work. But the last bit takes up the most time and I get the most out of it. I'm pretty happy about that.
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Easih 8y ago
loving the USD is not much different than woman in the US though; atleast they are honest in thailand.
[deleted] 8y ago
I spent some time in Vietnam and it was a liberating experience. There was much I didn't like about the place, and I was homesick while I was there, but when I came back, I missed Vietnam more than I missed home while I was there. Life was different over there, it had a different rhythm. Surfing the internet and playing video games weren't hobbies, rather, living your life was a hobby. People congregated together. Outside of Saigon, there wasn't really such a thing as "night-life", or rather, it was something that very few people indulged in. I guess it's a reflection of how poor the people there are that their interests revolve around socialising. Which has its pros and its cons, admittedly. I'm not really making a point, but of the people I talked to more than once, they seemed to have more intimate relationships with one another. People retained respect for their community and for the human bonds that make us what they are. In the western world, the ties that once bound us together are gone. I hear people bemoaning the collapse of community - community being the idea that people who lived on the same street would respect and know one another, and work towards making their street a good place to live. Usually, they blame foreigners or low-quality people for the collapse of this idea, but it is our fault that we have allowed it to collapse. We are so insular in our treatment of people outside of our social group, we are so cruel to people we consider to be inferior to ourselves, that we are undeserving of a close-knit and pleasant community. It is our fault that we went wrong because we lost sight of the value of the other people around us. As far as women are concerned, they lost sight of the value of the inferior man.
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falafin 8y ago
You sold your kids? What am I reading
TRP-Talk 8y ago
"Apocalypse: Now"
DeerStag 8y ago
This is so true. There is so much hate in relationships now in the West.
Travelling unlocks you and your mind from it. Great post!
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[deleted] 8y ago
Also worth looking into the writings of Joe Bageant. He also saw the rot set in decades ago, but now it's worse...
[deleted] 8y ago
I was last single in 2005 and 2001. Mercenary certainly describes my dating experience since March. Nothing like it was 10 and 15 years ago.
I'll be back in Uni full time for my Masters in the fall. Hopefully, it will be less brutal. More time to build a shared narrative, as opposed to mostly online.
epixs 8y ago
I'm in university right now. Trust me man, you will be disappointed in the quality of women here. Most of them are obese as shit, using yoga pants and over sized shirts to hide it.
[deleted] 8y ago
I just graduated. Unless things changed (or you go somewhere far away) that's not quite it. There are fatties and undesirables, but the girls in the campus gym and in certain majors are super-driven and great options.
spacelord777 8y ago
Can confirm. College girls are generally the shittiest females around.
[deleted] 8y ago
I'm not looking for life partners. Just girls to screw through the semesters
robo23 8y ago
If you're at community college
[deleted] 8y ago
I'm at an SEC school. There are some USDA grade-A choice selections here. And also some actual cows.
RPmatrix 8y ago
I got arrested and locked up in Thailand, but I still think it's a great place with really cool people
sabai sabai dee khup!
TekkomanKingz 8y ago
Even a hardened criminal loves Thailand. What is not to love????
LMFAO
[deleted] 8y ago
You can't just drop that carrot without explaining it.
What happened?
RPmatrix 8y ago
got busted with some weed, had to spend a few day's in Lumpini on $2,500 US bail before I got out, waited 2 mths and went to court and was fined the equivalent of $20 and got my bail back
I could've jumped bail and bailed from TL but I didn't want to give the cops my bail, which was about a yrs wages for 2 of them!
I could've bribed my way out but that's usually a bad idea straight off -- I've spent quite a bit of time in Thailand and I think the people/food are great, the cops and courts, meh, not so much!
[deleted] 8y ago
It undoubtedly involved beer. I feel sorry for the Thai locals who have to put up with Farang (westerners) who make Thailand their peter pan island.
[deleted] 8y ago
It's not that one way. Thailand caters to these people to a degree.
