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21 Convention: PATRIARCH EDITION
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There is something in common with these two videos, a fact I’m sure the folks marking the 21 convention would not agree with, that irks me something fierce. Everyone and their grandmother has said their piece about why the Gillette ad was a miserable regurgitation of SJW man-hatred, and I didn’t feel like hopping on the caboose of that outrage train until I watched the promotional for the 21 Convention and found myself having the same gut reaction to what is essentially a polar opposite piece of messaging.
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Most of the outrage over the $24.99 dollar shave club’s commercial was over the implication that all men are rapists, bullies, and bad fathers. That’s definitely something you might take away from that 90 seconds of mood music and bad acting, but it’s quickly deflected by the producers as being targeted only at making men “better”. “If you’re a good boy, then this isn’t for you”. Or perhaps it’s a form of group punishment; because one guy didn’t know how to use his dick correctly and now we all have to scrub the floors of the barracks with our toothbrushes. It would be misguided at best, but wouldn’t warrant the bile that has issued forth since it’s airing. Most of all it shows that the producers of the video at least ascribe to the idea that there is such a thing as manliness that needs to be shaped and formed by their hand.
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Then there is the 21 Convention, which I know nothing about. At first I thought it was meant to be a parody. Men walking stiffly through frame, expensive cars, double-takes of the guy in a maga hat adjusting his blazer. When they called out for Elliot, I half expected Rogers to waltz in.
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What struck me most though, after realizing it was not meant as a joke, is that I had roughly the same gut reaction to both videos. They both sent the same message, albeit on opposite sides of the spectrum. The message was “We know how do man good, you listen us if want be Real-Man ™. These are both pieces of media aimed at telling you the secret to manhood can be yours, if only you follow a prescribed, pre-packaged, and profit generating formula. Society will thank you, or perhaps your counter-culture will thank you, for standing up and doing things the right way.
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Fuck that noise. Men are judged only by their peers, and occasionally a court of law when they fuck up real hard. There is no reality in which *men*, half the earth’s population, all start abiding by some universal code, nor should there be. Anyone who tries to sell you on how to be a *man* in anything but the most abstract sense is trying to sell you something and using your desire to be desired against you.
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That’s not the same as the apologist's refrain of “anyone who identifies as a man is one”. Being good at being a man is hard. It takes work, sacrifice, and suffering. But what constitutes a good man can only be judged by one’s tribe. Your value or lack thereof is only relevant in the context of your mission. Any universal qualification for men is meaningless.
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hazelstein 5y ago
Im never trusting a reddit link. Why you do that XD
jonpe87 5y ago
" But what constitutes a good man can only be judged by one’s tribe. Your value or lack thereof is only relevant in the context of your mission. Any universal qualification for men is meaningless. "
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This is the real shit test. Are you running after someone else's carrot?
oooKenshiooo 5y ago
The Gillette clip made me roll my eyes, but the 21C one made me cringe so hard I shat a diamond.
memphisjohn 5y ago
"When I'm watchin' my TV
And that man comes on to tell me
How white my shirts can be
But he can't be a man 'cause he doesn't smoke
The same cigarettes as me"
SalporinRP 5y ago
That 21Con video was the gayest thing I've ever seen in my life...
The whole 21Con thing in general is gay. Imagine paying thousands of dollars to go to a RP convention to hear a bunch of guys parrot stuff you can easily just learn about on this site. And the idiots who run that convention will defend it by saying "collection of great RP minds, networking opportunities, etc."
Any person who pays money to go to that convention is a literal idiot.
Dream_21 5y ago
Imagine watching all of the conference videos for free on YouTube...
SalporinRP 5y ago
And what does that have to do with my comment?
If you pay 2k to go to a redpill convention you're an actual idiot...
Nick Sparks, the speaker in the most viewed video on your channel looks like he can barely lift the bar...
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AshyLarry27 5y ago
I fundamentally don't get the outrage over the Gillette commercial here.
Just more white noise to me honestly. "Think as you like, but behave like others." Let the BP machine grow, keep cutting down the competition, enjoy the decline.
No one has chopped off my dick yet because of this commercial, it clearly has no direct attack on my life, I am going to save my time being "outraged" and spend it on something more important. Maybe they're right, if this commecial offends you, YoU MuSt Be gUiLtY of soMeThing, or just grow tougher fucking skin to be giving such a shit about this dumb commercial. Let the useful idiots at these MGTOW/Incel/MRA forums handle it . . .
