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- Hide Preview | 59 Comments | submitted 3 months ago by red_philosopher [Post Locked]

Intoduction

Obtaining plates is a simple matter. You work out, spend time refining your social skills, slaughter the temptation for oneitis in your heart, and go out and do your thing. You find a girl who's hot, game her, take her home and fuck her brains out, and then kick her out the door. If she calls you back, great, you can fuck her again. If not, oh well, who cares? You've got 100 other women in line chomping at the bit waiting to be your willing cum dumpster.

That sounds great, and it definitely fosters an attitude of abundance. And as we know, that attitude is critical. Women come and go, and understanding that is also critical. Plating and letting go teaches you that it's okay if she skips on you. It's not that you don't care about whether she does or not, as it is an irritating inconvenience when it inevitably happens.

Over time, I felt that the routine of gaming and fucking, gaming and fucking was really quite empty. There is more to us than being raging fuck monsters (though we are that as well). We bond, we share, we provide, and all of these things are things that women also find attractive.

Attachment and Bonding

Oxytocin is the hormone that (is believed to be) largely responsible for a slew of human behaviors and emotions. These include such things as empathy, generosity, affection, love, favoritism, bias, and predjudice. When we are exposed to the hormone, either through expressing or receiving affection, sex, or experiencing belonging, or understanding, etc., we become more attached to the individuals in question. This is why we tend to form a group mentality; oxytocin urges us to trust those we are close to, and that trust causes us to view others with distrust; this creates the us-vs-them dynamic. It is also why we experience "oneitis."

It is interesting to note, that TRP recommends that we don't grow attached to our plates; it recommends that we fuck them and let them go in an effort to avoid the dreaded "oneitis." Our brains work they way they always have, and it is known that sex increases the strength of the bond you share with the person you have sex with. This is inevitable, and over time that bond will grow despite your efforts. It is impossible to not feel anything if we are truly honest with ourselves. However, it is exactly that feeling that we elicit in women, when they want to be around us. That feeling of safety, security, and well-being that is provided by the oxytocin flooding her brain when we connect with them. Just as they need it, we too need it.

The Harm of the Revolving Door

If attachment is inevitable, just as inevitable as hypergamy or anything else that TRP preaches, then why is it do we recommend that we do not grow attachments? TRP suggests, and the attitude is fairly clear, that we sever these bonds on the routine. To break them before they threaten us, to isolate ourselves from the risks and dangers of a deeply intimate relationship. The experience of loss is a real result of these activities, and, no matter how minor, they add up over time. This fear, however justified, prohibits men from reaching their apex. Just as women hamster away that the next Chad is just around the corner, we men hamster away that fear.

Women who engage in repeated sexual promiscuity inevitably develop the "thousand-cock stare." Described as a hollow, almost mournful look, it is associated with the inability to pair-bond due to the self-inflicted psychological trauma of riding the cock-carousel. It is precisely because they have been severing their bonds repeatedly that this hapoens. Either due to denying themselves the fullness of bonding, or due to the repeated injury of severing these bonds over time. Perhaps both.

It is fallacious to assume that we men are immune to the effects of oxytocin. It is harmful to have high turnover with your plates. It may take years, but eventually you will likely experience times where sex really just isn't that interesting anymore. You aren't getting one of the strongest reinforcing hormones that builds bonds, and are experiencing a loss, however small, every time you have sex. It doesn't lead you to where your brain literally needs you to be from time to time.

It is then, inevitably harmful in the long run to sever these bonds repeatedly and without remorse. Do not fear growing close, it is inevitable. However, one should be aware so they can take action accordingly and reasonably.

Reducing Turnover

The life of a plate can be extended by leveraging attachment. This attachment creates a sense of trust, of being a part of your group, a sense of safety and belonging, something that took time to develop, and something they will not easily want to throw away. That doesn't mean being a pushover, pedestalizing women, or giving them everything they want. Men who do this value attachment over their own well-being, and inevitably get burned wondering what went wrong.

You can build attachment in a number of ways:

1) Sex 1) Cuddling after sex 1) Bathing/Grooming together/eachother 1) Exploring together 1) Acts of generosity 1) Encouraging good choices 1) Sustained eye contact 1) Proper Dread*

*Your plates should always believe that you'll drop them at a moment's notice if they repeatedly fail to live up to your expectations. It will give them a sense of accomplishment when they know that you have choices and have chosen (so far) to not eliminate them from your life.