FLFTW16 8y ago
Have you been here? Thais like Westerners. It's the Chinese they dislike. They (Mainland Chinese) swarm like locusts, don't queue, are loud, pushy, argue the price too much, shit in the canals, graffiti city walls, and in general act like they own the place. Westerners and Japanese--even the ones that come as tourists--have a good relationship with Thailand.
hirjd 8y ago
If it's anything like vietnam the "like" westerners in comparison to how racist they are against every other country in Asia. I dated a girl in Saigon and she would occasionally spout off about how the Chinese were greedy and rude, how the Korean men were violent savages, how the Korean women were all fat (mostly true), how thai people were not true Asians but we're actually black and Indian, how Cambodians were ignorant and violent backwards living hillbillies. Oh, and the North people. Back stabbing two faced liars they were with their high pitched nicey nice voices thinking they're better everyone because they can steal money and murder people and follow the China! Japanese are okay. Americans are okay.
My experience is similar to everyone else here. Great. The people in Vietnam were very warm and sociable. I'm going back at the end of this month and am very much looking forward to it. But no matter how you slice it, SE Asia is one of the most war torn, corrupt, and violent places on earth. This is something very hard for me to reconcile. Khemer rugue killing millions. European imperialism everywhere except Thailand before that. Ho Chi Minh. Hundreds of ethnic groups in the mountains. Thailand is having issues right now, actually.
So yea, they like westerners. I guess we're lucky to be on their good side.
Gunnilingus 8y ago
I'm currently living in South America, and I feel the exact same way. I went through your post, looking to see if there's anything I could contribute or add to it - I found nothing. I guess all I have to say is: Can Confirm. Get out of the west, men of TRP. There's a whole world out there that values your masculinity. A whole world where, yes - AWALT, but the flavor of AWALT isn't nearly so bitter. In fact, often times its sweet; in a land where a truly masculine man is valued, so too is a truly feminine woman.
randomuserwot 8y ago
I'm also studying in a foreign country because I wanted to get away from all the shit. Will probably stay here. Not going to specify though, ain't nobody's business where I am.
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[deleted] 8y ago
I hope this comment doesn't disappear. Due to my father's job I've moved from country to country many times during my life and if there's one thing I can say for sure its that people are afraid of change. I've also had the privilege of living in South East Asia for 4 years and without a doubt, they are much happier people. I currently live in what could be regarded as a western country and whenever I go on about my dream to live elsewhere, move about, and never settle down I get a hit with baseless facts that are meant to convince me that this country is the best, that I'm a dreamer, that most places suck as much as this place, that we have it pretty good here (We're placed number 3 after Korea and Japan in regards to working hours) and that I should just grind the grind, work in a job I hate, marry a girl I despise, buy a house, have a couple of kids, and die. No thank you.
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rpscrote 8y ago
the streets are paved with gold. Or, in other words, we're wealthy because all we do is make money and spend money. We don't waste time on that "living life" nonsense. So poor immigrants see the cash and come here, not realizing what price is paid for having that wealth. But I cant say I blame them. Getting enough money to eat and have shelter is much more fundamental than ensuring you can "enjoy life"
[deleted] 8y ago
Propaganda. Ask any American in the US with a camera and they'll say it's the best country in the world. Criticizing the US is akin to treason. That sort of attitude leaks into other countries. You can't ignore all the US culture in the world. It makes people think the US is amazing.
Things changed after 9/11 and a greater exposure of information through the internet.
flexiblehold 8y ago
Unplug your goddam television, gentlemen.
I haven't had TV at all for over a year, and before that when I lived w/ my SO we didn't have cable, so I suppose I was weaned off of it.
Television is a sewer pipe connected directly to your reptilian, instinctual brain, it stimulates everything base and sick in you and then programs you through advertising with desires that can never be fulfilled, and even if temporarily sated will only lead to deeper, more pointless pursuits.
Most shows self-reflexively reinforce the ideology of consumerist culture, even when they superficially wink and mock it, like in The Office.
A plate of mine loves TV, when I've been to her place she's put it on, and it honestly makes me sick, the ads, the bullshit, I feel like a smoker who has quit who then gets nauseous at a whiff of second-hand smoke. Like, I physically get ill.
The internet is bad too, but at least we can navigate it more shrewdly than TV, which just drill-fucks you in the face.
[deleted] 8y ago
I only plug in my TV to watch movies. I haven't had cable in probably ten years.