Imperator_Red 5y ago
Then you fundamentally don't get anything about what's going on in the west.
AshyLarry27 5y ago
Of course I do, yet again its impact is immensely overblown. That commercial does nothing but rally the BP's, the betas, and the white knights. Again, enjoy the decline. Just makes it easier on those of us here.
Maybe I am confused, what was your solution for saving the west again . . .
WarriorMonkMode 5y ago
If the first thing that crosses your mind is "this shit is gay" when you see these ads, it's safe to say that they've failed in their advertising.
This is simply a sign that the average IQ of the consumer is dropping like a rock in today's society. They would've been better off showing a shirtless Chris Hemsworth with a full beard chopping firewood up in the mountains before riding off on his Harley Davidson into the sunset.
Charbenew 5y ago
ADJ is a liberal, he works within the liberal frame. Given his background is mostly from the PUA community, his only real response to blue-pill criticism and internal red-pill criticism is to use Agree and Amplify for any question that may shatter his American neo-liberal mind. This leads us to this ad which is barely distinguishable from a parody. When you don't read any books above the sixth-grade level you end up filming this sperg shit. Our favorite soap salesman has fallen into the master-slave dialect, and since he hasn't taken it upon himself to read any difficult books he can only describe masculinity by using super kewl carz and MAGA hats (btw Augustus Caesar had neither of these! must have been a beta!) instead of anything more subtle or symbolic. This is what ADJ's TRP toolbox looks like, a bunch of unsheathed, repetitive, dull knives that you will cut yourself with if you reach in there. We need a real toolbox and an organized library that gives us radical thoughts and solutions to destroy the liberal frame. The solution isn't to make a freshman film class project that is a simulacra of masculinity and lavishing in commodity fetishism, it's pulling ourselves towards greater intellectual thought and learning from the past.
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Psychological_Radish 5y ago
ADJ has always struck me as being a Beta who tries very hard to appear Alpha. That's why he comes off as so phony and cringe-inducing. His hatred of feminism and effort to look "cool" reach an almost comedic level. And like most Betas, he is sensitive to criticism and lashes out at any perceived slight, as the recent drama with Rich Cooper aptly demonstrates.
Both videos generate revulsion at a gut level precisely because they come from a Beta mindset.
adam-l Endorsed Contributor 5y ago
I remember reading Rollo's definition of the "Alpha" from 2011. The article features a video of the kid whom Rollo called the "Alpha Buddha". It was as much enlightening, about a concept that has eluded a credible definition, as it was unconventional. That video makes quite a contrast with the convention's ad...
Battagliare 5y ago
I think this was inevitable. I also think the individualistic viewpoint of TRP about "manhood" is essentially paradoxical.
You see, masculinity and hierarchy really walks hand in hand. TRP essentially criticizes the feminine imperatives forced "man up!" point of view which is absouletely healthy and helping. Because feminine imperative wants to use mascuilinity in order to benefit herself. So she creates her own hierarchies and ways to categorize and use masculinity which is non-beneficial to Men.
But this is where TRP fails: TRP rejects this unhealthy "man up" bullshit but puts nothing instead of it. So enterpreneurs like 21 Studious use this vacuum for their own advantage and sells Soaps or makes commercials like this. And then you complain about this. What did you expect ? There'll be always one organization or one guy trying/enforcing/persuading rest of the tribe of his own definition of Manhood and create hierarchies out of it. Because mascuilinity will always be paired with hierarchy. This is how alpha-beta behaviours happened at first place, or how animal communities survived etc..
I am not saying that TRP should somehow "enforce" hierarchies or qualifications for being a Man. I am just saying it is the inevitable part of the process. It started with PUA first, focusing essentially on primal insticts of Men, trying to satisfy it. Then comes TRP, moving beyond that instict and puts theories and abstracts concepts on what constitutes masculinity and gender relationships. I believe the next step is hierarchies which is beyond the TRP's scope or aims.
VinterBot 5y ago
I think TRP also calls for men to 'man up' but in its own way. TRP doesn't tell men to raise their wives children, or to stuck up and slave away for a so called queen, TRP calls men to 'man up' , to act like a man, to take their reality into their own hands and for once in their life actually have agency in their decicions. It calls men to leave the cocoon built by their hopefully now former female imperators, and become what a man is deemed to be in the eyes of TRP.