I almost always cuddle with my plates after sex. Always. They will form an attachment to you this way, and over time it will be one they don't want to lose if you possess healthy, masculine qualities. They will do more to keep you happy, do more to keep you close, and do more despite the fact that they know you are seeing other women.

Bathing and grooming is an intimate behavior, and it shows care for the other. I've had plates do my hair, bite my nails, do my laundry, and more. Washing her hair in the shower, cleaning in the intimate nooks and crannies, all of it goes.

There's a reason why they say to take your date out to multiple venues and to avoid boring places. Multiple venues fosters multiple instances of memory, and fosters the sense of belonging and attachment. Especially when you physically escalate. Do it, and do it often.

Being generous, and not foolhardy. Being generous when they are truly, and desperately in need, is core to being both a good man and to fostering solid attachments. If you cannot care for her, there's no need for her to stay. She needs to find someone who can. This is inevitable. Don't forget, if you choose this, it is up to you to not be taken advantage of. Only part with what you are willing to lose. And if you cannot, perhaps you should not be at all.

Always encourage them to make good healthy choices. From seeking treatment for problems, to eating better, to exercise. One of my best FWBs, she was an alcoholic, and she hid it well. One day she called out of the blue telling me it was over, and when I inquired, she said she was entering into a treatment program and wouldn't be available for a long while. I told her that that was a good thing, and that I am glad to see she is taking steps to grow. She was surprised that I wasn't angry or upset, and even though she needs some emotional support from me from time to time, it is a minor cost.

Prolonged eye contact, in excess of 5 seconds, can cause attachment as well. This has been documented in a few other studies. Strangers who engage in lengthy, friendly, eye contact report feeling safer, friendlier, and more trusting of the other person. This is riskier in terms if developing oneitis, as it will have the same effect on you.

These behaviors, when used sparingly and correctly at the right times, will improve your relationships with your plates, and prolong their time. This, in turn, will help keep you whole.

The Pitfalls

Do not attempt these things if you are unaware of the risks.

I've had plates beg for commitment but still come back for more, because I give them what they need. A sense of belonging. I've even had ones willingly change their perspectives on monogamy so they could stay. However, I have had crazy single moms come visit me at odd times because I called it off for their crazy antics. Being too generous, close, supportive, etc., Is a one-way ticket to male purgatory. Just as you love carefully and without expectation, you must attach carefully and be prudent about that attachment. Likewise, you can develop a focused oneitis if you are not careful. I've felt that urge a number of times, though in hindsight that possibility never really goes away anyway.

Conclusion

Expand your horizons, develop a deeper bond with a select few women and see where that takes you. You may surprise yourself when you discover that your plates will share a desire to grow and become more merely by being in your presence. They will work to improve, and work to change insofar as you support and encourage that positive growth. Be the example you wish to see from your plates.

Your plates, and your mind, will thank you.

Edits

Added sustained eye contact

[-] Zech4riah 2 Points 3 months ago

Good post.

This kind of posts are really rare where the male mentality is analysed realistically from the point of pair bonding. For too long TRP has preached that male should not pair bond even though it's a genuine strong desire built within and most guys really want it. Personally I'm in a point that I rather skip early night easy pull if she isn't for something more than ONS or shallow FB (so if she is from another city, has a BF or something like that). I'd say that the denial of desire to pair bond has been some sort of blind spot in the community.

When you have had your share of having sex with multiple women, you begin to desire much more than just sex because sex is just...so common -> having sex and fun times with a girl with some level of emotional connection is much more fulfilling.

And still the best way to avoid oneitis is to have multiple girls around. If you let yourself pair bond, this goes two fold.

[-] red_philosopher 1 Point 3 months ago

Yeah, I still game on the side in order to stay level.

[-] [deleted] 3 Points 3 months ago

[deleted]

[-] red_philosopher 1 Point 3 months ago

This is fair advice. You obviously don't do it with everyone; that's akin to fucking everything with a hole; you just don't do it.

[-] frooschnate 1 Point 3 months ago

I only downvote the best things I see on here, easier to find that way. You earned it.

All this shit we discuss and share here is meant to be used by you in whatever way you see fit, once you have failed, learned and internalized the main principles.