I recently got rid of my cell phone. Damn it feels good to unplug from technology. I hate the feeling of being connected at all times. How many times do you walk by someone at work and they have their phone in their hand, distracted checking emails or updating their status? How many smartphone zombies do you see out in public thoroughly enchanted by the hypnotic glow from their Electronic Attention Device?
BallisticTherapy 8y ago
I'm sitting at the DMV reading this on a phone right now!
Helmut_Newton 8y ago
Television is okay in small doses. We all need a little down-time. The problem in the US is that TV (and to a lesser extent, videogames) has become THE main down-time activity for most people. They don't socialize anymore, they don't read, they don't exercise. They just plop down in front of their screens...
flexiblehold 8y ago
Cyanide is also ok in a small enough dose.
[deleted] 8y ago
As a young man, this is one thing I'm afraid of. I want to enjoy my life, not work the shit away. But when I say this out loud, I'm called lazy. I'm not lazy, I just don't want to spend the majority of my life making some motherfucker I don't know rich and then finally get time to relax when I'm 60-70 and too old to do anything fun.
crosenblum 8y ago
So true. So true!
I am a total novice at TRP, I acknowledge that completely.
But I have felt for a long time, like we in the west are asleep.
I keep thinking to myself. To what end is our civilization, are we more than workers, family makers, and death, repeated endlessly?
Is there no purpose, no dreams anymore?
I think life has become TOO convenient for us, and with technology always looking for ways to do things for us, to make their bucks, has made us weaker as people. With no drive, no dreams, no purpose.
I also have to thank TRP for I have finally started to see a Personal Trainer, and get my physical crappy body in some shape. I am only at the beginning.
So what is our purpose here?
There has to be more than simply, rinse, repeat the same cycle over and over again.
Is it to explore the stars, explore the seas, explore the greatness within us all?
I don't know.
Until we take the effort to dream again, then act on our dreams we will be an asleep nation.
rpscrote 8y ago
Individually nobody but you can say. You need to find what clicks. Try things and see what gets you excited. I'm fortunate that I've got too many exciting things I want to do and too little time to do them instead of the other way around
coffee_and_lumber 8y ago
My personal answer is to go into nature as much as possible.
I do day hikes and trail running for training purposes at a state park by my city, but it's always full of casual city people pushing babies around bitching about the weather or the incline of the hills and not even carrying water half the time. It's pretty on those trails but it's really just a diorama of nature surrounded on all sides by human habitat, roads and commerce.
No, go into the wilderness, where you have the real threat of wild animals, inclement weather, no ready help available, etc.
The experience of hiking solo for days or even weeks, with all your needs inside a pack on your back, will pay dividends for your perspective on the world. It's not survival in the true sense, but you will get an idea very quickly just what it would take if you were out there with nothing, or just a knife and a bit of rope for example.
People talk about the "real world" as though it has anything to do with civilization. Civilization is our attempt to insulate ourselves from the real world, which is wild, fierce, dangerous, with scarce readily usable resources. Even some of the more desperate financial situations you can find yourself in, possibly even homelessness, are merely temporary minor inconveniences compared to what you would have to do to genuinely survive in the wilderness by yourself. Being outside a lot will make you detest whiny cunts, and will whittle the one inside of you down to nothing. This also quiets the mind, and if you are looking for purpose, this is one good clean way to find it.
crosenblum 8y ago
I really like your answer.
It's so easy to use our homes to isolate ourselves from the raw fresh real world.
I do like to go outside, just not during summer or winter times.
Too hot for me, during summer, and too cold during winter.
But fall and spring, I love to just smell the fresh air.
thefisherman1961 8y ago
Brilliant! Americans are going to elect a President next year who will do absolutely nothing about the NSA spying on them and the Patriot Act, NDA '12, etc. On the 4th of July I wasn't even sure what we were celebrating because half the Constitution is ignored and the other half is a failure. I hate this country.
"Turn on, tune in, drop out" as Timothy Leary said.
FLFTW16 8y ago
The Fourth is the day you get to celebrate fireworks, but only in states where they aren't already banned. In the state I lived they even banned sparklers from public property because little kids were burning themselves with them. Reminds me of this sign. You almost have to sign a contract to enter the park. The sign would be more simple if they let you know what you can do because the list of what is prohibited is so long.