The difference is that is up to each individual to build the discipline to make that change, we do not enforce it, and we don't have a silly catchphrase to go along it. This forum informs people on how to achieve becoming a man women want to be with, and men want to be. One does what one wills with that information.
randomTATRP 5y ago
I think this is the best definition of TRP I've seen so far, thanks
[deleted] 5y ago
Read Julius Evola. You are on point - masculinity thrives amongst hierarchy.
Battagliare 5y ago
I will.
shady_nasty_mf 5y ago
The guy driving the white fast car in the video (Entrepreneurs in Cars) publicly withdrew from this event citing "security issues": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uwhGDqibvHA
He probably realised how scammy the video came off and didn't want his brand associated with this convention.
In fact, here is the official update statement Richard Cooper (Entrepreneurs in Cars) made:
WarViper1337 5y ago
Yeah I saw that Richard decided to back out. Now the owner of 21con has been throwing shade at Richard all over social media. Honestly it's embarrassing watching these men bicker like a bunch of emotional teens. I never was a big fan of 21con anyway. To many guys there trying to get you to sign up to their private brand whether that is books, private counseling, or grooming products. 21con is a celebration of the monetization of the manosphere. There are a few good presentations that come out of there but on the whole I feel like they want sell you the socal Instagram version of the red pill.
shady_nasty_mf 5y ago
The 21con guy is just a businessman really. He cares little about the redpill, he's about the greenpill (money). If money isn't involved, you won't see him there. If he could make a fortune selling pussyhats he'd do it.
It's the men who he gets to speak make it even worth it. The thing is these men have platforms of their own so the 21con isn't need to hear their message.
SmackinDatAss 5y ago
Who are these "men" and why should I give a shit about them? Why are we watching Beta videos?
bakamoney 5y ago
Its funny how anyone associated with "Alfa fucking Soap" can even given two seconds of attention in anything redpill related.
Swan_in_a_Cage 5y ago
Everything you need is on this subreddit...and ultimately within yourself.
redpillschool Admin 5y ago
I think what puts me off the most about the 21 commercial is that he's trying to sell some sort of SoCal version of lifestyle with slick jackets and fast cars.
He doesn't focus on the benefits of the content, or even what the content is.
He mistakenly believes the best marketing campaign is simply to sell the instagram lifestyle.
Who the fuck wakes up from the matrix and falls for that again?
awakenedspirit1 5y ago
+1
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Battagliare 5y ago
Are you checking your PM's ? There is a thing i'd like to ask you but cant write here, its not personal advice, more about West and future of it.
Omnidempotent 5y ago
How many plates do you have?
iknowthewhey 5y ago
Do you view sex with women as degenerate and immoral?
Omnidempotent 5y ago
Promiscuous sex is traditionally considered to be immoral and degenerate.
scissor_me_timbers00 5y ago
Sorta. There’s two sides to this. Many traditional societies allowed for a man to take multiple wives. Essentially if he had the resources to provide for them he could be polygamous. I know this isn’t the same as modern rampant promiscuity cuz it was still marriage. But, it does have a similarity to spinning plates.
Now if our society wasn’t going down the toilet and monogamy was still a good bet, I would agree that spinning plates is degenerate. But currently that doesn’t really matter so fuck it.
iknowthewhey 5y ago
Traditionally by who? I would highly recommend choosing your own values instead of those thrust upon you by slave morality.
Omnidempotent 5y ago
Thanks, Nietzsche.
Scatre 5y ago
Don't worry Gaylube claims he "beat the system" by planning to marry a woman in latin america.
He wants to shame tradcons, and then goes on to say "avoid degeneracy!". Gives me the giggles.
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Battagliare 5y ago
Your narrow-minded binary thinking literally hurts lmao.
Scatre 5y ago
Sorry I'm not open-minded enough to believe a contradiction, lol
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Scatre 5y ago
Can you be more specific? Or is it easier to just ad hominem all day, lol.
Battagliare 5y ago
Saying avoid degeneracy= being Tradcon. This is your binary thinking, and its retarded. There is no contradiction here, saying avoid degeneracy doesnt automatically makes you a Tradcon.
Scatre 5y ago
Stop using labels to try to identify with an opinion. Ironically, it's your binary thinking which is causing the confusion in your head.
Whether someone spouting conjecture about Americans being "formless" or saying "By avoiding degeneracy we move towards greatness" makes someone a 'tradcon' or not is irrelevant. It's just a word.
You're defending a comment that criticises people for "just trying to make money". If "avoiding degeneracy" means being a cuck, go right ahead and be one. Thinking there's some sort of collective "greatness" to achieve makes you a tradcon in my mind. Sorry if you don't agree with that.
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