I ain’t a believer of telling people to be themselves, some people really shouldn’t. But don’t sacrifice whatever good traits or worthwhile personality you once had to try to be this perfect image of “alpha”; you’ll be miserable m8.

[-] GutseeAAS 1 Point 3 months ago

I really appreciate this post. This subreddit has put a lot of questions in my head and some of the answers I've seen on the subreddit seem.. wrong or just not the full truth. TRP says to treat women pretty terribly in a lot of regards. If they're crying, just hug them no talking. You're not their friend. They must always pay half of the bill. Don't let them sleep over. Don't listen to their problems etc. In my younger years, 8 years back, I had "plates" before I knew what that meant and they all knew about each other. We fuck, have a good time, sit and talk for hours. I enjoyed the sex, the bonding, the friendship, the game.

TRP says two of those four things are not real. I'm hesitant to disagree with TRP because who am I to say it's wrong when it works for so many and I know so little about it. So I'm trying everything here out.

Some of my attitude is beta, I acknowledge that. However, my presence is commanding and girls pay attention to me. Most plates I get are girls coming to me. This is nice, but I need to work on it. if these girls come to me I'm sure if I started working on cold approaching I could get girls a number or two above these.

In regards to my beta traits, removing some, and some being the keyword here, have made me not enjoy women at all. Like they're a fucking chore when I follow what TRP has taught me to a T. You seem very rational. What are you opinions on this?

Disclaimer: I'm just fresh back in the game after a 4 year LTR. It was a great relationship with a girl I probably could have married. I broke it off to play the field because why not. Discovered TRP from a friend, one month ago. he recommended The Rational Male to me and most of what I read I agreed with and knew intuitively before reading. Putting it in words made it more real though.

[-] red_philosopher 2 Points 3 months ago

I disagree with the listening to problems part. I listen to their problems all the time. I give them advice, and if they take it, they stick around. If they look at me like I need to shut up, they get shown the door.

The ones that have stuck around are the best that I've ever experienced. And I thank TRP for that. But, it doesn't have all the answers, as it's focused heavily on just getting laid and avoiding the consequences that could result from being a dumbass.

[-] GutseeAAS 1 Point 3 months ago

Thanks, all this reading I've been doing on TRP has me not able to see the forest for the trees. Ill lean a bit more towards my intuition, that usually does me right.

[-] red_philosopher 3 Points 3 months ago

A LOT of TRP is geared heavily towards broken and hurt men who need firm guidance on how to not get fucked up. As you work through the material, you start to see that most of the PUA shit is a set of fairly firm guidelines to keep from getting attached and to create a situation where the women invest more heavily.

It works, but only to a point. And that's what TRP is for.

[-] Razkolol 1 Point 3 months ago

Why reduce turnover? They’re aging, you want to increase turnover...

[-] red_philosopher 2 Points 3 months ago

They don't go from 20-25 to 30-35 over the course of several months you know.

[-] Razkolol 2 Points 3 months ago

I'm not liking the whole solidifying thing, could easily lead down a path of oneitis/complacency. Kills the hunger, you start skipping a few days at the gym to spend some solidifying bonding time with one of your plates, you realise you kinda like her more than the others, you've already invested some time with her > you start dropping the others> you decide to go into an ltr, you solidify things further into monogamy > one thing leads to another you're married with 3 kids and a nagging wife and you're working that 9 to 5 to pay mortgages.

Risky business if you ask me. It's not like bonding is gonna spark any attraction in them, quite the contrary, familiarity gets boring, fun and excitement that's where attraction is at.

[-] [deleted] 3 months ago
[-] Psychocist 4 Points 3 months ago

"I've even had ones willingly change their perspectives on monogamy so they could stay."

More people need to realise this. If your relative SMV is way above hers she will accept whatever she needs to accept to keep you around, including polygamy. Of course, we have to accept that she is also practising non-monogamy, she just needs to do it covertly to maintain face.

Not sure I could accept any other arrangement. Be fucked if I'm sexually committing to someone who pretends to commit to me. Nah.

I feel the same RE perpetual plate spinning. It gets boring real fast, but it is a lot of fun every now and then, and it is absolutely crucial to hammer home an abundance mentality. I never believed in the abundance of women until I was spinning 3 plates at the same time with the opportunity to spin more. Now I can barely handle 1 woman at a time. Far better things to spend time on.