1independentmale 8y ago
It's depressing as fuck bro. I'm shocked at the number of people who don't give a fuck about the Snowden revelations. Even worse, a great many of them think he's a traitor. ಠ_ಠ
I tried an experiment a couple of years back. I'd noticed my Facebook posts linking stories about the massive constitutional and civil liberties violations our government has been pulling lately received virtually no interest. So I posted a couple of things back to back: A recent news story about parallel construction, a process our government is actively practicing that involves evidence gathered by warrant-less NSA surveillance being quietly handed over to local law enforcement, violating the constitution and denying suspects due process rights all so we can continue jailing people for enjoying substances the government doesn't want us putting in our own goddamn bodies... And an intentionally stupid post about a corn dog I'd just eaten at the county fair.
The parallel construction post got nothing but crickets. The corn dog nonsense? 42 likes and a couple dozen comments.
I don't post to FB anymore unless I'm bored and trolling with some inane drivel.
YuriJackoffski 8y ago
She felt the same way
thefisherman1961 8y ago
Typically people will say something like "America: love it or leave it", "Get out of my country" or other such nonsense. I may hate America, but I hate it less than every other country that I'd be willing to move to.
YuriJackoffski 8y ago
True dat, its kind of like my bitch pisses me off to the point of want to kill her sometimes. But I love her nonetheless
[deleted] 8y ago
comeone guys. There is nothing wrong with working hard. Just ensure that you enjoy what you are spending hours of work doing every single day. If you don't enjoy it, then you made the mistake to study a degree and get a job you don't love. Go back to school and get another degree or use the internet and work at night to be able to do what you want. The world is not going to spoon feed you what you 'deserve'. You need to go out there and take it
FLFTW16 8y ago
There are systems that incentivize people to discover their passion and there are systems that crush people into poverty so they cling to anything to avoid falling into the permanent underclass.
No one can claim that Americans are lazy. Americans work more than anyone else, and are super productive, and most of their wealth is sucked away from them to the 1% and what is left is taken away in taxes and fees. Where I lived and worked there were NO paid sick days, NO paid holidays, NO affordable health insurance (maybe this has changed since the implementation of Obamacare, how is that working out for ya'll?).
Education is so expensive the pressure to perform and be perfect in all academic subjects was so intense that we never really figured out what we actually wanted to do. The goal was merely to pass the State administered standardized tests, to get into a good college, to get a degree, any degree, just make sure you have a degree! Looking back now it's easy to see that the entire middle class has education FOMO--fear of missing out. They know that if you fuck up and fall into poverty you are finished. There are strong currents that will keep you down there. The US has a permanent underclass, not that the politburo will ever admit it publicly.
Another comment here mentioned about starting a business and how you have to jump through all the hoops of getting a business license, health inspection, insurance, etc just to sell lemonade. This isn't an accident. The plantation is established and they can't allow slaves to just run off. In Thailand there is virtually no regulatory environment. It seems everyone is running some little side business. There are guys that just set up a little card table and sell dildos on the side of the street with a single light bulb for illumination. The government sometimes makes a fuss but they provide no welfare or social safety net, so they can't complain about people selling things for profit.
"Just go back to school and get another degree" seems like something a bureaucrat or college president would say. It strikes me as nonsensical advice. We need less education (less brainwashing) in the US, less regulation, less oversight, less big brother, less permission, less welfare, less help, less police. Americans are very hardworking and very productive, it's just that a corrupt rotten system has siphoned off most of our blood sweat and tears to the gross benefit of a few.
[deleted] 8y ago
Most of your post is spot-on, but I can't help but wonder at your comment about poverty. I doubt poverty is a one-way street. The demand for able persons is as high or higher than ever. The biggest problem is that a bunch of not-so-able people are distorting the traditional seal of ability, college education, and tests directly measuring ability are verboten on grounds of "discrimination against minorities".
king-schultz 8y ago
ITT: Guys that couldn't make it in the U.S., move, then bitch about how awful America is. Sound like a bunch of men hating women.
TRPApprentice 8y ago
The SJW subreddit is over there, not here, you fool!