That's why they say focus on yourself and your mission. Everything else will be taken care of in due course.

[-] 0io- 4 Points 3 months ago

I think it's more fun to have sex multiple times with girls that you genuinely like than to just go for one-night-stands. If you travel a lot it's particularly easy, because you can just hook up with your old gf/plate when you go to her city. "I'm going to be in London next week, which night are you free?" You don't really care or expect her not to have some kind of man/boyfriend/ltr/etc in her life. It always seems weird to me on TRP that people are like "My plate had sex with a guy, I'm dumping her immediately" instead of just poaching the girl out of her existing relationship for a booty-call. Instead of spinning plates that break and disappear forever you just keep a Little Black Book so you can always hook-up with that girl you know in LA/Chicago/Munich/Texas/Whatever. As long as they know you will never blow their cover, they're DTF.

[-] RicoAuerbach 1 Point 3 months ago

But what if she cares about having a man/bf/ltr ?

[-] Psychocist 1 Point 3 months ago

Doesn't matter. She also cares about having a great time in bed.

[-] Synthetic_Citizen 3 Points 3 months ago

Remember, it is in a womens biological imperative to "conquer" a untamed male with options. Your honesty reveals to them you are emotionally independant and self assured, they want to change that. They derive carnal pleasure from slowly making the male emotionally dependant on her and also seek her validation, once this is accomplished however she loses interest.

If a man is too emotionally malleable she will only ever see him as easily manipulated, if a man is emotionally independant she judges his fitness based on his lack of reaction to her poking and prodding at his frame.

Also remember that while most men fall easily for a womens natural subtle manipulations and give their committment without much resistence, women have to exert an effort they are unfamiliar with when competing for an emotionally independant male who is not so easily parted with his time, attention and resources. Women are not used to working so hard for it so they will actively invest more into it to ensure a chance that all the investment she puts in she gets out. When she realises one day that she cannot gain control of your emotions and manipulate you for your time, attention and resources, she will break it off and hamster that whatever recent emotional response from you however small it may be is her victory over you.

That time foir weeks ago when you gave her that opened packet of skittles, or last night when you cuddled with her after fucking, or the advice you gave her about her family drama that fixed her problems last week. She knows she wont get more from yoi, so she will hold on to that most memorable little sliver of hope you showed her and rationalize that it is and indication of your emotional investment and proof of her victory over you. She simply cant get more because you are damaged and autistic.

[-] SilenceOnTheWire 1 Point 3 months ago

You had women bite your nails?

[-] red_philosopher 5 Points 3 months ago

She did it of her own volition unprompted. It's a grooming behavior.

[-] SilenceOnTheWire 1 Point 3 months ago

I just don't understand why she didn't clip them instead.

[-] UmbreFezz 2 Points 3 months ago

After you fingered her, right? Haha

[-] red_philosopher 5 Points 3 months ago

To quote Vasily, "I was just looking for my car keys."

[-] UmbreFezz 6 Points 3 months ago

Lmfaooo. Great post tho dude. Speaks apart from the typical plate spinning women hating realm out here. This sub is often more take than give, but if you can be outcome independent while giving some, you can truly ascend.

[-] red_philosopher 5 Points 3 months ago

You can't be truly abundant if you are incapable of giving without expectation.

[-] sanitypanacea 2 Points 3 months ago

this is a golden maxim my dude

[-] MentORPHEUS 16 Points 3 months ago

I like this article, because it aligns well with my own decades long plate spinning experience. I happen to be an oxytocin junkie so I maintain higher-involvement relationships than the bare minimum necessary, even at the plate level.

If your preference is a high churn low retention series of partners that's fine but this advice simply isn't calibrated toward that model.

OP did a good job of defining limits and risks of his system. I'd like to add that when you find yourself literally speeding from woman to woman, that's your signal to dial back some numbers or commitment levels.

For beginning plate spinners, it's easy to overestimate the minimum amount of non-sex activities necessary to maintain a sexual relationship. According to the principle of Women are the gatekeepers of sex, Men are the gatekeepers of commitment, it is her prerogative to negotiate for relationship perks. When you stop volunteering them, you might be surprised to find how little if any are requested.

You want to apply economies of scale where possible when spreading resources across several women, but take careful note of what each individual woman wants out of the deal. There is something to that "love languages" concept, and by tailoring which extras you offer each woman accordingly, you can make an efficient minimax system of it.

One concept of Libertarianism that I find important is stewardship of common resources, and I hold that this extends to the pool of single women we plate. It's in all of our mutual interest not to create a tragedy of the pussy commons in our wake as we each sleep with far more women than the average man.

[-] Zech4riah 2 Points 3 months ago

For beginning plate spinners, it's easy to overestimate the minimum amount of non-sex activities necessary to maintain a sexual relationship.

To my experience it's better to overestimate little than to underestimate. My plates drop most of the time because I invest too little and it always surprises me. I think beginners should invest rather too much than too little (when some level of actual relationship is already formed which means that you have fucked her couple of times already etc.).

  • If you invest too much, you just have to maintain a bit higher investment level for awhile but you can always decrease the level investment subtly.
  • If you invest too little, she just makes a decision and ghosts you or suddenly just doesn't wanna see you more. There is two problems here. She has hamstered and made a logical-like decision which may be hard to turn around and secondly you look like a needy pussy if you suddenly start showing higher level investment. So if you start chasing, you will push her further away. Now all you can do is to wait or wait for multiple months and then try to reinitiate.
[-] Pinetreewhisperer 2 Points 3 months ago

For beginning plate spinners, it's easy to overestimate the minimum amount of non-sex activities necessary to maintain a sexual relationship. According to the principle of Women are the gatekeepers of sex, Men are the gatekeepers of commitment, it is her prerogative to negotiate for relationship perks.

Completely agree. I ruined a recent good plate from doing this.

[-] [deleted] 3 months ago
[-] calibroni16000 2 Points 3 months ago

Thank you for bringing this to attention. One thing I’ve noticed in the TRP atmosphere is the confusion that emotional stability means not feeling things at all. That being an emotional rock is accomplished by eliminating everything that allows you to feel anything in FEAR of being hurt. FFS I read a post about keeping a journal but “don’t write your feelings in them, that’s the difference between a journal and a diary”. Emotional strength is not the absents of emotion, but rather approaching the situation, regardless of what the situation is and how it makes you feel with a level head. How are you ever going to develop true emotional strength if you don’t allow yourself the opportunity? As we all know by now, love is not a security. Love however, is a vulnerability. If there is a LTR you are in and she is a good girl, hey fuck it, life is too short. Be vulnerable to an extent and if shit ever hits the fan, you know exactly how to deal with that shit this time around.

[-] red_philosopher 2 Points 3 months ago

TRP is heavily influenced by the stoics, and Stoicism has been my most recent endeavor, though it is a slow and time consuming process. The stoics believed that being emotionless was not the point, as it made you more akin to a statue, a facsimile of being human. We're not supposed to be statues, we're living, breathing, feeling human beings. We are gifted our rationality so we can overcome our emotions, not eliminate them.

[-] izzyinjurious 32 Points 3 months ago

I hang out with some PUA for shits and giggles and they have plates, but they always seem to get dropped by their plates because they are never honest from the start. They're players and snake their way to keeping them. TRP has told me to be honest... well it taught me that I am the prize and to not really care if they leave or go. TRP has also taught me that when women know you're sleeping with other women their hamster kicks in and they do what they can to win you over. So, being honest after I f-close them the first time sets the bar and gives them the option to leave or not. I on the other hand will not have exclusivity with them and I don't judge them for finding another guy to sleep with or date while they're sleeping with me. "We can see where this goes, but I don't want a relationship as I have life goals" I usually talk about my passions, goals and dreams while on the first hang out which paves the way for me to drop this bomb of honesty on them. They appreciate the honesty that I gave them. Its refreshing. Many plates have told me this before. Which is why they stick around judgement free.

So, with that being said, I can confirm everything in this post is true. I kinda treat my plates like LTRs. I bring them to parties kick backs or bars with me or invite them out to do something when I don't wanna hang out with the boys. I'll call them over to cuddle and fuck when I'm lonely. I never hide the fact that other women have slept in the bed, but I also don't make it obvious either as it pushes them away if I do. So they never expect a relationship, but every once in awhile have to be reminded. Plates will break, but most of the time they enjoy the honesty , comfort and experience that I give them. So kudos OP I just wanted to back up this post with my own experiences.

[-] red_philosopher 11 Points 3 months ago

Thanks for the props.

TRP has some holes in it still. Many don't understand that there are many different qualities of plate, and that most relationships, even purely sexual ones, are built on quid pro quo. Providing a little comfort by cuddling with your plate doesn't cost much when you're half dozed from the orgasm and probably would be laying there anyway enjoying the moment. So why not make the smart investment there?

Idk maybe I'm just lazy when it comes to my plates . Hahaha.

[-] JuliusTestvola 5 Points 3 months ago

Hey I just wanted to share:

I read about one guy who stabilized his plates by forcing them to make eye contact with him while they were coming. Give it a try.

[-] red_philosopher 2 Points 3 months ago

I do stare them in the eye like that, at least my nicer plates. I'll add that in a bit.

[-] cupshadow 9 Points 3 months ago

I fell the same way, can't help but being a bit of a boyfriend in the moment. And they do reciprocate, like making lunch together or taking a bath. It's like you are having a honey moon.

To be completely honest, having short honey moons with several plates for the rest of the life sounds like a really good plan.

[-] izzyinjurious 8 Points 3 months ago

I think those holes are there and we fill them in with who we are and what best works for us.

You're right though, the extra little things doesn't affect anyone and you'll always have the abundance mentality with consistent plates. So, its not like you're catching oneitis with any of them. I just like the plates I retain and drop the ones I don't. I like to focus more of my time into my work or passions rather than having to go out and find new plates.

Idk if it's legal to call it monk mode,but just call those same plates during that period. Once I'm out, then I can refresh the list.

[-] FereallyRed -2 Point 3 months ago

Plates are women you use for sex. Period.

I don't know what the fuck you're trying to turn them into, but if you're taking them out on dates, doing each other's hair, having them bite your fingernails?!?, then they're not plates anymore.

The whole idea is repellent.

If you want to turn plates into something more then promote them.

If you want to keep plates around longer promote them.

Scarcity and a perversion of the definition.

This is not behavior of a man with abundance.

You're trying to change the definition of a plate. Concern trolling.

[-] [deleted] 3 months ago
[-] red_philosopher 1 Point 3 months ago

I concede that when I first started testing these effects, it was solely for the informational value, and if it is done without consideration for your partners, it can, most definitely, cause the kind of damage that you are talking about. The idea is to not be a heartless soulless monster, but a powerful, generous, and magnanimous person.

To quote a trainer I had, "red_philosopher, we only use our powers for good."

[-] Nicolas0631 1 Point 3 months ago

You seems to be focussing on vocabulary. Who care?

[-] SilenceOnTheWire 1 Point 3 months ago

I don't know what the fuck you're trying to turn them into, but if you're taking them out on dates, doing each other's hair, having them bite your fingernails?!?, then they're not plates anymore.

I think OP's idea is to turn plates into a defused oneitis and play-pretend to be a couple with them.

[-] Nicolas0631 1 Point 3 months ago

I'd say a plate base level only fullfil physical needs and both partners are aware of that and don't care much for each other. Also they don't get the most out of their relation.

By having more bonding you make the experience more satisfying for both, get to pass great time together. So that's positive.

But you avoid the drawbacks, don't see each other too often so you don't loose interrest, you can keep the nolvelty and stick to the best moments together.

You don't get in exclusive relationship so you don't loose abundance. You keep and leverage opportunities. You don't act as needy.

Doesn't look too bad.

[-] red_philosopher 9 Points 3 months ago

From the Sidebar:

Plate - Woman with whom you are in a non-exclusive sexual relationship with. Spinning plates is the act of having multiple plates simultaneously.

We can discuss the meaning of non-exclusive sexual relationship further if you would like. Though, I would suggest that you take a moment to self-reflect instead of regurgitating some nonsense an anger-phase sperg said.

[-] FereallyRed 3 Points 3 months ago

u/HumanSockPuppet is an anger phase sperg?

Sidebar.. his Managing bitches.

Level 1: Plate -or- Fuck Buddy. You have sex with this girl more than once. You will know her name and just enough about her life so you can schedule sexual encounters. You may also know a little bit about her personally, so you can help her rationalize being your fucktoy, assuming she's uncomfortable about the idea of being one. Otherwise, she's down with it and you're both satisfied with being casual. She is a temporary answer to a physical necessity.

[-] red_philosopher 5 Points 3 months ago

His tiering system is fine and helps novices understand that there are many different layers of trust and investment in relationships. It's that way to prevent novices from jumping the gun and provides a foundation for newbies to learn and grow.

However, HSP isn't the sole arbiter of the usage or definition of the coliquialism "plate." There's a reason it's defined that way in the glossary, alongside Rollo's article. If anything, HSP redefined the term himself when he used it. A plate is still a woman with whom you are in a non-exclusive sexual relationship. Not some arbitrarily decided upon level of investment or ranking of relationship status.

[-] FereallyRed 7 Points 3 months ago

Fine. Agree to disagree on definition.

The root of the umbrage is you're using David Koresh levels of manipulation on simple plates, just to have continued access to the vagina and fulfill your own strange need for pair bonding with obviously unacceptable partners.

Not operating in your own frame.

[-] red_philosopher 2 Points 3 months ago

The root of the umbrage is you're using David Koresh levels of manipulation

Thanks for the laugh. I've always been naturally manipulative, so this may be true.

on simple plates, just to have continued access to the vagina

That's a pretty big assumption on your part, vaginal access notwithstanding. Do you really think that I put in that much effort just to get a lay? This is stuff that you can do in your down time waiting for the Uber to show up.

and fulfill your own strange need for pair bonding with obviously unacceptable partners.

Haha I wish you knew what my partners were like.

Not operating in your own frame.

Uh huh. Nice try kid.

[-] MentORPHEUS 7 Points 3 months ago

Brothers, you're both excellent and aware writers, whose quality is not enhanced by ad hominem jags.

[-] sanitypanacea 1 Point 3 months ago

amazing discussion

https://blacklabellogic.com/2018/11/16/the-guide-to-being-a-high-t-alpha-male/

comes to mind with a lot of the discussion here -- I personally think HSP's focus on the definition was to discourage oneitis/scarcity mentality/beta plate game

[-] randomTATRP 2 Points 3 months ago

Agreed, I haven't seen a discussion like this for a long, long time and I aspire to be as calm-headed as these two guys

[-] [deleted] 3 months ago
[-] ariky 11 Points 3 months ago

That was long. I couldn’t decide if I read it or not but anyways, I’m giving thumbs up for the great effort.

[-] Olga_Schmutzer 1 Point 3 months ago

If this is a long read for you, then you have more important problems than TRP.

[-] red_philosopher 3 Points 3 months ago

It was a bit longer than I expected as well.

[-] [deleted] 9 Points 3 months ago

Before this gets written off as true Purple Pilling, from a biological standpoint, it checks out.

An adjacent point is that there are two primary ways to avoid damage from routine bond-severing.

The first is to have a granite fucking bedrock of friends and family. You millennials call it a tribe, or whatever. In essence, you’re getting that oxytocin elsewhere.

The second option is true buddhist/zen disattachment. You draw oxytocin from the experience of life itself, not from any of your friendships, possessions, relationships. This is the practice that decades-long practitioners of meditation acquire. It is perhaps worth noting that it if you successfully do this, it will also make your brain resemble a psychopath’s in an MRI. Seriously. You will find this to be a good or bad thing, user experience may vary.

[-] red_philosopher 2 Points 3 months ago

The first is to have a granite fucking bedrock of friends and family. You millennials call it a tribe, or whatever. In essence, you’re getting that oxytocin elsewhere.

Honestly, if you have good solid attachments with your friends and family, you're less at risk of getting tunnel vision and getting into oneitis mode as well. You'll be more discerning about whom you introduce into your "tribe," which will make you less prone to making errors of judgement.

As for preventing any sort of experienced loss and impact on your mental state, it's probably worth mentioning that you'll experience it anyway. Having the solid foundation just makes it less impactful as your well-being isn't dependent on women.

The second option is true buddhist/zen disattachment. You draw oxytocin from the experience of life itself, not from any of your friendships, possessions, relationships. This is the practice that decades-long practitioners of meditation acquire. It is perhaps worth noting that it if you successfully do this, it will also make your brain resemble a psychopath’s in an MRI. Seriously. You will find this to be a good or bad thing, user experience may vary.

Willfully chosen disassociation is always going to come with it's barbs.

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